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Garbage-Tier Waifu wrote:

I was really sold on EK's when I learnt about the Collosal Telekinetic Sword Hurler strategy, and the arrival of the Sword Binder means that a Wizard/Martial Class/EK can do quite a lot.

Also, that s%%% is so anime its hilarious.

Which sort of sword hurler do you prefer? The stand and shoot type or the hero who charges in?

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I find the easiest way to be "evil" is to have a smaller circle of caring.

Do you respect and care for, say, the rest of the party? Absolutely. Do you defend them, help them, support them? Yes! Do you care about the members of the city watch you're killing your way through to bust out one of the party who got arrested? Hell no, they're obstacles at best. You do what you need to do to help the rest of the party, everybody else be damned.

Since some of the old 10th level spells (from Netheril's books in early editions of D&D and such) were recreated as epic spells, it's possible to guess what sort of a jump we're looking at in complexity by observing the Spellcraft DCs needed to cast them and what they are. Most spells noted so far in this thread are... well, let's say tame.

So, leveled spells on the left, epic spells on the right:

Create Volcano (10) --> Volcano (DC 56)
Weave Mythal (10) --> Mythal seed (DC varies)
Tolodine's Killing Wind (10) --> Tolodine's Killing Wind (DC 70)
Proctiv's Move Mountain (10) --> Proctiv's Move Mountain (DC 280)
Mavin's Worldweave (11) --> Ice Age or similar spells (DC 323 for Ice Age)
Karsus' Avatar (12) --> Never translated to epic

There are also spells that I wouldn't even know where to start with as far as pricing is concerned. Case in point, the 11th level "Breach Crystal Sphere" spell could close a crystal sphere (or open one). Yes, an entire crystal sphere. For those unaware, that has an area of effect approximating a solar system.

I (almost) took True Love on one character to make a point to the GM that if he laid a single finger on said character's family for drama and plot hooks, he'd be deliberately shooting me in the foot mechanically. We've since stopped using story feats of that ilk.

I also took Light, Medium and Heavy Armour Proficiency on a wizard character.

Because I wanted the Taldane Knight feat for a second cohort.

UnArcaneElection wrote:
for a long time, nobody paid attention to this

Wait, what? Magaambyan Arcanist has been and is still an excellent PrC choice for wizards, who's not been paying attention?

Also, echoing what others have said about Eldritch Knight, it's preferable to anybody who thinks long-term as far as casting is concerned. Spells are king, particularly off the Sorc/Wiz list (superior by far to the Magus list).

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AlgaeNymph wrote:
The seven runelords, Arazni, Tar-Baphon, Treerazer, Razmir, Baba Yaga, and Mengkare.

1. What would they talk about (besides the usual taking over the world stuff)?

2. What sort of personality conflicts would arise?

I still think that Sorshen and Xanderghul would probably be pretty friendly or at least on reasonable speaking terms. Enemies or not, when you know each other for thousands and thousands of years, you'd probably wind up appreciating that for all that you hate each other, they're still among the few that you can actually relate to among these most-recent other "Runelords" in Thassilon, despite whatever squabbles you've been having for the past couple centuries.

Anyway. Question in two parts.

The various types of Outer dragons in B4 have very little information associated with them regarding their attitudes and such.

1) When comparing how Outer dragons act compared with other PF dragons (e.g. blacks are sociopathic, blues are OCD-like tidy and in control, brasses are whimsical and light-hearted - taking these from Dragons Revisited), what metallics/chromatics would Outer dragons likely be most similar to?

2) Is there any intent on expanding the background information on Outer dragons in any upcoming publications?

I would suggest holding the NPCs at static points while the PCs level up, until the PCs are at a level where they can take the NPCs as cohorts, then see if they want to use the Leadership feat to bring them directly under their control.

blahpers wrote:
The fun part is now "why do I need to buy all these special inks et al. to scribe new spells into my head?"

