Pathfinder Society and the Remaster

Thursday, October 26, 2023

Ever since we announced the Pathfinder Remaster project, my inbox has not known peace. Every day I get asked by the Pathfinders worldwide, “how will Pathfinder Society handle the Remaster?” Every day I must give the same answer, “I don’t know yet! Ask me in 1d4 months!”

It’s now 1d4 months later and I can finally start to answer this question! With the assistance of some incredibly dedicated Additional Resources volunteers and no less than six members of Paizo staff, we are here today to present the broad strokes of our plan to convert (or not convert) your Pathfinder Society characters to the brand-new Remastered rules. While we don’t intend for our scenarios to be written using the Remastered rules until Year 6 begins at Gen Con 2024, we know the characters will need to make the switch faster.

Before we get into it, I’d like to offer a couple of disclaimers. First, the rules we’re sharing today are the broad strokes. There will be more specifics to come on release date, but we’re still working our way through specific questions like “what happens to my staff of transmutation now that transmutation isn’t a school?” We’re sharing this today to get you ready for what’s to come.

Second, these rules are still in flux. We have a pile of questions yet to answer internally (we’re having weekly meetings to do nothing but answer them), and we expect more will come from the community as time goes on. We expect this to happen! Our intention is for these guidelines to live in a subpage of the Guide to Organized Play, to allow them to be a living document we’ll update as time goes on.

Finally, we will not be able to answer every single question that comes up. Rules discrepancies and questions come up all the time at tables, and the Remaster will increase the odds of that happening. The GM always has the power to make calls on rules questions at the table. While we strive for the Pathfinder Society experience to play out the same at every table worldwide, we need to accept as a community that there will be some variance, and be patient with each other as we figure things out. This is a game, we’re here to have fun, let’s all keep that in mind as we play!

With all that out of the way, here are the current planned guidelines for Pathfinder Society and the Remaster. If you have questions/comments/concerns, drop them in the comments of this blog and we’ll do our best to answer them. Once the Remaster drops, we’ll create a separate thread in the Pathfinder Society forum for those specific rules interactions that we won’t discover until they come up in play.

Alex Speidel
Organized Play Coordinator

Ezren looking over plans and judges them.



Objectives

When considering the Pathfinder Remaster, our intent is as follows:

  • To ensure that players are not forced to rebuild characters
  • To ensure that as much previous material as feasible is still useable
  • To incentivize adoption of the new, Remastered ruleset
  • To provide an optional method to rebuild characters into Remaster rules

General Guidance

  1. Game Rules
    1. Players and GMs must use the remastered rules of the game immediately where possible.
      1. Example: Recall Knowledge has been updated with additional guidelines. These take effect immediately at all PFS tables.
      2. Example: The Refocus activity and the focus spell rules have been updated to be more intuitive. All characters immediately begin using these rules.
      3. Example: Monster abilities such as Grab are no longer automatic, but allow a free skill check to attempt the action. GMs immediately begin using this new version of the rules.
  2. Character Options
    1. Beginning on November 15, 2023, no new characters may be created using the class chassis printed in the Core Rulebook if the class has been reprinted in the Player Core.
      1. This affects the following classes: bard, cleric, druid, fighter, ranger, rogue, witch, wizard.
      2. Characters with at least 1 game reported prior to November 15 may be built using the Core Rulebook chassis.
      3. Previously-existing characters with at least 1 game reported may continue their progression using the Core Rulebook chassis. They may not use the chassis in the Player Core without rebuilding.
    2. If a character option has been reprinted with the same name, use the new version as if it were errata. No additional retraining is necessary.
      1. Example: divine lance has been reprinted with new Remaster-compatible rules. All PCs with divine lance must update the spell accordingly.
    3. If a character option has not been reprinted, characters are free to use the option as previously printed, or to select it at any time.
      1. Example: the brooch of shielding has not been reprinted. Characters may still purchase and use a brooch of shielding.
      2. Example: the produce flame spell has not been reprinted, but ignition takes its place thematically. Characters may learn either spell anytime they would learn a new spell, and could learn both spells if they chose.
      3. Example: the oracle class has not yet been remastered. Players may still build and play oracles using the rules in the Pathfinder Advanced Player’s Guide.
  1. An oracle who learns divine lance must still use the remastered version of the spell.

