Pathfinder Roleplaying Game: Bestiary 2 (OGL)

This is really a great book! Combined with the first Bestiary, there are so many fantastic and unique outsiders to populate the planes with... great!

Now all that's missing is a PLANAR ADVENTURE PATH!

That would be fabulous!

I loved this book.

It's just unfortunate that the longest stat blocks usually end up with shortest shrift in regards to flavour text. It's about the only gripe that I have.

I just picked this up today from my FLGS and I am throughly impressed. My favorite parts are how it describes how to alter several of the monsters to make them different from the standard blocks. Great job guys.

I really like this as well, such as with the Jabberwock and dullahan. I thought the dullahan in particular with him driving the entire coach and keeping souls in there was awesome; made me think of the coach from Bram Stokers Dracula.

Razz wrote:

The other thing I'm kind of scratching my head on is the qlippoth compared with the obyriths of 3.5e. They seem similiar, except their horrific appearance is reliant on sight (when it should assault all 5 senses), they're immune to cold, and they lack fast healing?

So should I give all my obyriths the qlippoth subtype stats or should I give the qlippoths the obyrith subtype stats? How would I determine fast healing in the latter case?

When I made up the obyriths for 3.5, the qlippoth were part of my inspiration. Since obyriths are not open content, but qlippoth are, and since I'm a huge fan of the "proto-demon," it just made sense to simply embrace qlippoth as the creature of choice for this role in Pathfinder.

If you want to use obyriths and qlippoth in the same game, they should go together perfectly. You don't really need to make one fit the other. If you do, though, pick which one you like more and go with that one's traits for all of them. The best way to determine fast healing amounts is to simply look at a monster that has the same CR and fast healing and copy that monster's fast healing value.

Thanks for the advice and for the commentary on the Qlippoth/Obyrith. Dumb question: they /were/ inspired by the idea of the Qlippoth from Jewish Kabbalism, right?

Thanks for the advice and for the commentary on the Qlippoth/Obyrith. Dumb question: they /were/ inspired by the idea of the Qlippoth from Jewish Kabbalism, right?

Correct! On the source of their inspiration, that is... not that it's a dumb question! :P

Amazon just pushed back their ship date again!!!

Oh, great, that means that Amazon.de will probably ship it at the end of February. Well, I got the PDF, but it's a poor substitute for having the real hardcover in my hands.

Eric Hinkle wrote:

Thanks for the advice and for the commentary on the Qlippoth/Obyrith. Dumb question: they /were/ inspired by the idea of the Qlippoth from Jewish Kabbalism, right?

Correct! On the source of their inspiration, that is... not that it's a dumb question! :P

Hmm, another question related to the first: does this mean that some of the usual magical ways to get rid of evil outsiders (like banishment) don't work so well against them in the game? My own reading was that part of the horror of the Qlippoth in Kabbalism was that they came from a universe before this one, and as such lacked names. Meaning that most Western ritual magic and defenses (which depended on finding the "true name" of something and commanding it) would be <i>utterly useless</i> against a Qlippoth. Depending on the kind of game being played, a nasty outsider who is utterly imune to all the traditional defenses can be very frightening!

I loved this book.

It's just unfortunate that the longest stat blocks usually end up with shortest shrift in regards to flavour text. It's about the only gripe that I have.

Ok, glad to see I'm not the only one to feel that. I would rather have a 2 page spread if it meant telling me more about a particular creature and/or adding some more unique SA and SQ than trying to fit everything on one page. There were quite a number of monsters that received a very small blurb but were complex enough to require much more than that (the Star Archon definitely comes to mind, but I can pull several others by glancing through the book).

Amazon just pushed back their ship date again!!!

Amazon has pushed back everything I've got on order, Bestiary 2, Condition Cards (to March) and Flip Mat City Streets.

Hmm, another question related to the first: does this mean that some of the usual magical ways to get rid of evil outsiders (like banishment) don't work so well against them in the game? My own reading was that part of the horror of the Qlippoth in Kabbalism was that they came from a universe before this one, and as such lacked names. Meaning that most Western ritual magic and defenses (which depended on finding the "true name" of something and commanding it) would be <i>utterly useless</i> against a Qlippoth. Depending on the kind of game being played, a nasty outsider who is utterly imune to all the traditional defenses can be very frightening!

