Actually, one of the devs said they stopped reading because you kept reprinting your lists over and over and over again. So please, refrain from doing that.
Ok, succes with an soon-to-be-dead-topic then.
Dragon78 did the same thing btw, so don't blame only me.
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Want ... this ... wallpaper ... in downloads ... nnggrrrggglll ...
Chief Technical Officer
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Because in 2000 WotC allowed Necromancer Games to publish Tome of Horrors, an OGL bestiary that included dozens of up-to-then WotC IP monsters. Among them, apart from Orcus and Jubilex, were dark creepers/stalkers, shadow demons, nupperibos, lurkers above, flumphs, and many others. Some things (such as references to proper names in D&D campaign settings) were filed off, but Orcus-goat-headed-demon-lord-of-undead and Jubilex-formless-demon-lord-of-oozes were left pretty much intact. So, under OGL, anybody can use them as long as they're not connecting them to Greyhawk or FR or whatever else that is WotC closed content IP. And that's exactly what Paizo has been doing for some time, because both Orcus and Jubilex have an established presence in Golarion.Why would Orcus and Juiblex be available? They are clearly specific characters from other peoples existing works, that are still in production.
I see how you can get away with Asmodeus, who really is just the devil with a generic name. But even if Demogorgon and Orcus also have preexisting names, their appearance and lore is something very D&D specific.
Note that Wizards has Juiblex, while Necromancer has Jubilex. The latter is Open Game Content; the former is not.
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OK, this is a MUST buy for me. Kaiju AND Cthulhu? I sincerely hope the Lovecraft monsters from Carrion Crown and Shattered Star get in this. The only bad thing is that as a GM I now have to put a planned campaign on hold again till this comes out so I can look this over and decide how much of it needs to be in my campaign to vex my players.
Never heard of Green Ronin's Advanced Bestiary? Or Silverthorne Games' Book of Templates: Deluxe Edition 3.5? Or for something that is fully Pathfinder-compatible, Rite Publishing's Book of Monster Templates?If they do end up staggering them, I'd prefer to see something like a book of templates rather than immediately another NPC Codex.Meh on the idea of a book of templates...I don't think there are enough reasonable templates to fill a entire book...though if they do so more power to them.
Sorry if I was clear enough...I meant in my opinion there is not a need for that many templates. Not that no one will find use for it...just not something I need or want.
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I find templates eminently useful. Too many players know the default statblocks like the back of their hands. Templates keep things interesting.
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"My Little Cthulhu: Friendship Is Madness"
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"My Little Cthulhu: Friendship Is Madness"
Now that is a TV show that would fill up my DVR as fast as they aired.
Templates are awesome, but useful and flavorful templates aren't that numerous.
Actually Turin, it was the name of a blog on this site, but really funny none the less.
I'm curious if, since psychopomps will be getting a full listing in a world-neutral Bestiary, will the Valkyrie from Bestiary 3 be retroactively made psychopomps or will they remain non-specific outsiders that just happen to shepherd some dead souls to the afterlife?
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"Pah, Cthulhu? My third level summoner can stop that guy. Two words: summon narwahl."
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Mahaha was a monster I proposed for the AP Bestiary when I was writing The Hungry Storm for Jade Regent but it got bounced in favor of other concepts. We will see if it shows up in B4.
Is it any relation to the bombastic Muahaha? Or the less impressive Meh?
Well what do you know.
I was going to need stats for a Clockwork Dragon when my Reaper Bones show up
Actually, Cthulhu and company are in the original printing of Deities and Demigods for first edition AD&D. TSR dropped the Cthulhu Mythos, along with the Newhonian Mythos (i.e., Fafhrd and Grey Mouser material by Fritz Lieber) and Melnibonean Mythos (i.e., Elric and Stormbringer material by Michael Moorcock) from later printings (which were renamed Legends and Lore) because, among other things, they felt it was free advertising for other people's stuff.
Cthulhu and Hastur were greater gods, and Nyarlathotep and Shub-Niggurath were lesser gods, in the original write-ups. I'm not sure what those decisions were based on.
Also, the Deities and Demigods version of Shubby is very similar to the Great Old One called Abhoth in Chaosism's Call of Cthulhu.
Back on topic, GLEE.
Off topic, but a minor point, Nehwon was not dropped when Dieties and Demigods got a reprint, nor was it dropped from legends and Lore which followed. TSR had actually liscensed the creations of Fritz Lieber in this case and produced a boxed setting set, and several supplements for both 1st Ed AD&D and 2nd Ed AD&D. As for the full story on why Cthulhu and Melnibonean mythos were dropped, there is a history printed at Drivethru RPG on the description page of the WotC PDF.
