Weapon Training—And So Many Weapons!

Excellent work! ^_^

What a pleasant surprise ^^

This is beautiful. Nice work, John, Linda, and Team!

Hmm... was sure the dwarven longhamer and longaxe were going to be in the polearm group as well.

Guess not.

Yay!

Extremely useful! I wasn't expecting this either. Thank you guys so much for putting this list together, you're a bunch of lifesavers.

I totally suck with computers can someone make this a downloadable list I can print?

I totally suck with computers can someone make this a downloadable list I can print?

You could copy & paste it into a text document (NotePad, WordPad, Microsoft Word). That's probably what I would do. ^_^

Wow do I feel like a total idiot, chalk it up to 40 hours of work a nasty cold no sleep and a ton of cold medicine. So sorry.

Thank you!!!

Hmm... was sure the dwarven longhamer and longaxe were going to be in the polearm group as well.

Guess not.

Yeah, that one surprised me, too. Yet the lucerne hammer is a polearm, but not a hammer. That blows my whole "anything with hammer in its name is a hammer, and anything with reach is a polearm" theory out of the water.

I'm just glad the dwarven longhammer is officially a hammer, since that means it can be used in conjunction with the Foehammer Fighter archetype from the dwarf chapter of the Advanced Race Guide (where the weapon was introduced).

Now I have to look up the dwarven maulaxe. It's a hammer with "dwarven" in the name, so my Foehammer might want one, just for the sake of completeness. Just looked it up, and it's from the Adventurer's Armory, which I already own, so that works for me.

Thanks to John and the team for coming up with a full list for us!

Many thanks! No more table variation worries for my Polearm Master wielding a fauchard!

So where are the stats for a doru? I know it's a Greek spear, but I have never seen the stats for one.

So where are the stats for a doru? I know it's a Greek spear, but I have never seen the stats for one.

Freshly released, in the Iblydos section of Distant Shores.

I believe Mr. Compton wrote that section, so it only makes sense that he'd include it here. ^_^

Thank You, it is wonderful to see a definitive list.

Imbicatus wrote:

So where are the stats for a doru? I know it's a Greek spear, but I have never seen the stats for one.

Freshly released, in the Iblydos section of Distant Shores.

I believe Mr. Compton wrote that section, so it only makes sense that he'd include it here. ^_^

Yep, the doru, gastraphetes, and phaleros are all in the Iblydos section of the very-soon-to-be-released Distant Shores

Thanks to everyone involved for their hard work in putting this together for us!

My Sohei can finally Flurry with his Fauchard! Thank you!!

We really should have a blanket call for allowing common sense , otherwise this is just going to crop up again after every new equipment book.

Fighters spend so much of their time using the same weapon that anything but the most egregious use of the weapon catagories would be meaningless. Wealth by level pretty much forces the fighter to pool their resources into adding +s to one weapon, that they try to use all the time (to the point where fly potions are a better investment than magic bows). You would almost have the two catagories be "melee" and "Ranged" with little effect.

Brawlers with barbazu beards. Hell yeah.

What about the firearms that also include melee weapons? For the purposes of things like the fighter's weapon training class feature, does the melee part of the firearm fall under the firearm category or the original weapon's? (Dagger, sword cane, warhammer, battleaxe)
The description of the items in ultimate combat said that they are enchanted like double weapons, but I didn't see them in the double weapon category. How does two weapon fighting work for these double weapons? Especially curious about the one-handed ones.
Similarly, does a feat like Weapon Focus apply to both parts of the firearm, or would it need to be taken twice?

The Bladed Scarf finally has a weapon type! Thanks!

What about the firearms that also include melee weapons? For the purposes of things like the fighter's weapon training class feature, does the melee part of the firearm fall under the firearm category or the original weapon's? (Dagger, sword cane, warhammer, battleaxe)

The description of the items in ultimate combat said that they are enchanted like double weapons, but I didn't see them in the double weapon category. How does two weapon fighting work for these double weapons? Especially curious about the one-handed ones.
Similarly, does a feat like Weapon Focus apply to both parts of the firearm, or would it need to be taken twice?

Pretty sure its taken twice.

Wait, Phaleros? Like, the Argonaut?

He has a weapon named after him?

Morningstar: A morningstar is a spiked metal ball, affixed to the top of a long handle.

