Rub-Eta's page

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Hi, just wanted to ask about this specific skill feat (ranked as blue in the guide):
Quiet Allies - You can keep your heavily-armored friends from blowing the plan.

As I read the feat "When you are Avoiding Notice and your allies Follow the Expert, you and those allies can roll a single Stealth check, using the lowest modifier, instead of rolling separately. This doesn’t apply for initiative roll".

This reads to me that I'm not keeping anyone from blowing any skill checks, rather that I make them blow my stealth check, because we will be using their modifier.

Is there something I'm missing here or why is this feat considered good?

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So, to address the title-question, (I might repeat what has already been said in the thread, because I'm not reading three pages. I saw some mean-spirited takes very early and I want to spare myself but also offer my simple opinion).

I think it's good to see it from other people's perspective and remember that there may be different perspectives in the same camp:

From the sub-reddit moderators' perspective, I don't think it's a hateful reason why they removed your threads and changed the rules. *I think* it's purely that your posts made them realized that they had to take a stance on the matter, of letting people advertise a specific kind of paid services on the sub-reddit or not. And they chose to discourage it. Not to thwart you or any other legitimate DMs. But to completely remove any chance of anyone abusing the sub-reddit as a platform - if it is normalized it is much easier for people to get away with scamming or half-assing it. And I don't think there is a real, feasible way of controlling who is and isn't a legitimate, professional pay-for-play DM.
(Not sure if they allow art-commission advertisement, but in those cases it's very easy to assess the skill and style of an artist ((assuming they provide a portfolio)) which also makes the process more self-moderating, since people won't pay for lousy art or style they don't like).
*I think* the moderators just want to save themselves a ton of problems with having to deal with the aftermath of possible (inevitable) issues.

And I think they should be allowed to make that decision for the sub-reddit they moderate, because they are not being payed to moderate. They shouldn't have to take on more responsibilities, it's up to them.


The users on the sub-reddit who spewed vitriol at you (and some of them may also be moderators, I don't know); I think they're just uninformed, narrow-minded (or possibly just unwell) people who can't restrain themselves from typing negative things.
There is, sadly, a very strange mind-set among a lot of people online (well, I guess they have the same mind-set offline as well, but it's shown online more) where they can't distinguish between "making a living" and "greedy scalpers", especially when it comes to people making a living in creative fields (like art, game development and DMing, in this case, etc). The satisfaction of creating should be enough to sustain oneself, apparently. I suppose it comes from them seeing it as a commodity, when it's actually a luxurious service when provided by an experienced professional.


From my perspective, I just don't see why I would pay for a DM when I have my playgroup with decent and good DMs.
But that's just my *opinion*. Don't let that stop anyone.

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I feel like Charisma is a bit underrepresented here.

This is something I have changed my mind about over time, a few years ago I would probably not have had these thoughts.

To me, Charisma is a very important ability score to invest in, because I want to use it all the time. Charisma opens so many opportunities in the game, just through the skill bonuses alone. To (just) go from inconsistent to semi-consistent in charisma skill check successes is a big thing and changes how I play.

Of course, this is a very soft-rules area and the usefulness of charisma based skills varies greatly between tables and who you are as a player.
But when I play a character with low Charisma, I find myself biting my tongue and holding my character back, while passing messages (ooc and not) to the actual party-face, because I know that those words are just wasted coming from my character.

To me, Charisma is important enough to warrant consideration for every character I build and very often is my 2nd or 3rd highest ability score. And I really do think it pays off, many times.

To make it perfectly clear, I'm not saying that investing in Charisma is my favorite way of building unoptimized characters. I'm saying that a character could very well be unoptimized because it doesn't have Charisma (again, this varies greatly depending on what table and player you optimize for - not throwing any stank on other people's preferences).

Granted, I have limited experience with PF2 so I can't speak too much about how it works exactly in this edition. Though from what I've seen, there are less substitutes for Charisma than in PF1? (Student of Philosophy, Inquisitions, etc), making me think that Charisma is more important than previously (at least for me).