Specific Rules

  1. Alignment: Alignment has been removed from the game. PCs and NPCs no longer have alignment.
    1. Edicts and Anathema: To replace certain aspects of alignment, edicts and anathema are being emphasized. These are voluntary and optional, though deities and classes may introduce specific edicts and anathema which are not optional.
    2. Holy and Unholy: Many previously-aligned options now have either the holy, unholy, or sanctified traits. At a GM’s discretion, enemy abilities which previously had the good or evil traits may now have the holy or unholy trait.
      1. Example: A quasit’s strikes previously had the evil trait. A GM may choose to give them the unholy trait, as quasits are demonic creatures. Similarly, a quasit’s weakness to good should now be considered a weakness to holy.
  2. Wizards
    1. Wizards built using the Core Rulebook chassis may continue to treat spells that had their spell school removed as part of the Remaster as if they have spell schools. They must otherwise fully update their remastered spells.
      1. Example: An evocation wizard may still select electric arc as an evocation cantrip. They must use the new damage as printed in the Player Core.
    2. Wizards built using the Core Rulebook chassis may learn new spells printed in remastered books, but they can never treat them as having a school spell if they did not previously have one.
    3. Runelords
      1. On November 15, 2023, the Runelord boon will be removed from the Achievement Points store. No new Runelords may be created after this date until/unless the archetype is reprinted.
  3. Campaign-Specific Rules and Clarifications
    1. Pathfinder Society characters may not be sanctified to unholy. This is the spiritual successor to the previous rule forbidding PCs of evil alignment.

Rebuilding

  1. On November 15, 2023, all characters with at least one game reported are granted one free rebuild. This is a full rebuild; you may completely alter a character’s ancestry, class, background, and any options selected. You may not alter the adventures a character has participated in, nor may you alter a character’s Reputation earned.
  2. Upon rebuilding, your character starts with gold equal to Table X.X[Alex note: this table will be published with the full rules, and is built on our baseline assumption of earning 8 TB per scenario].
    1. Alternatively, a player character may sell any and all currently-held items at face value and purchase new items as normal.
  3. If you use this rebuild, indicate “Remaster Rebuild” on your character’s most recent Chronicle Sheet.
  4. If, in the course of this rebuild, you wish to refund any purchased boons, please email orgplayreportingerrors[at]paizo[dot]com with your character’s name, OP ID and character number, and the boon(s) you would like to refund.
  5. This rebuild must be used before December 31, 2024. A second rebuild of this type will not be granted following the release of Player Core 2.



One Final Change

While this isn’t a direct result of the Remaster, we’re taking the opportunity to make another change. Beginning on November 15, we will be removing the Pathfinder Training from the Guide to Organized Play. Your characters who are already Field Commissioned may still take bonus downtime, and we’re not going to take away the bonus Lores or feats your characters may have already gained. However, new characters may not use this system. Quite simply, it’s an extra layer of complexity that most players aren’t engaging with, and that doesn’t add much to the program.

However, we know everybody loves free items, so they will remain in the form of Pathfinder Provisions! We’ll have a pared-down list of consumables which all agents (including formerly Field Commissioned agents) may choose from at the start of a mission. By default agents will receive healing potions, though they may choose another item or items if they prefer. The Society wants to ensure its agents come home safe!

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Tags: Organized Play Pathfinder Remaster Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Pathfinder Second Edition Pathfinder Society
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4/5 5/55/55/5 **** Venture-Lieutenant, Minnesota—Minneapolis

1 person marked this as a favorite.

Thanks, I eagerly await answers to the many questions asked and unasked.

