Confessions of a Burnt Out Dungeon Master

[Master_of_Plataea]

I have posted this on the DnD forums, but I thought I'd post it here as well to see what my Paizo friends think. Enjoy.

Be advised! This post is part rant, part ramble, and part instructive notes, hopefully, on how NOT to DM. This is drawn from my experiences alone and does not necessarily mean the things that did not work for me won't work for you. I intend this as a warning to young DMs; however, some shared stories or possible solutions from older DMs would be greatly appreciated. You have been forewarned.

My name is, well it's irrelevant, but for the sake of any possible repliers, call me Canis (it's easier to type than Master_of_Plataea). I've played in two editions as well as Pathfinder and DM'd for PF for two years.

In only two years, I've started and cut short too many games to recall, most of which were generic, cookie cutter adventures that any novice could have ran, but not I. Why, you may ask? Simply put, I couldn't see the forest for the trees. I was so caught up in unimportant details "The devil's in the details," goes the old adage, and for me, there were always endless details. The best way to explain this is to give one of my better, terrible DM moments as an example:

In one of my first games, I was using a premade adventure to supplement my homebrew campaign. I was making a few NPCs to really flesh out some encounters, I was trying to look like a well put together DM for my group. Vanity, thy name is Canis (mistake 1.) As a sidenote, I choose to make a level 2 NPC from scratch because, according to my reasoning, all "real" DMs made their own NPCs so I had to do it to be like them (mistake 2.) Before I had even rolled a stat, I ran into a roadblock: what is this NPC's name? Yes, I know those who read this will probably laugh at something this trivial but at the time, this was a serious problem. So what do I do? The only thing I can do, dangit, I fire up the ole' web browser and look for names (mistake 3.) Completely abandoning stat creation, I launch into a two hour search for the "perfect name." Not just a name that sounds cool, oh no, too easy. This name must be racially correct, as well as correct for class, place of origin, and alignment. Why? Because that is how you do it, according to my naive reasoning (mistake 4.) After researching countless campaign settings, mythologies, and regional name guides, I finally gave up and went to bed, assuring myself I'd "get around to it soon." (Mistake 5)

I never got around to doing any preperation, showed up to the session with no idea of what I was going to do, and ended up cutting the night short. The adventure lasted two more sessions before I scrapped it altogether. Not one of my finer moments.

To wrap up, let me return to my example and explain the mistakes I made (for those young DMs who may not fully grasp these mistakes and maybe even for some of you older DMs who have some idea of what is about to come):

Mistake 1: Rather than trying to impress your players with how acccurately you can quote rules or how prepared you are, let your adventure "do the talking." A lackluster adventure with a rules lawyer in the DM's seat will lose everytime in a contest with an awesome adventure run by a DM with a working knowledge of the game. In other words, don't try to memorize every rule, learn naturally as you DM.

Mistake 2: Use the resources at hand rather than tailor making NPCs just to ensure every last skill point is where you want it. Most NPCs won't matter in 3 sessions.

Mistake 3: Avoid needless distractions during prep time. Set attainable goals, work at your own pace, and don't overload yourself with too much at once.

Mistake 4: Don't try to make every NPC, village, or region completely perfect. Your players will rarely, or more likely never, notice that the orc they just killed doesn't have an orc name.

Mistake 5: Before stopping prep, evaluate what you have completed and consider if more prep is needed to ensure a good session. If you don't think you have enough to run with, set time aside within the next few days.

I think that about does it for this post. Thanks for anyone who struggles through the ramble and I hope it helps someone out there.

-Canis

[WhipShire]

I hear ya. I play with a group of 6-8 players and 5 of them are of enough experience and skill to DM but majority of the work falls to two of us. its easy to get burned out. I came to the realization about the "Devil in the Details" a while ago... Take a day to prep a village with NPC in all the right areas for the PC to interact with... 5 minutes in the village and they are in bed and leave the next morning without even checking out... wasted of a good night of prep.

I will give you a great +1 for going out of your way to try and create a very detailed game for your players. Its a fine line between too much and not enough.

[Squawk Featherbeak]

Ahaha... I remember when I was so caught up in making my own town, I tried to get as much pages as the Cheliax book. Fair enough, I made a 4 page document on said town, complete with government, organizations, and monuments. I may use it for reasons outside of Pathfinder.

[psionichamster]

Glad you learned from your experiences.

Nowadays, I roll with the flow, and reserve my creative energies for neat stuff at the table.

For example, the magic sword the party just acquired has no sheath, and cuts through the standard ones available. When using divination magic, they get images of water, green, and weird faerie creatures. Later on, they find the missing sheath, which is essentially a column of water with a belt, and get some plot exposition at the same time.

If, instead, I had elaborated on the sword, it wouldn't jab had the same impact...oh hey, a +4 sword. That's cool, lemme stash it with the other backup weapons...

[Hecknoshow]

When I think of a cool idea for an encounter or location I design it and put it aside for later use. Then when I'm running a game I check through the locations and encounters I've done up to see if any of them fit well. They usually require a bit of tweaking, but it can cut down on the stress of preparation. I do the same with NPC's and I collect names that I think are interesting.

The best thing about this approach, for me at least, is that if the players rush through the area, or just gloss over it, it can go back in the pile for later use.

I don't stat most NPC's unless they'll be getting into combat. I'll work out their key skills, the blacksmiths craft check for example, and pretty much ignore the rest. If combat comes up most people will hide and then flee once able.

[Nochtal Balzer]

It took me quite some times, and during this time, I did almost no GM'ing of my own. But I built my own world filled with locations and NPC's. This way, they are all already there. And now that I'm running a campaign in that world, its very easy. Very low prep required.

[Master_of_Plataea]

To bring this thread up to speed with my Wotc thread, I'll go ahead and post my second big post.

In my first post, I touched on preparation for a game, NPCs, and not losing yourself in the details. While I will talk about these subjects in the future, today I want to talk about the most important, and often most difficult, responsibiluty of a Dungeon Master: creating an adventure.

For me, this has always been my Achilles heel. I’ll have an idea for an adventure, then I reach a wall and am unable to progress the storyline any further. That’s usually when I tell my players to roll new characters. This is one of those times when player input is crucial. Ask your players what they want to play and really listen. Then, use their ideas to spark an adventure. Don’t be ashamed if you reach a wall. Talk to your players, post in the forums for ideas, or take a break to recharge. If you still can’t think of anything, look to published adventures for ideas or use the entirety of the published adventure to “fill the gap” in your campaign. Speaking of different types of adventure (segue alert).