On the topic of balance: with my limited experience, I have little to add to the evaluation of balance between Ability Scores.

But I do think that they don't have to be "perfectly balanced" (put in citation marks because "perfect" is very hard to define) - what I mean is that I don't think "perfect balance" is needed to enjoy the game (or build/brew characters).

And I do absolutely think that they shouldn't be symmetrically balanced - I'm mentioning this because I'm not sure that Charisma should have generic mechanical benefits (like saves). I think that could risk turning Charisma into an artificially useful Ability Score, functioning as an Ability Score tax that you need to invest in (contra an Ability Score that some players wants to invest in).

But that's just my opinion.

zza ni wrote:
i mean like getting 2 aoo. one with spear when target get close then getting a 2nd aoo from him casting a spell near you using your natural weapons on him)

But you can normally only take 1 AoO per turn

Yes, you can make attacks using weapons wielded with vestigial arms, just like any other arms.
(EDIT: I probably need to reiterate before someone starts screaming at me, no EXTRA attacks).

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Talk to them.

Remember that all encounters don't need to be challenging.
Also, remember that an APL appropriate encounter isn't a challenging one. Those encounters are supposed to be manageable for the party - If you want to challenge them: AMP IT UP!

Rents wrote:
Do I just have to make situations to force them off their mounts?

NO! They are playing mounted characters, do not engineer situations that disallow them to play their characters! Don't target your players because of their choice of play. I'm serious. Players outputting a ton of damage is not a problem, just let them.

Iroran Paladin wrote:
Iroran paladins meditate on self-perfection and train relentlessly, knowing that their example can inspire others to excel. Irori offers no universal paladin code— each paladin in his service creates his own code as part of his spiritual journey, seeing the adherence to such a self-formulated creed as one of the many tests one must face to reach perfection.

To me, this means "Yes, they absolutely have to". Doing anything else would be such a big flavor fail that I honestly wouldn't allow it at my table.

But what I'm quoting isn't rules text, and there are no rules that states that they all have to.

I see a lot of un-cited sources here. What's all this about terminal velocity and aerodynamics? I can't find it in any of the rule books.

I really don't see a problem.

"I'd rather have a consistent party for long-reaching storylines" - Then stop killing their characters...

My Operative has the Fleet feat, Quick Movement (+10), Sure-Footed and Jet Dash - Being able to run 300ft in difficult terrain VS walking 10-15ft is an insane difference.

My group used to have this problem as well. The players sat down and thought out a "smart" plan, only to get it instantly foiled because they had missed some vital information. - This happened multiple times.

Now days, the players mostly have a quick talk to make sure everyone is on the same page and then goes in guns blazing - Works out much better.

OmniMage wrote:
The wish spell has a cost of 25k GP because its not a spell any player should be casting often. You shouldn't allow any trick to work if it cheats this limit.
blahpers wrote:
By the time you're flinging wish spells, finding a means of exchanging 25,000 gp for a 25,000 gp diamond ought to be child's play.


Lanathar wrote:
So he started off with d6+5 damage at point blank shot and 17 AC and 12 HP

This sounds like a weak barbarian with a wasted feat to me.

While I don't think that being creative should get you easy to-make magical items, I feel like your DM is a bit too stiff.
You should be allowed to theme it so that you use the trophies while technically paying upb/wbl.

In my games:
1. I assume that an average intelligent being knows about as much about his world as we do about ours. Unzipping a jacket isn't that much of a challenge, even if the zipper is a bit strange. More complex gadgets will require special knowledge (as determined by the DM)

2. It is very reasonable if he/she has reason to suspect an ambush. Being a good tactician or succeeding a sense motive check to notice that something is off/you're walking into a trap is enough reason.
Being smart and wise is not enough on its own.

3. "Can your mumbo-jumbo fix my weapon? Or does that only work on people?" is a very natural question for anyone in your situation.


Please don't assume we know what ability you are referring to. There are multiple 'misfortune' abilities in the game.

@David Knott 242: There is nothing in the rules demanding that a DM have to operate in the way you suggest.

Other re-roll powers don't function the same way as this one.

