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Pathfinder Roleplaying Game: Mythic Adventures (OGL)

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Pathfinder Roleplaying Game: Mythic Adventures (OGL)
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Heroes of Legend

Not all heroes are created equal. Many adventurers pick up swords or call upon strange powers in times of trouble, yet only a few are chosen by fate or the gods to change the course of history. These are mythic heroes—legendary figures whose every footstep shakes the heavens. With Pathfinder Roleplaying Game: Mythic Adventures, it's your turn to change the world. Choose a mythic path and take on unbelievable powers by completing mythic trials tied to your character's story. Each mythic path works in parallel with your character class, allowing you to continue advancing in your chosen calling even as you seek a greater destiny. Best of all, you can start playing a mythic character at any point—even as early as 1st level!

Pathfinder Roleplaying Game: Mythic Adventures is a must-have companion volume to the Pathfinder RPG Core Rulebook. This imaginative tabletop game builds on more than 10 years of system development and open playtests featuring more than 50,000 gamers to create a cutting-edge RPG experience that brings the all-time best-selling set of fantasy rules into a new era.

Pathfinder Roleplaying Game: Mythic Adventures is a 256-page hardcover book that includes:

  • Complete rules for playing mythic characters of six different paths: archmage, champion, guardian, hierophant, marshal, and trickster.
  • New mythic feats for every class, such as Powerful Shape, which allows druids to transform into enormous animals, or Deadly Stroke, which lets a mythic character dispatch even a formidable enemy with a single blow.
  • A whole grimoire of new and supercharged spells. Bring down a castle with a mythic meteor swarm, transform the landscape with terraform, or make every memory and record of someone disappear with mythic modify memory!
  • Tons of monsters enhanced with mythic abilities and ready to challenge your heroes, from dragons to vampires!
  • A hoard of new mythic magic items and artifacts. Brandish the sword of inner fire, capable of burning even elemental creatures, or turn your enemies to stone with the medusa-headed shield aegis!
  • A complete mythic adventure for 7th-level characters.
  • Advice on running a mythic game and forging your own legends.
  • ... and much, much more!

ISBN-13: 978-1-60125-549-5

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Paizo's only major failure

1/5 —

This is my only 1 star review of a Paizo product. So I feel the need to explain why.

Mythic Adventures is a based on a great idea. Instead of restricting epic play to (say) characters after level 20, create a mythic system that runs orthogonal to standard level advancement, and which allows players to do things and explore themes not allowed by the standard ruleset.

In the abstract, here are the kinds of things one would want such a product to do:

--1. Provide new mythic abilities which provide plot hooks, inspire the imagination, and suggest ideas for various campaigns or adventures.

--2. Provide new mythic abilities which allow players to do qualitatively different kinds of things than the standard ruleset allows.

Now, D&D 3.5 and Pathfinder have a number of problems when it comes to high-level play: everything takes too long to resolve, and the combat starts turning into rocket-tag -- whoever goes first wins. In part this is because the core game offers more means of boosting offense than defense, and in part this is because the D&D 3.5 math doesn't extend well to high level play. Given this, here are the kinds of things one would hope such a product would avoid:

--3. Avoid positing many more mythic abilities that boost offense than defense.

--4. Avoid new abilities which just add static bonuses to everything. (Increasing everyone's BAB and AC by 10 doesn't make your game more mythic -- it just leaves you with the same game but different numbers.)

--5. Avoid positing abilities which do little other than boost the numbers into the high-level regime where the D&D 3.5 and Pathfinder math breaks down.

--6. Avoid adding abilities which add new sui generis ways of making the game rocket-tag like, by adding yet more "I win"-types of abilities (either by themselves, or in combination with other Pathfinder material that's been published elsewhere).

Unfortunately, for the most part, the mythic ruleset doesn't satisfy these desiderata. Most mythic abilities and spells offer what are effectively bland numerical boosts. There are many more ways to boost offense than defense. There are a handful of abilities inspire plot hooks and feel epic (mythic Levitate and mythic Sleep, for example), but they're surprisingly few in number -- the spells in Ultimate Intrigue offer more interesting plot hooks and adventure ideas than can be found in this entire book. And the mythic rules introduce a huge number of ways to break the game, especially when considered in combination with abilities offered in other books: attacks that do over a 1000 points of damage, spells that ignore SR, give no save, and could kill any creature published in the Bestiary, and so on. (The 3rd party product Mythic Solutions offers some helpful suggestions for how to tone down the mythic rules a bit, but in my experience, most of the game-breaking abilities and combos we ran into are left intact.)

