Starfinder Society Update: Year 4 Program Changes

Are secondary success conditions still going to be a thing? How do those work?

Yes, those will not change at all and are completely unaffected by this shift.

So I have thought of two things that may change and hope there is an easy way around them.

1. I give away most of the boons I earn at cons and such as I GM a lot of Starfinder and get lots and lots of boons I don't need. Will there be a way to gift boons with AcP (I don't know how it works in PF2 so I apologize if this is not a issue).

2. PF2 has to change event codes every quarter for our lodge - are we going to need to do that for SFS now? If so this makes me sad and I wish there was an easier way around it. If this is the case, when do we need to start doing that?

I do like the progress so don't get me wrong - just look for clarification so I can prepare some.

1. There is not a way to gift or trade boons at this time.

2. The short answer is that yes, the Regional Support Program is on a quarterly system and so if an event is earning extra AcP because of RSP, it will need to rotate event codes. Please consult with your lodge's venture officers for more information on this.

I gather that those system traveler boons are of the "Assign to PFS(2) character, make a copy, and put the copy in the SFS character's chronicle" sort of boon and vice versa for SFS to PFS(2)?

I gather that those system traveler boons are of the "Assign to PFS(2) character, make a copy, and put the copy in the SFS character's chronicle" sort of boon and vice versa for SFS to PFS(2)?

Affirmative. Unfortunately not a better way to do it within the system currently, but it works!

EXP doesn't change for a scenario?

Still 1 for Scenarios, 'x' for Modules?

EXP doesn't change for a scenario?

Still 1 for Scenarios, 'x' for Modules?

Correct; XP, credits and Reputation earned for adventures will not change.

Are any of the boons likely to be a non mndeom.mneeomertic.. hard to spell editor? Only being able to go back one level won't even let you change a feat that isn't working out.

(Non mnemonic editor based retraining option)

Kishmo wrote:

So, we're all on board with calling the Starfinder achievement points Space ACPs = "Spacey Pees," right? Right :D

My vote is for Spacey Peas!

That sounds like Raxilite talk to me!

How do we report multiple sessions of an SFS Quest for the same PC?

At Cons I often had walk-ins across multiple sessions.

As a GM I often have characters playing "catch up".

How would the Lone Agent Boon be impacted by the transition? Would the way to build up the bonus to reduce a Boon cost still happen somehow or will it not be a useful boon anymore?

Are any of the boons likely to be a non mndeom.mneeomertic.. hard to spell editor? Only being able to go back one level won't even let you change a feat that isn't working out.

I don't want to comment on our plans for specific boons until they're finalized, but it's been discussed.

(feel free to take this answer for any question of "will there be a boon to do X thing/play X species" until further notice!)

How would the Lone Agent Boon be impacted by the transition? Would the way to build up the bonus to reduce a Boon cost still happen somehow or will it not be a useful boon anymore?

Can you (or someone) remind of the text of this boon? I think I know which one it is but I want to be sure I'm commenting on the right boon.

How do we report multiple sessions of an SFS Quest for the same PC?

At Cons I often had walk-ins across multiple sessions.

As a GM I often have characters playing "catch up".

This is a really good question! Quest Packs are weird in SFS, and I'll take a look at if we want to change the way we're reporting these. For now, my answer is that you report them the same way as before, which yes, will lead to an excess of AcP. If our method on these changes I'll be sure to make a big noise about it.

Can you (or someone) remind of the text of this boon? I think I know which one it is but I want to be sure I'm commenting on the right boon.

Alex Speidel wrote:

Can you (or someone) remind of the text of this boon? I think I know which one it is but I want to be sure I'm commenting on the right boon.

** text of Lone Agent omitted **

Thanks! My read is that this particular boon would cease to function once Fame goes away at the end of the year, as we don't really have a way to discount AcP purchases in this way. I'll mark it down as something to discuss internally in case we want to do something else, but for now you should operate under the idea that it won't work once there isn't Fame to discount anymore.

Hi all, As I Look at the Boon Tab in Organized Play I notice that Pathfinder 2e and Starfinder are intertwined. Could I suggest that you separate the Starfinder stuff from the Pathfinder 2e Stuff. Give each Its own Tab. Maybe make separate tabs for the playtest for each system as well.

On a side note it would be nice to be able to click on a boon and bring up a description of what the boon does.

Just my two cents, on making it easier to find stuff in the boon sections.