In my experience, there are three main ways to approach this aspect of DMing: 1) Run a Homebrew adventure, 2) Run a published adventure, 3) or run a mix of the first two. I have always opted for way 3. This way of DMing has its pros and cons. For inexperienced DMs, the cons can outweigh the pros. If you are new to DMing, start of with a pre-made adventure; it’s the best way to “get your feet wet.” As a young DM, choosing options 1 or 3 can lead to disastrous consequences. Example:

I decided to run a level one adventure; we started off with a simple plot: rescue the princess. (Mario’s been doing it since 1985, so it can’t be that hard to make something from that premise, right? Oh no, not me, too easy.) I began the adventure with this plan: I’ll make it up, night by night (Mistake 1). I decided to use this homebrew adventure as a lead in to another adventure. My players got to the dungeon, annihilated my carefully laid dungeon and soon reached the Big Bad Evil Guy, BBEG. That’s when I hit the wall. So what do I do? I doubled the BBEG’s CR and made him pull punches to capture the PCs (Mistake 2). Flash forward three levels and we find my PCs working for a villian named Risir who has them search a dungeon for a mythical sword said to contain the essence of a dragon who slew a God in combat (Mistake 3.0). Oh it gets better. Within this dungeon, not only is there one obscenely powerful weapon, there are three (Mistake 3.5). The PCs recover all three and what do you think they do with them? Use them of course. Next session, the PCs were visited by a god who told them they must take the weapons to a certain location and hand them over to a certain NPC. They had no choice in the matter (Mistake 4). The adventure lasted two more sessions before I scrapped it.

Mistake breakdown: (for the sake of ease of typing, I will abbreviate mistake as M.)
[list]

M-1: For any adventure, have at least a rough draft of where you want it to go. Do not make a habit of “making it up as you go along,” as this will come back to bite you.

M-2: Don't build up a quest only to intentionally make your players fail. This takes the fun out of the game. Let the players decide the outcome. No adventure should end with the mentality, "I'm the DM, do as I want or I'll kill your character."

M-3.0/3.5: Never give your PCs ungodly powerful weapons and expect them not to use them. This type of unbalance within a game will upset combat. Especially don't give PCs multiple ungodly powerful weapons. Now instead of one game breaker, you have several.

M-4: This is akin to M-1 but is a deeper problem than taking options away from your players. This type of action is a Deus ex machina (wikipedia it). Use of this type of plot device makes your players think that they have no power over what their character does, as the DM resorts to piss poor plot devices to make something he wants happen. Conversely, over use of this can foster thoughts of, "It doesn't matter what we do, the DM will get us out of it," from your players.

In the end, it doesn’t matter if you don’t think you did as well as you could have on an adventure; as long as you and your players are having fun then you, my Dungeon Master friend, have succeeded.

Thoughts?

[DM_aka_Dudemeister]

I'm a method 3 GM myself. Using premade adventures for the bones of my campaigns and writing my own stuff for the meat of the campaign. I had tried running completely original campaigns in the past, but the problem with that is you have lots of time to prep the first adventure and knock everyone's socks off, but writing 4 hours of entertainment a week while also studying/working/spending time with family and friends becomes impossible.

Aim for fun and simple to adjudicate for your sidequests and you'll be right.

Think of writing for home games as impressionist painting, you paint the broad strokes, the players own imagination colours in the small details.

[WhipShire]

DM_aka_Dudemeister wrote:

I'm a method 3 GM myself. Using premade adventures for the bones of my campaigns and writing my own stuff for the meat of the campaign. I had tried running completely original campaigns in the past, but the problem with that is you have lots of time to prep the first adventure and knock everyone's socks off, but writing 4 hours of entertainment a week while also studying/working/spending time with family and friends becomes impossible.

Aim for fun and simple to adjudicate for your sidequests and you'll be right.

Think of writing for home games as impressionist painting, you paint the broad strokes, the players own imagination colours in the small details.

I agree. I usually start my games with a published adventure and go off into homebrew and down the road another published one.

[Sowde Da'aro]

Not a DM, and maybe never a DM, but I will Dot this.

[Hecknoshow]

Master_of_Plataea wrote:

M-1: For any adventure, have at least a rough draft of where you want it to go. Do not make a habit of “making it up as you go along,” as this will come back to bite you.

I occasionally do this, though I make a point of taking notes ofwhatever I make up so I can stay consistent.

Master_of_Plataea wrote:

M-2: Don't build up a quest only to intentionally make your players fail. This takes the fun out of the game. Let the players decide the outcome. No adventure should end with the mentality, "I'm the DM, do as I want or I'll kill your character."

I almost, completely agree with this. While the players should be able to decide the outcome, you can stack the odds against them, just make sure they get a chance later to fix things or get revenge.

Master_of_Plataea wrote:

M-3.0/3.5: Never give your PCs ungodly powerful weapons and expect them not to use them. This type of unbalance within a game will upset combat. Especially don't give PCs multiple ungodly powerful weapons. Now instead of one game breaker, you have several.

Agreed, though an Intelligent ungodly powerful weapon that can withhold its powers can be fun, though hard to do right.

Master_of_Plataea wrote:

M-4: This is akin to M-1 but is a deeper problem than taking options away from your players. This type of action is a Deus ex machina (wikipedia it). Use of this type of plot device makes your players think that they have no power over what their character does, as the DM resorts to piss poor plot devices to make something he wants happen. Conversely, over use of this can foster thoughts of, "It doesn't matter what we do, the DM will get us out of it," from your players.

I've seen people walk from games because of this, and I've been tempted myself.

[Richard Leonhart]

my motto for gamemastering is wwhd , what would Homer (Simpson) do?
I do a halfe-arse job with DMing, and everyone is having fun.
I'm glad you share your problems with us, as they are more educational than some things in the GM-manual. You seem to have noticed where you mistakes are, but I wonder if you are capable of correcting them, as you seem to be more of a Ned Flanders whose religion is RPGs.

[Master_of_Plataea]

That was and is my preferred method as a DM. Back when this story took place, however, I should have used a pre-made. I jumped in feet first and nearly drowned, to speak metaphorically.