It's not all bad. As I mentioned, there are a handful of mythic spells that feel epic and are plot-hook inspiring, and the book offers some tools for DMs to use to make opponents more deadly. But on the whole, most of what's in this book is best avoided.

Rare mixed, but generally okay, score

3/5 —

This book presents an excellent way, which I think worked better than 3.0-3.5's epic system, to allow for the truly legendary and heroic heroes of the world. Think less Aragorn and more Beowulf. In general it is a fine product and I don't recommend against getting it.

That said though I found it flawed in two ways which, while they've occasionally crept up into other PF/Paizo books, I think need to be noted.
1) Balance issues. To some extent when you discuss epic you're throwing that out the window anyway but this book, more so than even other books like the ARG or what the Ultimate series offered, needs a GM to keep an eye on what's going on. I wish it had undergone more play testing but I think this might just be an inherent issue at this power level. When you start multiplying character power as a DM you need to be ready to regulate that.
2) Print quality. The bigger issue I had. I've tried to physically own this book 4 times now. Twice from game stores in two different states and twice from a credible online store. In all four cases I found inking issues on some of the artwork, 3 of the times on the same few pictures. This is problematic because one of the biggest reasons to get the printed book and not just use the online info for free is the artwork. I am about to try and buy it again now, hopefully it's on a later run at this point and that's been fixed. That said, if you buy it and care about the artwork make sure to look at the larger pictures in the book and make sure they aren't faded or have streaks at any points.

In summary though, I want to make it clear that for it's price it's not a bad book. I'd give it a C++ or B-, it won't be something you regret (especially if you don't care much about a few images being a little off). It was a good, and unique, Paizo/Pathfinder book just not one of their very best.

5/5 —

I've reviewed this book over on RPGGeek.com.

Hopefully More To Come

3/5 —

I was thrilled at the concept of this book. Sometimes the story, the characters, need to step up to a more rareified level and really bring the oomph and this book provides the oomph. I especially love some of the little pieces added therein that make a mythic adventure less roll-play and more role-play; the concept that mythic power can simply go away, that the leveling of tiers is solely up to the DM, that in fact much of the advancement and introduction should be story-based.

Loved all of that.

But for what I didn't love.

1. The powers offered are wildly inconsistent in effectiveness. I don't mean powers that are taking for a roleplaying reason. I mean powers that are obviously crunch-based when compared to another crunch power and you cannot fathom how one is supposed to anywhere near equal another. The same with the feats.

2. The very limited scope of mythic paths. I get that this is the intro book and we cannot get a ton of paths right off the bat, but really, six paths? Only 37 pages of path descriptions and powers out of 250+ pages? I've played more characters that wouldn't fit into these paths thematically than would.

3. Mythic monsters takes 57 pages and could have been done in 10. Paizo has been awesome about not reprinting crunch from one book to another, really guaranteeing the value you get in a book. But the monsters presented are basically mythic versions of creatures we all know already. And the mythic build rules for creatures are simple enough (a good thing!) that all we really needed was one example.

So, I like the idea, was a little less than thrilled with the execution, but I am awaiting more.

BAD *SS book

5/5 —

Here is why I like it. The system is so flexible that a GM can attach the rules to his or her game anywhere, anytime. Additionally, said GM can pace advancement to fit his or her campaign. Want PCs that are only marginally more powerful than standard PCs? Simply space or limit the number of trials.

Walks like its mythic, quacks like its mythic. It's mythic.

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Liberty's Edge
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Cathulu lives in my house. I have the scars to prove it.
1 person marked this as a favorite.
Axial wrote:

Something occurred to me.

If I were to make an Archmage NPC and apply the Lich Template, wouldn't it's phylactery be redundant with it's mythic immortality?

"We have destroyed your phylactery!"

"Haha, it doesn't matter!"

It's called redundancy, and every good plan should have them.

Scarab Sages
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

Wouldn't a Level 20 Wizard already have access to the immortality discovery anyway? Wizards are ridiculously easy to make immortal.
Pathfinder Lost Omens, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Stratagemini wrote:
Wouldn't a Level 20 Wizard already have access to the immortality discovery anyway? Wizards are ridiculously easy to make immortal.

There is a considerable difference between immortality from aging and immortality from death.

