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Hey, Paizo types, can you give us any information on if/when Numeria will get a book? It's one of my favorite parts of the Inner Sea World Guide, and I'd love to hear more about this ship you guys crashed there. I figured Distant Worlds was a prelude to that--yes/no?
RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16
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My first thought was, "that's a silly question, James. Yes, we would like a Numeria book." But on second thought...
No.
I, for one, would like to experience Numeria, at any serious depth, first as an adventure, maybe a 32-page module, but preferably a product about the size of the Goblinworks Thornkeep book.
Numeria would lose a lot of its charm for me if it was first spoiled with a lot of technical detail, monster stats, rules for Cool Tech Stuff, and all, before I got to play through it and experience the wonder of it all.
James: Yes, I would like a Numeria book. I find the Technic League fascinating, and I love the idea of a steady trickle of technology so advanced it's essentialy magic.
Chris: I have two concerns with your suggestion. One, why can't I have the book and you just don't read it until you're ready? Two, isn't it going to be a lot easier to write things about Numeria once it's been established what's actually going on there? It seems like you're trying to put the cart before the horse, and then argue against horses conceptually.
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I think I would prefer an Adventure Path in Numeria to a book. This would provide insight through gaming, plus you guys always provide ancillary support in the other product lines for each AP. This in my mind is the best way to introduce the details of Numeria.
Just like the Shackles pirates- it would have been fun to get a 32 page book about them, but much better to play through an AP AND get the 32 page book :)
An AP in Numeria would be awesome.
I like Chris Mortika's suggestion.
I second the nomination.
I really do want Numeria support, but allow it to be unwrapped gradually, like a mystery.
I don't know how wise it'd be to do a numerian AP. It's quite polarizing. But I'm not the one who makes such decisions, and if I had the ability to choose without care for other customers, I'd as for it in a heartbeat.
That said, I'd love a 32 page book on it. And not just about the silver mount, although that's obviously a big aspect of it.
Things I'd love to see:
Wouldn't mind Chris' suggestion though. I still think the dynamic between the barbarians and the league would make for a lovely story.
The problem with not having a source on Numeria (in whatever form) is that most GM's and players won't touch it without one. PF is a very crunchy game and many gamers feel uncomfortable trying to handwave Numeria's pseuo-tech without some level of official support or guidance. So the whole country becomes a half question mark on the map where people talk about it but no one ever goes or comes from there.
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The problem with not having a source on Numeria (in whatever form) is that most GM's and players won't touch it without one. PF is a very crunchy game and many gamers feel uncomfortable trying to handwave Numeria's pseuo-tech without some level of official support or guidance. So the whole country becomes a half question mark on the map where people talk about it but no one ever goes or comes from there.
These are fair points, Sir Jolt. A 32 page module doesn't allow for a lot of mechanics.
I think you could dip your toes in it with a 32 page book dedicated to nothing but Numeria (and not an adventure), but then you hurt your ability to sell a future 64 page book that delves into the subject thoroughly. And I think 64 pages is warranted.
So let me amend what I said, I think Chris Mortkia's point has a lot of merit, but it may not be practical. I think the Numeria book should be 64 pages like the Land of Linnorm Kings book is...
And if you go to that much trouble, it should accompany an AP. Either that or a hypothetical 64 page mega-adventure, a concept that has been kicked around but not has been realized at this time.
I made a suggestion in a thread a while back dealing with this subject. Paizo could release a book dealing with the land of Numeria that has information on their society and all those who inhabit its land. Maybe have stats and examples of what classes are present, what creatures are native, and their religious ways. Keep little bits of secrets there just mentioning the Technic League is unknown even to the 'nobles' of the Black Sovereigns court and that the League remains silent on the matters of rogue Automatons roaming the badlands.
I also would suggest a book dedicated entirely to the Technic League and their inner workings. This would appeal to those DM's who don't like the idea of Numeria's Technic League holding technology. This book would have possibly a Technic League society/organization advancement offering benefits for doing certain things such as collecting stolen tech, collecting star metals from Thassilonian ruins or even long forgotten lore. This would be like those small books dedicated to the wrokings of the Pathfinder Society
Another book for this 'series' could even be a book detailing what Numeria has technology and magic wise, maybe include a feat chain dealing with the relics or new traits to represent those 'touched' by what dwells within Silver Mount. Possibly include customization for automatons as well as expanded rules on how to build them with the proper materials in Numeria and outside it.
Over all make the secrets of the League secret as well as the technology, make Silvermount seem vivid yet alien, give Numeria what it needs! Tender love and care and time, the Inner Sea Bestiary will give us two Numerian native automatons and who knows what else is on the line. I for one would love a book on Numeria but I want it done right much like JJ has said before. Numeria is a region that pays homage to the first campaign setting known as Blackmoor and those modules and adventures that dealt with science fiction bleeding into fantasy.