Reading this one as is: You are better of using it on yourself or allies.

Solved! Thanks Paizo team!

Dajur wrote:
Then, the GM's sister finds out that he hasn't been in California at all, he was actually in Utah

This is amazing.

Volkard Abendroth wrote:
Instead of going for piranha strike/power attack, you could always go for arcane strike.

Why not both?

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From another thread:

Rub-Eta wrote:

Had a bad DM who just couldn't for the life of his campaign make anything interesting. We didn't want to go on his adventure, our characters found much more interesting stuff to do. Every NPC we'd meet didn't want us to go on his adventure (for many different reasons). When we (the players) threw him a bone and went on his adventure anyway, he constantly tried to convey to us how everything we tried was impossible (because he had thought out some "puzzles" with very specific solutions that we in no way could figure out). It was over after one session.

The worst DM (who almost made me quit my group and role-playing altogether, before I kicked him out instead):

  • Took one and a half session before introducing a new player's character (while the new player sat and waited, for one and a half session).
  • Spent an entire session (about four hours) telling us how our characters traveled for a week by boat, repeating basically the same day seven times, with a bit of variation. As soon as we got to our destination he called off the session.
  • Did not know how to read a simple Bestiary entry, which lead to some very questionable on-the-spot rulings.
  • Stole from the PC's during impossible circumstances.
  • Knee-jerk house-ruled away PCs' abilities mid-sessions.
  • Would occasionally overrule role-play and fully ignore player agency. He would actually "correct" players and tell them "no, that's not at all what your character does".

  • Any attempt in correcting him was met with a very degrading and demeaning attitude and always ended up in an even less favorable result.
    Oh, it also turned out that he sent dick-pics to one of the players' girlfriend... f$~! that guy.

    A few things stick out to me:

    xSaber0022 wrote:
    we're usually canceling them because the GM and one of our players constantly have to cancel for multiple reasons

    It's evident that everyone in your group does not share the same engagement. And that should be okay, but you may need to talk to the group about this if it bothers you. Maybe consider playing even if you're one player short?

    xSaber0022 wrote:
    rant about how there needs to be more GM respect at the table and how he doesn't have the time or patience to read 500 pages of the rulebook

    I have no respect for this person as a GM and would honestly not allow him to GM at my table.

    There is no excuse for not knowing the rules of the system. The bare minimum is knowing enough so that you can make a quick decision in any situation (even if it's not 100% correct).
    Being defensive about it and demanding respect because of your title is just plain childish.

    I honestly would suggest that you (politely) suggest to your group that you can start your own game, where you will GM and play every week (that the "normal" campaign isn't running, if people still want to play that game), even if all players aren't present.

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    pennywit wrote:
    Each player must play a vigilante (magic child) who dresses in a different color and has a different animal as a familiar. And each of the players has access to a Huge golem modeled after its familiar ...

    ... what's the problem with this?

    Lady Platypus wrote:
    - A new national holiday named after us, to celebrate our future achievements.

    I hope you have a group name, or else it's a going to be a mouth full. And everyone will hate you.

    Lady Platypus wrote:
    - A large manor, just outside the capital, to call home.

    Just one? Get multiple castles with servants!

    Lady Platypus wrote:
    - Unrestricted access to all knowledge places, such as arcane academies or libraries.


    Lady Platypus wrote:
    - A monthly payment (nothing gamebreakinig) to sustain our basic expenses.

    Eh. Weight in gold sounds better.

    Lady Platypus wrote:
    - Becoming nobles, with a title high enough to be more important than most other nobles (except for the crown's family).

    A noble title is enough. The other nobles will get a bit butt-hurt otherwise.

    Lady Platypus wrote:

    - A bunch of gold to spend immediately, and access to special shops and discounts.

    Nah, the shop-keepers will hate you.

    Addition: Any hot daughters? Any hot sons?

    Almost all of these points apply to the fighter as well.

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    I'm starting to see Starfinder more and more as basically a wild-west in space. So guns are probably just natural.

