Character wants to play a Cleric of Asmodeus but wants to heal

[Mavrickindigo]

I have a character who wants to be a LN cleric of asmodeus, but wants to use channel positive energy. We figured out maybe having a feat that lets the character do it as a cleric of a lower level, but I was wondering if there are already rules and feats or spells out there a cleric of asmodeus can use to achieve similar effects?

[RainyDayNinja]

He could play a life oracle instead, which can channel positive energy, but could be of any alignment, so he could still worship Asmodeus.

[Zhayne]

You could just let him do it. Alignment-based mechanics are always ... questionable.

[Haladir]

Clerics of evil deities channel negative energy. That's not to say that a cleric of Asmodeus can't prep cure spells. It's just that spontaneous casting will only be for inflict spells.

If your GM wants to make a homerule to change this, that's fine.

Honestly, if you're playing in Golarion, a better choice would be to either pick a different deity if you want to channel positive energy, or stick with Asmodeus knowing that you can only channel negative. And there's always the infernal healing spell, which is perfect for clerics of Asmodeus.

[Lamontius]

If all the rest of the party also worship Asmodeus, there's a feat in Inner Sea Gods that allows his channel to heal them.

[Darksol the Painbringer]

You must be thinking of this.

Unfortunately, it won't be of any help to you.

[Claxon]

Have you considered the Church of Abadar? He's Asmodues without the evil.

Seriously though, by the rules there is no way to do this that I am aware of. Clerics of evil gods channel negative energy, and I believe thats what your focusing on.

Now, a cleric of Asmodeus can still use cure light wounds, and all the cure spells. Heal, breath of life, and so forth. He just wont have Channel positive.

If that's what you're after, than being a Cleric of Abadar is probably the closest in feel you can get to Asmodeus or being a life oracle who happens to worship Asmodeus.

Darksol the Painbringer wrote:

You must be thinking of this.

Quote:

Versatile Channeler

You can choose to channel positive and negative energy.

Prerequisites: Channel energy class feature, necromancer or neutrally aligned cleric (see below).

Benefit: You may make a choice whenever you use your channel energy class feature.

If you normally channel positive energy, you may choose to channel negative energy as if your effective cleric level were 2 levels lower than normal.

If you normally channel negative energy, you may choose to channel positive energy as if your effective cleric level were 2 levels lower than normal.

Having this feat means you qualify for feats and abilities that have “channel positive energy” or “channel negative energy” as a prerequisite (for example, you qualify for the Command Undead feat and the Turn Undead feat).

Note: This feat only applies to necromancers, neutral clerics who worship neutral deities, or neutral clerics who do not worship a deity—characters who have the channel energy class ability and have to make a choice to channel positive or negative energy at 1st level. Clerics whose alignment or deity makes this choice for them cannot select this feat.

So Versatile Channeler doesn't help him.

Edit: Seems Darksol realized the problem just after I quoted him.

[Lincoln Hills]

Since you're filing this in 'Advice', not 'Rules Questions', I'll offer some advice that definitely isn't rules-as-written. Choose your favorite trickster-god and have him secretly granting the player's spells for his own amusement. Asmodeus has plenty of enemies, and one of his divine foes might have decided to take the master of Hell down a peg using one of Asmodeus' own classic strategies - granting spells to a misguided mortal and slowly leading him into apostasy.

"Any good deed you did in his name, I take as a service to me."

[Mavrickindigo]

I and the player are interested in playing a cleric of asmodeus. that't the first and foremost thing. I believe the character wants to establish orphanages to make more asmodeans.

[Seadin]

Despite what the rules under cleric say, in Pathfinder #64 you will find a cleric of Zon-Kuthon who is LN and channels positive energy. Whether this is a special case, the result of his alternate interpretation of his god, or just a mistake, I don't know. But if it was intended, then I don't see why a cleric of Asmodeus couldn't do the same thing.

[TriOmegaZero]

Prepare cure spells, buy wands of infernal healing, use your channel to harm your enemies.

[Paladin of Baha-who?]