There's a spell-book abandoning ability in 3.5 called "Eidetic Spellcaster" that allows you to no longer need a spellbook. Instead, the cost in inks etc. is replaced by the cost of special incense and such to help you fix the spell in your "memory" versus your "memorised spells" (so to speak). It would be fairly simple to adapt that if spell scribing costs is an issue.

The better question is whether the Perfect Preparation ability applies to prepared casters introduced since Mythic Adventures was released (e.g. Arcanist). Probably deserves FAQing, actually.


Because nothing says WIZARD like putting reality over your knee and spanking it.

ChaosTicket wrote:
For the Paladin, I dont know how I could play with that class as its too different for me to play as it is summarized as "Lawful Stupid".

Ever watch Transformers and see Optimus Prime?

Ever find the Dresden Files and read about Michael Carpenter?

If you could successfully ape either of them at the table, you'd be fine.

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James Jacobs wrote:
Divine Source does not allow you to choose a favored weapon. As written, a cleric of a quasi deity does not gain a favored weapon. I suspect this is an accidental error of omission... but I also like the precident that it sets that a cleric of a quasi deity is just a little bit less powerful than a cleric of a demigod.

Question with reference to this.

1) The Distant Shores book provides favoured weapons for the quasi-deity hero gods of Aelyosos (Kelksomides, Druid 16 / Marshal 5, favoured weapon sickle; also Psomeira, Skald 13 / Champion 6, favoured weapon doru). Is this then an oversight? Or should quasi-deities also get favoured weapons for their clerics?

Note: An inability for quasi-deities to have favoured weapons would also influence the Warpriest class in a reasonably large way.

Other question, though, and the more - to my mind - important one.

2) Harking back to Jade Regent, in the early stages of the AP the party can meet Spivey, a Lyrakien azata cleric of Desna (level 3 cleric). A Lyrakien can be taken as an Improved Familiar for a spellcaster of the appropriate level and alignment. How would you, as a GM, adjudicate players who would like to take Spivey as an Improved Familiar, given that she has class levels? She can already accompany the caravan as a NPC ally, but making her an Improved Familiar would go a bit further and influence the rules regarding familiars at baseline, making her a "mechanical part" of a character.

First, what your GM says goes. Expect table variance. However, purely based on the rules text of the spells as written:

Iosif Adaloglou 748 wrote:
-does it alter the casting time of the spell to be cast via this ability to swift action

Yes. You are expending mythic power as a swift action in order to immediately cast one of your spells for no additional action cost. It's functionally Quicken Spell.

-in case the companion spell of the arcane surge requires multiple saving throws (e.g. Baleful polymorph or suffocation), the subject of the spell is compelled to roll twice and take the lower result on all required saving throws or just the first one?

I would say all required saving throws as applied to the spell.

In your Baleful Polymorph example, the text of the spell includes:

"Saving Throw: Fortitude negates, Will partial"

Both of these would need to be rolled twice and the lower result taken for each. If there are saving throws resulting from but not linked to said spell, however, then those would not be roll-twice-take-lower. It only applies to saving throws that are specifically a part of the rules text of the spell.

Archmage is the superior choice, both in terms of core path ability and available mythic path abilities. Just ask your GM if you can take Touched by Divinity and have it work for you as an Archmage path character.

Alternately, grab one of the path traits from Mythic Origins that pertain to the god you want to be a child of, and couple that to Mortal Herald in a RP story arc worked out with the GM if he's completely intractable on any campaign trait alteration.

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Hermea, if you're accepted.

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I'm just going to leave this here:

"There are times when the end justifies the means. But when you build an argument based on a whole series of such times, you may find that you've constructed an entire philosophy of evil." ~Luke Skywalker

That is all.

The +2 to ability scores stops mattering after the early levels. The topic of how overpowering it is (and other "templates" such as Advanced Simple etc.) was also mentioned in this thread as related to point buy (i.e. point buy, much like Azlanti race, matters more at the early levels than the later ones).