The problem with not having a source on Numeria (in whatever form) is that most GM's and players won't touch it without one. PF is a very crunchy game and many gamers feel uncomfortable trying to handwave Numeria's pseuo-tech without some level of official support or guidance. So the whole country becomes a half question mark on the map where people talk about it but no one ever goes or comes from there.These are fair points, Sir Jolt. A 32 page module doesn't allow for a lot of mechanics.
I think you could dip your toes in it with a 32 page book dedicated to nothing but Numeria (and not an adventure), but then you hurt your ability to sell a future 64 page book that delves into the subject thoroughly. And I think 64 pages is warranted.
So let me amend what I said, I think Chris Mortkia's point has a lot of merit, but it may not be practical. I think the Numeria book should be 64 pages like the Land of Linnorm Kings book is...
And if you go to that much trouble, it should accompany an AP. Either that or a hypothetical 64 page mega-adventure, a concept that has been kicked around but not has been realized at this time.
They indicated the possible experimentation with the module line this year. Hopefully, that will include some larger 'supermodules' and something like this would be perfect, in my opinion (Something like 48 page of adventure/background material with 16 pages of mechanics).
Yes...oh god Yes
I would totally go for an AP set there and a CS book on the region. Honestly I think it's an odd enough place that a GM really will need a 64 page setting book to flesh out a campaign there. That would allow room in the AP's for more detailed gazeteers on cities, Dark Tapestry related stuff, Technic League, etc.
Yes. Want. Numeria. Book.
Please.
I totally agree running anything in Numeria w/o book would be difficult.
I don't get the unraveled mystery/Module idea at all - I think, as Jim Groves said a 64 pager is warranted. And that's the LEAST page count IMHO.
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How about an AP and a sourcebook coming out around the same time as each other, sort of like Dark Markets coming out alongside Legacy of Fire?
Ap and book? Yeah, works for me. C'mon, you know you want to do a Barrier Peaks thing. Admit it.
I would love an AP in conjunction with a Setting book. The campaign doesn't have to start in Numeria, but could at least detour there for one or two chapters - though I'd prefer once the AP went to Numeria, it stayed in Numeria.
Yes please. Numeria AP with accompanying book from the Campaign Setting line and a player companion book about Kellids or whatever type of people live up there.
Pretty much exactly what you're doing for the Rein of Winter AP, only for Numeria.
Numeria does sound like one of the more interesting places. That AP would be very interesting...robots, plentiful rare metals, new kinds of poison and sickness, TONS of new things to kill, maybe even a space ship?
Would folks LIKE a Numeria book?
I'm seeing a lot of love here. Whaddaya say?
Creative Director
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I don't know how wise it'd be to do a numerian AP. It's quite polarizing. But I'm not the one who makes such decisions, and if I had the ability to choose without care for other customers, I'd as for it in a heartbeat.
True... but it's looking more and more like it'd be polarizing in a way similar to how Shattered Star is polarizing—with a LOT more people on the "I want it" side than not. Which is veerrrrry interesting.
In the interests of joining all the little iron filings at the Want, WANT, end of the pole.
Numeria AP!
& Campaign Setting!
& Player's Guide!
and a Pony
Please?
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If there's an AP, can I vote for Logue writing whichever book will first detail the party's dealings with the Technic League or Silver Mount?
Nic and depraved societies go together like peanut butter and jelly.
As usual, I'd like something on Numeria.
Numeria is one of the most fascinating aspects of Golarion, I would gladly purchase an entire AP subscription if I knew a Numerian AP was in the works.
Furthermore, TAKE MY MONEY.
Like many others, I find Numeria to be one of the most fascinating aspects of the Inner Sea. Count me in for all of the content you can muster for that region. :-)
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Addicted sorcerers deriving their powers (and their physical mutations, and their pervasive mental issues?) from the toxic run-off of a fallen spacecraft's damaged reactor?
Mutated animals, plants, vermin and even-more-mutated-already-monstrous-beasts, struggling to survive in a blasted landscape being slowly encroached upon by an utterly alien ecology?
Ruthless barbarian warlords hoarding scraps of dangerous, toxic and sometimes even radioactive skymetal to arm and equip their increasingly inhuman berserkers, giving them an advantage over the equally afflicted footsoldiers of their rivals?
An order of mysterious robed figures who may or may not have control over strange clanking metallic constructs (who may or may not have usurped control of the robed figures, instead, through strange metal spider-like contraptions attached to their skulls, spines and shoulders, concealed under their hoods...)?
Oh hell yes.
Bring it. Bring it *all!*
I'm in for anything Numeria, personally. But I really, really want something Numeria related.
I would buy a Numeria book and a Numeria AP in a red hot second.
And I would hope at least one of the volumes would be entirely set withing a crashed starship. Two would be even better, but one is compulsory.
Now if you could FIX the starship and fly it around the solar system, that would be even better.
Gary McBride
Fire Mountain Games
That does sound suitably...mythic.
