Fix an archetype


Homebrew and House Rules

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Ok, the rules are simple:
1) Pick an archetype
2) Fix it... and explain the modifications
3) Keep it balance and in theme with the concept
4) Explain why you fixed it

Two-Weapon Warrior (Fighter) (Advanced Player's Guide)

Improved Balance (Ex): At 11th level, the attack penalties for fighting with two weapons are reduced by –1 for a two-weapon warrior. The penalties are reduced by an additional –1 for every four levels after 11th. This ability replaces armor training 3.

The wording was awkward to the point that wielding 2 one-handed weapons was... pointless, because this ability and Prefect Balance do the exact same thing without reducing the penalty. With this, you get up to a -2 reduction to attack rolls when TWF, regardless of what kind of weapon you have.

Perfect Training (Ex): At 15th, a two-weapon warrior can apply any weapon specific feat for its primary weapon to its off-hand weapon, such as Weapon Focus and Weapon Specialization. This ability replaces armor training 4.

This is to replace Perfect Balance that got merged with Improved Balance. Also, this is an ability I've seen a few times, so...

***********************

Ok, what archetype(s) can YOU fix ;) ?


Brute (Vigilante) (Ultimate Intrigue)

Brute Talents
Lucid Regression (Ex): The Brute has trained himself to better control his Brute Form after heated battles. The Will Save DC to avoid attacking allies and bystanders, after all enemies are gone, is reduced by 10. At 18th level, the Brute doesn't need to make a save anymore to avoid attacking others. A brute must be at least 10th level to select this talent.

This is probably the most problematic aspect of the Brute, being the equivalent of the Frenzied Berserker. Unlike the Wild Rager archetype, this state is not similar to a confusion effect. With this talent, which is totally optional to the player, the Brute won't cause to kill other PCs.

Raging Brute Powers (Ex or Su): The Brute can tap into his inner rage to gain extraordinary powers. He may select a Rage Power from the Barbarian class list, using his Vigilante level as his Barbarian level. He must have the required level to select certain powers.

Ok... the Brute is a raging viligante... without any rage powers... Yeah, I think it's weird... This new talent solve this. Again, talent = optional.

Brutish Strength (Ex) The Brute has learned to bulk up his form and tapping into his inner rage. Upon assuming his vigilante identity, the Brute gains gains a +4 enhancement bonus to his Strength and Constitution. A brute must be at least 12th level to select this talent.

I get that it might be too powerful to grant size bonuses to stats when assuming the Brute Form, but it shouldn't have been left out either. This talent grants enhancement bonuses as an option.

Monstrous Wielder (Ex) The Brute uses his immense strength to lift and wield objects that no person would be able to. He can wield weapons up to one size larger without penalty from wielding inappropriate sized weapons. The weapon category (light, one-handed, two-handed) is not affected. For instance, the Brute using a Huge Greatclub would be using it a two-handed weapon. A brute must have the Sizing Equipment talent before selecting this talent.

This is another ability that suits the Brute pretty well, so I've made it into a talent.

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I studied the brute carefully and it honestly doesn't look as bad as most think. It's still a poorly designed archetype. However, you don't really address the major two issues I have with it:

1) The archetype prohibits you from using your social identity for combat. However, the brute also forces you to transform back to social after every fight. It's an antipattern. You can only do combat as your brute form, but it only lasts until the end of the fight. Then you have to waste time resting and then transforming back. This gets very tedious during a dungeoncrawl or a combat-heavy adventure. They should have designed it so that when you succeed your Will save to not pummel your allies, you can choose whether or not to change back or stay in the form.

2) You're super squishy as a brute. You have a d8 Hit Die. You take like...a -3 penalty to AC. You can't wear armor until later levels. And unlike a barbarian or an alchemist with mutagen, you don't get any natural armor or Constitution bonuses to boost your hit points.


Cyrad wrote:

I studied the brute carefully and it honestly doesn't look as bad as most think. It's still a poorly designed archetype. However, you don't really address the major two issues I have with it:

1) The archetype prohibits you from using your social identity for combat. However, the brute also forces you to transform back to social after every fight. It's an antipattern. You can only do combat as your brute form, but it only lasts until the end of the fight. Then you have to waste time resting and then transforming back. This gets very tedious during a dungeoncrawl or a combat-heavy adventure. They should have designed it so that when you succeed your Will save to not pummel your allies, you can choose whether or not to change back or stay in the form.

2) You're super squishy as a brute. You have a d8 Hit Die. You take like...a -3 penalty to AC. You can't wear armor until later levels. And unlike a barbarian or an alchemist with mutagen, you don't get any natural armor or Constitution bonuses to boost your hit points.

1) Well, when you're an enraged hulking monster, I... don't think you're gonna resort to social skills in that form :P I get the omittion, but on the other hand, it fits with the concept.

2) You're right... but maybe you can go for bracers of armor, amulets of natural armor and rings of protection instead of armors. Then again, at 6th level, you take no penalty for wearing magic armor when "hulking", so it's still pretty early.

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I don't think you understand my first point. Combat is the entire point of being a brute, but the archetype forces you to transform back to your non-combat form after every single fight. This can be crippling or tedious when you're going to be having lots of fights one after another.


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Cyrad wrote:
I don't think you understand my first point. Combat is the entire point of being a brute, but the archetype forces you to transform back to your non-combat form after every single fight. This can be crippling or tedious when you're going to be having lots of fights one after another.

Yeah, I got it, it gets tiring after a while :P


JiCi wrote:
Cyrad wrote:
I don't think you understand my first point. Combat is the entire point of being a brute, but the archetype forces you to transform back to your non-combat form after every single fight. This can be crippling or tedious when you're going to be having lots of fights one after another.
Yeah, I got it, it gets tiring after a while :P

What about the option to remain somewhat in control of your Brute form on a successful save? So if you make the save, you can either revert back to your regular form, and be fatigued, or stay as a Brute for another (minute? 10 minutes?) without attacking your allies.


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All Fighter archetypes that replace Weapon Training with a similar ability that is not worded as counting as Weapon Training

In the class feature that replaces Weapon Training 1, add the text, or replace the text that says "This replaces Weapon Training 1" with the following: "This alters and otherwise works like Weapon Training 1".

These Fighter archetypes logically should be able to access Advanced Weapons Training (via the feat of the same name) as long as the option selected is usable with the weapon group named in the Weapon Training 1 replacement class feature (and does not depend upon another class feature that was replaced, such as Bravery), but are currently unable to do so. In the accompanying class feature table, indicate that these archetypes change rather than replace Weapon Training 1.