Vigilant Seal

Apologies if I just missed it while going through the thread, but I would also like official guidance on :

1.) If existing characters who are not yet level 5 do not recieve the level 5 School Feat as a result of Pathfinder Training being removed on November 15th, and…
2.) If existing characters who take the Remaster Respec option immediately lose access to previously acquired benefits from the newly-deprecated Pathfinder Training as part of the Respec due to “full rebuild” being interpreted as “create from scratch plus chronicle and boon purchases” and thus a “new character”.

I’ll probably Respec anyway to incorporate lessons learned over the past year, but asking to clarify confusion over the wording for my local branch.

Shadow Lodge *

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Maps, Pathfinder Accessories Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Starfinder Superscriber

I have a character with the Discarded Fleshwarp heritage. What effect does that have now?

Discarded Heritage wrote:
The biomancers and mutagenists who warped your form labeled you a “discard on discovery”—a euphemism for destroying you on sight. An anomaly among anomalies, your body stubbornly repudiates the efforts of fleshcrafters seeking to mold you to their grandiose visions, and your immune responses blunt the worst effects of unwanted fleshwarping attempts. If you roll a success on a saving throw against a transmutation effect, you get a critical success instead.

My suggestion is that it should work against effects with the Morph or Polymorph traits.

(For reference, the Dwarf heritage that did the same thing against necromancy effects, Death Warden Dwarf, now works against things with the Void trait, or created by the undead.)

Grand Lodge 4/5 ****

Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
pH unbalanced wrote:

I have a character with the Discarded Fleshwarp heritage. What effect does that have now?

Discarded Heritage wrote:
The biomancers and mutagenists who warped your form labeled you a “discard on discovery”—a euphemism for destroying you on sight. An anomaly among anomalies, your body stubbornly repudiates the efforts of fleshcrafters seeking to mold you to their grandiose visions, and your immune responses blunt the worst effects of unwanted fleshwarping attempts. If you roll a success on a saving throw against a transmutation effect, you get a critical success instead.

My suggestion is that it should work against effects with the Morph or Polymorph traits.

(For reference, the Dwarf heritage that did the same thing against necromancy effects, Death Warden Dwarf, now works against things with the Void trait, or created by the undead.)

That's probably what we need, though I imagine the guide will have to say something like "Any time you see 'transmutation', use traits X Y Z', etc... or people will lose their minds.

Paizo Employee 5/55/5 ** Organized Play Coordinator

5 people marked this as a favorite.

Sorry for the delay on this answer:

Any character which uses the Remaster Rebuild will need to remove their free bonus lore and bonus feat from Pathfinder Training. All PFS characters will get free training in Pathfinder Society Lore going forward.

If you have not earned a bonus feat from Pathfinder Training prior to November 15, your character cannot earn that bonus feat in the future.

This is the simplest and cleanest solution as we remove this subsystem.

Shadow Lodge 4/5 5/55/55/55/5 **** Venture-Captain, California—San Francisco Bay Area North & East

3 people marked this as a favorite.
Alex Speidel wrote:

Sorry for the delay on this answer:

Any character which uses the Remaster Rebuild will need to remove their free bonus lore and bonus feat from Pathfinder Training. All PFS characters will get free training in Pathfinder Society Lore going forward.

If you have not earned a bonus feat from Pathfinder Training prior to November 15, your character cannot earn that bonus feat in the future.

This is the simplest and cleanest solution as we remove this subsystem.

Strong motivation to not rebuild.

Envoy's Alliance 4/5 5/55/55/55/5 *****

1 person marked this as a favorite.

I think we all love the bonus skill feats we got at Level 5.

Wayfinders 4/5 5/55/55/55/5 ***** Contributor

Alright, so in Pip's case, I will instead skip a day job to retrain her burrowing elocutionist feat into animal elocutionist rather than use the remaster rebuild.

Unless... Will we need to retrain to switch to the shortened ancestry feat chains from remaster? This affects not just burrowing elocutionist, but also all the ancestral weapon feat chains.