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Now if you could FIX the starship and fly it around the solar system, that would be even better.
Yes, the lone survivor of the adventuring party, and the severed head of a rogue gearman, off to find the home world of the ship's creators and ask them why they sent a ship to destroy Golarion!
Or not. The first and second movies were better. :)
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I am not in favor of a Numerian Setting AP. I am personally not a fan of a large amount of Sci-Fi Tech in my fantasy. Perhaps in a module, much like This One Here, I might enjoy.
One of my concerns would be that should a Numerian AP be made it would affect the Player Companion line, as well as the Campaign Setting line, and perhaps the Game Mastery Map line. For me, I know that these books would be enjoyable to read, but ultimately I would not have much use for them as they would go straight to my game shelf.
One thing that is great about Paizo is that they do listen to their fans. Even though I may be on the short end of this discussion, I know that down the road there will be something for me which peaks my interest as a Numerian AP interests those in this thread.
Game On my Friends!!
I am not sure I need to say it again, but yes, please!
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I have to agree with the many that have posted. Numeria is one of those regions that almost everyone wants to do something with it, but without more to go on, they don't want to delve into it just to have what they came up with negated by an official release. Please release a book/module/adventure path about Numeria and soon. :)
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I have to agree with the many that have posted. Numeria is one of those regions that almost everyone wants to do something with it, but without more to go on, they don't want to delve into it just to have what they came up with negated by an official release. Please release a book/module/adventure path about Numeria and soon. :)
I think this touches on one of the tricky elements of going further into Numeria(and honestly other well-known-but-little-used corners of Golarion): Expectations of Numeria and its aesthetics are probably wildly different between readers at this point.
Some of those expectations may get calibrated with Inner Sea Bestiary of course. I know how I imagine the people of Numeria and the alien wreckage, but that likely isn't too close to what will be established as canon. And other gamers, particularly older ones that grew up with Barrier Peaks, probably have very different visuals coming to mind.
I'm really curious about how it all looks and feels officially.
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When have I ever NOT fallen on the side of MOAR ROBOTZ, James?
Put me on the "want everything on Numeria all the time" list, and put me wearing my Chris Mortika, Russ Taylor, and Jim Groves masks apologizing for wanting a "thin 32-pager, which is pretty much just paphlet, guys, I mean come on, you get more information about Invisalign at the dentist's while you're waiting in the lobby, I could probably write that for you myself, let's not half-ass it here, let people have their laser guns and spaceship dungeons in full detail, 32 pages isn't a cautious bet, it's a damnable cock-tease," on the list as well.
EDIT: Seriously, cock isn't covered by the censor-bot? Weird.
Well, now I'm the evil swearing jag-off.
Well, now I'm the evil swearing jag-off.
::cough::
Jim Groves changed his mind. As in like two posts later. 'Cause, like I can do that. Without shame!!
Special Abilities
Listen to Reasoned Argument (Ex) As an immediate action Jim Groves may alter his opinion when confronted by a reasoned position presented with mutual respect and civility.
Seriously, I see what you mean. 64 pages would be better. Before you say more than 64 pages, I'm just pointing to a number that seems practical.
Let me also come to the defense of what Chris Mortika was saying. Which I don't think was crazy talk. Or, rather let me defend what *I* took away from his post. In the olden days of TSR, we didn't always get all the goodies right away. Greyhawk wasn't plopped in your lap all in one shot. We didn't get a detailed explanation of the drow the first time we saw them in print. There was a lot of mystery and time to ponder.. and it made the discovery pretty satisfying. Of course, one could argue we didn't have a lot of choice in the matter.
Lest you say I flipflop, young N'Wah—I don't think that's the way to go in this generation, with this campaign setting, or with this fan base.
So I changed my mind.
Edit: @Ashton
Internal Ensign: Cap'n, Aston Sperry just posted about you on the Paizo Boards. The word "cock" was used!
Me: Go to yellow alert!
Internal Science Officer: Captain, I feel it necessary to point out that the message board post, however coarse, could have been intended to be complimentary. In some primitive cultures the word co-
Me: Dammit I said yellow alert! Engineering, arm photon torpedoes!
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I'm going to throw my hat into the ring on this one as well. I would love to see Numeria detailed. I'll take anything. Player Companion, Campaign Setting, an AP, or all of the above. I'm not picky.
While you're at it, if you do end up doing a full AP associated with Numeria, maybe you could throw some solar system goodies in as well? Maybe some stuff on Aballon? Maybe tie it all together with a plot that involves the First Ones, or at least their legacy?
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Yeh, I'm just being a sassy-pants fellow, Jim. I own masks of you guys out of mutual respect, of course, and not to frame you for an upcoming Heat-style bank robbery. :D
Block Knight, I too love Aballon. If I may entice you to whet your space-whistle with a perusal of my fan-made Akiton content?
Heh. Akitontent.