Affected archetypes (and the relevant replacement class features):

Archer (Expert Archer)
Brawler (Close Combatant -- requires additional changes -- see below)
Cavern Sniper (Sniper Training)
Crossbowman (Crossbow Expert)
Learned Duelist {= Ustalavic Duelist?} (Duelist Training -- requires additional changes -- see below)
Polearm Master (Polearm Training)
Savage Warrior (Natural Savagery)
Shielded Fighter (Shield Fighter)
Two-Handed Fighter (Weapon Training -- the text is almost but not quite right)
Unarmed Fighter (Weapon Training -- the text is almost but not quite right)

Additional change for Brawler:

Crowd Control (which replaces Armor Training 1) is delayed to 3rd level (instead of 2nd).
Close Combatant (which currently replaces Weapon Training 1 and 2) is delayed to 5th level (instead of 3rd), and is considered to replace only Weapon Training 1.
No Escape (which currently replaces Weapon Training 3 and 4) is considered to replace Weapon Training 2.
Stand Still (curretly gained at level 13 but not considered to replace anything) is considered to replace Weapon Training 3 and 4 (since it gives a scaling bonus).
This reduces the extent to which this archetype is front-loaded, as well as giving access to Advanced Weapon Training (with Close Weapons) as noted above.

Additional changes for Learned Duelist:

For the purpose of Advanced Weapon Training options and feats that use Weapon Training Bonus, the Weapon Training Bonus is considered to be equal to the attack bonus granted by Duelist Training.
This prevents confusion which might cause people to think that the Weapon Training Bonus is increased according to the damage bonus when using Duelist Stance.

Edit: This doesn't necessarily fix everything wrong with these archetypes (Crossbowman, I'm looking at you). It just keeps them from being ripped off out of important updates to the Fighter brought by the Weapon Master's Handbook.


No other takers?

I'd like to fix Eldritch Scion and Elemental Knight Magus (for one thing make them compatible with each other), Tyrant Antipaladin (fix some things that were left out of the Chaotic-to-Lawful shift), and Overwhelming Soul Kineticist and Cloistered Cleric, but I can't do it right now.


Dotting for interest.


Can't do details right now, but I'd like to see a fix applied to a lot of archetypes, to add conditional text to the altered/replaced class features to allow combination of archetypes that should be able to go together but currently can't, especially those that would be compatible except for 1 or 2 altered/replaced features in common (Elementa Knight and Eldritch Scion, I'm looking at you on both counts). The Qinggong Monk "archetype" of Classic Monk already did this in its own way, but I'd like to see more.


Still no other takers? How about if we broaden it to include fixing a VMC (this has some REALLY juicy opportunities in it -- especially but certainly not limited to Gunslinger and Witch)?


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Metamorph Alchemist

Shapechanger ability, second to last sentence:
This ability can also function as monstrous physique I at 5th level, as monstrous physique II at 7th level, as monstrous physique III at 9th level, as monstrous physique IV at 11th level, as giant form I at 13th level, and as giant form II at 15th level.
The current progression is weird. You get MP1, GF1 and GF2 at the levels a wizard gets them, but MP2 and MP3 two levels later. Also, currently the archetypes has an empty level at 7th.

Shapechanger ability, last sentence:
This ability replaces Alchemy, Bombs, and Throw Anything.
Bombs is a seperate ability and not part of Alchemy. Therefore, it should be mentions in the main sentence and not in parentheses.

Brew Potion gets replaced by the following ability:
Mutagen Mastery A metamorph's focus on mutagens instead of extracts made her an adept at creating a mutagen much faster then other alchemists. It takes a metamorph 10 minutes to brew a dose of mutagen instead of one hour.
Metamorph is severly lacking class features, so the few he has should at least be good. Brew Potion itself is completly unusable without multiclassing and an obvious oversight.

New ability added:
Shapeshift Mastery At 17th level, a metamorph is no longer fatigued for 1 round each time she changes shape.
I don't like empty levels.


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I don't usually do this, but I found an archetype even an inexperienced homebrewer like me can fix: The Holy Gun (Paladin Archetype)

Have Gun: Instead of the 1 grit point gained from Amateur Gunslinger, a holy gun gains a number of grit points equal to her Charisma modifier (minimum 1). If she already has levels in Gunslinger, she gains a bonus to the maximum amount of grit she can have each day, equal to her Charisma bonus (if any) but gains no extra grit as the start of each day.

(Fixes the fact that until level 11, the Holy Gun has a single grit point to charge her awful Smite Evil Replacement. Now, let's make that replacement significantly less awful)

Smiting Shot: Remove the line "as a standard action". Add "This effect applies to all attacks made against a single opponent until the end of your turn.

(Now the ability you traded Smite Evil away to get scales past level 5! Still only lasts one turn, but you can recharge Grit, unlike Smite Evil. Given that Grit can recharge and the damage boost from Smiting Shot is so significant, I did need to specify the Smite only works against a single opponent. I'm not 100% happy with the wording there, but I think you get the idea)

- Holy Grit: Remove the Charisma-based Grit pool because you already got that at access to level 1.

Boom. Not going to claim it's balanced, but it should be a lot more user-friendly.


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Good fixes for Metamorph Alchemist, and good catches and fixes for Holy Gun Paladin/1

Fixes for Eldritch Scion Magus

Skill ranks per level: An Eldritch Scion receives a number of skill ranks per level equal to 4 + Intelligence Modifier. (This makes up for not being an Intelligence-based spellcaster. Note that other non-Intelligence-based classes, spellcasting or otherwise, need this as well.)

Add Magus Arcana section: The following Magus Arcana is available to Eldritch Scion Magi:

  • Fast Metamagic (Prerequisites: Any Metamagic Feat) An Eldritch Scion Magus who chooses this Arcana can spend Eldritch Pool points to avoid the increase in casting time for using one or more Metamagic Feats to modify a spell. This costs a number of Eldritch Pool points equal to the level of the increase in spell required by applying the Metamagic Feat(s). Abilities (such as the Magical Lineage trait) that reduce the spell level increase likewise decrease the number of Eldritch Pool points which must be spent; this can reduce the number of Eldritch Pool points spent to 0, but even in this case, the Magus must have at least 1 unspent Eldritch Pool point to use this Arcana.

The above still isn't completely satisfactory. In particular, the Spell Combat restriction and progression delay hurt out of proportion to the early ability to use Bloodrager Bloodline Powers, while the bonus spells are gained very late for their level, and no bonus spells of 5th or 6th level are available -- I wonder if Eldritch Scion would be better with a Sorcerer Bloodline instead of a Bloodrager Bloodline.

Fixes for Elemental Knight Magus

Optionally dependent archetype: Elemental Knight may be applied to the Eldritch Scion archetype, in which case Eldritch Scion Magus is treated as the base class for the purpose of adjudicating archetype capability.