Played one before and have played with one. It was not a particularly major issue - we were all sixth level at the time. The Shattered Star Azlanti-blood thing was also awkward when the party ran into it, but that was primarily because of who the Azlanti-blood was.

bookrat wrote:
You'd have to be either extremely lonely and/or extremely selfish to not want to come back.

Once you hit the final stages of an AP, you'll have access to all sorts of things that mean you can go back and forth as much as you please, and bring people with you if you so desire. Put simply, my point is that the experiment by its own nature will turn into a different experiment as you reach the late game and high level play. That's because of how the game functions, and is in its own way fascinating to observe.

Incidentally, the GM is inarguably a variant of Evil and deserves to take a Holy Avenger to the face.

bookrat wrote:

Game rules:

You're playing an AP, but you don't know which one.
If you beat the AP, you are transported back to the time and place you got sucked into the game.
If your character dies and is not brought back to life within one week, you die. No going home.

Hang on, hang on.

If I beat the AP, then by the time I've beaten it I could be a god in all but name who is not so much a reality warper as one who has reality bent over a table.

Why would I want to go back to being a mere mortal again? This isn't about beating the AP, it's about dealing with the bad end when you intentionally don't beat it after reaching somewhere in the last part of the AP. It's not like a one week buffer is an issue.

Question on Greta for those who used her in some fashion:

Assuming a PC wants to take her along, and will eventually be picking her up as a cohort via Leadership, how would you or did you progress her levels? She seems to primarily be an unarchetyped Fighter, though there is the lure of that bodyguard Ranger archetype for Witch-related guardians.

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Mavrickindigo wrote:

Also, that shortpacked comic made me think of this image in rebuttal to it

I like this one, but then, I do like bizarre adventures.

The Archive wrote:
A mythic character with 10 ranks could additionally gain at least another 70 strength for carrying purposes through Display of Strength and Mule's Strength. So 131 Strength for carrying with Ant Haul resulting in a heavy load of a ridiculous 5,788,139,520 pounds. That's nearing 3 million tons.

For a more visual aspect, that should be almost four Golden Gate bridges.

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Torbyne wrote:
CBDunkerson wrote:
Joana wrote:
James Jacobs has been very emphatic that Aroden is dead
Yes, but 'dead' isn't always permanent on Golarion. There are disparate hints and theories (not to mention a module) about how he might be able to come back. I doubt they mean for any of those to happen, but the possibility exists.
Oh come on. He was just a god, not an X-man. Dude's not coming back.

To be perfectly fair, several X-men can and have pulled double-duty as gods, but the revolving door of comic book death being what it is, nobody has failed to come back to life/undeath at least once. Even Uncle Ben has.

What module, incidentally? I'm obviously not up to date.

Encountered it twice, employed it once. Once with a group in 3.5e (my usual group), and in PF (not-quite-usual group, three out of the five players weren't the usual).

In the first (3.5e), we dispatched it and were on our way. 15th level at the time. In the second (PF), myself and the other regular from my usual group dispatched it ourselves (well, I say dispatched, but we really just dumped it in a mostly-non-escapable demiplane, rather than using rules abuse to kill it), and we went on our way. 15th level again. Though the second time, the rest of that group were a bit put out by how easy it went down, as they were under the impression that it would be a boss battle of sorts. Apparently the GM didn't understand the Tarrasque's severe limitations.

The one time I actually employed it as a GM, it was about first getting out of its way, then stopping the crazy wizard-BBEG from mind swapping with it to become the Tarrasque.

Veilgn wrote:
Alleran wrote:
Get the ioun stone from PFS that grants a bonus feat. It's priced at 30k and mechanically is a curse effect.
What is the name? Can you be specific?

Ocher Rhomboid.

Get the ioun stone from PFS that grants a bonus feat. It's priced at 30k and mechanically is a curse effect.