The Clockwork dragon was in AP#66
So what AP is the stopping point this time to get monsters from?
based on the last bestiary...I would guess Shattered Star, with an emphasis on slightly older APs
I think only the extremly fan-favorites from Shattered Star will end up in this bestiary, namely the Lovecraft critters and the Clockwork Dragon. The others (such as the mythological Polevik and Wolpertinger aren't that lucky me thinks)
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Creative Director
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I'm curious if, since psychopomps will be getting a full listing in a world-neutral Bestiary, will the Valkyrie from Bestiary 3 be retroactively made psychopomps or will they remain non-specific outsiders that just happen to shepherd some dead souls to the afterlife?
Nope; they're remaining their own unique thing.
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Okay I just managed to pick my jaw up off the floor and all I can say is G!% D$!n...
Paizo you made me pine for fall, I never pine for fall. That cover, my god that cover. In one cover you've managed to tell me I'm getting everything I've been asking to get printed into pathfinder rules since I converted. Now all I can complain about is that it's not here now, I have a birthday in 2 two months and dark plans for my players and I wants me some Cthulhu!
C'thulhu.......CR 30, right?
just a guess.
I am going to say CR 30 as well if that is the Max CR is with the mythic rules.
Going by experience this book will actually come out either November or December. I would actually be very surprised if it came out in October but I will be happy as long as it gets here before Christmas ...of this year.
I'm curious if, since psychopomps will be getting a full listing in a world-neutral Bestiary, will the Valkyrie from Bestiary 3 be retroactively made psychopomps or will they remain non-specific outsiders that just happen to shepherd some dead souls to the afterlife?Nope; they're remaining their own unique thing.
Thank you for the prompt response!
Now to consider why they don't get to be psychopomps and their relationship with them.... :-)
I'm curious if, since psychopomps will be getting a full listing in a world-neutral Bestiary, will the Valkyrie from Bestiary 3 be retroactively made psychopomps or will they remain non-specific outsiders that just happen to shepherd some dead souls to the afterlife?Nope; they're remaining their own unique thing.Thank you for the prompt response!
Now to consider why they don't get to be psychopomps and their relationship with them.... :-)
I have an image of a flock of valkyries hovering over the same battlefield as a flock of memitims, all trying to both glare at each other and keep an eye on the dying... :)
Yet another book from paizo i want really hard. Why am I not surprised?
I'm looking forward to it. A lot.
I hope that we get some playable races that are fey, monstrous humanoid, aberration, and another plant one. I wonder if any of the playable races from the Innersea Bestiary made it in...or anything from that book at all. Well hopefully there will be around 8-12 new playable races in this one like the first bestiary had.
Bestiary 1- 11 races
Bestiary 2- 7 races
Bestiary 3- 5 races
I hope that we get some playable races that are fey, monstrous humanoid, aberration, and another plant one. I wonder if any of the playable races from the Innersea Bestiary made it in...or anything from that book at all. Well hopefully there will be around 8-12 new playable races in this one like the first bestiary had.
Bestiary 1- 11 races
Bestiary 2- 7 races
Bestiary 3- 5 races
I kind of doubt there will be that many, But 5-7 seems reasonable.
I think 5 playable race creatures are good enough.
Also I hope none (well maybe the scarab because it doesn't suit in there) monsters from the Innersea Bestiary are inside Bestiary 4, if they are I bought Innersea Bestiary for nothing.
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I would like at least 7 playable races, at least 5 improved familiars(not just animals/vermin), at least 1 animal companion, maybe a new plant companion like from ARG.
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Yes, probably the Gremlins in this book will be like the gremlins from the movies! Multiplying when touching water!
Jinkin already have the movie gremlin likeness. Still im hoping for mogwai.
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I want a chicken. I've wanted a proper chicken familiar for ages.
Jinkin already have the movie gremlin likeness. Still im hoping for mogwai.
Jinkins only look like those Gremlins, but they don't have their ability to become a surinam toad when touching water..
I'm curious if, since psychopomps will be getting a full listing in a world-neutral Bestiary, will the Valkyrie from Bestiary 3 be retroactively made psychopomps or will they remain non-specific outsiders that just happen to shepherd some dead souls to the afterlife?Nope; they're remaining their own unique thing.
I assume the same goes for the Shinigami. And the Ankou. And there is probably some Hellish Ferryman Daemon as well.
Which makes me wonder what psychopomps are still left that would justify a dinstinct class of creatures.