** text of Lone Agent omitted **

Thanks! My read is that this particular boon would cease to function once Fame goes away at the end of the year, as we don't really have a way to discount AcP purchases in this way. I'll mark it down as something to discuss internally in case we want to do something else, but for now you should operate under the idea that it won't work once there isn't Fame to discount anymore.

That makes me a sad panda. :( I was lucky enough to get his boon for my only SFS character, and I already planned out a dozen of cool options to take when I got the Fame for it.

If I can make a suggestion on how to adapt it to the new system: Have it automatically give a certain reputation tier (2? Maybe even 3?) with ALL factions. It won't replicate the "discount" part of the boon, but at least it will give you access to a whole bunch of faction boons that would otherwise be difficult to get, which is really the essence of Lone Agent, in my opinion.

Hi all, As I Look at the Boon Tab in Organized Play I notice that Pathfinder 2e and Starfinder are intertwined. Could I suggest that you separate the Starfinder stuff from the Pathfinder 2e Stuff. Give each Its own Tab. Maybe make separate tabs for the playtest for each system as well.

On a side note it would be nice to be able to click on a boon and bring up a description of what the boon does.

Just my two cents, on making it easier to find stuff in the boon sections.

I would also like separate tabs for SFS and PF2 Boons! I know that no tech change is simple, so this is not a huge priority for me, but it would make the page sooooo much easier to read.

Hi all, As I Look at the Boon Tab in Organized Play I notice that Pathfinder 2e and Starfinder are intertwined. Could I suggest that you separate the Starfinder stuff from the Pathfinder 2e Stuff. Give each Its own Tab. Maybe make separate tabs for the playtest for each system as well.

On a side note it would be nice to be able to click on a boon and bring up a description of what the boon does.

We are not looking at creating multiple boon tabs at this time, though we have requested the ability to collapse sections to keep the page from extending for miles. No timetable on that yet.

As for boon descriptions, that's a larger lift but something we're also looking at. For now, any boons that cost points and whose function isn't obvious (e.g. not the Ancestries) have their full text on the Pathfinder Society FAQ page, and we'll look to do the same for Starfinder Society.

Collapsing works too!

We are not looking at creating multiple boon tabs at this time, though we have requested the ability to collapse sections to keep the page from extending for miles. No timetable on that yet.

Any chance of sorting them away from each other some other way instead of mixed together? You could sort them alphabetically with SFS-Kobold SFS-Space Ship etc and PFS2-Kobold PFS2-ship PFS2- etc. I know if they're mixed in together like that people are going to be buying boons for the wrong campaign.

Any chance of sorting them away from each other some other way instead of mixed together? You could sort them alphabetically with SFS-Kobold SFS-Space Ship etc and PFS2-Kobold PFS2-ship PFS2- etc. I know if they're mixed in together like that people are going to be buying boons for the wrong campaign.

There are already headers separating the systems, and it will also be impossible to purchase a Starfinder boon for a Pathfinder character and vice versa. System Travelers are a special case where you purchase on a character for one system and have a place to assign it to another on the boon, which kinda has to be done because of how the system is wired. Not sure if that solves your issue?

Alex Speidel wrote:

We are not looking at creating multiple boon tabs at this time, though we have requested the ability to collapse sections to keep the page from extending for miles. No timetable on that yet.

Any chance of sorting them away from each other some other way instead of mixed together? You could sort them alphabetically with SFS-Kobold SFS-Space Ship etc and PFS2-Kobold PFS2-ship PFS2- etc. I know if they're mixed in together like that people are going to be buying boons for the wrong campaign.

Are you talking about the system traveler boons? Because other wise they *are* currently sorted. (If they are not sorted on your page, a screenshot might help. You may have found a bug...)

There are already headers separating the systems, and it will also be impossible to purchase a Starfinder boon for a Pathfinder character and vice versa. System Travelers are a special case where you purchase on a character for one system and have a place to assign it to another on the boon, which kinda has to be done because of how the system is wired. Not sure if that solves your issue?

DOH facepalm when i saw the system traveler boons I thought it meant the solar system, ie you traveled the worlds and picked up these alies. Not pathfinder system to starfinder system. Thats why they looked mixed up.

I have to admit I'm a little concerned with the reporting accuracy and fixing errors. On either side of the DM Screen getting the wrong character number is probably the most common error I see. If it has to go on the right character to get what used to be a chronicle boon, then that really needs to be corrected. Correcting it is easy enough if its a game you reported, but if you have an intermediary like a convention reporter or Lodge reporter thats going to be a fair bit of back and forth.