In the time that's passed, I like to think that I've gotten better, but this thread, and thinking about my games makes me realize how much I have to learn. In the end, though, that's what this thread is about. Taking a hard look at myself and fixing what's broken.

[Master_of_Plataea]

The Ned Flanders thing made me laugh, but I don't watch much of the Simpsons, so I definitely want an explanation on that one Richard. lol

[Richard Leonhart]

the Simpsons analogy was that you take everything too serious, you overplan, you overthink and you assume that everything runs smoothly. You know how to plan the game perfectly in every little detail.
You just forgot one little thing, it's about having casual fun with your friends.
You would be perfect to write premade adventure paths, but you seemingly lack(ed) the ability to improvise and just go with whatever takes your fancy.

Simpsons: Homer is a bad father, yet his children love him and they have tons of fun. Ned Flanders leads the perfect moral life and his children think the most fun you can have is to stay at home and pray.

btw. M-2 is not always true: I once had my players taken by a slave trader because they nagged about something, they were stripped of all their equipment and barely got free. Afterwards they were angry with themself as they tought they could have prevented it and one even (wrongly) "remembered" that I did some hidden rolls for bluffs. They were very motivated to take revenge.
My "moral": if you players are good enough to best every adventure, make some where they have to fail, but use it when their guard is down.

[Master_of_Plataea]

Let me clarify something from my original post. I just now noticed it, thanks Richard. In my first post, I use the phrase, "In one of my first games..." That should actually read, "In my first game DMing, with three first time players." That whole first quest was full of fail lol

And I agree with you Richard. Sometimes, failure is a much better motivator than success.

[Azoun The Sage]

Interesting...

I prefer Homebrew personnally, it gives me more freedom with creation of the story. I normally use the first adventure to 'unite' the PC's to one another; give them a common goal. Through out the next course of adventures I start throwing in things that are more specific to each PC so that in the end the story 'seems' to be their destiny all along to be involved in.

I've gotten no complaints from my players and several compliments. Actually at the moment i'm on a short break from DMing so I can study for some work related issues, at least one time each of my players has asked, "So when are we getting back to your campaign? I really want to see how X plays out in the end". X being the part of the story that is more focused on their character or theirs and anothers.

Oddly enough when I first started DMing, (for my father and his friends; they were my first group), the only big 'bad' thing I got was: "You need to not pull your punches, if the dice roll up PC dies, let them die, we as PC's will decide to rez or whatever. In the end don't be afraid to kill PC's." And honestly that little bit there probably took me about 3 years to get over and really understand.

*tosses two cents in the jar

[Egoish]

Some good advice in here, i'd like to offer a few anecdotes as well.

GMing pathfinder you have to be prepared, monster stat blocks and items etc are all complicated and only get more complicated as you level up. Random encounters are the worst for this as if they are truely random it will show and you will not be prepared.

However i ran a sucessful deadlands game in savage worlds based entirely on the premise of get the macguffin back that got robbed from the train you were on. This game lasted 5 months (about 20 3 hour sessions) and i to this day still don't know what the macguffin does (i'm saving that for part 2). That was possible due to the system being simpler and ad hocing stats being easier.

When it comes to npc's i don't fuss about names, i roll them out from people i've talked to at work in the week who's name stuck with me (Countess Maria Funibotom was a real person lol) and use a notebook to keep track of names and people i've made up. If i suspect a fight will start istat them up or give them an escape mechanism and make them impossible to find until next week when i've stated them up (my group once spent 2 sessions trying to find a gnome illusionist cause they were having so much fun trying to find him that actually finding him would have sucked).

I actually prefer running modified (sometimes heavily) pre written content, since my group are quite optimised i need to modify and i've grown to enjoy it more than actual writing. If a GM is a better actor, storyteller and comedian than writer thats exactly what he needs to be, writing is overrated since most of rpgming is presentation.

[mplindustries]

Ok, so I just found this whole thing really amusing, not becuase I find your suffering funny or anything, but beacause almost everything you list as a mistake is something I do and consider totally essential.

Master_of_Plataea wrote:

Mistake 1: Rather than trying to impress your players with how acccurately you can quote rules or how prepared you are, let your adventure "do the talking." A lackluster adventure with a rules lawyer in the DM's seat will lose everytime in a contest with an awesome adventure run by a DM with a working knowledge of the game. In other words, don't try to memorize every rule, learn naturally as you DM.

I think most gamers that know me would categorize me as a rules lawyer. I'm not obnoxious about it or anything, I just make it a point to know all the rules, and I enjoy analyzing them for interactions and whatnot. Most of the games I've seen fail actually, were because a GM didn't really understand the rules or the implications of certain rules combinations.

Case in point: Another guy in my group ran a session of Traveller. The session required that we be overwhelmed and captured by an assault force of some kind. Obviously, what he should have done was just say that we were overwhelmed and not make us roll out a futile encounter. However, it still could have worked had we actually been taken out. Unfortunately, he did not realize before the session started that we literally could not be taken alive due to our armor. D'oh. Game ended before it really began.

Master_of_Plataea wrote:

Mistake 2: Use the resources at hand rather than tailor making NPCs just to ensure every last skill point is where you want it. Most NPCs won't matter in 3 sessions.

I always use custom npcs in every rpg I run. I never used a monster manual or other game equivalent--not once in 18+ years of running games. I think the problem is fussing over minute details rather than the important stuff. I actually create most of my custom npcs off the cuff.

You're right that you don't need to place every last skill point--hell, chances are, you don't need to place any skill points, because they're unlikely to matter. And if it comes up, you can make the decision on the fly whether said NPC would really have put ranks in Perception or Spellcraft or whatever.

Master_of_Plataea wrote:

Mistake 3: Avoid needless distractions during prep time. Set attainable goals, work at your own pace, and don't overload yourself with too much at once.

I think at this point, it is important to mention that there are multiple GM styles. Your style, clearly, is that of the planner. Mine is the "asspuller." I don't "prep" my games the way you're talking. I think about them, sure, but generally it's in the shower, on the drive to work and back, when I'm bored at work, etc. I don't write anything down if I can help it.

And this is where that rules lawyering can really help you. If you know the rules like the back of your hand, you can create stats on the fly, because most of it follows patterns.

Master_of_Plataea wrote:

Mistake 4: Don't try to make every NPC, village, or region completely perfect. Your players will rarely, or more likely never, notice that the orc they just killed doesn't have an orc name.