Elemental Matric: At 4th level or 11th level (see below), an Elemental Knight gains Incremental Elemental Assault as a bonus feat; an Elemental Knight who already has this feat can retrain it for free at this time. In addition, at the same level, as a Swift Action, an Elemental Knight may expend rounds of duration of Elemental Assault ability to gain Arcane Pool (or Eldritch Pool) points, at an exchange rate of 4 rounds expended for every 1 pool point gained.

This ability replaces Spell Recall and is gained at 4th level if applied to Magus or an archetype that does not replace Spell Recall, or replaces Improved Spell Recall and is gained at 11th level if applied to an archetype that replaces Spell Recall but not Improved Spell Recall.

Magus Arcana: The following Magus Arcana complement the Elemental Knight Archetype: Empowered Magic, Pool Strike, Spell Shield. In addition, the following Magus Arcana complements the Elemental Knight Archetype in combination with the Eldritch Scion archetype: Fast Metamagic.


Student of Stone (Monk) (Advanced Race Guide)

Strength of Stone (Ex): At 3rd level, a student of stone learns to draw strength from the earth. So long as both he and his opponent are touching the ground, the student of stone gains a +2 bonus on attack rolls, damage rolls, bull rush and trip combat maneuver rolls, and to his CMD when resisting a bull rush or trip attempt. This bonus increases by +1 every 2 levels beyond 3rd. This ability replaces fast movement.

Ok... someone will have to explain me how can you call swapping an scaling speed enhancement for a single +1 bonus to rolls a fair trade... Yeah... oreads can now be more potent on the ground as they level up.

Bones of Stone (Su): At 7th level, as a swift action, a student of stone can spend 1 ki point to gain DR 2/magic until the beginning of his next turn. At 10th level, he can spend 1 ki point to gain DR 5/magic until his next turn. At 15th level, he can spend 1 ki point to gain DR 10/magic until his next turn. This ability replaces high jump.

You're obtaining 5/chaotic for free at 20th level, making this ability completely moot. I changed it to x/magic only.

Soul of Stone (Su): At 12th level, as a swift action, a student of stone can spend 1 ki point to gain tremorsense 30 feet until his next turn. At 16th level, the range of this tremorsense increases to 60 feet. This ability replaces abundant step.

Again, you're gaining Tremorsense 20ft. at 20th level, making this ability completely useless, even for an extra 10ft. for tremorsense. Now, spending a ki point greatly increases the sense's range, making a GOOD investment.


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Blade Adept (Arcanist) (Advanced Class Guide)

Adept Exploits: A blade adept can select from the following additional exploits.

Eldritch Celerity: The blade adept can expend 1 point from her arcane reservoir in order to treat 3/4 of her spellcaster level as her base attack bonus (cleric's BAB progression, for instance). At 12th level, the blade adept can expend 2 point from her arcane reservoir in order to treat her full spellcaster level as her base attack bonus (fighter's BAB progression). This bonus lasts until your next turn.

That's all you need. I fail to understand why they gave a 1/2 BAB spellcaster a very martial-flavored archetype, without any ability to be a martial-flavored character. With this exploit, which is optional BTW, you can at least HIT something with your sword.


Cloistered Cleric (Archetype)

Just as a buff I would give them access to a second domain (but limit it to ones that fit the theme, so artifice, community, knowledge, those types of things). Most everything else is fine.


JiCi wrote:

Blade Adept (Arcanist) (Advanced Class Guide)

Adept Exploits: A blade adept can select from the following additional exploits.

Eldritch Celerity: The blade adept can expend 1 point from her arcane reservoir in order to treat 3/4 of her spellcaster level as her base attack bonus (cleric's BAB progression, for instance). At 12th level, the blade adept can expend 2 point from her arcane reservoir in order to treat her full spellcaster level as her base attack bonus (fighter's BAB progression). This bonus lasts until your next turn.

That's all you need. I fail to understand why they gave a 1/2 BAB spellcaster a very martial-flavored archetype, without any ability to be a martial-flavored character. With this exploit, which is optional BTW, you can at least HIT something with your sword.

I came up with a Blade Adept Arcanist build that partially does this by first dipping 1 level in Bloodrager, going VMC Magus, getting Mad Magic as soon as possible, and taking the Bloodline Development Exploit as soon as possible, and then taking the Maneuver Mastery Magus Arcana at 7th level. Still, would be nice to not have to jump through so many hoops, and apparently a little bit of question remains about whether Bloodline Development can progress a Bloodrager Bloodline, although most of the consensus seemed to be that it can.

* * * * * * * *

Went back and looked at Tyrant Antipaladin again: Actually seems pretty easy to fix by modifying the spell list as noted below, and by adding the following text at the end of Diabolic Boon: A Tyrant who chooses to bond with a weapon gains a bond with the weapon that functions as the standard Fiendish Boon with the following exception: A Tyrant cannot add the Anarchic weapon property, but instead can add the Axiomatic weapon property.

The following changes are made to the Tyrant Antipaladin's spell list, but only if spellcasting is not replaced by another archetype that the Antipaladin has taken:

1st level: Protection from Law is replaced with Protection from Chaos.

2nd level: Protection from Law Communal Version is prelaced with Protection from Chaos Communal Version.

3rd level: Magic Circle Against Law is replaced with Magic Circle Against Chaos.

4th level: Dispel Law is replaced with Dispel Chaos.


Buccaneer Bard (Pirates of the Inner Sea)

Pirates of the Inner Sea wrote:
Knock Out (Ex): At 5th level, a buccaneer may focus his blows in an attempt to knock out an opponent. Once per day as a swift action, the buccaneer can choose one target to attempt to knock out. The buccaneer adds his Charisma bonus (if any) on his attack roll and adds his buccaneer level on any nonlethal damage rolls made against the target. The bonus lasts until the buccaneer deals nonlethal damage to his target or until the buccaneer chooses a new target to attempt to knock out.

The power is called "knock out". The Buccaneer Bard is a slaver - he's supposed to be capturing his foes alive. It should say: "The bonus lasts until the bard does lethal damage." This could be fixed with errata.


Ragechemist

Rage Mutagen
At 2nd level, whenever a ragechemist creates a mutagen that improves his Strength, that mutagen’s bonus to Strength and penalty to Intelligence increases by 2.

Sturdy Rage
At 6th level, whenever a ragechemist uses his rage mutagen, he also gains a +4 bonus to natural armor, but takes a -2 penalty to will saves.

Lumbering Rage
At 10th level, whenever a ragechemist uses his rage mutagen ability, he may have the mutagen also give him a +2 morale bonus to Constitution, but he also takes a –2 penalty to Dexterity.