Houserule it if you want. You could tie this into the campaign -- Asmodeus is secretly becoming more LN than LE, and having a select few LN clerics able to channel positive is a reflection of this. Reasons? Whatever you can think of. Maybe he feels guilty about killing his brother (Ihys).

[LoneKnave]

Lamontius wrote:

If all the rest of the party also worship Asmodeus, there's a feat in Inner Sea Gods that allows his channel to heal them.

Conversion channel

Why you need 7d6 channel for this is anyones guess.

[Mavrickindigo]

I can't really tie it into the campaign, as i'm running rise of the runelords

[Chengar Qordath]

Paladin of Baha-who? wrote:

Houserule it if you want. You could tie this into the campaign -- Asmodeus is secretly becoming more LN than LE, and having a select few LN clerics able to channel positive is a reflection of this. Reasons? Whatever you can think of. Maybe he feels guilty about killing his brother (Ihys).

Maybe it's a reflection of Asmodeus' Pragmatic Evil tendencies? Channeling positive energy is more useful than negative, so...

[Tcho Tcho]

There are like 300 official deities. Let him choose one he does like.

[Zhayne]

I'd say just let him do it. There's no reason for this to be tied to alignment, since positive and negative energy aren't aligned in the first place.

[Tcho Tcho]

Yes, we all know you don't like allignments but you should make people reading the forum aware of the fact that your advice is not pf legal.

[Wolfspirit]

I'll second the "Life Oracle of Asmodeus" unless he's really set on playing a cleric. The Legalistic Curse is perfect for this type of character

[RainyDayNinja]

Wolfspirit wrote:

I'll second the "Life Oracle of Asmodeus" unless he's really set on playing a cleric. The Legalistic Curse is perfect for this type of character

And of course, he can still be a priest in the church of Asmodeus, even though it doesn't say "Cleric" on his character sheet.

[CraziFuzzy]

Have the rest of the party play undead...

[Haladir]

I really like Conversion Channel, but I agree that the 7d6 channel prereq is WAY too high. If I were the GM of this group, I'd allow that feat with the prereqs as worshiper of Asmodeus and Channel Negative Energy 1d6.

That would solve your problem immediately, and think of the role playing possibilities!

"Worship the Prince of Darkness and be healed... Or feel the sting of his rebuke!"

[Wolfspirit]

Haladir wrote:

I really like Conversion Channel, but I agree that the 7d6 channel prereq is WAY too high. If I were the GM of this group, I'd allow that feat with the prereqs as worshiper of Asmodeus and Channel Negative Energy 1d6.

That would solve your problem immediately, and think of the role playing possibilities!

"Worship the Prince of Darkness and be healed... Or feel the sting of his rebuke!"

I think the Asmodeus Channel was set prohibitively high to discourage people from making an all Asmodeus group that allowed the Cleric to easily dip into getting healing out Channel Negative Energy.

[NerdforChrist777]

Mavrickindigo wrote:

I have a character who wants to be a LN cleric of asmodeus, but wants to use channel positive energy. We figured out maybe having a feat that lets the character do it as a cleric of a lower level, but I was wondering if there are already rules and feats or spells out there a cleric of asmodeus can use to achieve similar effects?

Unfortunately there is no way to do this by core rules or any official documented paizo publication that I am aware of. There is a Feat Called "Versatile Channeler" but this is exclusively for neutral clerics of neutral deities (or no deity). There is nothing to say that he cannot heal people. He just has to prepare healing spells and use them within the realms of asmodean law, for example your friend could not heal people of chaotic good alignment. Also, worship of Asmodeus allows access to the spells "Infernal Healing" and "Greater Infernal Healing". In terms of channel energy the best he could do would be to convert his party to the worship of Asmodeus and then select the "Conversion Channel" feat at thirteenth level (or as early as 9th level if your GM is nice and allows a technicality with a "Phylactery of negative channeling"). IF all else fails you can try to have the entire group be an undead, Asmodeus probably wouldn't have issue with that. But when it comes right down to it, an Asmodean Cleric will never be able to channel positive energy. Hope this helped you.

[Zhayne]

Tcho Tcho wrote:

Yes, we all know you don't like allignments but you should make people reading the forum aware of the fact that your advice is not pf legal.