Wayfinders 4/5 5/55/55/55/5 ***** Contributor

2 people marked this as a favorite.

And another question: will PFS have a clarification on whether players can use a custom mixed heritage (other than Aiuvarin / Dromaar)? I know that I will have players asking, and I'd love to know what to tell them.

If it were just me, I would happily open the floodgates to whatever mixed heritage people wanted. "Ah, so you are mix of a ghoran and nagaji? You have purchased both ancestral boons? Check. And come up with a ridiculous backstory? Oh I see. There was a cooking contest between two gods and you are an escaped ingredient? Check. Okay, that looks good to me."

But whatever route we choose, it would be nice to have some consistency.

Shadow Lodge *

Pathfinder Maps, Pathfinder Accessories Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Starfinder Superscriber
Hilary Moon Murphy wrote:
Unless... Will we need to retrain to switch to the shortened ancestry feat chains from remaster? This affects not just burrowing elocutionist, but also all the ancestral weapon feat chains.

I would expect that you wouldn't need to retrain the base ancestry feat chain, since the name is identical to the current one. But the later feats in the chain would be superfluous, and might need retraining individually.

Wayfinders 4/5 5/55/55/55/5 ***** Contributor

It's a little more complicated.

Pre-Remaster, the feat Burrowing Elocutionist (lvl 1) was required for Animal Elocutionist (lvl 5).

In the Remaster you can take Animal Elocutionist at level 1 and Burrowing Elocutionist disappears. I want to know if I have to spend downtime to retrain my Burrowing Elocutionist feat into Animal Elocutionist, which is much better.

1/5 5/55/5 *** Venture-Agent, Online—VTT

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Hilary Moon Murphy wrote:

And another question: will PFS have a clarification on whether players can use a custom mixed heritage (other than Aiuvarin / Dromaar)? I know that I will have players asking, and I'd love to know what to tell them.

If it were just me, I would happily open the floodgates to whatever mixed heritage people wanted. "Ah, so you are mix of a ghoran and nagaji? You have purchased both ancestral boons? Check. And come up with a ridiculous backstory? Oh I see. There was a cooking contest between two gods and you are an escaped ingredient? Check. Okay, that looks good to me."

But whatever route we choose, it would be nice to have some consistency.

Custom mixed ancestries are Uncommon, per Player Core 1 (in the body of the Mixed Ancestrt entry, instead of in a label at the top), so there would have to be something in the sanctioning document or a boon or something saying it was an option. That something would presumably include any other limitations or stipulations.

Shadow Lodge *

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Maps, Pathfinder Accessories Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Starfinder Superscriber
Hilary Moon Murphy wrote:

It's a little more complicated.

Pre-Remaster, the feat Burrowing Elocutionist (lvl 1) was required for Animal Elocutionist (lvl 5).

In the Remaster you can take Animal Elocutionist at level 1 and Burrowing Elocutionist disappears. I want to know if I have to spend downtime to retrain my Burrowing Elocutionist feat into Animal Elocutionist, which is much better.

Ah, I was thinking more of the ancestry Weapon Feats...that is knotty.

Dark Archive 4/5 *** Venture-Lieutenant, Finland—Turku

1 person marked this as a favorite.

Eldritch Trickster rogue apparently wasn't reprinted in the player core - is it still a valid option for remaster rogues, or is it removed from options because rackets are part of the class chassis?

On a more general level: can remaster classes use class options/subclasses that haven't been reprinted? For example, can clerics choose deities that have not been reprinted in the new format? Can a druid pick flame or wave order from SoM? Can rogue use Eldritch Trickster, or can a witch choose a patron theme that hasn't been reprinted?

Dark Archive 5/5 5/55/5 *

So, far as wizard schools go, has there been any word on whether the Pathfinder Society will have its own arcane academy?

Asking for the Society players.