The class is the same mostly, it just doesn't have a chance to turn into a snowball of suck whenever it gets hit.


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Acrobat (rogue)
This is an archetype I reworked a few years ago, with a small update. I thought that the original benefit from expert acrobat was pretty lame. It eliminates ACP to certain skills while in light armor, but the ACP is probably -1 or zero anyways. These new abilities are a little more potent that the class features they replace, but I see no harm in it.

Expert Acrobat (Ex): An acrobat adds 1/2 her level as a bonus to Acrobatics and Climb skill checks (minimum 1). When she deliberately falls any distance, she can subtract her level from the amount of falling damage she takes.

This ability replaces trapfinding.

Agile Movement (Ex): At 3rd level an acrobat gains a +1 dodge bonus to herAC against attacks of opportunity. At 6th level and every three levels thereafter, this bonus increases by +1.

This ability replaces trap sense or danger sense.


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Urban Ranger: Gets favored terrain urban. Rather than getting extra favored terrains, his favored terrain urban improves.

As is, his favored community is pants on head horrible.


Favored Terrain: Urban would be better, but he should also be able to pick secondary terrains at 5, 10, 15, and 20. That or some other feature secondary terrains.


Here's a fix for Overwhelming Soul Kineticist to make it be not so lacking in offensive power, by way of modifying Mental Prowess (original version here):

Flamboyant Mental Prowess (Su)

An overwhelming soul's mind is strong enough to protect her body from the stress of channeling the elements. However, in exchange, she is unable to push her limits quite as far as other kineticists; still, an overwhelming soul is not completely lacking in ability to push around the elements, using the same panache that swashbucklers use to fuel their amazing deeds.

At the start of each day, an overwhelming soul gains a number of panache points equal to her Charisma modifier (minimum 1). Her panache goes up or down throughout the day, but usually cannot go higher than her Charisma modifier (minimum 1), though feats and magic items can affect this maximum. An overwhelming soul's panache counts as a swashbuckler's panache for the purpose of prerequisites, is affected by feats and class features that affect panache, interacts with grit in the same way as swashbuckler's panache, and can be used for any swashbuckler deeds that the overwhelming soul gains, whether by feats or swashbuckler levels (or levels in a similar class), although an overwhelming soul does not automatically gain deeds without such feats or class levels. An overwhelming soul spends panache to accept burn, and regains panache in the following ways.

  • Critical Hit with a Kinetic Blast or a Melee Weapon created or modified by an infusion: Each time the swashbuckler confirms a critical hit with a kinetic blast or a melee weapon created or modified by an infusion (such as Kinetic Blade or Kinetic Whip), she regains 1 panache point. Confirming a critical hit on a helpless or unaware creature or a creature that has fewer Hit Dice than half the overwhelming soul's character level doesn't restore panache.

  • Killing Blow with a Kinetic Blast or a Melee Weapon created or modified by an infusion: When the swashbuckler reduces a creature to 0 or fewer hit points by attacking with a kinetic blast or a melee weapon created or modified by an infusion (such as Kinetic Blade or Kinetic Whip) while in combat, she regains 1 panache point. Destroying an unattended object, reducing a helpless or unaware creature to 0 or fewer hit points, or reducing a creature that has fewer Hit Dice than half the swashbuckler's character level to 0 or fewer hit points doesn't restore any panache.

An overwhelming soul that gains levels in a class (such as swashbuckler) that has its own method of regaining panache can use the methods of both classes to regain panache.

An overwhelming soul accepts burn by consuming panache points on a one-for-one basis If she does not have enough panache points to cover the burn cost of a talent, she can't choose to accept burn, though she can still use wild talents with a burn cost if she can reduce that cost to 0 points with abilities such as gather power and infusion specialization. If she would be forced to accept burn against her will (for example, if she fails a concentration check) and does not have enough panache to accept the burn, instead of taking burn she takes 1 temporary negative level, which never kills her and can't be removed with restoration or greater restoration, but which disappears automatically after 24 hours.

At 6th level, once per day, she can reduce the total burn cost of any wild talent by 1. She can use this ability an additional time per day at 10th level and every 4 levels thereafter.

This ability alters burn and replaces internal buffer.

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I'm not crazy about your overwhelming soul rework. The entire point of the archetype is eliminate the annoyance of managing burn and burn costs. Here, you not only kept that but also gave them another resource that doesn't fit the flavor of the archetype at all. In addition, the resource panache works very differently from burn. You can't just swap one resource system for another like that. From a mechanical perspective, they're totally different systems (one's a static system and another is dynamic).


What about gaining Charisma to Will saves, and the ability to take burn up to your Charisma modifier? Instead of regular Constitution burn, burn applies double to Will saves and Wisdom-based checks. Maybe also applies (regularly) to initiative? At higher levels, maybe you also get a DC and AC booster? So you can keep competitive with a regular Kineticist who has stacked up on burn to get a bunch of Overflow. Additionally, maybe Gather Power or Infusion Specialization can provide a greater burn reduction.


Cyrad wrote:
I'm not crazy about your overwhelming soul rework. The entire point of the archetype is eliminate the annoyance of managing burn and burn costs. Here, you not only kept that but also gave them another resource that doesn't fit the flavor of the archetype at all. In addition, the resource panache works very differently from burn. You can't just swap one resource system for another like that. From a mechanical perspective, they're totally different systems (one's a static system and another is dynamic).

Of course, flavor fitting may vary with character concept, but Panache COULD fit with an Overwhelming Soul -- the very name sort of implies somebody with a REALLY BIG EGO that wouldn't mind being flamboyant (although not necessarily in the style usually considered as such -- think of Magneto, for instance).

In addition, one of the purposes of the archetype is to provide a way for Kineticists who have a Constitution penalty (Elves, for instance) or even no Constitution score at all (Undead and the occasional sentient Construct) to be Kineticists. The problem is that as written, Overwhelming Soul has struck an awful lot of people as . . . Underwhelming.


Eldritch Scoundrel!! I would change the following: Skill points 6+Int mod instead of 4+Int mod, able to cast in light armor, Sneak Attack at 1st level and every 3 levels after, Rogue Talents at 2nd level and every 3 levels after with Advanced Talents at 11th level.


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I can't believe that nobody has mentioned the worst Pathfinder Archetype.

The Paladin's Empyreal Knight...

This, as it is, is a steaming pile of fail in every way possible.

Behold the face of failure!

So, basically this Archetype creates the non-Paladin. It removes practically EVERYTHING the Paladin normally gets.

Divine Grace? Nope! Instead we give you the ability to speak and read Celestial. So basically we give you 1 rank in linguistics instead of being able to add your charisma bonus to all of your saves.