3 people marked this as a favorite.

Well, this will be the first core/supplement book for Pathfinder I won't be getting. Mid to high-level PCs are a pain to deal with as it is, but adding mythic levels alongside them would be a headache I prefer not to have.

Crap, I just noticed Bestiary 4, including Cthulu and mythic creatures. Darn you guys!
Mister Fowler wrote:
Well, this will be the first core/supplement book for Pathfinder I won't be getting. Mid to high-level PCs are a pain to deal with as it is, but adding mythic levels alongside them would be a headache I prefer not to have.

They designed mythic for low level characters as well for people who don't like high level games ;)

Contributor

If I recall, this book will feature rules for legacy weapons i.e. weapons that scale with level. Is that correct?
Paizo Employee Lead Designer
1 person marked this as a favorite.

I think you will find that Mythic actually eases some of the problems with High Level play, letting mythic characters ignore and break some of the rules that hinder the characters. Its a bit more complicated in some senses, but we feel that the payoff is worth it. Of course, the book is designed to be used with all levels of play, not just mid and high, so everyone can get a taste of what it means to be legendary.

Jason Bulmahn
Lead Designer

August cannot get here soon enough!

Quick Q guys - If I intend on running a RotRL campaign with only two players, do you think adding Mythic levels (perhaps only 1 or two) to their characters would aid in balance/survivability?

Or would it perhaps be too much power...?
Designer, RPG Superstar Judge
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Being able to run a standard adventure with fewer PCs is one of the goals of the mythic rules.
Sean K Reynolds wrote:
Being able to run a standard adventure with fewer PCs is one of the goals of the mythic rules.

I love that, since school I have never run more than 2 PCs. Everything becomes a struggle with just 2 -though my family of 4 boys will eventually sort that problem out, I just need to be patient ;)

Tracer-Actual wrote:

Quick Q guys - If I intend on running a RotRL campaign with only two players, do you think adding Mythic levels (perhaps only 1 or two) to their characters would aid in balance/survivability?

Or would it perhaps be too much power...?

James Jacobs, in his thread Ask James Jacobs Anything, gives out the formula used for adding Mystic Tiers to your characters, showing how much of a challenge rating increase each tier gives. I will find and link it when able...

Swashbucklersdc wrote:
Tracer-Actual wrote:

Quick Q guys - If I intend on running a RotRL campaign with only two players, do you think adding Mythic levels (perhaps only 1 or two) to their characters would aid in balance/survivability?

Or would it perhaps be too much power...?

James Jacobs, in his thread Ask James Jacobs Anything, gives out the formula used for adding Mystic Tiers to your characters, showing how much of a challenge rating increase each tier gives. I will find and link it when able...

Hey thanks! That would be very much appreciated.

Tracer, the post was on thread page 601 of the "Ask James Jacobs Anything", in Off Topic Discussions. It stated:
2) +2 tiers more or less = +1 CR, regardless of level.
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
donato wrote:
If I recall, this book will feature rules for legacy weapons i.e. weapons that scale with level. Is that correct?

Donato, that is something I have wondered also. (And like yourself, I think I recall seeing that somewhere) ...

Just not sure where it was ... ;)
Swashbucklersdc wrote:

Tracer, the post was on thread page 601 of the "Ask James Jacobs Anything", in Off Topic Discussions. It stated:

2) +2 tiers more or less = +1 CR, regardless of level.

Mate you are a legend - thanks.

Was there a re-released version of the Mythic adventure Playtest? I see some references that I cant fid in the initial release.
Adam Metz wrote:
Was there a re-released version of the Mythic adventure Playtest? I see some references that I cant fid in the initial release.

Check the playtest forums

I am kind of new to this whole message board thing, so where would I find those?
Paizo Employee Chief Technical Officer

http://paizo.com/paizo/messageboards/paizoPublishing/olderProducts/playtest s/mythicAdventuresPlaytest

Are the power levels in the Mythic rules something like what would be displayed by a Chosen or Champion of a god? I'm talking Erevis Cale, Drasek Riven, Elminster, Dove Falconhand type Chosen. Especially Erevis Cale, I love that character. How many Chosen get into a fistfight with their god in an ally?
The Exchange Contributor; Publisher, Kobold Press; RPG Superstar Judge

Some design notes by SRM on Mythic spells on this Deep Magic blog update.

