If it made your jaw drop, or your eyes pop, or your halls echo with cries of "AWESOME!" or "BROKEN!" we want to hear about it.
For me, it was definitive proof that arcanists were OMG powerful: They can potentially pick up an item creation feat or metamagic feat at every odd level IN ADDITION TO their normal feats!
Wizard who?
Sorcerer who?
I'm playing an artificer AND an incantatrix!
(They easily make the best blockbuster blaster casters now too.)
I kind of went "whoah, really!?" When I saw the magus archetype with bloodlines and rage and spontaneous casting. Particularly because of the casting change, it always seemed like archetypes weren't allowed to do that.
I nearly cried about the hunter without an animal companion and gained wild shape.
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OMG! The Ecclesitheurge archetype finally gives us an unarmored, wizard-like cleric! Among other things they can prepare their domain spells in their normal spell slots.
I am SO happy with this concept being realized.
EDIT: And the Eldritch Scion archetype for magus finally gives us a spontaneously casting magus!!
EDIT 2: Darth Vader guest appearance on page 119!!!
EDIT 3: The Spell Sage wizard archetype can cast bard, cleric, AND druid spells in addition to his normal allotment!
I can see this thread will have a balanced approach to the book.
Sarcasm? I did say awesome and broken...
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Looking at the Swashbuckler's precise strike, I realized that it is meant as a platform that makes 1weapon/1handed, sword and board, and throwing builds viable with its precise strike damage on top of their 'not really' weapon training.
And while I have heard a person or two worrying about ACG classes being overpowered.... I honestly find Swashbuckler more balanced than the gunslinger it was based off of. Getting rid of guns and making it salvage some overlooked styles makes it fit in a lot easier into most games without the GM having to worry about Cthulu's touch AC.
ummm has it come out early or something?
Subscribers are starting to get their PDFs.
The Nature Magic feat is better than Master Artisan in every way since it gives you a spell-like ability with a caster level equal to your character level and only requires 1 rank in knowledge: nature.
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Keep it pleasant. This thread is meant to be fun, not vitriolic.
I'm not liking the Life Shaman they get more boons leveling up, start with a free ability to Channel where Oracles have to pay for it, and get a free hex to go with it. Oh and later they basically get a free Quick Channel Feat.
The Arcanist is plain out OP. They get a huge bag of tricks but only advance spells one level lower than wizards.
This book convinces me more and more that we need a revised and updated Core Rulebook to update some of the classes and clean up the rules a bit.
I like the ACG but it may have accelerated the problems of bloat and "mudflation" this game already suffers from.
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I'm not liking the Life Shaman they get more boons leveling up, start with a free ability to Channel where Oracles have to pay for it, and get a free hex to go with it. Oh and later they basically get a free Quick Channel Feat.
The Arcanist is plain out OP. They get a huge bag of tricks but only advance spells one level lower than wizards.
This book convinces me more and more that we need a revised and updated Core Rulebook to update some of the classes and clean up the rules a bit.
I like the ACG but it may have accelerated the problems of bloat and "mudflation" this game already suffers from.
With the sheer number of classes, archetypes, and class-features-via-feats that now exist, I wonder if a classless system isn't the way to go for rules-heavy systems.
Found a 3rd-level spell that is a "SR no" will save or be helpless for 1 round/level for constructs. Makes golems even more of a joke then they already were.
The Nature Magic feat is better than Master Artisan in every way since it gives you a spell-like ability with a caster level equal to your character level and only requires 1 rank in knowledge: nature.What spell-like abilities are on the table?
Constant know direction and one other 0-level druid orison 1/day. But those aren't why you take the feat.
Found a 3rd-level spell that is a "SR no" will save or be helpless for 1 round/level for constructs. Makes golems even more of a joke then they already were.
Constant know direction and one other 0-level druid orison 1/day. But those aren't why you take the feat.The Nature Magic feat is better than Master Artisan in every way since it gives you a spell-like ability with a caster level equal to your character level and only requires 1 rank in knowledge: nature.What spell-like abilities are on the table?
Good lord! Yeah, Disable Construct needs to be taken down a notch.
I like the Nature Magic feats, they're an interesting idea to make the Vital Strike chain more appealing.