Oh, this is fantastic advice. Only care about what the PCs care about. My NPCs get names when, and only when, PCs ask them--or I guess when another NPC refers to them. Same with my towns, countries, kings, whatever.

There is nothing behind the door at the end of the hall until a PC opens it.

Master_of_Plataea wrote:

Mistake 5: Before stopping prep, evaluate what you have completed and consider if more prep is needed to ensure a good session. If you don't think you have enough to run with, set time aside within the next few days

Again, styles--planners need to do this. Others might not.

Master_of_Plataea wrote:

M-1: For any adventure, have at least a rough draft of where you want it to go. Do not make a habit of “making it up as you go along,” as this will come back to bite you.

Not if you're awesome at "making it up as you go along." I've actually tried to plan a handful of times, just to see the other side of things, and it failed miserably--I was bored by my own story because I knew what was going to happen next and everything felt inevitable.

But when I run everything off the top of my head, I can make a surprisingly deep web of intrigue. As long as I figure out how it all connects before the players do, it's all good.

Master_of_Plataea wrote:

M-2: Don't build up a quest only to intentionally make your players fail. This takes the fun out of the game. Let the players decide the outcome. No adventure should end with the mentality, "I'm the DM, do as I want or I'll kill your character."

I could not agree more, but as a quick bit of advice to tack on here:

Only roll the dice if something interesting will happen regardless of success or failure. If you want to run a session about the PCs breaking out of jail, don't roll through their capture, because they might avoid it and you'll just look like a heavy handed jerk forcing them in. Just cutscene--say, "you were captured by X" or whatever and start with them in jail. This makes them feel heroic and awesome for escaping, but doesn't make them feel crappy and weak for getting captured.

Master_of_Plataea wrote:

M-3.0/3.5: Never give your PCs ungodly powerful weapons

My personal advice would end here. I am weird, but I generally totally avoid magic items in my games (and it works because I custom-create my NPCs, so CR is irrelevant anyway).

Interesting side note about god-killing weapons:

I once ran a very long game in which the PC party acquired a single god-killing weapon at level 2. It was the only special item the party had for the entire duration of the game. Do you know what its stats were? It was just an unbreakable Falchion that was able to kill gods. No +X to hit or damage, no special weapon abilities, no other properties.

MacGuffins can fulfill their MacGuffiny purpose without necessarily being especially powerful (or even useful) for other tasks.

[Mark Hoover]

OMG I've just gone through almost the same things in my own game! I was running a game part homebrew, part published for a bunch of players and made almost all the same gaffs. I have spent 2 hours looking for the "perfect" name only to get distracted and go to bed. Heck I'll go you one better: I had a 15 minute debate with my 2 daughters trying to get their help coming up with some silly fey names for fantasy tree types! I say debate because I actually argued with some of their suggestions.

I've been the overprepped GM, the underprepped GM, the killer GM, all of it. In the end, just before the game imploded I was railroading the party pretty shamelessly to hurry through one plot since I was...TRYING TO WEAVE 2 MAJOR PLOTS over each other! If you ever want to watch your player's eyes glaze over ask them to follow the storyline of a BBEG plaguing the town they're based in with lots of little but deadly threats WHILE AT THE SAME TIME keep up with the encroaching war of the nobles to the south which clues and portents point to being orchestrated by an ancient dragon that the party is somehow connected to (in 5 levels I hadn't firmly established the connection in order to have them keep after the BBEG)

Now the obvious answer is: make the BBEG a henchman of the dragon right? OH NO! Way too easy! The players I'm dealing with are highly intellegent grown ups I need to challenge their minds. So instead BBEG and dragon are competing for the same goal; domination of the area. BBEG is Chaotic Evil, dragon is Lawful Evil, so they and their plots/minions/etc are all based around primal law/chaos structures. And I'm killing myself, 5 hours a week, with family life, work and all the rest, trying to weave these delicate plots together with the law/chaos themes, deeper themes of family and nobility, interconnecting them with subtle intrigue, political wrangling, and all of that.

In the immortal words of Agent Smith: It was a DISASTER! Whole crops were lost as they wouldn't accept the program!

In other words I was forgetting the cardinal rule of EVERY GM and EVERY writer since the dawn of time: REMEMBER YOUR AUDIENCE! I had forgotten that my highly intellegent and adult friends also have lives, families and stresses, met only once a month instead of obsessing over the material several times a week as I did and wanted their game cinematic in style (and I should add by "cinema" their favorite films involve zombies, high-speed car chases and combat tournaments involving a short dancer from Brussels...)

Add to this the very personal issue that all 4 players have extremely differing styles and 2 of them played total opposite characters (a palladin and an evil necromancer...its in a different thread out there) and I don't know how I kept the game going as long as I did.

...Ok, so I was a terrible GM. But I have learned! We're on a break from RPG's for a while. I'm taking the next couple months to seek out new players, take my game back to 1 and reboot. I have some ideas for levels 1-3 but rather than obsess over details I'm plotting it out outline style with key scenes the party will hit come heck or high water.

For instance: the very opening will be goblins trapping folks in a flaming guildhouse as the party happens to be in the area. There's a fight with some goblins in an alley and then...freeze screen: 2 decision paths appear - follow the one on the roof back to a nearby sewer lair or help the guard and citizens free the guildmembers. Each decision will lead to a 5-room type dungeon scenario and involve fights, skill challenges and such but in 2 radically different styles. At the end of these optional scenes the clues/npc speeches/villain warnings etc inevitably both lead to a dungeon outside of town.

My current players have all told me they don't need a "theme" or grandiose plot, so there is none right now except what any of them read into it. At the end of 3 levels the final scene has them blow up an evil portal and take some permanent hinderance but also pick up some cool power from it. I don't really know what to do with levels 4-6 but I have some vague idea that it'll involve using their powers.

Listen to your players and act on their answers. Also, and this is so simple but easily forgotten in a hectic online world, have a character gen session. EVERY really successful or memorable campaign I've run always started this way and it really brings everyone together both as players AND characters. Also this gives you a chance as GM to get to know where the party as a whole wants to go.