Instead of Mercies you get some passive resistances that scale and a limited use buffed Protection from Evil. Not bad.

Instead of being able to channel positive energy or lay on hands you get the ability to get inferior versions of Summon Monster. Yay? I guess.

For your divine bond you have to take the mount, but, the mount gains wings! Uhm. No.

The capstone is nothing to write home about either.

So... Here we go... Let's fix this blob of wasted potential.

-----

Empyreal Knight:

The empyreal knight dedicates her life to serving the celestial beings that guide mortals in their struggle toward the light.

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Angelic Form (SP)
Beginning at 3rd level, as a free action, the Paladin may assume the benefits of "Angelic Aspect, Lesser" for 1 round per day equal to their Paladin level. These rounds do not need to be spent consecutively.

At level 6, this becomes "Angelic Aspect" and at level 9 this becomes "Angelic Aspect, Greater."

At level 12 the duration goes from 1 round per day, to 1 minute per day.

At 20th level, an empyreal knight transcends her mortal self. Her type is treated as outsider for the purposes of spells and magical effects. She loses her ability to assume an Angelic aspect and instead she gains low-light vision; darkvision 60 feet; DR 10/evil; immunity to acid, cold, and petrification; resistance to electricity and fire 10; a +4 racial bonus on saves against poison; and protective aura and truespeech as supernatural abilities for the duration of the spell. Also, her wings give her a fly speed of 60 feet with good maneuverability.

She also gains a protective aura provides a +4 deflection bonus to AC and a +4 resistance bonus on saving throws against attacks made or effects created by evil creatures to anyone within 20 feet. Otherwise, it functions as a magic circle against evil and a lesser globe of invulnerability, both with a radius of 20 feet.

She also gains Truespeech allowing her to speak with any creature that has a language, as though using the tongues spell.

Unlike other outsiders, an empyreal knight can still be brought back from the dead as if she were a member of her previous creature type.

This replaces the Mercy class feature and the Holy Champion class feature.

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Divine Bond (SP)
An Empyreal Knight must take a divine bond with their weapon.

This changes Divine Bond.

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Celestial Ally (SP)
At 4th level, an empyreal knight can summon a celestial ally as a full-round action. This functions as summon monster I, except it can only be used to summon celestial creatures, archons, and angels. At 6th level, this improves to summon monster II, increasing by one spell level for every two levels thereafter, to a maximum of summon monster IX at 20th level. This ability can be used a number of times per day equal to the empyreal knight’s Charisma modifier (minimum 1), but only one ally can be summoned at a time.

This ability replaces Spellcasting.

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UnArcaneElection wrote:
Cyrad wrote:
I'm not crazy about your overwhelming soul rework. The entire point of the archetype is eliminate the annoyance of managing burn and burn costs. Here, you not only kept that but also gave them another resource that doesn't fit the flavor of the archetype at all. In addition, the resource panache works very differently from burn. You can't just swap one resource system for another like that. From a mechanical perspective, they're totally different systems (one's a static system and another is dynamic).

Of course, flavor fitting may vary with character concept, but Panache COULD fit with an Overwhelming Soul -- the very name sort of implies somebody with a REALLY BIG EGO that wouldn't mind being flamboyant (although not necessarily in the style usually considered as such -- think of Magneto, for instance).

In addition, one of the purposes of the archetype is to provide a way for Kineticists who have a Constitution penalty (Elves, for instance) or even no Constitution score at all (Undead and the occasional sentient Construct) to be Kineticists. The problem is that as written, Overwhelming Soul has struck an awful lot of people as . . . Underwhelming.

I think a soul pool equal to half their level could work


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
Iceman1077 wrote:
Eldritch Scoundrel!! I would change the following: Skill points 6+Int mod instead of 4+Int mod, able to cast in light armor, Sneak Attack at 1st level and every 3 levels after, Rogue Talents at 2nd level and every 3 levels after with Advanced Talents at 11th level.

I'm not sure I'd give it all that. Light armor, probably but it's a pretty solid archetype overall so I'm not sure it necessarily needs better sneak attack or rogue talents.

I would get rid of Alarm Sense altogether though if I were modifying the archetype.


Squiggit wrote:
Iceman1077 wrote:
Eldritch Scoundrel!! I would change the following: Skill points 6+Int mod instead of 4+Int mod, able to cast in light armor, Sneak Attack at 1st level and every 3 levels after, Rogue Talents at 2nd level and every 3 levels after with Advanced Talents at 11th level.

I'm not sure I'd give it all that. Light armor, probably but it's a pretty solid archetype overall so I'm not sure it necessarily needs better sneak attack or rogue talents.

I would get rid of Alarm Sense altogether though if I were modifying the archetype.

I'd probably add Arcane Strike at 1st, Arcane Armor Training at 2nd, Arcane Armor Mastery at 6th, and reincorporate Uncanny Dodge and such at later levels when you would replace Rogue Talents (10th, 14th, 18th.)


HWalsh wrote:

I can't believe that nobody has mentioned the worst Pathfinder Archetype.

The Paladin's Empyreal Knight...

This, as it is, is a steaming pile of fail in every way possible.

That's because Totem Warrior is still worse. It is the absolute worst waste of paper in all of Paizo's output. I can only imagine what kind of malaise the writers and editors must have been in for it to have be allowed a release at all.


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Larkos wrote:
HWalsh wrote:

I can't believe that nobody has mentioned the worst Pathfinder Archetype.

The Paladin's Empyreal Knight...

This, as it is, is a steaming pile of fail in every way possible.

That's because Totem Warrior is still worse. It is the absolute worst waste of paper in all of Paizo's output. I can only imagine what kind of malaise the writers and editors must have been in for it to have be allowed a release at all.

I don't think the Totem Warrior is as bad as Empyreal Knight. Here's why.

ThevEmpyreal Knight makes the Paladin worse. The Totem Warrior... Doesn't do anything... At all.


HWalsh wrote:
Larkos wrote:
HWalsh wrote:

I can't believe that nobody has mentioned the worst Pathfinder Archetype.

The Paladin's Empyreal Knight...

This, as it is, is a steaming pile of fail in every way possible.

That's because Totem Warrior is still worse. It is the absolute worst waste of paper in all of Paizo's output. I can only imagine what kind of malaise the writers and editors must have been in for it to have be allowed a release at all.

I don't think the Totem Warrior is as bad as Empyreal Knight. Here's why.

ThevEmpyreal Knight makes the Paladin worse. The Totem Warrior... Doesn't do anything... At all.

There are plenty of archetypes that are worse than the base class and some that are pointless outside of very specific circumstances. But I don't think any just do nothing quite the way Totem Warrior does. It just teases a powerful archetype (being allowed to take more than one totem) and just gives us nothing.