Charisma to saves at level 5 for any oracle, cleric, inquisitor or person willing to dip 1 level. Madness for the oracle and will make me seriously question dumping charisma on the other two.
Cleric and Inquisitor already have such great saves I'm not sure if it's really worth the investment. Oracle is insane with it of course, but otherwise I see it mainly being used by classes that desperately want to get more out of Charisma and will dip Cleric for it (IE Swashbuckler).
I have to wait for it to hit the shelves, but it sounds like it is awesome, though a definite power-creep. How is the feats, if any of you subscribers are willing to divulge? I always loved looking at feats first, then items so I can start figuring on NPC builds.
Looking at the Swashbuckler's precise strike, I realized that it is meant as a platform that makes 1weapon/1handed, sword and board, and throwing builds viable with its precise strike damage on top of their 'not really' weapon training.
And while I have heard a person or two worrying about ACG classes being overpowered.... I honestly find Swashbuckler more balanced than the gunslinger it was based off of. Getting rid of guns and making it salvage some overlooked styles makes it fit in a lot easier into most games without the GM having to worry about Cthulu's touch AC.
I am playing a playtest version Swashbuckler at lvl 14 at this moment and he seems to be very balanced. Gets screwed over by concealment and immunity to precision damage a lot, but otherwise very good. Panache really works well as a waning and waxing resource, much better than grit did.
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Charisma to saves at level 5 for any oracle, cleric, inquisitor or person willing to dip 1 level. Madness for the oracle and will make me seriously question dumping charisma on the other two.
Madness? This! Is! Paizo! <kicks andreww into a bottomless pit>
:p
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I wonder when monsters will get an upgrade to keep up with the costant power creep of this game. Right now, the only challenging option left are munckined npc. Put up Bestiary Unchained next in the pipeline.
Charisma to saves at level 5 for any oracle, cleric, inquisitor or person willing to dip 1 level. Madness for the oracle and will make me seriously question dumping charisma on the other two.Cleric and Inquisitor already have such great saves I'm not sure if it's really worth the investment. Oracle is insane with it of course, but otherwise I see it mainly being used by classes that desperately want to get more out of Charisma and will dip Cleric for it (IE Swashbuckler).
How would they (swashbucklers) get 2º level divine spells only by a 1 level dip?
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I wonder when monsters will get an upgrade to keep up with the costant power creep of this game. Right now, the only challenging option left are munckined npc. Put up Bestiary Unchained next in the pipeline.
Optimized PCs have always torn through standard encounters, and they always will. Because Pathfinder is balanced for players of average skill, not the best.
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For me, it was definitive proof that arcanists were OMG powerful: They can potentially pick up an item creation feat or metamagic feat at every odd level IN ADDITION TO their normal feats!
Just wanted to point out an arcanist can only take the metamagic knowledge and and item crafting exploits once each. "An arcanist exploit cannot be selected more than once," and those two don't have any language making them exceptions.
In keeping with the thread, I like the Champion of the Faith archetype for warpriest - it's pretty clearly the substitute for an "any alignment" paladin.
Now I want to play a chaos-smiting warpriest of the God-Claw for WotR.
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Now I want to play a chaos-smiting warpriest of the God-Claw for WotR.
My WOTR paladin has been enjoying the extra daily uses of Smite Evil from Mythic Smite. You won't get that with Champion of the Faith smite, unfortunately. There are some other paladin goodies that you'll look at jealously, too, or hope for GM flexibility.
Disable construct seems ok you can already have much the same effect with glitterdust, create pit or aqueous orb.
None of those make the construct helpless, though. Inflicting that condition in combat is pretty much a death sentence for the target. Plus, at least with the other spells, the target has a chance to escape from the effect each round (maybe not a very high one, but it's still there). Also, Aqueous Orb has an upper limit on the size of the target it can engulf, same with the size of the pit that could be created by Create Pit.
For me, it was definitive proof that arcanists were OMG powerful: They can potentially pick up an item creation feat or metamagic feat at every odd level IN ADDITION TO their normal feats!Just wanted to point out an arcanist can only take the metamagic knowledge and and item crafting exploits once each. "An arcanist exploit cannot be selected more than once," and those two don't have any language making them exceptions.
lol! Well that certainly makes a difference! :D
Does the spell make a golem helpless enough to CdG it?