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    Any class that requires deep knowledge of the system and options, or a class that has complex class abilities.
    Fighters, Brawlers 9th level spell non-divine casters are good examples of how there are too many options to build. Though any 9th level caster is a bit too much, as spells require a lot of understanding of the general system.
    All the occult classes are good examples of classes who has too complex class abilities.

    I feel like the Ranger is a good class to introduce new players to. It starts as a straight martial class, 2nd level they get a limited option of feats and they eventually get some spell-casting, and animal companions don't require much at all.

    jscott991 wrote:
    Rub-Eta wrote:
    jscott991 wrote:
    I'm surprised that it's not a more common sentiment.
    And this is why. If they would later re-publish them in a better format, why would anyone buy them on release?

    Presumably to get them immediately rather than waiting the months or years it would take to republish.

    Comic books collect issues in paperback anthologies and that doesn't seem to put their monthly individual issues at risk.

    To be honest, I assumed Adventure Paths worked the same way. Put out the flimsy six issues for those that can't wait and then collect them into a hardback book for those that did.

    Comic books don't take 2 years to get through, though.

    LordKailas wrote:
    ok, so for dual wielding you're looking at a rogue, ranger or slayer and 2H is what? barbarian? Fighter?

    2H is for everyone.

    jscott991 wrote:
    I'm surprised that it's not a more common sentiment.

    And this is why. If they would later re-publish them in a better format, why would anyone buy them on release?

    Why feeblemind?

    If your BAB is 7, then it's not 8. 7 is in fact a lower number than 8, so you do not fulfill the prerequisite.
    Jokes aside, any and all prerequisites about BAB always refer to the first number. The later number is always the previous number -5 and is just written out to remind you that you get an extra attack at that BAB, nothing more.

    Wow, yeah. They have basically the same stats, minus the pounce, rake and grab on bite. A shame but a huge upgrade from the original bear. The grizzly actually makes me want to play a Druid - Double bear combo!

    It's almost as if Paizo already knew that the game could be overwhelming for new players.
    But actually, yes, it's a well known fact that the CRB isn't well organized, actually having been acknowledged by Paizo.

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    I vote lobster.

    One of my dwarfs asked for a "zombie-free" room at an inn we stayed at. Two of the other PCs woke him up in the middle of the night, nibbling at his feet and acting weird. On the bright side, the inn-keeper paid him back every copper for the room!

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    It's not the race, it's the player. Some people are disruptive no matter what.

    Um, yes, and the BOMPA and the LOMPA gadgets are outrageously priced.

    While I can't say that it's as solid as I would have liked it, I feel like it's less weird than PF (where even 1st level PCs are filthy rich by NPC standards).

    Also, FAQ's and errata are not the same thing.

    Zhayne wrote:
    But why are those the exact same words and gestures the wizard uses to cast a Fireball?

    They are?

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    You guys seem to know a lot about second edition already. Enough so that you're able to make accurate assertions about it and very specific pieces of the rules.
    I'm impressed.

    Egeslean05 wrote:
    I was actually hopping for an actual constructive answer, not '*froths at the mouth* ARG is bad'. There's a reason I'm asking about using the Race Points system, I'm not just doing it for fun.

    I understand. But I'm trying to tell you that what ever reason you have, you're asking an impossible question. There is no reason in the race point system, we can't logically value anything in RP as it's all over the place.

    If you use the system of your own volition, just stop. If you're building a race to get approved by someone else, ask them instead.
    This is as honest advice I can give.

    This is a question of what rule is the most specific and which one is the most general.
    I'm quite convinced that Underfoot Assault is the most general and that anything that allows one to avoid AoO's trumps it.

    Keaton Stizz wrote:

    He usually burrows and sneak attacks.

    Or maybe some examples of enemies that could be more of a challenge for them?

    Stuff that can't take precision damage, like oozes.

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    ... Yes that's definitely why they're releasing 2nd ed, as clearly stated...

    If you don't like it, stay with first edition until they re-release it.

    It's anywhere between 1 to 20 points.

    Seriously though, don't ever bother with the ARG's Race Builder system. It's just bad. Use common sense instead as a guideline.

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