Vrindel’s journey has only just began...
Yes. I too love the game and want to keep going.
I like Ibrox, but I've been reading Midgard and want to explore other concepts.
I've be jealous of the Clerics of Thor in my two Midgard games. And, I finally realized why: they are loud! I hadn't seen one played until Atlas, and they look more fun than my sneaky, heavy back story that no one cares about.
So, I would want to change concepts, anything, just play it loud?
If possible, of course...
cheers
Wow! I hadn't realized we'd passed the one year mark. Thanks to you all for the great characters and playing.
Glad everyone is enjoying the game, I certainly have been as well and am happy to continue on.
Zove and Ibrox, if you feel like switching out characters I'm fine with that if you want to try something new. This seems like a natural break as the group recovers in the village and decides what to do next with plenty of opportunity for any departures and new arrivals.
I'll get the group back to the village tomorrow, from there we'll see where things go.
As far as where to venture next, I don't have a major preference. Vrindel is a druid, so city adventuring wouldn't be his first choice, but being based there, and heading out on adventures would be fin.
I also don't have any strong preference with regards to where to venture next. Paladins are generally easy to nudge forward ;)
For sure, the idea of trying to build towards reclaiming Krakova by securing powerful items (like a spear from Thor), forging political alliances, gathering knowledge about undead, disrupting the occupants' base of power, or other great ideas, will get Trevor forgetting about his sore feet.
That being said, I'm happy to play along with other ideas. For example, Trevor might recognize that his long term goal needs to be put on hold, or that a friend needs immediate help.
As for me, the player, I really enjoyed the story, your storytelling, and enjoy Midgard in general. I have a slight preference for when things are a bit gray and you don't always know who to trust or have to strike bargains with shady individuals. The scene with the reavers was great fun.
If I may make a suggestion, I would like to connect with NPCs on a more long-term outlook. Perhaps our exploits have drawn the attention of some patrons? Perhaps multiple ones, based on our affiliations, present and past?
Just a suggestion. Very happy with the game as is.
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Oh yeah loved the reavers!
I concur on that something longer and trying to retake Krakovia could be fun.
Indeed ive always had a taste for mass. Combat but few else think its either worthy or doable.
Mind, of we did put together a squad on friends to take on bigger targets, I have been known to come up with names, backstories and personalities for each one!
Alright. I think I've got a few ideas brewing. We'll probably stick nearby in the near term while the ship is repaired. (You all actually did quite a bit of damage with the fires and there's limited materials, facility, and manpower right now.) But once repairs are made and a crew is trained/secured the ship opens some doors. Nargenthal is actually centrally located enough for raiding in Krakova, trading, raiding, or adventuring further north, east or west.
As for NPC interactions please feel free to interact with the village folk as desired. I think Vrindel already has a friendship/potential apprentice with one of the young women. Ibrox knows all of the horses. :)
You all have already earned the trust and respect of most everyone. Bentknee could certainly be considered a patron, with probable contacts in the bigger cities back south. Britta, as the 'mayor' could also be a bit of a patron at least within the village and surrounding area. You haven't really come across any higher level patrons just because of the sparse population, but that will likely change as you explore futher.
Zove and Ibrox, will the end of the week be enough time to make any character changes and transitions?
In the meantime, feel free to RP in town as you like.
Zove: Same XP, and yes, standard starting equipment.
To plumb the setting, I was thinking of a Bearfolk or Ravenfolk. Zove, let me know what you’re thinking.
Alright, Ive pretty much decided now. Ill be an illusionist halfling with some thief skills hailing from Barsella, the city at the end of the world.
I have a similar crunch concept in another game thats sort of dying, and would like to stretch its wings a bit.
O_O
Wow!
This alias name has been pretty lucky in the past...but don't want to jinx it.
DM: Any bonus starting spells in spellbook or just the standard 6+2+2+2 for 4th level wiz? Figure no, but just thought Id ask...