HWalsh wrote:

I can't believe that nobody has mentioned the worst Pathfinder Archetype.

The Paladin's Empyreal Knight...

This, as it is, is a steaming pile of fail in every way possible.
{. . .}

If they had made this more like the Summoner's Summon Monster SLA (Standard Action, 1 minute per level, and 3 + ChaMod per day) it wouldn't have been so bad. But this archetype was written long before the Monster Summoner's Handbook.

Still, I could get behind something like your changes.


After looking at the D&D 3.5 Cloistered Cleric, I think the easiest fix for the Pathfinder Cloistered Cleric is to replace it with the D&D 3.5 Cloistered Cleric, except to keep the Skills section and 4 + IntMod skill ranks/level (or 6 + IntMod if the standard Cleric gets upgraded to 4 + IntMod like it should be) from Pathfinder.

I have been toying with other changes, but those get involved enough to make almost a new class (hint: I want a d6, 1/2 BAB divine caster -- the D&D 3.5 Cloistered Cleric is a start, but more could be done for a Pathfinder class of this type).


I have a cloistered cleric archetype I have retooled with a number of times. I imagine I have the same issues with it as you. The general goal is less martial and more skills. Divine wizard and all. That can be accomplished rather simply in a bare bones way I suppose, but I want to do it by adding something interesting, and not by causing spell casting to suffer. The most recent incarnation I wrote gave them a modified version of the investigator's inspiration ability. I like that as a start, but I haven't been able to really finish it.


This thread has pointed out the need for a fix to Two-Weapon Warrior -- currently it takes too long to get online for a Two-Weapon Fighter who uses two non-identical weapons, because it needs two stages of Weapon Training. So, replace Twin Blades with:

Two-Weapon Training

At 5th level, the Two-Weapon Warrior can gain the standard Fighter's Weapon Training with one Weapon Group, or can instead choose two One-Handed or Light Weapons with which to gain the benefits of Weapon Training. In the latter case, the Two-Weapon Warrior gains the benefits of Weapon Training equally with both weapons even if they are not in the same Weapon Group, but does not gain the benefits of Weapon Training with other weapons in the same Weapon Groups. This modifies and otherwise works like Weapon Training 1, and counts as such for feat prerequisites even if the second option is chosen, but only when using one or both of the chosen weapons.


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Magus Archtype, The Greensting Slayer.

The issue is with The Modified Arcane pool ability.

Normally magus have get this ability called arcane pool. where they can spend an arcane point as a swift action to give there weapon a +1 enchantment for 10 rounds. then at level 5 this enhances to +2 and every 4 levels it goes up by one. at level 5 magus can also give there weapon Shocking, Flaming, Keen, Vorple ect. needless to say, this is a really powerful ability.

what the green sting slayer does is replaces the enchantment with sneak attack, but the major problem is that you still have to spend an arcane point (you don’t get many and other things cost them as well) to give your next attack sneak attack. as you can see the problem. its way better to have a +1 weapon for 10 rounds than it is to get sneak attack on one attack that might not even hit.

and at level 5 when you can make your weapon flaming. so you can have a +1 flaming attack for 10 rounds, or you can get 2d6 sneak attack for one attack that might miss.

so what I’m proposing is that the Magus can spend an arcane point as a swift action to gain the sneak attack ability for 10 rounds with the same die progression. So a level 5 magus can spend one arcane point as a swift action to gain 2D6 sneak attack for the next 10 rounds.


I am thinking about changing the Magical Child specialization to Bard (from unchained summoner) and giving it access to some of the bardic music abilities (inspire courage, competence, heroism - basically the "positive" stuff) as special vigilante talents, essentially making it a familiar-assisted buffer rather than a sort-of summoner. Do you think this would work?

Alternatively, I would just ditch the familiar for the music,but I do not want to make it too similar to the bard.


Super short fix for the sword saint samurai. Iaitsu strike is now a standard action from level 1, and at tenth level, it gains +2 to hit.

This is because it is otherwise a completely useless archetype from levels 1 through 9. Now it is merely somewhat lacklustre, which is fine.

Dark Archive

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The Reanimator (Alchemist)

I would make the following changes:

- At 4th level, the Reanimator adds command undead to their formula book as a 2nd-level formula. This takes the form of a powder that the Reanimator throws at their target. Instead of its standard range, treat it as a thrown weapon touch attack with a range increment of 20 feet that only effects corporeal undead, and targets that get a saving throw take a -1 penalty to that saving throw per -1/4 levels.

Why?: Bear in mind that playing a Reanimator is a serious "Marshmallow Test" - as is, you don't get anything until 7th level, but you start out handicapped (in the form of weaker Bombs) starting at level 1, so I think it's sufficiently fair that they get this ability (which they will REALLY WANT for their higher-level abilities, and has its lesser uses in the meantime) for free; also, I never fully agreed with treating individual spells/formulae as equivalent to Class Features like Bomb Damage Increases or Discoveries (rather, my initial inclination would have been that new formulae/spells are added to your class list at the expense of others being entirely removed from your list). The fact that this also requires spending a 2nd-level infusion, has a much weaker range, and requires an attack roll unlike the spell, all act as restraints on its power. Also, the current solution to the "Reanimators can't control their higher-level undead" problem - investing in a wand of command undead - remains valid and is now easier and more reliable, since a Use Magic Device check is no longer required.

- Reanimation formulae no longer have the same expensive material components, nor time of day requirements, that their spell analogues do.

Why?: I don't have too much of a problem with the 1-hour 'quickening' period, but put that together with the expensive material components, and it might start to get unfair. Dr. Herbert West never had any truck with onyx, and while one could easily say that the solution instead demands rare salts, oils, and electrolytes and such that might be similarly expensive, I like the opportunity to trade one heavy cost for an entirely different kind of heavy cost, while both together might be too much, so I side with the atypical 1-hour delay over the "conventional magic" expensive gem component, thus further distinguishing alchemical magic from spellcraft.

- At 15th level, instead of gaining create greater undead, the Reanimator gains create variant mummy, save that the corpse does not need to have been steeped in a peat bog for 24 hours (instead only requiring the 1-hour 'quickening' time that the lower iterations do), and also temporary resurrection, which requires only 50 gp worth of expensive reagents (10% the normal cost), but takes 1 hour to work.