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Question: while recently catching up on the Critical Role webshow (basically a bunch of voice actors playing through what started out as their home D&D campaign, shifting to 5E from PF), I saw one of the special episodes, the one based off We Be Goblins. I was wondering, have you seen it, or watched it as it happened? I think there were gifts and such done between the show and Paizo as part of it, so I'm curious about how aware you were that they did it.

(It was, needless to say, quite funny.)

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James Jacobs wrote:
Razmir may think he's a big deal, but in truth he's a small fish. His little nation is nowhere NEAR large enough to threaten an actual deity, much less attract their attention. He's a tiny little problem that can be fixed by the faithful, and he'll die in a few years or decades anyway, since he's mortal.

I have a follow-up question about Razmir in relation to this. Generally it would perhaps be assumed that gods are "immortal" (though the deaths of various gods throughout Golarion's history argues that while they might not necessarily die of old age, they can still be killed one way or another). With the release of Distant Shores and the expansion on places like Iblydos, with hero-gods capable of granting divine spells who explicitly can quite possibly grow old and die in the normal fashion, is the fact that Razmir still isn't "immune to aging" necessarily seen as a strike against him, depending on the person?

After all, if a hero-god of Iblydos can grow old and die (or be publicly and visibly killed in battle, or similar), nothing says that Razmir might not be able to do the same while still being some degree of god. And while the Starstone can accelerate somebody to full godhood, Mythic Realms does indicate that it may not do so for a particular user.

(I'm aware that in canon he isn't a god, but it seems that there are enough published variations and exceptions to the rule that Razmir's charade could be much more believable in-universe than it might have been earlier in the setting's publishing schedule.)

Zaloma wrote:
Ok, next question would be, if I back away from ROTR, does anyone have suggestions for a fun, lighter, Indian Jones type adventure path?

Mummy's Mask is all about digging into not!Egyptian tombs.

But really, RotR isn't difficult. I have yet to play a single AP that was (there is the occasional difficult encounter, but nothing consistently difficult, and if anything it goes in very much the opposite direction).

Also, you haven't had "fun and games" until you're mostly naked while standing very still under a vanish spell and hoping that Shayliss Vender's father will leave the basement very soon. It makes for a very tense several seconds.

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Arueshalae is the big one.

Nocticula is looking to shift alignment from evil to at least neutral, and was supposedly a fallen empyreal lord before that.

Gisher wrote:
You mean mice and dolphins? ;)

Orcas and crows (plus ravens and magpies) have demonstrated problem-solving intelligence, while elephants and dolphins are both self-aware. I remember an article I read a couple of months back about some ape/monkey/somethingorother possessing limited tools as well. Of course, the real rulers of the world are the cats, as any cat's "owner" (read: household staff) is aware.

To bring this back with an actual question or two, however.

James, when developing an AP, what's generally the final stage for making modifications and edits to the adventure on the development end versus editing end, and how long is that usually before it's sent to the printers and/or the notice of the AP installment names appears here on the website or at various cons? I'm curious about how long they exist "in-house" at Paizo offices before people are made aware.

And have there been times when you've needed to frantically drag something back from the printers at the last minute (or past the last minute) for whatever reason?

Tollak Vargsson wrote:
I've been asked to run a game for beginners. Never ever played a RPG before beginners and I want to give them the classic "D&D experience". I'm just not sure which part of Golarion is the most appropriate.


Maybe Rise of the Runelords.

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Amusement mode engaged.

Lamontius wrote:
please explain the caster/martial disparity

Casters rule, martials drool.

can someone elaborate on when a paladin should fall

When they stop being Optimus Prime and start being Megatron.

how do I do grappling

You don't because if the other guy has a functioning brain he has a ring of freedom of movement.

why does the rogue even exist

For people who think "scout ahead and look for traps designed to kill you" is a good idea.

how do armor spikes work

By hugging it out.

is charm person an evil act

It's an old Jedi mind trick, you peecha chakka no wookiee boonowa tweepi Solo. Ho ho ho.

why are most CN characters complete dumpsters

They want to be Ma-Ma.