Bah, scratch that. That idea isn't going to work out in a way I'm happy with on halfling...too few skills. I'm just going back to straight rogue...
Just some random thoughts: Transitions within campaigns are delicate matters. What brings the characters to move into a new story arc? To what extent this is externally or internally driven?
We often read on the tavern cliché with regards to starting campaigns, but less so of mid-game clichés. How do we avoid those? I think this can be done, in part, by having ooc discussions on where are the characters wishing to go and whether they'll likely move things on their own (internal locus of control) or wait for something to respond to (external locus of control).
Trevor has been an external locus of control type of guy. Things happened to him, as far as how he describes his past. But his conversion is tied to an understanding that not acting was in fact acting. That by letting things happened, he helped make them happen. He is, in other words, coming to the paladinship with a growing understanding that his actions matter, but he's not quite good at taking ownership.
So I see him at this point as a mix of both personalities. He is in transition. He might just start thinking about what he could do next to help his nation, or he might just not see how he could and instead just accept the next challenge that presents itself. He might set out or settle.
That's where I am. I'm curious to see what Trevor will do ;) For sure, I would like to have IC conversations at the party and during the coming days on 'now what?'
Also, would it be possible to keep the PC-become-NPC as significant NPCs? I would very much like Aterro and Zove to remain satellites around us. Trevor has an ambiguous relation with Aterro and the priest of Thor would likely continue to shape or unshape the paladin of Khors. And Zove, well Zove could get Trevor and the group in all sorts of trouble. Same goes for Ibrox!
Vrindel's journey at this time is one of self discovery. He is eager to spread his wisdom among all he meets, but his visage and the history of his heritage give him pause to speak. He has a hard time feeling "accepted".
He also feels that he has a greater role to fulfill in life, and is cautiously seeking that role. For the first time in his life he has people that he is truly bonding with, and he's still coming to grips with that. In fact the departure of Ibrox, and Zove he will probably take very personally as more people that he begins to care for desert him. Should be fun!!!
Though he might seem a little "Goody Two Shoes" in fact he more judgmental and convinced that his way is right.
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Aterro keeps waiting to be able to call Trevor a Brother of STEEL but for now just sees him as another fool of a reckless deity that can't get his act together enough to solidly toe the battle line.
If you can see your way to give him a more solid personality I think we would have rich interactions.
Heh. I think Vrindel and Aterro are like two mountains shouting "I'M RIGHT" at each other. =) Perhaps when he realizes he's not judged and can open up more there might be more opportunities for interactions.
Grr...paizo site not letting me change avatars at the moment...
On the transition topic, I'm not sure about mid-game cliches, but we've always done an extended downtime and it works well. Like a month or so, maybe less since we're lower level. Gives time for character development in various ways and for new hooks to set in.
To be clear, I wasn't saying we were doing it in this game, but that it often happens.
This alias name has been pretty lucky in the past...but don't want to jinx it.
DM: Any bonus starting spells in spellbook or just the standard 6+2+2+2 for 4th level wiz? Figure no, but just thought Id ask...
Sounds like you went a different direction, but just in case you change your mind...assuming the scrolls or spellbook from the party treasure aren't sold or otherwise travel away before your new character arrives, then there would be access to any of those spells to add to the known list.
Thanks, also sorry to be a bother, but is rolled gold in place of standard equipment or selling standard equipment for custom equipment a possibility?
And I remember the glasses now...failed in my search for 'glasses' I guess since they turned out to be 'Eyes'. :)
Sure, you can use either rolled gold or sell the standard equipment. Note, that your purchases would have likely occurred in whatever larger town/city you were in before ending up in Nargenthal. Supplies in the village itself are very limited at this point.
Thanks! There were a few mundane nonstandard things Id like to start out with.
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Sure, you can use either rolled gold or sell the standard equipment. Note, that your purchases would have likely occurred in whatever larger town/city you were in before ending up in Nargenthal. Supplies in the village itself are very limited at this point.
Used Reaver chaps are on sale though.