Why?: Let's face it - the devs made a mistake here. Look at [I]create greater undead: almost all of the things you can make with it are either incorporeal, or so otherworldly/spiritual in nature that they don't seem appropriate for being the results of alchemical reanimation. So, I substitute create variant mummy, which is much more appropriate and doable all around, and since it's a less powerful spell than create greater undead, I also throw in the equivalent-level temporary resurrection - a final, bittersweet, just-short-of-yet-so-far-from-perfection of the reanimation solution they'd worked so hard on and sacrificed so much for.[/I]


The Shaman wrote:

I am thinking about changing the Magical Child specialization to Bard (from unchained summoner) and giving it access to some of the bardic music abilities (inspire courage, competence, heroism - basically the "positive" stuff) as special vigilante talents, essentially making it a familiar-assisted buffer rather than a sort-of summoner. Do you think this would work?

Alternatively, I would just ditch the familiar for the music,but I do not want to make it too similar to the bard.

Well, if people want to keep the Familiar for the Magical Child, I'd say this:

Magical Child (Vigilante) (Ultimate Intrigue)

Animal Guide (Ex): [Ok, I'll skip to the part it needs some changes]
At 5th level, the familiar can alter its form as per the Polymorph Familiar spell, using the vigilante level as the caster level. However, each casting is tied to a specific form that is permanent each time the spell is cast. At 13th level, the spell lasts indefinetely and the familiar can change forms as per the change shape universal monster ability if it doesn’t already have it.

I removed the entire ruling about the familiar gaining the equivalent of the Improved Familiar feat for various reasons.
1) Not many choices based on the original familiars
2) Not many choices for encounters
3) Not many choices per level; there are not many critters in every level.
4) Not many options to get the equivalent of Kerobero in both forms :P


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Totem Warrior Barbarian:

Issue: The archetype is literally worthless. It does nothing whatsoever and actually just wastes space and makes people think it should do something.

Fix: The archetype should be centered around Totem powers to that end some abilities should be replaced to increase that aspect of the archetype.

Level 2 - Replace Uncanny Dodge with Totemic Attunement - Every Totem Warrior creates their own symbolic Totems, by spending 1 hour focusing upon a totem the Barbarian can change which Totem powers which he has taken that he has access to during his rage. A Totem Warrior may take rage powers from any amount of Totem groups. This Attunement time becomes 1 minute at level 6, a Standard Action at level 9, and a Swift Action at level 12.

Replace Trap Sense with Totemic Synergy - A Totemic Warrior may add 1 additional effect of a lesser totem rage power he knows to his Attuned Powers this is increased by an additional 1 lesser power every 3 levels thereafter.

Replace Improved Uncanny Dodge with Improved Totemic Synergy - A Totem warrior may add 1 second tier Totem power to his attuned powers. Increase this by 1 power at level 12.

Replace Indomitable Will with Greater Totemic Synergy - A Totemic Warrior may add 1 Greater Totem power he knows to his attuned powers when starting to Rage.

Replace Mighty Rage with Totem Master - The Totem Warrior is always attuned with all of his totemic Rage Powers.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

I'm not convinced this isn't overpowered since I traded out some garbage for good things but at the same time since it's self limiting until around level 12, I figured it probably wouldn't be too busted also none of the rage powers other than Beast Totem are all that fantastic. Let me know if you'd pick this over Invulnerable Rager normally or if it would only be a flavor pick.


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Wizard archetypes are, in general, some of the worst archetypes out there. There are some decent ones, but most of them are complete and total stinkers that vastly under-estimate just how punishing trading off the arcane school really is. Let's tackle a few of those:

Arcane Bomber
Bomb (Su)
At the 1st level, the arcane bomber gains the alchemist's bomb ability. This ability stacks with the alchemist's bomb ability to determine number of bombs per day, DC, and damage. This ability replaces arcane school.

Spellblast Bomb
At 1st level, as a free action, an arcane bomber can sacrifice one of his spells to empower the next bomb he throws during his turn. When he does, he gains a bonus to hit with the next bomb he throws before the end of his turn equal to the level of the spell he sacrificed, and a bonus to damage equal to twice the level of the spell. This ability replaces arcane bond.

Bomb Discovery
At the 5th level and every 5 levels thereafter, a Wizard gains one alchemist discovery. He can only pick discoveries that modify his bombs. An arcane bomber can take the Extra Discovery feat, but only to select discoveries that modify his bombs. This replaces the wizard bonus feats at the 5th, 10th, 15th, and 20th levels.

Analysis: Bombs synergize very well with the Wizard, and are particularly powerful at low levels, so a suitably high downside is necessary. However, the original Arcane Bomber was ludicrously over the top with its tradeoffs. The loss of Arcane School and Arcane Bond, taken together, is already very substantial and further downsides are not necessary. Spellblast Bombs are not a very useful class feature, and serve as filler to offset just how good the baseline bombs actually are. Heading in a different direction from the Arcane Bomber, this one not only allows the use of alchemist discoveries, but actually gives them to you at higher levels. Bombs simply become less and less substantial at higher levels, to the point at which a regular Evoker completely outclasses the Arcane Bomber. By giving him discoveries, his bombs can hopefully remain relevant.

Siege Mage
Siege Engineer
At 1st level, the siege mage gains Siege Engineer as a bonus feat, even though he does not meet the prerequisites for that feat. This ability replaces Scribe Scroll.

Siege Engine Bond (Su)
At 1st level, a siege mage can bond with a single siege engine. Bonding with a siege engine requires 1 minute of uninterrupted concentration while standing next to the siege engine. A siege mage can only have one bonded siege engine at a time. The siege mage can end this bond with a free action. The siege mage's bond allows him to count as more than one creature for the purpose of fulfilling a siege engine's crew requirement. The siege mage counts as an additional number of medium creatures equal to 1/2 his level (minimum 1).

A siege mage begins play with a light ballista in his possession. This weapon is battered, and only the siege mage knows how to use it properly. All other creatures treat the ballista as if it had the broken condition. If the weapon already has the broken condition, it does not work at all for anyone else trying to use it. This starting weapon can only be sold for scrap (it's worth 4d10 gp when sold).

This ability replaces arcane bond.

Siege School
The siege mage gains access to the following powers:

Create Ammunition: the siege mage can create ammunition for his bonded siege engine. This ammunition lasts only for 1 minute or until used, at which point it dissipates. No other siege engine can use this ammunition. Starting at the 4th level this magical ammunition counts as being enchanted, and is treated as having a +1 enhancement bonus. This bonus increases by another +1 every 4 levels thereafter, to a maximum of +5 at the 20th level. This ability can be used a number of times per day equal to 3 + intelligence modifier.

Resize Siege Engine: as a standard action a siege mage may touch his bonded siege engine and resize it. He can change it to any size that is smaller than its original size, down to the size of a small object that fits in the palm of his hand. Its weight changes accordingly.

Remote Fire: the siege mage may fire and reload his bonded siege weapon remotely. The siege mage must be within a distance of 25 ft. + 5 ft per level to use this ability.