I notice that morningstars are in the flails group, but the weapon description still describes them as a club with spikes in it, and traditionally, the morningstar is just the spiked ball that can be used as the head of a mace or the weight on a flail.

Should morningstars be in the hammers group in addition to or instead of flails?

Thanks!

Thanks, John and Linda and Andrew and Dave and Robert!

I notice that "siege weapons" are listed as part of the firearms group, but I don't think any of those are actually PFS-legal. Hopefully people won't see this and not cross-reference the rest of the AR list... maybe some warning text in this blog's AR entry could clarify?

Beautiful work, always appreciated!

I see the infinite scrutiny curse I cast is working perfectly...

On a serious note, this clarifications are excellent. Thank you!

Great to see where the Golarion-specific weapons go in the weapons groups.

I saw that the repeating hand crossbow was double listed in crossbows and that there is no listing for Minotaur Double Crossbow, i guess that is officially not a thing then? i have seen some debate on that point back and forth over the past few years.

Where are these shield spikes from? "Shield Spikes" isn't on any table I can find.

Or did you mean spiked shields? I didn't see those on the list. Nomenclature!

:)

And I sincerely truly hope you redid the definition on the *^(*^ klar properly.

Note: If you're going to use 'shield spikes', then you're going to have to completely redefine them as not altering the damage of the shield, but doing damage based on the size of the shield they are attached to.

Which will, of course, mean they stack with Bashing once again...

So...I trust the correct wording is going to be used?

==Aelryinth

Where are these shield spikes from? "Shield Spikes" isn't on any table I can find.

Or did you mean spiked shields? I didn't see those on the list. Nomenclature!

:)

CRB. You put them on a shield (no bucklers or towers) to effectively make them spiked shields.

PRD Shield Spikes

My starting point for this project was the weapon categories table from Ultimate Equipment, so any of the weapons appearing therein were unaltered in their nomenclature. If there is a mistake in that regard, though, I am happy to pass it along to the design team for possible tweaking in any future printing of the book.

My starting point for this project was the weapon categories table from Ultimate Equipment, so any of the weapons appearing therein were unaltered in their nomenclature. If there is a mistake in that regard, though, I am happy to pass it along to the design team for possible tweaking in any future printing of the book.

And John rolls a natural 20 on the acrobatics check to dodge responsibility. :)

Seriously, good job on the list, and thanks for posting it. As I said, i'm just happy that my dwarven foehammer fighter can use a dwarven longhammer.

Then please do.

The weapon tables list 'light spiked shields' and 'heavy spiked shields'. It does NOT list 'shield spikes'.
It DOES list Armor Spikes.
So that needs to be revised. Shield Spikes are Not A Weapon. Spiked Shields are weapons, and are not on your list.
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Here's the Klar definition, which is completely different then its original, because some doo-hah doesn't know what armor spikes are and mistyped the carryover.

Benefit: A traditional klar counts as a light wooden shield with armor spikes. A metal klar counts as a light steel shield with armor spikes.

As should be obvious, you can't attach armor spikes to a shield. It should simply read that a Klar counts as a light spiked shield. Furthermore, it should note that using the blade of a Klar is NOT a shield bash (the blade does d6 slashing and a bash is d4 piercing).

Please get the klar nomenclature corrected.
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It may seem a minor point, but what you're doing is creating contention where shield spikes are crafted and enchanted separately from the shields beneath them, just like armor spikes are weapons that are separate from the armor underneath them.

You need to crush that terminology and keep the nomenclature consistent.

You do NOT enchant shield spikes separately. They do NOT do damage independent of the shield below them...they aren't a weapon at all, and they don't do silver, cold iron or adamantine damage. The shield is the weapon and defines everything about the shield. All that happens with spikes is it turns them into spiked shields. Spikes are relevant in NO OTHER WAYS.

If you suddenly have to enchant the shield spikes, you now have Shields are Shields + Weapon + Weapon (spikes), effectively making them triple weapons. Where I put adamantine spikes on my shield and it works against adamantine/DR. Etc etc.

All because you're saying shield spikes are separate weapons from the shield.

You need to stamp this out NOW.

===Aelryinth

BTW Aelryinth, you don't need to sign your posts. Your name is listed right above your forum avatar.