Sure, you can use either rolled gold or sell the standard equipment. Note, that your purchases would have likely occurred in whatever larger town/city you were in before ending up in Nargenthal. Supplies in the village itself are very limited at this point.Used Reaver chaps are on sale though.
Ha! Very true.
I've also added to the known NPC list since it looks like we'll be sticking around here a little. I'll try to keep this a bit more up to date going forward especially if we start adding a ships crew or other followers.
Used Reaver chaps are on sale though.
Lets pray they are the assless type. :)
Hey, I know thievery/stealth is handled slightly differently by everyone. I wanted to see if what I had in mind meshes with what I can expect in gameplay. I think its also the reason I agonize over my feat/skill/race choices for rogues so much. I apologize if this is overkill and you have no time for it, no worries if so. I care about this game so just wanted to bring it up.
Required for Stealth? 3/4 body cover or better, or heavy obscurement. Dim light is not enough without Skulker feat, and light obscurement is not enough without Wood Elf (in nature settings). Lightfoot halflings can stealth with 1/2 cover, but only if that 1/2 cover is a creature larger than they are.
Its not really clear that 3/4 cover is the threshold for stealth, but I think it makes sense considering phrases like 'see clearly' and the halfling ability (if 1/2 cover was good enough for everyone, what would be the point of the ability?). For medium creatures, 3/4 cover is like an arrow slit or thick tree trunk...I mean that seems rational that a human could hide behind a big tree partially exposed. For halflings though, they are smaller and 3/4 cover means smaller stuff is possible to hide behind. At 3 ft tall, 3/4 cover would be anything 2.25 ft tall with enough girth, like a little chair or something.
Moving from Cover to Cover? RAW, I couldn't start from behind a wall, run through even dim light (moonlight) and hide again behind another wall with another creature looking. Stealth simply wouldn't be possible in that case since I would be in the FOV of an observer (unless I had the Skulker feat).
However RAW also leaves a huge caveat with 'under certain circumstances, the DM might allow you to stay hidden as you approach a creature that is distracted'. So, here my question is what counts as a distraction? Throwing a coin or glass bottle down the hallway? Would that be built into the stealth roll? What about in combat, what counts as distraction?
This one has caused me the most headache and I think ultimately disadvantage is the best solution. A roll of something like deception in previous editions enabled this, which is pretty much equivalent to disadvantage (2 rolls, 1 fail means fail). Some instead treat the usual passive DC instead as an active contest.
Statistics wise, I think they more or less accomplish the same thing and the disadvantage is simpler. It also means you can use the same rule in combat, since active checks aren't even possible without the Search action.
So in combat, stealth vs distracted also has disadvantage...but with extra common sense thing: an ally is around to warn. So like, sneaking up on a foe engaged in melee with another PC should be possible with disadvantage vs passive. Yet, sneaking up on a foe engaged in melee with another PC with an archer standing 10 ft yelling 'watch out!' shouldn't even be possible, absent favorable lighting conditions. Dunno...best I can come up with.
Invisible, not hiding? Since this also pertains to a character not hiding in darkness (unseen but not unheard) Ill mention also: a lot of internet people seem to think that if an invisible creature is not hiding, their location is pinpointed (by hearing) and attacks have disadvantage. In other words, 2 combatants separated by 30 ft in a fog cloud spell would know exactly where they both are without any check. I do not agree with this because of the 14th rogue ability Blindsense (if you are able to hear, you are aware of the location of any hidden or invisible creature within 10 feet of you). If all characters could aurally pinpoint invisible but not hiding creatures at any range without a check, what would be the point of that ability?
Group stealth checks? My opinion on this is that when you don't allow group stealth checks, you are basically sextuple disadvantaging PCs. If even one person fails, the entire party fails. However, for the purposes of surprise rounds, since surprise resolves on an individual basis, I don't use group checks there.
Sleight of Hand? Not much RAW, but looking at AT Legerdemain...unlike stealth, this is vs an active perception check even in combat. I also don't believe in stuff like Stealth then Sleight of Hand, since that's the same as putting disadvantage on every Sleight check.