Remote Move: starting at the 3rd level the siege mage may move his siege weapon remotely. The siege mage must be within a distance of 25 ft. + 5 ft per level to use this ability, and cannot move the siege weapon beyond this distance.

Imbue with Spell: starting at the 5th level, the siege mage may cast a spell to store it in his bonded siege weapon. When the siege mage next attacks with his bonded siege weapon, the spell activates. If the spell targets a specific creature, then it affects one creature that was directly hit by the siege weapon attack. If the spell activates at a specific location, it activates at the location where the siege weapon strikes. Only one spell may be stored in his bonded siege weapon at a time.

Automatic Fire: starting at the 8th level the siege mage may fire his siege weapon as a swift action. This does not change the time required to reload.

This replaces Arcane School.

Analysis: The original Siege Mage simply doesn't function. Even for an NPC that serves as a siege engineer, the archetype is so deeply flawed as to be useless. It's basically trading off all its class features plus taking a slew of extra downsides in exchange for little more than a bonus feat and a few abilities that are so situational as to be nearly useless. Its only redeeming feature comes at level 10, by which point any wizard has significantly better uses of his actions. This new Siege Mage tries to make itself more appealing to adventurers by giving ways to transport a siege weapon around, and also make itself more appealing to higher level characters by giving some action economy advantages to anyone who takes the time to lug around a siege weapon. The loss of arcane bond and arcane school is sufficient to pay for these advantages.

Sword Binder
Arcane Bond: a sword binder must choose a sword as his arcane bond. He gains proficiency with it. Starting at the 5th level he adds his intelligence modifier to all attack rolls with his bonded sword, and starting at the 10th level he adds his intelligence modifier to all damage rolls with his bonded sword. These benefits apply to sword of the mage. This alters arcane bond.

Sword of the Mage (Su) A sword binder can send his bound sword to srike foes. He gains the hand of the apprentice ability of the universalist school, but can use this ability only with his bonded sword. His range with the ablity is close (25 feet + 5 feet per 2 wizard levels). Alternatively, the sword binder can activate this ability to perform a full attack with his bonded sword. He uses his caster level in the place of his base attack when using this ability. He can use this ability a number of times per day equal to 3 + his intelligence modifier + 1/2 his level.
At the 5th level whenever the sword binder casts a spell with a range of touch from the wizard spell list, he can use his bonded sword to deliver the touch attack, including expending a daily use of hand of the apprentice to make the touch at range. This occurs as part of hte same action as casting the spell. He gains all the attack bonus that applies to his sword (including enhancement bonus and relevant feats).
At 8th level, when the sword binder casts a ranged touch spell or activates this ability to cast a touch spell through it, if his attack misses the spell lingers on the weapon and the sword binder can attempt to deliver the spell again by activating this ability as a standard action. If the sword binder drops or sheaths the weapon with the spell's charge still held, the charge dissipates to no effect.

Analysis: This archetype infuriatingly just repeats all the problems with the Universalist - widely panned as the worst school - and just proceeds to make them worse. Its one redeeming feature, the ability to hold the charge on a ranged touch attack, is ruined by turning it into a ranged attack. Good luck hitting with that. This rewrite drops a whole bunch of restrictions and adds new - and, most importantly, effective - ways to use a sword with a wizard.


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I'm baaaaaaaaack :P

Sovereign Blade (Samurai) (Legacy of Dragons)

Dogmatic Denial (Ex): A sovereign blade gains a +2 bonus on saving throws against spells with any of the following descriptors that don’t match part of the character’s own alignment: chaotic, evil, good, or lawful. This bonus increases by 2 at every 5 levels. This ability replaces mount.

Replacing a scaling class feature with a fixed bonus is... a poorly designed alternative here :S The mount gets stronger as you level up, so any ability that replaces it should do the same IMO.

Drakerider (Cavalier) (Legacy of Dragons)

Drake Mount (Ex): A drakerider gains a drake companion instead of a mount. Unlike a standard companion, the drake is either Medium (for a Small drakeriders) or Large (for Medium drakeriders), following the drake companion's increased size rules. The drake mount does not increase in size regardless of the drakerider's level. The drake mount may increase its size by one category instead of selecting a drake power, and it gains the Mount power as a bonus power. She gains cavalier’s charge at 9th level instead of 3rd.

Hey, do you want an archetype that doesn't let you ride your drake until level 13th? Me neither :P I don't know if it was to prevent having a flying mount at low levels, but right now, a Small drakerider can ride his drake only until 9th level, while a Medium drakerider can ridert his only until 13th level. Beside, flight is optional for the drakerider; it's tempting, but not mandatory. You could build your mount with a breath weapon and burrowing speed if you want instead of flying.

Silver Champion (Paladin) (Legacy of Dragons)

Drake Mount (Ex): At 5th level, a silver champion gains a drake companion. Unlike a standard companion, the drake is either Medium (for a Small champions) or Large (for Medium champions), following the drake companion's increased size rules. The drake mount does not increase in size regardless of the drakerider's level. The drake mount may increase its size by one category instead of selecting a drake power. However, a silver champion doesn’t gain additional uses per day of smite evil at 4th, 10th, and 16th levels, and doesn’t gain mercies at 6th, 12th, and 18th levels. Also, the drake mount's alignment is within one step of Apsu's, which is Lawful Good, Neutral Good or Lawful Neutral.

Same exact problem with the Drakerider, having to start with a drake too small to ride. I know that the Undersized Mount feat is there for something, but you're wasting a feat that will be rendered useless at 9th or 13th level. Furthermore, a drake of "any nongood alignment" is pretty dumb for a paladin's mount. The drake is intelligent enough that if it decides to ally itself to a paladin, it should act accordingly.


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Honestly I'd like to see a menu list of options that are subbed out for standard abilities (That Paizo believes are equivalent exchanges) to allow a player to customize their base class so no two fighters, rogues, wizards, clerics etc. are the same.
Additionally, a perquisite or penalty (such as a reduction in Rogue skill points) can be attached to a particular exchange to make it even out.


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JosMartigan wrote:

Honestly I'd like to see a menu list of options that are subbed out for standard abilities (That Paizo believes are equivalent exchanges) to allow a player to customize their base class so no two fighters, rogues, wizards, clerics etc. are the same.

Additionally, a perquisite or penalty (such as a reduction in Rogue skill points) can be attached to a particular exchange to make it even out.

I believe that archetypes are structured as such in order to avoid "cherry picking". While it certainly can be done as a house rule, the point of an archetype is to show a full specialisation of some kind.

Then again, some archetypes can even be combined, provided that the archetypes don't replace the same class feature(s).

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