Ma-Ma is not the law. I am the law.

explain sacred geometry interactions plz

Solvable mathematical equations.


should I rollplay or roleplay

how much can I optimize before I am considered a cheesing powergamer

Optimising is your left leg, roleplaying is your right leg. Playing RPGs is walking. Some people insist that you must use one leg or the other and hop along like an idiot. These people are weird, and should be avoided.

why do the forums smell like burning tires

Because you touch yourself at night.

Aelryinth wrote:
A Master's degree is just 'work experience' codified at a college, and worth the same at most.

Depends on whether you mean a Masters, or Master of Philosophy (MPhil), particularly in the Arts. An MPhil is kind of like a smaller DPhil (PhD).

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Law is who are you?

Chaos is what do you want?

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Deadmanwalking wrote:
(though I suppose a +8 and Masterwork Tools, which Grad Students generally have, does let you Take 10 and get a 20, so maybe go with that)

Access to a university network (and libraries or databases, e.g. JSTOR archive to pick one offhand) would almost certainly count as a +2.

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stormcrow27 wrote:
You know you could do this thing called adjust stats for your home game.

Part of the point of criticism and reviews is to encourage a well-made product. If the product is not well-made, why am I wasting money on it?

If there is a consistent problem with statblocks, then it should be examined in order to fix the problem at the source.

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Heck, the men even look like hairy brutes in comparison...

There is a disconnect on this, between the description and the artwork of the male Lashunta from Inner Sea Races. I could see the pictured one as a bit shorter than the women, perhaps (difficult without a direct comparison at the same aspect), and he's definitely muscled, but half the height? Twice as broad? Covered in hair? Yeah, no.

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MuertoXSky wrote:
MeanMutton wrote:
MuertoXSky wrote:
I have enjoyed all the repleis here, all i have to say ... I f****** love Scry and fry.
My classical understanding of "Scry and Fry" - use Scry, buff, then teleport to the target of your Scry - is no longer valid. Rules in Ultimate Intrigue make it clear that it doesn't work.

oohh :(.

could you attach a link to verify that?.
Still, it is a valid option, perhaps not in this case.

"Scrying can be enormously useful for a spy, if the circumstances all align well for the scryer, but it isn’t particularly useful on its own for a potential teleport. The 10-foot-radius visual requires the target to move in order to provide a clear idea of the layout of the destination, and the spell doesn’t directly indicate the location."

It depends on your GM's interpretation of the teleport spell:

"“Studied carefully” is a place you know well, either because you can currently physically see it or you've been there often. “Seen casually” is a place that you have seen more than once but with which you are not very familiar. “Viewed once” is a place that you have seen once, possibly using magic such as scrying."

It depends on the conflict between what Ultimate Intrigue's guideline* section says - that scrying isn't enough on its own - and what the wording of the teleport spell says, which is that it is enough for a Viewed Once teleport.

Until the teleport wording is officially errata'd, you should expect table variation.

* It is specifically advice: "The following section offers advice on certain spells particularly likely to see use in an intrigue-focused game, organized by level of play and spell school."

Ethereal Gears wrote:
Alleran, if you had read the OP you would have noticed I specifically restricted choices to acid, cold, electricity and fire.

I did read it, hence the amused remark on everybody always forgetting that sonic is a type.

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Kingmaker isn't that good for first-timers.

I'd suggest Giantslayer. Old-school hack and slash. You're adventurers, they're monsters, kill your way to the BBEG, then kill him too.

Fire immunity, sonic vulnerability (everybody forgets about the sonic damage type, including this entire topic). Not a lot of stuff uses sonic, while fire is by far the most common.

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1) Okay, I, by which I assume you mean my body, ceases to exist. Then my clone wakes up and I go about my day.

Assuming for some reason that "ceasing to exist" includes every single contingency I ever designed, including contingencies against "ceasing to exist" for this very purpose, I go with (2), below.