Dark Archive 5/5 5/55/5 *

And, tangential to the Runelords discussion, my thought is that the Runescarred dedication will no longer be available after 11/15, but I don't really see references to spell schools (well, aside from Warding Rune), so my thought is that it could be used going forward.

Wayfinders 4/5 5/55/55/55/5 ***** Contributor

HammerJack wrote:
Custom mixed ancestries are Uncommon, per Player Core 1 (in the body of the Mixed Ancestry entry, instead of in a label at the top), so there would have to be something in the sanctioning document or a boon or something saying it was an option. That something would presumably include any other limitations or stipulations.

Ah! I missed that it was uncommon. Well, that could be a nice boon later for Organized Play to offer.

Paizo Employee 5/55/5 ** Organized Play Coordinator

3 people marked this as a favorite.
Hilary Moon Murphy wrote:

Alright, so in Pip's case, I will instead skip a day job to retrain her burrowing elocutionist feat into animal elocutionist rather than use the remaster rebuild.

Unless... Will we need to retrain to switch to the shortened ancestry feat chains from remaster? This affects not just burrowing elocutionist, but also all the ancestral weapon feat chains.

All your specific fiddly rules questions* will be answered on the 15th.

*almost certainly not all of them but please be patient

Paizo Employee 5/55/5 ** Organized Play Coordinator

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Tomppa wrote:

Eldritch Trickster rogue apparently wasn't reprinted in the player core - is it still a valid option for remaster rogues, or is it removed from options because rackets are part of the class chassis?

On a more general level: can remaster classes use class options/subclasses that haven't been reprinted? For example, can clerics choose deities that have not been reprinted in the new format? Can a druid pick flame or wave order from SoM? Can rogue use Eldritch Trickster, or can a witch choose a patron theme that hasn't been reprinted?

Yes and yes. Though why a witch would pick one of the older themes is a mystery to me.


Alex Speidel wrote:
Tomppa wrote:

Eldritch Trickster rogue apparently wasn't reprinted in the player core - is it still a valid option for remaster rogues, or is it removed from options because rackets are part of the class chassis?

On a more general level: can remaster classes use class options/subclasses that haven't been reprinted? For example, can clerics choose deities that have not been reprinted in the new format? Can a druid pick flame or wave order from SoM? Can rogue use Eldritch Trickster, or can a witch choose a patron theme that hasn't been reprinted?

Yes and yes. Though why a witch would pick one of the older themes is a mystery to me.

Perhaps for thematic reasons? ;)

Dark Archive 4/5 *** Venture-Lieutenant, Finland—Turku

It was just a generalized question to disprove the following argument: "If a class option wasn't reprinted in core 1 or core 2, it should be considered removed and can't be used any longer" which is a thought that some folks seem to believe.

Probably comes from the fact that "class chassis" isn't defined as a concept (which parts of class options are included in the chassis?) and the blog says

Quote:
no new characters may be created using the class chassis printed in the Core Rulebook if the class has been reprinted in the Player Core."

Verdant Wheel ***

Alex Speidel wrote:
StarlingSweeter wrote:

I have a request

The Baba Yaga witch is available in PFS play through a unique boon from a very memorable adventure. Currently the Baba Yaga patron is not reprinted in Player Core and witch patrons have seen quite the revision to their familiar abilities. I feel like it would be unfortunate to have such a cool and unique PFS witch feel lacklustre compared to other options.

Would it be possible to have the Baba Yaga patron use the Silence in the Snow familiar ability until any rare patrons are given bespoke familiar abilities? Creating a patch of ice around your familiar. I feel like the winter/snow theme is already very tied thematically to Baba Yaga as chilling cold and lesson of the frozen queen are both tied to her as well. It would be a quality of life buff to a small minority of players but one that would be very appreciated for a fun option.

well see I was going to do that but now it'll look like I stole the idea from you!

(Yes, we will be providing alternate familiar abilities for both Baba Yaga and the Mosquito Witch, and you're bang on about which one Baba Yaga will get)

I though the Mosquito Witch patron was unavailable?