Nope; despite the fact that qlippoth are truly ancient outsiders, the usual magical methods for banishing them work just as well as on any other outsider. If an outsider is particularly resistant to banishment, it'd be a specific special defensive ability possessed by that outsider.

But being able to banish a creature is kind of what makes an outsider an outsider, so I wouldn't remove this feature from qlippoth.

Hmm, another question related to the first: does this mean that some of the usual magical ways to get rid of evil outsiders (like banishment) don't work so well against them in the game? My own reading was that part of the horror of the Qlippoth in Kabbalism was that they came from a universe before this one, and as such lacked names. Meaning that most Western ritual magic and defenses (which depended on finding the "true name" of something and commanding it) would be <i>utterly useless</i> against a Qlippoth. Depending on the kind of game being played, a nasty outsider who is utterly imune to all the traditional defenses can be very frightening!

The best creature I've ever seen for that is the Shatterer, from the Book of Unremitting Horror (which is d20 Modern, but should convert to Pathfinder fairly easily).

Among its suite of special powers, it can hijack a summoning spell, break barriers designed to hold outsiders, and has special resistance to spells designed to banish or impede them. It's a summoner's worst nightmare.

I will be getting my book soon but I did get to look at a copy at a gaming store and I love the artwork. Also had some time to look at some of the creatures stat blocks. First I would like to say that this is the first time I have seen a monster manual that is at least as good as the first. Second, I love the monsters that can be used as familiars. Third, I like the "playable" races a lot. Fourth, Love the primal dragons and Scylla is just awesome. But of course there are a few nitpicks, mostly about some monster's classification(ex: Scylla as an Aberration instead of Magical beast, Water Orm as M.b. instead of a dragon)nothing major yet. When I get the book(and read it) I will have better idea of what I like and dislike. One question though, are Merrow still just aquatic ogres or are they there own species now?

DungeonmasterCal wrote:

Amazon just pushed back their ship date again!!!

Amazon has pushed back everything I've got on order, Bestiary 2, Condition Cards (to March) and Flip Mat City Streets.

That's why I rely on brick-and-mortar stores; I know I'd get my Paizo stuff cheaper from Amazon, but my FLGS can give me a reliable estimation on the date and they e-mail me as soon as the stuff has arrived. And I also want to support my FLGS, even if it costs me around 10-20% more (since the prices are converted directly to euros).

I like the Crystal Dragon but I need a new name for it. I use the psionic gem dragons so it'll just be confusing, since this crystal dragon is no where anything like the psionic crystal dragon. Since there's Brine, Cloud, and Magma. Umbral I assume is basically Pathfinder's version of the Shadow Dragon. Going along the theme of representing different forms of elements, maybe Quartz Dragon or Lucid Dragon? Lucid sounds good.

EDIT: Ah, found one much better, Prism Dragon.

Dolgo wrote:

DungeonmasterCal wrote:

Amazon just pushed back their ship date again!!!

Amazon has pushed back everything I've got on order, Bestiary 2, Condition Cards (to March) and Flip Mat City Streets.

That's why I rely on brick-and-mortar stores; I know I'd get my Paizo stuff cheaper from Amazon, but my FLGS can give me a reliable estimation on the date and they e-mail me as soon as the stuff has arrived. And I also want to support my FLGS, even if it costs me around 10-20% more (since the prices are converted directly to euros).

Ditto, especially supporting my FLGS.

Dolgo wrote:

DungeonmasterCal wrote:

Amazon just pushed back their ship date again!!!

Amazon has pushed back everything I've got on order, Bestiary 2, Condition Cards (to March) and Flip Mat City Streets.

That's why I rely on brick-and-mortar stores; I know I'd get my Paizo stuff cheaper from Amazon, but my FLGS can give me a reliable estimation on the date and they e-mail me as soon as the stuff has arrived. And I also want to support my FLGS, even if it costs me around 10-20% more (since the prices are converted directly to euros).