The weapon tables list 'light spiked shields' and 'heavy spiked shields'. It does NOT list 'shield spikes'.
It DOES list Armor Spikes.

Actually, the current version of the weapon table on the PRD lists "spiked armor" instead of armor spikes.

Armor lists "Armor Spikes" and "Shield Spikes"

Armor spikes lay out some mechanics and then say "see spiked armor"

Shield spikes lay out some mechanics and then say "see heavy spiked shield and light spiked shield"

weapons list "Spiked Armor", "Spiked Heavy Shield", "Spiked Light Shield"

All three say "see armor spikes on page ten for mechanics."

two of those should probably be corrected to read "see shield spikes" not armor spikes, but yes, the nomenclature *is* consistent. And yes, shields are enchanted and crafted seperately from their spikes.

And I'm sorry, no, you cannot get a +1 weapon for 1200 gp by buying a spiked shield, enchanting it to +1 at armor prices, and hitting people with it.

And I'm sorry, no, you cannot get a +1 weapon for 1200 gp by buying a spiked shield, enchanting it to +1 at armor prices, and hitting people with it.

You can if you have the Shield Master feat...

FLite wrote:

And I'm sorry, no, you cannot get a +1 weapon for 1200 gp by buying a spiked shield, enchanting it to +1 at armor prices, and hitting people with it.

You can if you have the Shield Master feat...

Based on the cost of magic items, a feat costs ~8000 gp.

therefor, you have paid 9200 gp (8000 gp of which you got for free from your class or level or race ) :)

I stand by my math.

Okay, I forgot about Shield Master, but *absent a feat or class power* you cannot do it.

My starting point for this project was the weapon categories table from Ultimate Equipment, so any of the weapons appearing therein were unaltered in their nomenclature. If there is a mistake in that regard, though, I am happy to pass it along to the design team for possible tweaking in any future printing of the book.

Please pass along my concerns about the melee-ready firearms. Was disappointed not to see them addressed in the new update for UC.

we are all aware that sans Shield Master, armor enhancement bonuses are not weapon enhancement bonuses.

But, if shield spikes are a separate item from the shield, then a spiked shield is:
A shield (armor enhancement)
A weapon (weapon enhancement)
and another weapon, shield spikes (more weapon enhancements).

Which is basically a double weapon + Armor situation.

If they could get their nomenclature straight and close the bloody rules loopholes, it would be much appreciated, before someone jumps on them as 'proof' that they can now have +10/+10/+10 spiked shields.

It gets even worse with the klar, because it DOES have a separate blade, but nowhere does it say the blade of the klar is enhanced separately from the rest of it, thankfully...although some people would like it to be treated that way, and since it doesn't say it's NOT...

Oh, and armor spikes specifically include the language they can be enchanted separately from the armor underneath them, which just confirms what some people want to have happen with Klars! (gah, I hate the way they mangled all the rules with Klars).

And signing my name is just a reflex from having a lot of long posts, so you don't have to go looking up to see who's posting, and I just do it automatically after so many years.

==Aelryinth

I don't see the Chainsaw though.

I don't see the Chainsaw though.

I don't think that's PFS legal.

blackbloodtroll wrote:

I don't see the Chainsaw though.

I don't think that's PFS legal.

99.5% correct, Fromper. In the interest of spoilers, I'll leave it at that.

Blackbloodtroll, you're right to point out technological weapons. They had absolutely slipped my mind, and I'll inspect them to see what might make sense.

Well.

That is certainly uplifting to see you guys being so thorough.

Fromper wrote:

blackbloodtroll wrote:

I don't see the Chainsaw though.

I don't think that's PFS legal.

99.5% correct, Fromper. In the interest of spoilers, I'll leave it at that.

... Is it on a chronicle sheet somewhere? I don't like chronicle hunting, but I will do it for a chainsaw!

John Compton wrote:

Fromper wrote:

blackbloodtroll wrote:

I don't see the Chainsaw though.

I don't think that's PFS legal.

99.5% correct, Fromper. In the interest of spoilers, I'll leave it at that.

... Is it on a chronicle sheet somewhere? I don't like chronicle hunting, but I will do it for a chainsaw!

I'm 99% sure that it's on a Season 6 chronicle sheet, actually. As is my gunslinger's new favorite thing in the whole world...