Can't coup de grace it, they're immune to anything requiring a Fort save unless it works on items as well. Since you can't CdG a park bench or a tank, I'm pretty sure that means golems and other constructs are immune too.
My main issue with this spell is that something like an adamantine golem being rendered completely helpless by a simple 3rd level spell for upwards of 2 minutes is kind of nuts. If it at least allowed a save to negate the effect at the end of every round, like Hold Monster does, it'd be better. With crappy construct saving throws, though, most anything this spell targets is almost guaranteed to be rendered helpless if the caster has done anything at all to amp up their primary casting stat. Goes double if they happen to have a lesser persistent MM rod lying around.
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Can't coup de grace it, they're immune to anything requiring a Fort save unless it works on items as well. Since you can't CdG a park bench or a tank, I'm pretty sure that means golems and other constructs are immune too.
The auto-crit portion of a CDG works but not the save or die portion.
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Just a side note on golems. This has bugged me for some time now. Why do people think golems are going to be stupid?
If it's the mindless component, I'd like to point out that computers are mindless. There are computers that can outplay chess masters, computer driven war machines that perform better than pilots etc.
I play my golems with increasing capacity for problem solving, like a growing level of programming.
Any way, that doesn't stop the effectiveness of certain spells against them, but was something I've been interested in for some time.
Cheers.
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Just a side note on golems. This has bugged me for some time now. Why do people think golems are going to be stupid?
If it's the mindless component, I'd like to point out that computers are mindless. There are computers that can outplay chess masters, computer driven war machines that perform better than pilots etc.
I play my golems with increasing capacity for problem solving, like a growing level of programming.
Any way, that doesn't stop the effectiveness of certain spells against them, but was something I've been interested in for some time.
Cheers.
Mainly it's the description of golems. P. 158 in the bestiary reads as follows: ...Being mindless, golems do nothing without orders from their creators. They follow instructions explicitly and are incapable of complex strategy or tactics...
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Mainly it's the description of golems. P. 158 in the bestiary reads as follows: ...Being mindless, golems do nothing without orders from their creators. They follow instructions explicitly and are incapable of complex strategy or tactics...Just a side note on golems. This has bugged me for some time now. Why do people think golems are going to be stupid?
If it's the mindless component, I'd like to point out that computers are mindless. There are computers that can outplay chess masters, computer driven war machines that perform better than pilots etc.
I play my golems with increasing capacity for problem solving, like a growing level of programming.
Any way, that doesn't stop the effectiveness of certain spells against them, but was something I've been interested in for some time.
Cheers.
Hehe, I knew I was missing something.
Think I'll keep running them my way, but glad I was informed of that. It's amazing how many times I've read that but completely left that part out. Talk about failed perception check.
Cheers
Hehe, I knew I was missing something.
Think I'll keep running them my way, but glad I was informed of that. It's amazing how many times I've read that but completely left that part out. Talk about failed perception check.
Cheers
No worries! For what it's worth I think I actually prefer your way of running Golems. They tend to be really disappointing fights if played straight against smart groups.
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Just a side note on golems. This has bugged me for some time now. Why do people think golems are going to be stupid?
If it's the mindless component, I'd like to point out that computers are mindless. There are computers that can outplay chess masters, computer driven war machines that perform better than pilots etc.
I play my golems with increasing capacity for problem solving, like a growing level of programming.
Any way, that doesn't stop the effectiveness of certain spells against them, but was something I've been interested in for some time.
Cheers.
In addition to the good points made by others...
Obviously golems aren't entirely helpless. They react to their environment. Despite being "mindless", they can be given orders, in natural language even!
Here we bump against the limits of what the game mechanics can handle. The Intelligence score handles "human-ish" intelligence; on a scale of animal to human to superhuman intellect.
Computers are basically, not on that scale.
A cleverly programmed computer can perform complex strategies. But it still doesn't quite function like an actual intelligence yet. (We're trying hard to change that though.)
PF doesn't really bring any tools to model the differences in how well-programmed your mindless machine is compared to how well I programmed my mindless machine.