General Thievery? Id like to steal stuff randomly about town like a thief. I like the rules in XGtE under downtime: Crime including complications. I was wondering if you would be willing to use those. Outside of planned heists like that during downtime, I would hope I could roll Sleight to canvas a crowd, for example. I was also hoping I could steal gems and use jeweler's tools to recut them for selling (XGtE tool prof section).
Poison? In the DMG, theres a bit where one can roll either Nature or int poisoner's kit to extract poison from an incapacitated poisonous creature with DC 20. Would like to do such somewhat regularly to get around the incredible costs of poison, if allowed.
If you read through all this, thanks. It will really help me nail down some crunch thoughts...I just want to be an awesome thief of legends.
And more me. (Snow days have given me 6 days off in a row)
★ When Mnemnosyne, the goddess of memory, was imprisoned it weakened the magic she used to make the Western Ocean impossible to navigate. More and more ships, 1 in 10 perhaps, were actually making it back to Barsella, the city at the edge of the world...
★ Among the riches celebrated throughout the streets along with the costly spices and exotic furs was a certain jeweled optical telescope. This scope was rumored to be on its way to High Geomancer Rothgazzi, but its path from Whore's Lot on the docks to the Citadel would be perilous, if a little halfling named Scramsax had anything to say about it.
★ With the exception of one detail, no one ever quite worked out how he pulled it off. From his telling, the heist is somewhat different every time: a diminuating potion reduced him to a 5 lbs bundle and he was carried to the carriage in the mouth of a trusty dog; a nest of exotic, ravenous termites from the southlands ate the hole through the bottom of the wagon; the telescope was concealed in a large subway sandwich; and other such things of questionable veracity.
★ The one detail was his escape route: 4th Avenue on Highgate. Every street urchin would remember that detail for years to come, for it was there the thief was thwarted by simple chance and the innocence and honesty of youth. A child, no more than 10 years, spotted Scramsax and was his prosecutor's sole testimony.
★ His punishment was exile from Barsella, until 'Algos turns to sand'. Algos being the major fortified castle built into the nearby mountains...
★ He made his way through the wastes with the Winged Lion Company, a Trilolo based shipping outfit on its way to Zobeck. Along the way, he acted fence for gemstones and other minor scores, eventually meeting up with Bentknee's caravan headed north.
★ He likes to trade stories about the Western Sea for tales of the Red Queen, and in his most drunken state has been heard saying 'Ill pluck the crown from her head'
★ With the recent success of Bentknee's forward scouts, Scramsax is eager to get out of his hammock and get a piece for himself.
Before Zove leaves, can Ibrox copy the rituals from your spellbook? It would make him much more flexible than the one trick pony that he is currently.
(i) illusory scriptR, comprehend languagesR, alarmR, detect magicR, find familiarR, unseen servantR
(ii) shadows brought to lightR
Don't know if I can afford all of that, even if I knew how much it would cost.
Scramsax: Sorry I ended up having a busy afternoon and evening yesterday. I'll take a closer look at everything and try to respond later today. All seem like legit questions, so will definitely try to answer as best as possible.
Ibrox: You can change your spells around as part of this rebuild opportunity.
I think his Tome of Secrets invocation lets him copy the rituals with enough cash. No rebuild necessary
You're right! I'll probably pay now, and be able to use them when Ibrox levels to 5th with a 3rd invocation.
...if the GM agrees.
1. Required for Stealth: Obviously this will depend on each situation. But yes, in general, a halfling would be able to hide behind smaller objects. Something that might only provide 1/2 cover and not allow a medium sized creature to hide would provide 3/4 for a halfling and therefore allow them to use it to hide.