And one last thing on the bringing in ungodly powerful weapons thing: yes, 3 is too many. But bring in one and then take it away from the party after it does its job. Not "a god swoops in and plucks away the sword" but in a reasonable way. For example my brother when we were kids ran a game called Rifts and in it our party unearthed this MASSIVELY powerful 50' tall robot vehicle called an Abolisher. We needed it to help close a rift by sending a demon-thing back through. Anyway, he made a point of telling us that the rift was over a badlands/desert type area.

Now, the Abolisher walks everywhere; quickly mind you but it walks. We did our job, beat the monster and closed the rift. In the ensuing release of energy a gigantor sandstorm kicked up and our sensors were damaged. But what the heck; WE'RE IN A FREAKIN ABOLISHER! We wander off and at the beginning of the next session the Abolisher hits a conveniently placed sinkhole in the wasteland and begins descending. We tried EVERYTHING to save that dang thing; in the end it was futile but we did get some cool stuff from its inner compartments. The point is: it did what we needed it to and then my brother took it away in a perfectly plausible manner. I've had god fights with artifact swords where in the end the sword bent, extra-dimensional spaces suddenly attacked to loose powerful items stored there (perfectly legal in the description of said spell) and of course the Abolisher incident. Think of how many times the ONE ring changed hands before a petty hobbit strangled his buddy for it in a stream and then lost it at random to a thief.

The main thing I pulled from Cannis' posts is that almost everything's fixable but when it's not it just means you learn from your mistake and grow as a GM and a human being. What's the old saying? Failure is another word for opportunity? Something like that. Just listen to the Chairman: Pick yourself up, Dust yourself off, and get Back in the Race... That's Life!

[mplindustries]

Mark Hoover wrote:

For instance: the very opening will be goblins trapping folks in a flaming guildhouse as the party happens to be in the area. There's a fight with some goblins in an alley and then...freeze screen: 2 decision paths appear - follow the one on the roof back to a nearby sewer lair or help the guard and citizens free the guildmembers. Each decision will lead to a 5-room type dungeon scenario and involve fights, skill challenges and such but in 2 radically different styles.

So, let's say you enter a dungeon and arrive at a T intersection. You have decided that, down the left path, is a very dangerous Golem. Down the right path is the den of a goblin tribe that has been raiding nearby caravans for months (so there's lots of treasure).

As far as the players can see, the dungeon is essentially featureless--nothing special indicates what might be in either direction. They arbitrarily decide to go left, and they get the crap kicked out of them by a Golem.

The PCs decided to go left, but did they actually have any choice? As far as they were aware, the decision was arbitrary--they had no way to know what was down either corridor and you could have easily switched what they encountered without them realizing it.

There's no purpose to a decision branch that offers no clues or hints as to what might be behind door #1, and there's even less point to preparing two different possibilities for an arbitrary decision when it's not even actually possible to go back and try the other decision.

I guess my point is two-layered:
1) Don't give your players blind choices
2) If you do give your players blind choices, don't waste your time planning multiple outcomes.

[Gerrinson]

Dotting this thread so I can add my 2 cents later.

[Serisan]

My rule on NPCs: The only NPCs that need stats are the ones that the PCs are going to fight. If the PCs decide to fight an NPC that I haven't planned to have them fight, he either simply dies or I make up reasonable stats on the fly, such that most melee strikes will hit if done by a martial character, the NPC is capable of dealing damage as necessary, and that there will be a reasonably interesting set of options for the NPC. This usually means SECRET INQUISITOR!

I take a cinematic approach to NPCs that aren't supposed to be fought in 90% of cases, not requiring rolls. It works well.

That said, our long-standing rule on unimportant NPCs has been they are all named Jim, Bob, and Nebuchadnezzar. Race and gender need not apply.

[Xyll]

I have had similar problems over the years. I have had Micro /Macro issues with extensive information on kingdoms and background but i forgot to make the adventure fun for the players.

I have since changed back to the "organic" approach of offering a base adventure and see what springs from it. Players are great at jumping to conclusions and voicing ideas. From these come some of the best games I have run.

I had two players declare genocide on all halflings after being beaten repeatedly by a band of halfling rogue/highwaymen. Some of the halflings managed to keep surviving and ruining there day. They met them at 1st level and by 10th level they finally killed the last one. This was a simple encounter that turned into a campaign.

[Tinalles]

On naming -- I find my copy of The Writer's Digest Character Naming Sourcebook invaluable. It gives many thousands of names broken down by ethnicity, then male/female, and gives "meanings" for them.

It's not perfect; the "meanings" are often dubious or flat out wrong, and they sometimes put names under the wrong gender in cultures that were not familiar to the compilers. Also, it obviously doesn't include names specifically for fictional races -- elves, gnolls, etc.

But overall, if you just need a name with a good "mouth sound" that roughly fits your setting, it's really handy.

[Tacticslion]

Dot for later.

[Master_of_Plataea]

First off, let me say wow. There were a lot more posts than I expected when I logged on. Thank you all, it does a burnt out DM good to see the support and especially the critiques from my peers. I hope someone, player or DM, has learned something from my ramblings as well as the excellent replies I have received.

I am going through some things in my life right now so I will most likely be posting a lot in the next couple of days as a way of relieving stress. Forewarned is forearmed, my friends.

I will have another big post in an hour or so, hopefully. However, before I put finger to key for this next post, I'd love to see what you, my fellow DMs have problems with, so I can ramble about some of your topics.

Once again, thanks for the support folks.

-Canis

[Malignor]

My DM mistakes

[1]: Don't write your plot out from beginning to end. You'll sabotage your own mind and end up railroading the players, and they'll lose interest in a story they can't really have any power over.
INSTEAD just write out what the NPCs do, and then add to it after every session based on what the session results were.

[2]: Don't make PC-centric stories that are only about one PC. The others will ask why they're even there, and lose interest. Try to do things that make them all interested at once, even if it's petty greed or pride.

[3]: Don't create puzzles for your players that are mandatory to figure out. Puzzles are okay if the plot doesn't rely on them being solved, because then your game doesn't self-destruct when the group gets too annoyed, bored or frustrated to solve it.

[Master_of_Plataea]

Scratch that last post. I am at the hospital with my mother and sister as patients and I'm having to float between the two so I will not be able to post until I'm able to sit down for two seconds.

I'll catch ya'll later.

-Canis

[Azoun The Sage]

Hope everything is alright Canis; and best wishes to you and your family.

[Shiftybob]

Kudos on being man (or woman) enough to admit this. I think we've all had our shamefully unprepared moments.

Dotting for future elaboration...