We're in Advice, not Rules, so that's irrelevant.

Also, everything I said is completely true. Cure and Inflict spells don't have alignment descriptors, and neither does Channel Energy.

[The Human Diversion]

I could have sworn that you can be a LN character worshiping a LE deity and thus choose to channel positive, but maybe I'm thinking of 3.5

[James Jacobs]

Seadin wrote:

Despite what the rules under cleric say, in Pathfinder #64 you will find a cleric of Zon-Kuthon who is LN and channels positive energy. Whether this is a special case, the result of his alternate interpretation of his god, or just a mistake, I don't know. But if it was intended, then I don't see why a cleric of Asmodeus couldn't do the same thing.

That's a relatively special case.

You need GM approval to do something like that with a PC... I suggest you still need to be a non-evil cleric in order to justify this, even if you worship an evil deity.

The Zon-Kuthon cleric in #64 who does this is indeed a pretty unique individual who has that exception for story reasons, but frankly, I don't think that allowing a lawful neutral cleric of Asmodeus the ability to channel positive energy instead of negative energy is particularly game breaking NOR flavor breaking.

Can't do it in PFS, of course, but in a home game, I say go for it! With GM approval, of course.

[Tcho Tcho]

To Zhayne:

This is the official paizo forum where people come for official advice, not your houserules.

[Christopher Van Horn]

Check out the Unholy Barrister. I think it will provide what you are looking for. :D

[Arachnofiend]

Tcho Tcho wrote:

To Zhayne:

This is the official paizo forum where people come for official advice, not your houserules.

I love how your post was immediately superseded by "official advice" suggesting that the OP institute a house rule allowing the positive channeling.

Not everything about the game is going to be perfect for every table! Unless you're playing with the Society, house rules can and probably should be written!

[Zhayne]

Tcho Tcho wrote:

To Zhayne:

This is the official paizo forum where people come for official advice, not your houserules.

If this was for 'official' advice, then only Paizo staff members would be allowed to post here. This is very obviously and intentionally intended for 'hey, guys, what do you think?' conversations.

Also, N.B. that Mr. Jacobs and I agree that the house rule is fine. Do you need more 'official' than that?

So blow it out your (censored).

[James Jacobs]

Please be friendly folks! The game is best played when everyone's having fun! House rules can be a part of that fun, and the game is often better for it when the rules are adjusted and adapted to fit individual play styles. EVERYONE at Paizo uses house rules in their games for that reason.

Please don't use phrases like "blow it out your (censored)." That doesn't help anyone.

We're all gamers. Let's be nice to each other!

HUGS!!!

[Mystically Inclined]

*Is tromping by the forums. Notices James Jacob's name under a post for the Advice forum.*

*Gets Very Very Excited. James Jacobs on the advice forum? This must be seen! What wonders will be unveiled?*

*Sees the post is asking forum goers to play nicely with each other.*

*Is Very Very Sad.*

Edit: *Sees that James Jacobs posted earlier in the thread... is slightly less sad*

[The Human Diversion]

Mystically Inclined wrote:

*Is tromping by the forums. Notices James Jacob's name under a post for the Advice forum.*

*Gets Very Very Excited. James Jacobs on the advice forum? This must be seen! What wonders will be unveiled?*

*Sees the post is asking forum goers to play nicely with each other.*

*Is Very Very Sad.*

Edit: *Sees that James Jacobs posted earlier in the thread... is slightly less sad*

Dude, he said "hugs" - is that not enough for you?

ARE YOU NOT AMUSED?!?!?!

[Tcho Tcho]

I'm not against houserules, i'm against "helping" people by giving a them illegal advise without saying it isn't legal. Advising someone to ask his gm for a houserule is something different then telling him he can just go ahead and do it because you don't like the rule.

Ps This forum also has rules, guess you didn't like those either?

[Zhayne]

I inferred from the phrasing he has used thus far that he IS the GM.

If this is not the case, then yes, my advice would be different.

[Greylurker]

I've played a LN Asmodian Cleric myself (a Heretic who focused on Asmodeus as god of Contracts and Lawyers) and not having the Possitive channel hurts so you really need to focus on healing with Spells, Potions, Wands and even the Heal skill.