Silver Crusade 5/5 5/55/5 **** Venture-Captain, Germany—Bavaria

rainzax wrote:
Alex Speidel wrote:
StarlingSweeter wrote:

I have a request

The Baba Yaga witch is available in PFS play through a unique boon from a very memorable adventure. Currently the Baba Yaga patron is not reprinted in Player Core and witch patrons have seen quite the revision to their familiar abilities. I feel like it would be unfortunate to have such a cool and unique PFS witch feel lacklustre compared to other options.

Would it be possible to have the Baba Yaga patron use the Silence in the Snow familiar ability until any rare patrons are given bespoke familiar abilities? Creating a patch of ice around your familiar. I feel like the winter/snow theme is already very tied thematically to Baba Yaga as chilling cold and lesson of the frozen queen are both tied to her as well. It would be a quality of life buff to a small minority of players but one that would be very appreciated for a fun option.

well see I was going to do that but now it'll look like I stole the idea from you!

(Yes, we will be providing alternate familiar abilities for both Baba Yaga and the Mosquito Witch, and you're bang on about which one Baba Yaga will get)

I though the Mosquito Witch patron was unavailable?

There might have been a charity boon for it.

Dark Archive 5/5 5/55/5 *

What with how the Runelords have such a tie to Golarion's history, I'd be really surprised if there wasn't something in the works toward making their magical methodology a viable one under the Remastered rules.

If it were me working on the project, I would've opted to design an arcane school for each of the 7 Virtues/Sins, each with its own built-in anathema precluding the knowledge of certain styles of spells. You could still call it an ancient style of casting, but it would still work within the revised zeitgeist of modern-day Golarion.

*

pH unbalanced wrote:
Hilary Moon Murphy wrote:

It's a little more complicated.

Pre-Remaster, the feat Burrowing Elocutionist (lvl 1) was required for Animal Elocutionist (lvl 5).

In the Remaster you can take Animal Elocutionist at level 1 and Burrowing Elocutionist disappears. I want to know if I have to spend downtime to retrain my Burrowing Elocutionist feat into Animal Elocutionist, which is much better.

Ah, I was thinking more of the ancestry Weapon Feats...that is knotty.

This right here. I have Elven Weapon Grace at 5th level for my ranger. It’s the only thing that changes on him, since Elven Weapon Familiarity now covers that. Do I need to do a full rebuild, or just choose a new Ancestry feat, since that feat no longer even exists.

As for the free feat, I think only my Sorcerer has that. The free skill, yes. But most it’s PFS lore anyway.

3/5 ***

Will the same ability be offered to characters who might have options available in this book and then options in Player's Core 2?

Shadow Lodge *

2 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Maps, Pathfinder Accessories Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Starfinder Superscriber

I have a character with the Human Ancestry "Arcane Tattoo" line of feats from the Lost World Character Guide. (Arcane Tattoo/Ornate Tattoo/Virtue Tattoo) May I continue to gain feats along this line, using the same rules as listed in this blog post for Wizard for determining which spells count as "of the same school" as the tattoos?

Liberty's Edge 4/5 5/55/55/5 ****

Terevalis Unctio of House Mysti wrote:
Will the same ability be offered to characters who might have options available in this book and then options in Player's Core 2?

If i understand the question, we have until 2024 to do the rebuild. But there is only one rebuild. So you may have to wait until the next book is out before doing the rebuild.

3/5 ***

Gary Bush wrote:
Terevalis Unctio of House Mysti wrote:
Will the same ability be offered to characters who might have options available in this book and then options in Player's Core 2?
If i understand the question, we have until 2024 to do the rebuild. But there is only one rebuild. So you may have to wait until the next book is out before doing the rebuild.

That makes sense, do everything as one.

Paizo Employee 5/55/5 ** Organized Play Coordinator

The guidelines for converting Pathfinder Society characters and adventures are now located on the Lorespire Wiki.

Please use this thread for further questions and clarifications.

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