[Run, Just Run]

I hope your sister and mother get better, dotting for learning to DM.

[Malignor]

mplindustries wrote:

I guess my point is two-layered:

1) Don't give your players blind choices
2) If you do give your players blind choices, don't waste your time planning multiple outcomes.

What if they do one, then the other?

[Mike Schneider]

This thread should be perma-pinned.

[Shiftybob]

Tough news about your family. I hope your doctors roll all 20s on their heal checks.

[Run, Just Run]

Shiftybob wrote:

Tough news about your family. I hope your doctors roll all 20s on their heal checks.

agreed.

[Gerrinson]

Okay, started this earlier and I'm just getting back to it now.

Let's see. When I started out as a GM, I would write pages of planned plots, events, timelines, etc. I also used to print out the stat blocks for every last NPC and monster they might run into. This took quite a bit of time, but I enjoyed it, so I didn't mind. It also helped that we were on a rotating basis, so I only had to run the game once every few weeks.

Then, I planned out a massive multi-week murder mystery. It wound up running for 5 sessions. At which point, I was asked to take over as permanent GM for that campaign, with one of the others occasionally filling in as guest GM.

The whole time, I would write pages of planned plot development, only to have to scratch out, discard, or rework most of it as the PCs did things that I never expected.

I then adapted a bit, cutting down to writing only a page or two of planned development and leaving some room for crazy PC shenanigans. Though I was still printing out NPC stat blocks and monster stat blocks for basically everything they might run into.

Now, I've realized that improvising and 'going with the flow' is pretty much the best way to run. I plan out the basic events that are taking place in the world as the BBEG or his cohorts go about their business. For each game session, I now write two or three paragraphs of storyline and maybe one or two about general world events that they might notice. I also print up the stat blocks for major NPCs they are going to encounter. Particularly spellcasters. The rest of the game is completely organic improvisation in response to the PCs and their actions.

Much less prep time on my part, they still do whatever they want, and I don't have to skip or rewrite a ton of plot. The one part of preparation that I still write seriously is the specific actions taken by BBEGs that affect the PCs and the BBEG's motivations and rationalizations for doing so. Once I know how the BBEG thinks, then I can easily improvise in game responses as needed.

That's my two cents. And a few dozen words, too.

Also, Canis, sorry to hear about your family. I hope it all works out well.

[Master_of_Plataea]

Hello folks. Momma and sissy are alright and I'm so juiced on stress that I think it's time for another post to relieve some tension. (I didn't know it was even possible to sound like a geek and a redneck in the same sentence. Score one for me!) Thanks to everyone for your kind words. They are well appreciated.

To begin, I must thank Malignor. It is to you that I dedicate this post as your reply is what inspired my next topic: puzzles. Puzzles are, arguably, one of the cornerstones of RPGs as well as the scifi and fantasy genres. Puzzles are one of the most exhilarating, as well as frustrating, aspects of DnD. The question some young DMs pose is simply, “What the hell do you mean by puzzle?” Patience, young padawan, all good things to those who wait.

Puzzles in DnD are plot devices that require logic rather than brute strength, though strength is often involved, in order to solve. Puzzles can take the form of anything, though my favorite kinds are those that require the sacrifice of something important. The best example of good puzzles, as well as a multitude of deadly traps, is the tried and true Tomb of Horror (see notes). In TOH, Gygax shows time and again the value of well made puzzles, and well placed puzzles, which often test a hero’s mettle to insure those who can best the adventure deserve it. That, however, is another post entirely, so back to puzzles in general.

Puzzles can be great additions to any adventure, but, under the right circumstances, can completely break an adventure. I, unfortunately, have killed a campaign for this very reason. As is my style, the following is an actual occurrence from one of my games. (Let me take a few breaths before I enlighten you all to the absolute insanity of my DMing, though I like to think I have improved. One breath, two, three.) Alright, here goes:

wrote:

First, let me set the scene: my PCs were fifteenth level; I was running a homebrew/pre-made adventure, or an option 3 as I call it; most importantly, for your comprehension’s sake, the entire quest was focused around bringing down not one deity, nay nay, but five deities (Mistake 1). The whole premise of the adventure was the discovery that the “gods,” as the mortals knew them, were actually blood descendants of ascended mortals. The quest’s end goal was party ascension, as it is only possible to bring down a god in my campaign setting if you are a god, or at least have god-like power. (I think I may have bouts of pure insanity when I make my adventures; that’s the only explanation.)

The particular night in question was the climax of three sessions worth of dungeon crawl through the (level-adjusted) Tomb of Horrors (Mistake 2). At the end of the tomb, rather than facing the BBEG from the normal Tomb, my PCs were transported to a cavern deep beneath the crust of the world. Within this cavern there resided… A rock! (Cue dramatic music.) Note: this was the only thing within the cavern, no exits or entrances and all forms of magical escape were suppressed (Mistake 3) Now I don’t mean rock as in a pebble from your driveway, I’m talking Stonehenge. What did this rock do you may ask? It contained the essence of a god. Pretty awesome eh? What else did this rock/pokeball-for-deities do? Absolutely nothing. (Mistake 4) So what are the PCs supposed to do? Solve a puzzle and release the energy (Mistake 5). Which they did, and stuff just went down hill from there. The rest of the story, however, is for another day. (Mistake 6)

This is, in my eyes, my worst mistake as a DM. In addition, this is also the least enjoyable session I’ve ever had, whether as a player or DM.

Alright, ya’ll know the drill, mistake breakdown time:

M1- This is not so much a mistake as an instance of, “Too much, too soon.” When thinking about what kind of adventure you wish to run, avoid tackling the biggest, baddest subjects you can. In my experience, fighting a pack of wolves at first level is just as enjoyable, if not more so, as chasing down gods and demons.

M2- This is akin to M1 in that, rather than a mistake, this is more of a “knowing one’s players” problem. The Tomb of Horrors is a thinking group’s quest; my group is more of a hack and slash group. This is a clear example of a DM not listening to his players. The lesson in this: listen to what your players want and mold an adventure around it rather than running something because you like it. This particular instance says to your players, “I don’t care if you’re not enthusiastic about this quest, I like it, I’m the DM, so deal with it.” No one walks away from the table happy in that scenario.