Mogwai would be nice though I doubt they would like the movie versions but as long as there a type of gremlins I will be ok.
Bestiary II outsiders
Bestiary III cultural monsters
Bestiary IV mythic
I hope the Leanen Sidhe is CR10-14 and the Tooth Fairy is around CR6-11.
I think the Tooth Faeries are actually CR 1-3, I hope they can be swarm creatures of very tiny proportion, like a swarm of Faerie piranha's, having the tooth in their name only because they are more tooth than fairy.
And if the Ankou joins the Bestiary 4, I hope they remake it, just as the Vouivre, both those monsters didn't really stand out in the AP bestiary, both in art, appearance and background.
Of the AP monsters I really, really want to see, Skrik Nettle and Raiju are my personal Favorites, and many more from Kingmaker and Jade's Regent, but also from the Pirate Ap.
Only the Vilcasis, Weaverworm and Springheel Jack stood out from Carrion Crown for me personally, but something inside me tells me we will see most AP monsters from there... :-(
I'm thinking the Tooth Fairies are low CR, but yeah I hope the Leannan Sidhe are mid to high CR.
I think we will get a pretty good range of AP additions, so I wouldn't worry. I am hoping we knock off most of the 3.5 non-world centric/limited license monsters from those APs. I also don't think (hope?) we get any Inner Sea Bestiary creatures. I think those already exist in a bestiary, so there isn't need to move them to hardcover.
As far as themes go, I think it's more useful to look at what the bestiaries are meant to support. Bestiary 1 is clearly designed to bring in most of the necessary monsters from the SRD. Bestiary 2 fills in holes from Bestiary 1 in monster selection and fleshes out the Pathfinder planar creatures. Bestiary 3 is focused on fleshing out monsters suitable for Tian Xia as well as "lesser" planar factions. In that context, Bestiary 4 is clearly meant to flesh out mythic rules monsters and provide appropriate/new enemies that use those rules
Other random thoughts
Karcinoi = maybe one of the new 0HD races?
Outer Dragons = perhaps we are finally getting dragons for the outer planes. Dragons to represent good, evil, chaos, order and neutrality?
Is Guardian dragon = Ladon?
When I see necrocrafts why is my first thought vehicles, etc made of flesh and animated? I am thinking living ships composed of bone or hang gliders of skin.
Giants? I am having trouble thinking of two many giant niches we have left, at least outside of marine environments
Necrocrafts=Eoxian space ships?
I was thinking guardian dragon might be there version of force or prismatic but the idea of them being like Ladon is also a possibility.
I was thinking the same thing about the outer dragons if they are for the outer planes.
Karcinoi= crab people crab people crab people
Well Karkinoi are probably crab people as their name sounds extremly like the greek crab monster! I didn't liked the crabman from D&D mostly because of the silly artwork and name, at least the name for eventual crabpeople is awesome now! We already have many crabs so doing something so original with Carcinos is cool for me!
I hope necrocrafts aren't vehicles, but a living ship sounds cool.
Guardian Dragon(s) are hopefully Ladon & other greek guardian dragons, that would be cool, but I do hope the name Ladon is used, I really like that name.
I also think the Sea Cat is in there, if the Clockwork Dragon is there, so is one of the last non-added 3.5 D&D monster Manual monsters.
And Dragon78 lets hope the Ravid will make it as well now the Al-Mi-Raj is confirmed!
will this have the godzilla type monsters that III was supposed to have?
That's the Kaiju, yes.
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Creative Director
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A bestiary's not really the place for new feats. I agree that there's probably not a need to copy/paste the previous feats though.
A book that presents new options for monsters is a book I've been trying to convince the design team and management to tackle for some time. If folks want to see such a book, one that presents new feats and prestige classes and templates and maybe even things like monster archetypes and the like... let us know! Preferably in its own thread, and not here. ;-)
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A book that presents new options for monsters is a book I've been trying to convince the design team and management to tackle for some time. If folks want to see such a book, one that presents new feats and prestige classes and templates and maybe even things like monster archetypes and the like... let us know! Preferably in its own thread, and not here. ;-)
Now to consider why they don't get to be psychopomps and their relationship with them.... :-)
Psychopomps are True Neutral outsiders; the valkyrie is Chaotic Neutral.
I think 5 playable race creatures are good enough.
Also I hope none (well maybe the scarab because it doesn't suit in there) monsters from the Innersea Bestiary are inside Bestiary 4, if they are I bought Innersea Bestiary for nothing.
Not to worry! Paizo's beastiaries tend to be setting neutral, so you should be fine! :)