Can this be used as a way of doing EL6 (or EL8) play? Normal character advancement through 6 or 8 then just mythic from then on? Will it, in essence, keep some of the lower-CR foes that normally become irrelevant relevant while still offering an advancement path for the PCs? Or does the advancement path actually widen the gap?

Meaning, going to CL6 then to CL6+ML10 vs. going to CL6 then to CL16?
Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber
BigWeather wrote:

Can this be used as a way of doing EL6 (or EL8) play? Normal character advancement through 6 or 8 then just mythic from then on? Will it, in essence, keep some of the lower-CR foes that normally become irrelevant relevant while still offering an advancement path for the PCs? Or does the advancement path actually widen the gap?

Meaning, going to CL6 then to CL6+ML10 vs. going to CL6 then to CL16?

According to what has been said that would make you a CL6 + ML10 for a party should make them about the equivalent of CL11

Sorry it took so long to get back to this thread...

Thanks Justin, so not quite E6 but a bit more compressed than normal. Really looking forward to this!

Any details about the adventure included in this?
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and then there will be Advanced Mythic Guide for sure with options for the new base classes

And Ultimate Mythic with mythic paths for magus, gunslinger?

and then Ultimate Mythic Guide, with more options for Mythic options and Mythic Archetypes...

I don´t Know for sure, but that makes sense since the fact that only six option will be so bored after a few months form its release...

I suggest this because, 11 core classes never will be enough, plus six more classes never will be enough, plus two more classes never will be enough!!

Mythic Archetypes could be a great Idea (since the mythic issue are a kind of archetype itself)

I don't think Mythic Archetypes make sense though. Archetypes are variations on Class abilities. Mythic Tiers are based on Paths, and your Path abilities aren't set in stone anyway - you pick what you want out of a list each time you gain a Tier. So they would really just need to add more Path options rather than "Mythic Archetypes". Not sure how you would even archetype Paths.

As for Path choices for the Magus and Gunslinger, we have those, they're called the Archmage (for spell-focused Magi), Champion, Guardian, Marshal, or even the Trickster. I suppose Hierophant doesn't really fit. Mythic Paths are not really Class-specific so there's not really a need for Paths based on Classes. All you need to do is offer Class-specific or Class-based Path Options that can be selected upon gaining Tiers. Which the developers already said they would be incorporating into Mythic Adventures(at least, I'm pretty sure they've alluded to it).

And the Dual-Path feat as well.
The Block Knight wrote:


Mythic Paths are not really Class-specific so there's not really a need for Paths based on Classes.

i will not say more after it shows itself, but when people start to feel tired to the paths or maybe in less time, the paths will pop up and spread like a toilet paper rolling stairs down!!

Juda de Kerioth wrote:
The Block Knight wrote:


Mythic Paths are not really Class-specific so there's not really a need for Paths based on Classes.

i will not say more after it shows itself, but when people start to feel tired to the paths or maybe in less time, the paths will pop up and spread like a toilet paper rolling stairs down!!

I also expect to see a fair amount of 3rd party material as well. It won't be as bad as 3.x prestige classes, but expect to see a lot. Heck, Kobold Press has a new Mythic Path for the Deep Magic kickstarter as a met stretch goal - Saint ( great idea for a Mythic Path I think).

Juda de Kerioth wrote:
The Block Knight wrote:


Mythic Paths are not really Class-specific so there's not really a need for Paths based on Classes.

i will not say more after it shows itself, but when people start to feel tired to the paths or maybe in less time, the paths will pop up and spread like a toilet paper rolling stairs down!!

I actually disagree. Given the customization abilities of each path, I think it'd make more sense to instead give more Path Abilities and options to further customize the six paths. The Paths are generic enough to allow for that.

Also, there hasn't been a new class in two years. So I suppose worrying about an avalanche of new classes is moot.

Are there any public information on what mythic rules will actually be in practice? The product description doesn't really say how it is different from regular gameplay.
Silver Crusade
Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

There was a public playtest of Mythic Rules going for some time, I'm sure you can get a hold of the playtest document somehow.
Lantern Lodge RPG Superstar 2014 Top 4

Just remember that the mythic rules from the playtest don't represent 100% the mechanics that will be in the finished version. There was a lot of great discussion and development from players of the game that came from the playtest that changed the way certain abilities and principles of the mythic rules functioned.
Juda de Kerioth wrote:

and then there will be Advanced Mythic Guide for sure with options for the new base classes

And Ultimate Mythic with mythic paths for magus, gunslinger?

and then Ultimate Mythic Guide, with more options for Mythic options and Mythic Archetypes...