I'm late to Pathfinder and have Amazon's free shipping, so it has been great to use to catch up with core books and older items. This makes getting it straight from paizo looking better though.

Asgetrion wrote:

Dolgo wrote:

DungeonmasterCal wrote:

Amazon just pushed back their ship date again!!!

Amazon has pushed back everything I've got on order, Bestiary 2, Condition Cards (to March) and Flip Mat City Streets.

That's why I rely on brick-and-mortar stores; I know I'd get my Paizo stuff cheaper from Amazon, but my FLGS can give me a reliable estimation on the date and they e-mail me as soon as the stuff has arrived. And I also want to support my FLGS, even if it costs me around 10-20% more (since the prices are converted directly to euros).

I'm late to Pathfinder and have Amazon's free shipping, so it has been great to use to catch up with core books and older items. This makes getting it straight from paizo looking better though.

Yeah, free shipping is great; sadly, that's not an option for us here in Europe (although even if it were, I would probably still want to support my FLGS).

Amazon just pushed back their ship date again!!!

Why do they do that???

DungeonmasterCal wrote:

Amazon just pushed back their ship date again!!!

Why do they do that???

Because you touch yourself.

I finally was able to pick-up a copy yesterday (slow arrival to Canada it seems), and I can't get enough of it! I want to use everything in my campaign, whether a creature fits or not. I do have a quick inquiry though.

I noticed that the write-up for some of creatures that can be taken as Improved Familiars gives the prerequisites (ex. Brownie), but some don't (ex. Silvanshee). It' shouldn't be difficult to figure out myself, but I was just curious what you guys thought. The one creature that surprised me the most in this manner was the badger, and it not have information on being either a familiar or an animal companion.

All-in-all, I am really enjoying the book and can't wait for the Inner Sea World Guide to come out next. Keep-up the good work guys!

I finally was able to pick-up a copy yesterday (slow arrival to Canada it seems), and I can't get enough of it! I want to use everything in my campaign, whether a creature fits or not. I do have a quick inquiry though.

I noticed that the write-up for some of creatures that can be taken as Improved Familiars gives the prerequisites (ex. Brownie), but some don't (ex. Silvanshee). It' shouldn't be difficult to figure out myself, but I was just curious what you guys thought. The one creature that surprised me the most in this manner was the badger, and it not have information on being either a familiar or an animal companion.

All-in-all, I am really enjoying the book and can't wait for the Inner Sea World Guide to come out next. Keep-up the good work guys!

The sivanshee was indeed intended to be a familiar option. There SHOULD be a CR 2 outsider for every alignment now for spellcasters who took the Improved Familiar feat.

The sivanshee was indeed intended to be a familiar option. There SHOULD be a CR 2 outsider for every alignment now for spellcasters who took the Improved Familiar feat.

What about Lawful Good? Archons don't seem to offer a familiar option, unless Lantern Archons were slipped in somewhere and I didn't notice. They're not listed under improved familiar or in the Bestiary.

The one creature that surprised me the most in this manner was the badger, and it not have information on being either a familiar or an animal companion.

That is criminal! If any animal is associated with gnomish society, it is the loyal badger! I hope we see this oversight rectified so that our Gnomish wizards and Gnomish rangers can have the familiars and companions they richly deserve. This bodes ill for the day when we'll see the iconic gnomish riding goat available for our Gnomish cavaliers and Gnomish Paladins.

Now I wish sorcerers could get familiars, not just arcane and I think serpantine, but all bloodlines and bards too.

Now I wish sorcerers could get familiars, not just arcane and I think serpantine, but all bloodlines and bards too.

Obtain Familiar feat from Complete Arcane will solve that issue.

James Jacobs wrote:

The sivanshee was indeed intended to be a familiar option. There SHOULD be a CR 2 outsider for every alignment now for spellcasters who took the Improved Familiar feat.

What about Lawful Good? Archons don't seem to offer a familiar option, unless Lantern Archons were slipped in somewhere and I didn't notice. They're not listed under improved familiar or in the Bestiary.

Lawful Good got left out, it appears... I suspect because when we were looking at the list of CR 2 outsiders, the lantern archon already exists. I'm not sure why it's not an option for an improved familiar, in fact. Probably because it can teleport? (shrug)

Anyway... I guess a new LG familiar option is something we can look forward to in Bestiary 3?