M3- This is a clear case of “rail-roading” your players (no escape means there is only one way out, through the DM’s plot.) Sometimes it’s unavoidable, but it should be avoided whenever possible. Allow your players the freedom to choose for themselves rather than predetermining the outcome. Avoid forcing players to do things “your way, or not at all.”

M4- In the example, I relied on my players picking up on things two sessions earlier and using that knowledge to solve the final encounter. Never rely on players remembering irrelevant, to the task at hand anyways, information in order to solve a problem two or three sessions later. Another reason this is a major problem is that I gave my players no “in-room” help for the task at hand. I’m not saying have writing on the wall that tells the players how to complete the task at hand, but don’t leave your PCs completely clueless.

M5- This is what I call “bottle-necking” an adventure. In other words, your PCs either complete the task at hand in the way you have planned or they fail. Try to have multiple ways of approaching in-game problems and if you must have a one-solution-task, stack the odds in your player’s favors.

M6- This mistake, rather than being drawn from the example is the example in its entirety. This is the ultimate example of how a puzzle can break your game. My players spent hours trying to figure out this puzzle. Why didn’t I help them out? Simply put, the rest of the adventure depended on the PCs solving this puzzle. Everything depended on the PC’s ability to do a single task, a single way. Never, ever do this. There should always be, as I’ve said, multiple approaches for any in game problem. Lastly, as puzzles are the focus of this post, never hinge the entirety of your adventure on a puzzle, or any one thing really. Remember, “There’s more than one way to skin a cat.”

[Adamantine Dragon]

Puzzles are very difficult to play. My general rule is that as the GM the puzzle has to seem blindingly obvious to me for the party to have the remotest chance whatsoever to solve it.

I also pre-plan some heavy hints and try to deliver them in a way that doesn't just give the puzzle away outright.

I use puzzles a lot in my campaigns, and I've found that a few simple puzzles is usually more than enough to make the party feel like a bunch of Sherlock Holmes clones.

It has usually been when I've felt a puzzle is especially clever that I've regretted introducing it.

[Jak the Looney Alchemist]

It has been a long freaking time since I DM'd a game, heck I only started playing pathfinder recently. But the few campaigns that I've run the biggest thing I've learned is while planning out your campaign don't get too attached to any of it. Players are ingenious little bastards and you never want to pull the "It doesn't work because I'm the DM" card.

In an old shadowrun campaign I watched a group get out of a barrage of assassins layered and set to destroy because somebody picked up the phone and called the cops they fortified the door and ate bar food until they arrived. That foul and wicked puzzle you've got set that they're going to have to get the components for the key to open the door to get to the thing. Wizard screams hey I've got planar binding I'll send a insert celestial/infernal being to go get them who wants s'mores while we wait? Barbarian asks hey can I sunder the wall, I know the door is super magical did he thinks to magic the walls? I learned this early on long and intricate plans are great, but don't get too attached to them.

[Master_of_Plataea]

When I first started out, being too attached to my campaign setting was what killed most of my adventures. Listen to the Looney Alchemist, he's on to something there.

Hmmm, I think I'll do a BLP (Big Long Post) about that very subject. Might be a good idea.

[DM_aka_Dudemeister]

I'm very much "roll the dice or say yes" school of GMing, of course since I set the DCs of things this means I'm saying no sometimes but it was nice for the player to try.

In any case I love puzzles, but I also am careful that a puzzle challenges the characters and not the players.

For example:

Spoiler:

A hallway, at the end of which is a door with a sliding puzzle. Now the PCs can solve the sliding puzzle by making DC 10, 15, 20 and 25 Intelligence or Wisdom checks, aid another is allowed, take 20 is allowed, each check takes 1 round. The rub: when the players interfere with the puzzle it triggers a series of spears to abhor up from the ground starting at the opposite end of the hallway. Now the characters are challenged by the puzzle. Trap Perception DC 20+ APL, Disable Device 20 + APL. Reset: Upon puzzle solution. The rogue can then either disable the trap, aid in the Int checks, or climb the walls (DC 20) out of reach of the spear. Good traps and puzzles are about presenting difficult decisions for PCs

[Adamantine Dragon]

DM_aka_Dudemeister wrote:

I'm very much "roll the dice or say yes" school of GMing, of course since I set the DCs of things this means I'm saying no sometimes but it was nice for the player to try.

In any case I love puzzles, but I also am careful that a puzzle challenges the characters and not the players.

For example:

** spoiler omitted **

I tend to make distinctions between puzzles, traps and puzzle-traps.

Creating puzzles that have to be solved by rolling the dice on a DC doesn't appeal to me, because that strikes me as classic roll-playing. Plus I don't like the idea of puzzles being solved or not solved based on capricious rolls of dice.

Also that sounds sooo much like 4e skill challenges, which is one of the things I really, really despise about 4e.

If I'm going to put a puzzle in the game, I want the players to actually puzzle it out. Yes it's best if they can do that in a role playing perspective, but the goal of puzzles is not to give the players another die roll to succeed at, but to get their minds engaged and immerse them in the game play.

[Kelsey MacAilbert]

I feel for you. My gaming group doesn't play Pathfinder so much as we play F*&! You A~&@%@$s: The RPG, so I know burnout. I'll read over your suggestions more carefully. May be useful.

[Caliburn101]

Advice from an OLD GM

OK - some modus operandi that work for me.

Cultures: - Flesh these out with plenty of flavour and specific idiosyncracies. Make a list of male and female cultural names and list the noble houses , arcons, warlords, senators or whatever. List the cities and towns (under a decent naming convention for the same culture) and list no more than 5-6 names for caravanserais, pubs, inns or hostels. List 10 or so sketched NPC vendors and contacts.

It is likely you have enough material to use in ten games with the flexibility to seemlessly name-drop if the PC's go unexpectedly 'off piste' in the adventure.

Plots: - make a spider diagram of the main players and bulletpoint their motivations, favourite methods, goals and connections to each other. A flexible plotline can almost write itself as you go once you have done this - it is far easier to understand that when thread C of your resulting 'plot web' is pulled by action A by the party - what the connected 'movers and shakers' may do in reaction to it.

This allows a non-linear progression through a plotline which truly reacts to player actions (who love the fact their actions actually CHANGE things) with the only other parameter you need to feed in being timeframe.

It does require a list of assets for each mover and shaker (assassins, thugs, troops, scrying ability, political pressure groups, bound outsiders, magical items etc.), but these can be one-line entries with a rulebook page number in many cases.