The changes to the system will require accurate reporting, yes, but that's part of our goal here. Accurate reporting is vital and helps us make decisions about the program. The best way to avoid tedious back-and-forths is to ensure, as a GM, that your reports are accurate the first time, and that as a player you've given the correct information.

I've found in practice its worked quite well for more accurate and speedy reporting for PFS2. Of course how much of that is due to the last year+ being online without having hard to decipher handwriting on tiny sign-in sheets is another story....

The changes to the system will require accurate reporting, yes, but that's part of our goal here. Accurate reporting is vital and helps us make decisions about the program. The best way to avoid tedious back-and-forths is to ensure, as a GM, that your reports are accurate the first time, and that as a player you've given the correct information.

Mistakes happen though. And the "Report errors to paizo" button has been.. less than responsive. I can't see a way to let the player change that that couldn't be abusable (Flaming sword of fiery doom on my ice mage? no no no that's going to Fuego de Castile.....) So this is going to fall in the lap of the reporting teams.

Could we get met some of the way and get a reporting sheet that's easier to use? Currently reporting a game is five minutes (I timed it) of setting up two windows copy player 1s name paste player 1s name, copy player 1s character name paste player 1s character name, copy player 1's pfs number, paste player 1's pfs number, copy player 1's character number paste..click click 2 fame... At some point a squirrel is going to go by the window and I'm going to miss the copy not picking up the entire field or pasting a previous value onto the sheet. And thats without having to read chicken scratch.*

It really should just be copy fields, paste fields, done. It's a little thing but on top of the chronicle sheets it adds up.

I know that's a tech resource and anything dealing with the website is a dc 30 arcana check, but putting all the onus on the reporters here isn't fair. If you want more accurate reporting I think it would be fair to help us accurately report. Some of the online conventions are using a tool that can parse and report one field into usable info.

*The chickens have since informed me the comparison is unfair.

[many words]

1) The reporting errors inbox is better than it has been in literal years. I usually try to take a look at it once a week and clear it out; I'm not perfect, and some weeks are busier than others, but I'm going to push back on the idea that it's not doing anything.

2) We have wanted to overhaul the reporting interface for literal years, based on my conversations with Tonya. We're not out here claiming it's perfect, there's so much we'd like to improve. Doing so is also 6 months to a year of work, minimum. We're also not the only group who needs tech resources, so we have to pick and choose what is most important. Now that AcP is pretty functional, we'll be able to reallocate our allotted Tech Hours (TM) to things like this. So yes, in the meantime we have to ask people to double-check their work, but a core tenet of Organized Play is accurate reporting, and always has been. I don't think that's too much to ask.

3) This is not in response to anything you said directly, but Pathfinder Society has 2-3 times the number of active players Starfinder Society has (we think! who knows, maybe there are more Starfinders out there not reporting things!) and asking them to accurately report has not been a major issue thus far. Sure, there are errors, but they're typically minor and easy to resolve. I do not think asking the same of my fellow Starfinders is unreasonable.

This was a lot of words to say: I know the reporting system sucks but it's the one we have and I can't change it overnight, my sincerest apologies, you are free to curse my name specifically every time it causes you pain.

Darn you Alex! *shakes fist at the heavens*

Are we also allowed to curse your name if it does NOT cause us pain, simply to stay in practice?

:>

On sidenote, if you do change reporting system, would be nice if it made it more visible of whether party did or didn't complete faction goal bonus stuff and which reporting conditions they got.

I sometimes get paranoid when playing in online cons of whether our in game votes/actions matter since no way to see if there wasn't any reporting when you know "okay first they will report to another place which will then report to site" x'D (I could swear at least once the paizo.com version didn't include bonus reputation from faction mission, so that kinda left me wondering if correct reporting boxes were ticked either, but its hard to know for sure when as player you can't see anything besides which scenario character was involved in)

November 4: In our monthly update blog, we will share information on how to convert any remaining unspent Fame to Starfinder Achievement Points.

Was there ever a system to do this in Pathfinder 2e? With returning players that could or did not switch over to online play - the original post mentioned this but I have not seen that system posted. Would like to see how it works with PF2 to get a feel for Starfinder which will have more numbers.

Quote:

November 4: In our monthly update blog, we will share information on how to convert any remaining unspent Fame to Starfinder Achievement Points.

Was there ever a system to do this in Pathfinder 2e? With returning players that could or did not switch over to online play - the original post mentioned this but I have not seen that system posted. Would like to see how it works with PF2 to get a feel for Starfinder which will have more numbers.