2. Moving from Cover to Cover: If I'm following correctly, the real question here is what is the mechanism for moving up/past/around a creature that is distracted and how to help determine that creature is distracted. I think this is the way I would handle it. First, if the creature is distracted by other events (in combat with another PC, talking with someone else, watching a fight, etc.) then it would be a straight Stealth roll with a DC of the creatures Passive Perception. In a case where you are trying to create the distraction (i.e. tossing coins, throwing your voice, etc.) then it would be a Deception roll vs. enemy WIS save. If you succeed you have advantage on your stealth check to sneak with the Passive Perception as the DC. Not sure if this is better or worse, but this is how I'd initially try things.
3. Group Stealth: Although it hasn't really come up with this group so far, I am totally open to group Stealth checks in order to sneak everyone past a guard or other appropriate situations. And I agree that surprise is a different situation and would be resolved individually or as fits the situation.
4. Sleight of Hand: It's a straight Dex(SoH) check vs. Perception. Only time I would require Stealth is if you still needed to sneak up on the victim. And this would only be in a case where you absolutely didn't want the target to see you. Randomly picking a strangers pocket on the street would just require the SoL roll. Essentially Sleight of Hand should mean you are within 5 feet of the target. Perhaps it is possible to devise some method of doing Sleight of Hand actions from a distance in which case then even less need for any Stealth check.
5. General Thievery: I'm open to using those rules and think they could be fun. However, note that Nargenthal is not big enough (or frankly wealthy enough) for you to do any of this. A population of less than 40 (including the PC's) just isn't big enough to support that kind of thing. However, it is totally doable as we move into bigger towns and cities.
6. Poison: Harvesting poison from defeated creatures is certainly okay. A time honored tradition. However, beware the '1' on a harvest roll. ;)
I think that covers everything, let me know if I missed something or didn't cover what you were actually asking.
Ibrox: Yes, you can pay now and transcribe the spells. But the rituals and understanding to actually cast them are beyond your skills until you reach 5th level.
Ibrox: Yes, you can pay now and transcribe the spells. But the rituals and understanding to actually cast them are beyond your skills until you reach 5th level.
Thanks! How much do we have to spend?
Thanks Tareth, sorry to bother I just like to know I have the tools I need to be able to do what I need/want later. I wasn't planning to take Deception at all but now I may.
Just a note on (1), the 3/4 allowing Stealth is just my rule (borrowed from internet), not the rule...there isn't one really. Some interpret only total cover working. But like I said, 3/4 is a big tree, and someone hiding behind a big tree seems possible. So just wanted to make sure I could use 3/4 if it was around.
So, I will redo Scram's crunch tonight, but could jump in for RP whenever I think if background is alright. And/or play Zove more, its all good.
Scramsax: The 1/2 vs 3/4, etc. for stealth also seems to match up with the actual cover (for AC bonus) rules, so it makes sense, at least in my mind. And as small creatures, halflings should be able to use less cover, more effectively.
Background seems fine to me, you certainly could have been one of the couple of the other 'nameless' wagoners or caravan helpers hired by Bentknee for the long journey.
Feel free to transition whenever you like. If Zove's sticking around then she can just be an NPC for a while. If not, then go ahead and write her off the scene however you like.
All: I will likely bump things forward by a month in the next day or two.
I was going to say. It is likely that Trevor would love to stick around and make sure harvest goes well for the village.
He might even use some of his free time to build a shrine to Khors!
General Thievery: I'm open to using those rules and think they could be fun. ...isn't big enough to support that kind of thing
Maybe he plans a heist against Zove? She has 30 whopping gold and an amazing pearl likely worth 100 more... :) I will never steal or work against PCs in any way...but from myself maybe! What do you think? Might be a nice segway, especially if goes horribly wrong/right.
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General Thievery: I'm open to using those rules and think they could be fun. ...isn't big enough to support that kind of thingMaybe he plans a heist against Zove? She has 30 whopping gold and an amazing pearl likely worth 100 more... :) I will never steal or work against PCs in any way...but from myself maybe! What do you think? Might be a nice segway, especially if goes horribly wrong/right.
You will only be truly ready when you can steal your own pants.