2) There'll be an abort button somewhere. I cast Discern Location to find it, Greater Teleport to teleport to it. I push it. I spend the next twenty-eight rounds summoning succubi to grapple in celebration of my victory.

Osakaben wrote:
No one wanted to be a cleric, but the party needs the healing, channel energy, and knowledge religion.

For healing use Wands of Cure Light Wounds and/or Infernal Healing. Graduate to a NPC Life oracle cohort at 7th level if absolutely necessary via Leadership, but it shouldn't be.

For the knowledge skill, just have the wizard throw a skill point in that direction every level up.

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M1k31 wrote:
In truth their druids are closer to a Wizard by another name, and they have all kinds of other casters that end up converting or multi-classing into the order, including Cogline, who starts as some kind of alchemist/druid multiclass.

For the record, 3rd edition had (in Dragon magazine) the Elder Druid prestige class, which attempted to model several of their abilities (Druid fire, the Sleep, and so on). It also included rules for a number of individuals and items within the world of Shannara, including what is flat-out the single most broken artifact ever: the Black Elfstone.

Which was basically SR 40, energy drain on target when used, stole any supernatural or spell-like abilities the target had, along with any magic item enchantments, and gave them to the user. Permanently. You had to make a DC 20-25 Will save or go insane, and that was it for downsides.

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Kurgess, after Inner Sea Faiths.

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MMCJawa wrote:
So individually intelligence is less important, if you have smarter members of your race you can get help or advice from, or take over other matters.

The problem with this argument is first that Andoletta is supposed to be one of the older and smarter ones. Second, the smartest (statted) Empyreal Lord around is Korada, and he's still only INT 25, on the same level as Kostchtchie.

It's really becoming a noticeable issue.

Irnk, Dead-Eye's Prodigal wrote:
Insane KillMaster wrote:

Asked there, but reasking here: will Her Infernal Majestrix Abrogail Thrune II get a stat block in this?

Also, can the PCs flirt with her?

I know she gets one in one of the issues, just keep in mind she is at least a 15th level character; so if she is in this one, flirting with her is definitely taking your life in your hands...

It's not as if PCs don't do that every day anyway.

N. Jolly wrote:
So given the standard point buy levels (10/15/20/25), at what point do you believe the CR of an encounter should be adjusted? How much of a class's power really is point buy driven? I personally don't think a 20/25 point buy is really even enough to increase CR, maybe a 30, but I wanted to get other people's opinions on the value of a point buy to them and in their games.

The two main factors are level and the class itself, meaning whether it is SAD (Single Attribute Dependent) or MAD (Multiple Attribute Dependent).

A class like Monk requires multiple ability scores to at least a reasonable level, if not high. Wisdom for ki pool and Monk AC, Constitution for health (d8 hurts), Strength for damage, and so on.

A class like Wizard requires Intelligence. The rest is gravy.

So using a 15 PB, a Wizard will be inherently advantaged over a Monk simply because they can afford to be more effective in what they're supposed to be doing, while a Monk is forced to spread their points around. As the PB increases (25-30+ being the decent level), the Monk can achieve a bit more in the way of parity, but they're always playing catch-up. This is partly why I both run higher-PB games (it gives MAD classes the chance to shine) and don't bother with a low-PB one (e.g. 10 PB), because all it does is encourage people to play the classes that don't need a higher PB to function.

The second factor is level. At first level, 5-10 PB can be the difference between life and death in what's not-so-affectionately known as the Rusty Dagger Shanktown. As the levels increase, however, it quickly stops mattering. Even the vaunted Azlanti human (with +2 to all ability scores) is not drastically overpowered compared to others in the party, if at all, once you reach about 8th level.

The easiest way to make the encounter particularly challenging is to use the most important thing in the game, which is action economy.

In other words, give her some friends. Or bound outsider minions, as the case may be.

Thirteenth level?

Bind a genie, get your +3 inherent bonus from that, then do the second option.