Locations - dungeons, ruins, castles, sewers etc. are places for plot elements to be in - they should never be 'encounter 4' in a linear progression. Allow the party to cascade through the plot web and get there when they get there.

It is MUCH more fun for the GM seeing how the whole mess works out when you didn't write out the chronology in advance - trust me - the extra work is worth it - both for you, and the players who realise what they do matters and their fates are in their hands!

[Sissyl]

Kelsey MacAilbert wrote:

I feel for you. My gaming group doesn't play Pathfinder so much as we play F%&$ You A##!@$#s: The RPG, so I know burnout. I'll read over your suggestions more carefully. May be useful.

Is that a new game? :-)

[Egoish]

I hate puzzles, badly designed puzzles require player knowledge and interaction to resolve. A well designed puzzle can be solved by characters but very rarely is, for immersion reasons if my players come across a puzzle i normally listen to their RP methods of solving it or give them a selection of skill rolls.

Couple of examples, i was playing in a group and my int 7 barbarian solved the riddle that our wizard (int 22), rogue (14), arcane archer (16) and cleric (wis 22) had spent an hour faffing about with. Another riddle was solved by Google the bardic npc hireling.

A trap another group i was playing in came acorss was defeated by setting the entire room on fire until we heard the trap spring go off, then we had lunch while it cooled down. This was an all fighter party, no trapfinding skill or magic.

In the first case the gm had left no option other than working out the riddle, there were no skill checks for the wizard who had 5 knowledge skills maxed out to work out the answer, hell in an emergency (after the players have RP'd it for ten mins or so and are starting to get bored) i'd have everyone roll perception to "spot the clue".

In the second situation the pre written game we were playing called for a trap, our party spotted it (this should have been impossible and would have resulted in at least one death) but could not disable it. So like the burly facesmashers we were we decided to burn it till it gave up then have a bit of a break while the fire did its job, obviously not how the author intended his trap to be disarmed but it made sense and we had a little character rp while we stacked wood and coated it in lamp oil. Good work from the gm, we still have a laugh about that one now five years later.

[DM_aka_Dudemeister]

Adamantine Dragon wrote:

DM_aka_Dudemeister wrote:

I'm very much "roll the dice or say yes" school of GMing, of course since I set the DCs of things this means I'm saying no sometimes but it was nice for the player to try.

In any case I love puzzles, but I also am careful that a puzzle challenges the characters and not the players.

For example:

** spoiler omitted **

I tend to make distinctions between puzzles, traps and puzzle-traps.

Creating puzzles that have to be solved by rolling the dice on a DC doesn't appeal to me, because that strikes me as classic roll-playing. Plus I don't like the idea of puzzles being solved or not solved based on capricious rolls of dice.

Also that sounds sooo much like 4e skill challenges, which is one of the things I really, really despise about 4e.

If I'm going to put a puzzle in the game, I want the players to actually puzzle it out. Yes it's best if they can do that in a role playing perspective, but the goal of puzzles is not to give the players another die roll to succeed at, but to get their minds engaged and immerse them in the game play.

Not to distract from the main thread for too long, but the thing about puzzles is that the PCs are playing characters with Intelligence/Wisdom and Charisma often much higher or lower than their own. So a puzzle or a riddle would either be trivial, or next to impossible for them. Also players are rarely as immersed in the lore of the setting as the GM is. So riddles and puzzles that rely on setting knowledge can again fall short.

I've never played 4e, but I've seen the common complaints against skill challenges. I think that presenting interesting choices DOES keep players engaged. Frustrating puzzles that are either to easy or impossibly hard makes them switch off.

But that said, different strokes for different folks.

[Kydeem de'Morcaine]

On the subject of puzzles...

Adamantine Dragon wrote:

... If I'm going to put a puzzle in the game, I want the players to actually puzzle it out. Yes it's best if they can do that in a role playing perspective, but the goal of puzzles is not to give the players another die roll to succeed at, but to get their minds engaged and immerse them in the game play.

As a player, I have 3 HUGE problems with all the puzzles.

1) I as a real life person am not terribly great at most kinds of the puzzles seen in the game. My Char with a 14 wis and 17 int probably should be good at them. There is no way for me to role-play that.

2) Out of the last 5 puzzles I can remember seeing, 3 of them required knowledge that I don't have. Two of them were supposedly a come theme in the hold horror/slasher/monster movies. I don't watch those movies. The third required remembering an offhand comment made by the GM earlier in the campaign (almost 2 months real time). I actually missed that session so had no chance. But not a single other player remembered anything about the conversation.

3) The biggest problem I have is they just don't make any sense for them to be there in the first place. Why would anyone but a lunatic put a puzzle that needs to be bypassed in a dungeon, escape route, vault, library, etc...? If youare making a magic puzzle trap, it would be easier, cheaper, more effective, and use less space to just make a magic item the recognizes whether or not it is you (or person you authorized).

[Coriolis Storm]

For myself, the greater difficulty is game balance...and what that means to players and GM.

The GM(me), feels that there should be some element of danger for you to gain.

Party(or vocal members thereof), feel that encounters should be a cakewalk, until or unless they run into a "boss monster". See also random MMORPG/RPG.

Talking through the specifics as to what the group wants before the game starts, and what the GM is willing to accept, helps a great deal.

*chuckle* and also can lead to someone GMing for awhile when you absolutely refuse to do X as a GM...unless someone else wants to prove you wrong.

Specific difficulties I have while GMing:

Teleport. Remember all of the books where the party had to fight their way to the adventure? Nope! One quick scry spell, and the party skips all of the exposition. And if they missed a crucial clue? Why that's the GM's fault for not putting it where they could find it! (Not bitter..nope not me.. ;) )

Treasure by level. Remember folks if the party is fighting monsters that have no treasure, a treasure should spontaneously generate when the party levels, otherwise it's not "fair" to treat them as a higher ECL for encounters. (Please note the fact the group is regularly crushing ECL +4 encounters without any player dropping below half hps!)

Balancing encounters against specific players. So you've got the Dwarven zen Archer who is making pincushions of your encounters, and who has read the boards/planned enough that the rest of the party is hoping to "steal a kill from the monk!" every combat. Working out how to generate an encounter that is a challenge to every member of the party, without having specific bad guys who specifically counter that player.

Glad to see others are having their own challenges at least.. ;)