I don´t Know for sure, but that makes sense since the fact that only six option will be so bored after a few months form its release...

I suggest this because, 11 core classes never will be enough, plus six more classes never will be enough, plus two more classes never will be enough!!

Mythic Archetypes could be a great Idea (since the mythic issue are a kind of archetype itself)

I hope so. People who like high-powered games in 3.X have basically gotten one book in 13 years: the ELH for 3.0. That's why there aren't as many of us left--the people who like high powered games have fled to Exalted or GURPS:(

Also, this may be the first hardcover I purchase:)

The basic concept looks interesting though. Could be a neat way to represent legendary NPCs who have surpassed the level cap for a setting. And possibly leave it an option for PCs who reach that level while the campaign is still far from over.
Silver Crusade
1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Aren't 3.5 games high-powered already, with paladins one-rounding dragons and wizards imploding reality at mid levels? I've always considered D&D as Fantasy Superheroes game, if I wanted something more tame I'd go with Warhammer...

The breaking point seems to be somewhere around 10th level. Since you often hear from a great number of people that their campaigns rarely, if ever, get that high, it's not really a major concern if you are not fond of super-heroics in a generic fantasy RPG.

But out of curiosity, what characters from fiction would you consider to be mythic characters. Based on what you considers it means to be a mythic character.
- Galadriel from Lord of the Rings most certainly. And basicall all the noble Noldor of the first generations in the Silmarilion. These people are not normal mortals (as much as that term applies to the elves anyway), but have the power to get toes to toes with major demons. And Galadriel also seems to have powers that are unique and not shared by anyone else.
- All force users in Star Wars. In a game with numerous spellcasting classes, their abilites are not that special, but within the setting magic isn't something you simply learn. It's people with a mystical power that allows them to do things that their species simply are not normally capable of.
- Flemeth from Dragon Age. Flemeth simply defies some of the very basic rules of how magic is supposed in the world of Dragon Age. And it is this special nature that allows her to reach such a high level as a spellcaster. Usually, when a demon tries to possess a mage, it devours the mages soul. But in the case of Flemeth, her soul devoured the demon and apparently that happened rather early on when she still was starting to learn magic.
-- Also Anders, who got special powers by allowing a friedly demon to take a ride, but two souls inside one body didn't really turn out as they had planned it.
- The Witchers, from The Witcher (duh). Their powers are based on alchemy more than anything else, but the effects are still the same. They become faster and more durable and able to surive magic that would kill normal people straight away. But those are things that just help them surviving lots of dangerous situations, they still have to learn to swordfighting and monster hunting like everyone else. They are not neccessarily stronger, but it gives them a clear edge.

Hercules would be mythic.
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Yora wrote:

The breaking point seems to be somewhere around 10th level. Since you often hear from a great number of people that their campaigns rarely, if ever, get that high, it's not really a major concern if you are not fond of super-heroics in a generic fantasy RPG.

In my experience level 9 to 11 is the tipping point where the standard encounters in APs begin to be very easy as presented, especially if RAW magic item crafting is allowed.

Let's not let this thread descend into another "high level is broken, caster-martial disparity, monks suck and psionics is lame" please? There's plenty of room for that in the general discussion. :)
Silver Crusade
1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

So, let's discuss Paladin alignment...

...and why martials can't have nice things.
Lantern Lodge RPG Superstar 2014 Top 4
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Oh also, Yora, mythic can be applied at any time. So you can conceivably have a character who is a Commoner 1/Mythic 1. It represents a supernatural "greatness" beyond that of normal men. Maybe descended from a god, maybe special power gifted in a time of crisis by otherworldly beings, maybe you found a b!&+~in' magical hammer that makes you Thor, etc.
2 people marked this as a favorite.

Yeah, that's actually been one thing I've loved about Mythic is that you don't have to wait 20 levels, or build a 20 level character, to experience and enjoy it. I actually cannot wait to run a mythic campaign eventually.
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I have to agree. Having a party of say level 5 PCs face the mythic king of kobolds sound pretty awesome (not sarcastic). The PCs themselves do not need to be mythic, this just gives more options to GMs, and adds more dept and flavor to Pathfinder.

This sort of rule supplement, and others like Ultimate Campaign, really prolong the longevity of the edition.
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