Plato's Nephew wrote:

The one creature that surprised me the most in this manner was the badger, and it not have information on being either a familiar or an animal companion.

That is criminal! If any animal is associated with gnomish society, it is the loyal badger! I hope we see this oversight rectified so that our Gnomish wizards and Gnomish rangers can have the familiars and companions they richly deserve. This bodes ill for the day when we'll see the iconic gnomish riding goat available for our Gnomish cavaliers and Gnomish Paladins.

See page 53 of the Pathfinder Core rulebook. Badgers have been animal companions from day one in Pathfinder, so there was no need to add this material into Bestiary 2.

Yeah but the feat/alternate class ability to get a familiar needs to be for pathfinder not 3.5.

See page 53 of the Pathfinder Core rulebook. Badgers have been animal companions from day one in Pathfinder, so there was no need to add this material into Bestiary 2.

James is indeed correct (of course). This should also rectify complaints that anyone may have had that the noble badger was missing from the "Familiars" entry in the first Bestiary. That being said, so where are the ring-tailed lemurs now James, huh? Huh? (Kidding!)

I'm trying to get this book through a book store (both online and through the local store) and they are saying it's on back order with no info when it will be available?

I'm specifically trying to get it through Barnes and Noble since I got a gift card for my birthday.

Is this really on back order? Any ETA on when it will be back in stock?

Thanks!!!

I'm trying to get this book through a book store (both online and through the local store) and they are saying it's on back order with no info when it will be available?

I'm specifically trying to get it through Barnes and Noble since I got a gift card for my birthday.

Is this really on back order? Any ETA on when it will be back in stock?

Thanks!!!

I had the same thing happen last year with the GameMastery Guide. They kept me hanging until I went into a store and dealt with the poor customer service person who had to call their distributor and be told what turned out to be a lie, essentially. Back order turned out to mean the distributor either didn't order enough or none at all. I ended up just getting the pdf of the Guide.

And I just missed the window of time to edit my post.

I am sorry Marc to be the bearer of bad news. I hope I am wrong in your case. I don't have anything personally against Barnes and Noble. I love the stores in my area, full of nice helpful people. I am severely disappointed in the buyers and their distributors, however.

I'm trying to get this book through a book store (both online and through the local store) and they are saying it's on back order with no info when it will be available?

I'm specifically trying to get it through Barnes and Noble since I got a gift card for my birthday.

Is this really on back order? Any ETA on when it will be back in stock?

Thanks!!!

I'm not aware of a legitimate reason why it would take them "1-2 weeks" like the site says, or, for that matter, why it's not in stock now. We'll see what we can do, but we don't have a lot of control over those things here...

I'm not aware of a legitimate reason why it would take them "1-2 weeks" like the site says, or, for that matter, why it's not in stock now. We'll see what we can do, but we don't have a lot of control over those things here...

Turns out Erik was already aware of this. There was a shipping problem between B&N and their distributor; we'll do what we can to help both parties get it ironed out as quickly as possible.

I had a similar problem with the APG today, ordered last week from UK book seller using Christmas Vouchers, and it was on "Usually ships in 1-2 days" still hadn't shipped today, they claimed no stock, and don't know when to expect more, then 2 hours after I tweet whining about it, it miraculously ships.....

Odd, but I'm happy. ;)

Vic Wertz wrote:

I'm not aware of a legitimate reason why it would take them "1-2 weeks" like the site says, or, for that matter, why it's not in stock now. We'll see what we can do, but we don't have a lot of control over those things here...

Turns out Erik was already aware of this. There was a shipping problem between B&N and their distributor; we'll do what we can to help both parties get it ironed out as quickly as possible.

Ok... Erik was mistaken. The shipping problem was with Amazon, not Barnes & Noble.

B&N doesn't have stock because they never finalized their Bestiary 2 order with our book trade distributor. We're seeing what we can do about that.

Vic Wertz wrote:

Vic Wertz wrote:

I'm not aware of a legitimate reason why it would take them "1-2 weeks" like the site says, or, for that matter, why it's not in stock now. We'll see what we can do, but we don't have a lot of control over those things here...