There was not, no.

There also was no need to convert fame to ACP in PF2 as ACP ws available in that system from the beginning. Fame was simply a different currency with its own boons, and then both systems were merged into a single currency.

In Starfinder, there never has been ACP, so I do think there needs to be a way to partially award ACP over the past three years. A fame converter (if they can create one) would be a handy thing.

Hmm

There also was no need to convert fame to ACP in PF2 as ACP ws available in that system from the beginning. Fame was simply a different currency with its own boons, and then both systems were merged into a single currency.

In Starfinder, there never has been ACP, so I do think there needs to be a way to partially award ACP over the past three years. A fame converter (if they can create one) would be a handy thing.

Hmm

I would in part disagree, the original post said phase 4 for PF2 would have a conversion system. Scrolling through the blogs between that post and current I was looking and no where could I find that it was announced it was being done away with.

Yes, we gave players who played online months to convert. Looking for players who walked away till they could be at a physical table what they would need to do to get back to playing their characters. I'm now going to be telling them I get its a pandemic, and most of you were working but you've lost all those things you had before.

Have them add a note to their last Chronicle (assuming it's dated before the change), with a shopping list of Fame boons.

That's what I did for all of my characters. One's going to be spending her Off-Hours studying languages until like Level 15.

I think the *easiest* conversion of Fame --> ACP would be to double whatever Fame a character has, and dump it into the pool (Fame for previous scenarios was 2 per if all goals achieved).

Since the new system has it as 4 ACP per full scenario completion for 'normal operating conditions', it only makes sense.

Sure, it doesn't take into consideration for things like conventions, Premier conventions, Premier Super-Plus Extra-King Size Grande conventions, etc, but it's a 'quick and dirty' and reasonably fair conversion?

Yes, we gave players who played online months to convert.

To be precise, they gave all players who read the blogs months to convert.

It doesn't have anything to do with playing online or not.

Quote:

Yes, we gave players who played online months to convert.

To be precise, they gave all players who read the blogs months to convert.

It doesn't have anything to do with playing online or not.

Still sometimes sit at a virtual table and folks playing PF2 go "What's this 'Fame' thing that I got, what's it good for?" for players who started at launch and then had RL interference during the pandemic.

Queue the very uncomfortable silence as everyone tries to figure out the best way to describe a now-defunct system without being harsh about it.

Blake's Tiger wrote:

Quote:

Yes, we gave players who played online months to convert.

To be precise, they gave all players who read the blogs months to convert.

It doesn't have anything to do with playing online or not.

Still sometimes sit at a virtual table and folks playing PF2 go "What's this 'Fame' thing that I got, what's it good for?" for players who started at launch and then had RL interference during the pandemic.

Queue the very uncomfortable silence as everyone tries to figure out the best way to describe a now-defunct system without being harsh about it.

"It was a temporary stopgap measure to cover the period where they were trying to get the AcP system running. Fortunately that is now running, so you can ignore the fame and just use AcP as was intended from the start."

Seems easy enough to me.

What's with this "Taldor" faction?

Another question. How does Balanced Nepotism (the Acquisitives Capstone Boon) work? My recipient character obviously doesn't have that +10 Reputation on her Paizo profile.

Another question. How does Balanced Nepotism (the Acquisitives Capstone Boon) work? My recipient character obviously doesn't have that +10 Reputation on her Paizo profile.

The boon will have instructions on how to apply that bonus Reputation to your new character.

A guide on "how do do nepotism right" sounds lovely ^^

A guide on "how do do nepotism right" sounds lovely ^^

Chapter 4, picking a job that sounds impressive, pays well, but doesn't get people killed...

In preparation for being having to eventually get those two missing scenarios show up on my character in case fame converting to acp system requires it, went through the said characters all scenarios and listed them on their character page x'D Yeah one I run scenario is reported but doesn't show up there for some reason and second one I played in was never reported(I'm bit worried about having to show up that chronicle because uh I apparently had some shenanigans with on it as I have lot of really hard to interpret notes in it. It seems I accidentally marked wrong exp, fame and credits on it so had to fix them all with marker as well? x'D)

On sidenote, geez this character is really gm blob. Bit depressing since this is my only starfinder of note character, dunno if they even allow blobs to make appearances ;P I mean I do have played with this character and I'm fond of them since my first starfinder character, but still xD(6 times played with this one, one of them skittershot and one of them I could have played with char but played with pregen since I joined game fast and wasn't sure I was done with leveling up yet. Forever gm feels)