I found that I ended up using spells for Healing and Buffing and my Channel became my primary offensive weapon.

['Sani]

James Jacobs wrote:

Please be friendly folks! The game is best played when everyone's having fun! House rules can be a part of that fun, and the game is often better for it when the rules are adjusted and adapted to fit individual play styles. EVERYONE at Paizo uses house rules in their games for that reason.

Please don't use phrases like "blow it out your (censored)." That doesn't help anyone.

We're all gamers. Let's be nice to each other!

HUGS!!!

How can you hug, with those tiny little T-rex arms?

[James Jacobs]

'Sani wrote:

James Jacobs wrote:

Please be friendly folks! The game is best played when everyone's having fun! House rules can be a part of that fun, and the game is often better for it when the rules are adjusted and adapted to fit individual play styles. EVERYONE at Paizo uses house rules in their games for that reason.

Please don't use phrases like "blow it out your (censored)." That doesn't help anyone.

We're all gamers. Let's be nice to each other!

HUGS!!!

How can you hug, with those tiny little T-rex arms?

T-rex arm education link. (Warning—NSFW language in the text!)

Enjoy!

[Tcho Tcho]

Dear OP. Sorry we ruined your thread.

The answers to you question is:
1. Houserule
2. 3th party book.
3. All Asmodeus party, inner sea gods feat
4. Undead party.

"Blowes it out his censored"

[AndIMustMask]

or you know, play something not a cleric but still fitting in flavor, like the life oracle idea.

either way, there's several ways to go about it.

[Mystic_Snowfang]

If everyone plays Dhampires, then there is no problem

[Caimbuel]

Fiendish Vessel (Cleric) if party is evil

[AndIMustMask]

that or black-blooded oracles, or anyone else with negative energy affinity (theres an antipaladin archetype that gets that--knight of the sepulcher, iirc).

actually, what ARE all the ways to gain negative energy affinity, or some way to change positive to negative or vice-versa (there's a necklace that does that, iirc) there's that one 'kiss' feat (i forget the name) that lets you count people as undead for a while for negative energy healing/positive energy damage that could be used as well.

[Taku Ooka Nin]

Mystic_Snowfang wrote:

If everyone plays Dhampires, then there is no problem

This or Tieflings with the ability to be healed by positive or negative energy in the place of Darkness.

[Val'bryn2]

Have him, in flavor, worship Asmodeus, but in rules, worship the order, discipline, and law that Asmodeus represents, as a LN cleric Channeling positive energy, but having his domains selected as ones that Asmodeus would grant. He may not worship Asmodeus, per se, but he reveres him above all others.

[Tcho Tcho]

Val'bryn2 wrote:

Have him, in flavor, worship Asmodeus, but in rules, worship the order, discipline, and law that Asmodeus represents, as a LN cleric Channeling positive energy, but having his domains selected as ones that Asmodeus would grant. He may not worship Asmodeus, per se, but he reveres him above all others.

Will asmo still grand him devine powers? Raw I think he doesn't.

[Glutton]

The party can take the feat necromantic affinity. Doesn't work on channel, but inflict spells still work (why the wonky wording? I'm not sure you can heal someone with this feat with a harm spell.)

[Val'bryn2]

RAW doesn't really cover if the gods grant power. After all, if gods are the only source, where do they clerics of ideals come from? And they do exist in Pathfinder.

[The Shining Fool]

James Jacobs wrote:

'Sani wrote:

James Jacobs wrote:

Please be friendly folks! The game is best played when everyone's having fun! House rules can be a part of that fun, and the game is often better for it when the rules are adjusted and adapted to fit individual play styles. EVERYONE at Paizo uses house rules in their games for that reason.

Please don't use phrases like "blow it out your (censored)." That doesn't help anyone.

We're all gamers. Let's be nice to each other!

HUGS!!!

How can you hug, with those tiny little T-rex arms?

T-rex arm education link. (Warning—NSFW language in the text!)

Enjoy!

I am now imagining James Jacobs with arms "strong enough to bone a T. rex with." Which is somehow weirder than imagining him *as* a T. Rex.