Turns out Erik was already aware of this. There was a shipping problem between B&N and their distributor; we'll do what we can to help both parties get it ironed out as quickly as possible.

Ok... Erik was mistaken. The shipping problem was with Amazon, not Barnes & Noble.

B&N doesn't have stock because they never finalized their Bestiary 2 order with our book trade distributor. We're seeing what we can do about that.

You see, this is why (one of many reasons) Paizo is awesome. I wish I had mentioned my problem with getting the GameMastery Guide back last June. It didn't even occur to me to post about it. I assumed it was their fault and there was nothing Paizo could do about it.

You see, this is why (one of many reasons) Paizo is awesome. I wish I had mentioned my problem with getting the GameMastery Guide back last June. It didn't even occur to me to post about it. I assumed it was their fault and there was nothing Paizo could do about it.

Whenever there's a store that really should have our books but doesn't, and bringing it to their attention doesn't solve it, feel free to bring it to our attention. We can't force people to buy stuff, but we can at least see if there are problems in the channel we can help solve.

WOO-HOO! My FLGS has notified me that my copy has finally arrived! Sweet Asmodeus, once again You have answered my fervent prayers! I'm so happy that I could start dancing... nekkid!

Vic Wertz wrote:

Vic Wertz wrote:

I'm not aware of a legitimate reason why it would take them "1-2 weeks" like the site says, or, for that matter, why it's not in stock now. We'll see what we can do, but we don't have a lot of control over those things here...

Turns out Erik was already aware of this. There was a shipping problem between B&N and their distributor; we'll do what we can to help both parties get it ironed out as quickly as possible.

Ok... Erik was mistaken. The shipping problem was with Amazon, not Barnes & Noble.

B&N doesn't have stock because they never finalized their Bestiary 2 order with our book trade distributor. We're seeing what we can do about that.

Thanks Vic!

I know it's only been a day (more or less) but is there any update on this?

I'm just trying to figure out if I should wait a couple more days and still use my BN gift card or just say the heck with it and order the book from Paizo now and use the BN card for something else.

Thanks!

I know it's only been a day (more or less) but is there any update on this?

I'm just trying to figure out if I should wait a couple more days and still use my BN gift card or just say the heck with it and order the book from Paizo now and use the BN card for something else.

Thanks!

No news, but even if they finalized their order today, I'm sure it'd still take at least a few days for it to reach one of their warehouses.

Do the Pathfinder-powers-that-be have plans to expand the Summon Monster/Nature's Ally lists to include creatures from the Bestiary 2?

Do the Pathfinder-powers-that-be have plans to expand the Summon Monster/Nature's Ally lists to include creatures from the Bestiary 2?

Those powers have said No.

Can someone tell me if the Graveknight made it into the Bestiary 2???

Can someone tell me if the Graveknight made it into the Bestiary 2???

It did not.

Marc Radle wrote:

Can someone tell me if the Graveknight made it into the Bestiary 2???

It did not.

It should definitely be in Bestiary 3, because the Graveknight is the best version of this classic monster!

Here's to hoping that Graveknight is one of the 9 monsters in the new Campaign Setting book ...

I love the book, but here are a couple of questions about the crawling hand:

1) Shouldn't its size be Tiny instead of Diminutive?
2) Is the damage for its slam attack truly supposed to be '1d1+1'? Or is this a typo? I would get 1d2+1 or 1d4+1, but now it's awfully low, even for a 1/2 CR monster.

Otherwise it's a really nice monster, but when I compare it to the "original" (3.5 crawling claw) these changes seem weird to me (unless they're errors?).

Liz Courts wrote:

Marc Radle wrote:

Can someone tell me if the Graveknight made it into the Bestiary 2???

It did not.

It should definitely be in Bestiary 3, because the Graveknight is the best version of this classic monster!

Graveknight won't be in the Inner Sea World Guide.

If and when we do a Bestiary 3, it's probably going to be in there though. In fact, chances of us doing something with graveknights even earlier than that? 100%.

Undead Revisited will have 6 pages of graveknight later this year.