For one trait you get Improved Precise Shot.
How could I not get it as an archer? I don't understand.
I get to ignore the most soft cover, could someone explain how this is not broken?
No. You still take penalties for shooting someone hiding in a fog cloud or behind two or more people. I would actually say that its a bad trait for dedicated archers, because you're still going to want improved precise shot and once you get it... well its pretty much a wasted trait.
A trait what works for 11 levels is wasted? And we're not even talking about 3/4 BAB.
I can't find a way to avoid the -4 except having smart team mates and not being in the middle
For a dedicated longbow user it's by far the best trait in the game and therefore I'd consider it over powered.
For one trait you get Improved Precise Shot.Yeah it's definitely fine. If there's anything to complain about, it's that it's a longbow specific trait when longbows are already the best ranged weapon in the game.
It's a trait specifically for Worshipers of Erastil IIRC, so making it Longbow Specific makes a whole heap of sense.
And frankly not mentioning longbows in the benefit section wouldn't have cost them anything anyways,
Except it would cost them the flavour of the trait, that its specifically for using Old Deadeye's favored weapon.
In terms of combat styles, if you aren't playing a class who can cheese out IPBS early (ie: Zen Archer, the greatest offender), you're really not that far ahead on the curve truthfully.
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It's kind of ahead of the curve for traits; other traits that give circumstantial bonuses to hit tend to be +1 on for example AoOs, while this one negates a very common +4 bonus to enemy AC.
That said, it does have its limits. Two creatures providing cover (say, your ally, the NPC mook, both in front of the NPC wizard). And walls, doesn't help against those.
So it's not quite equal to a BAB+11 feat either. It's sort of at the power level of a feat with no prerequisites (other than religion).
I think the current most-elegant implementation is inquisitors with friendly fire tactics. That's a decent compromise between a feat to not be bothered by ally-caused cover, but not entirely remove the concept of cover from the game.
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It's good. But it's not overpowered.
It does make what is already the best martial combat style even better, but it's still no spell casting.
I think it's pretty much a good example of how you make an archery-related trait attractive but also not a problem. Specifically because it doesn't make the archer any better on the high end (i.e. once you have IPS). You want to throw some trait support to archery, since it's a popular combat style and you want to print stuff people will actually want to use, but you also don't want to pile bonus after bonus so it's even more better than everything else.
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I guess so. I'm mostly asking because I'm divided between Warpriest and Inquisitor and in all honestly the trait makes a huge difference when you're getting IPS at level 16
Warpriest can take it at 11, they're level counts as BAB for feats.
As far as the trait, meh, soft cover is rarely a problem that a 5' step can't fix. There is also a feat Low Profile that provides +1 AC vs Ranged attacks and you don't provide cover to enemies. Deadeye is half of that so...
Sanctified Slayer Inquisitor can get IPS at level 9; warpriest at 12.
How do you get it at level 9? Extra Slayer Talent doesn't work because you don't have Slayer Talents, you have Talented Slayer, so you don't meet prerequisites.
Personal preference, I guess, but I prefer traits to be less situational, and to not be obsoleted by such an essential feat.
On the other hand, I would rarely play an archer anyway, and like religion traits.
I don't like the trait because of the religion aspect, but getting a benefit of a level 11 feat for just 1 trait is awesome.
The next best choice is a TW feat at level 3 that only works with Solo Tactics, and most of the time it's just 1 guy standing in the middle of your LOS, so the trait is basically a full feat that gives +4 to attack.If you consider that only 3 classes can get IPS shot at level 6, fighters at level 11 and most 3/4 at 15 it's a great investment for something that comes from free.
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Personal preference, I guess, but I prefer traits to be less situational, and to not be obsoleted by such an essential feat.
Take the feat additional traits to pick up deadeye bowman and another trait. Then you can retrain the feat to either pick up IPS or to pick another trait when you qualify for IPS. That way you don't have to worry about the trait becoming obsolete.
Personal preference, I guess, but I prefer traits to be less situational, and to not be obsoleted by such an essential feat.Take the feat additional traits to pick up deadeye bowman and another trait. Then you can retrain the feat to either pick up IPS or to pick another trait when you qualify for IPS. That way you don't have to worry about the trait becoming obsolete.
Well gosh darn... that's a pretty good idea.
Well I think it also depends on the size of the encounters the more players and monsters that are on means more chance for soft cover.
its a lot more than half .... the feat is min level 15 or 11 to most characters.
or 6th...
That's probably a good thing. It's hard for a cleric to be a half-decent archer, even if their deity's favored weapon is a bow.
For 3/4 BAB archers, this trait is essentially a must-pick. I have two characters with it and I can say with certainty that it doesn't address some of the typical use cases for IPS. One of the characters I have it on is built on mobility, typically running around with 90' movement speed, so it's not as good in open layouts to have the trait, but it comes up enough for the character that it's still a must-have.
Personally, I would still think that it would be good if it was a feat instead of a trait, but it would be a harder choice then. As a trait, it's too easy to pick up and not worry about the consequences.
Sanctified Slayer Inquisitor can get IPS at level 9; warpriest at 12.How do you get it at level 9? Extra Slayer Talent doesn't work because you don't have Slayer Talents, you have Talented Slayer, so you don't meet prerequisites.His level was off. The Sanctified Slayer can take it at lvl 8.
The Talented Slayer feature allows you to take a Slayer Talent at level 8 of Sanctified Slayer. You opt for the Ranger Combat Style Talent, allowing a pick of one of the 1st or 6th level bonus style feats, ignoring the pre-requisites.
No, the lv6 options only become available the second time you take the talent.
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I've made 2 Zen Archers, and have leveled both from 1-6+. The First took Deadeye Bowman because I didn't want to fight with cover for 5 levels. The Second I would use surprise rounds to reposition myself when I couldn't full attack anyway, and would occasionally have to delay a couple points of initiative to let brainless party members 5' step to clear my firing lane. But I really didn't have to take many more shots with cover than the first character did.
With basic tactics and intelligent play this trait really doesn't offer much unless you're trying to target the baddie in the back and other baddies are in the way. Playing with people who can't do anything but double move adjacent so the baddie gets a free full round attack on them, this is a must have. But even as a must Have I don't feel it's exceptionally over powered to simply treat one creature as if it weren't there.
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I've never heard that interpretation of the trait, Firebug.
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It's actually a terrible trait.
Why? Because it locks you into longbow. IE, it does not apply to Composite Longbow.
Composite Longbow is a completely different weapon. It has its own entry in the weapons table, Different range increment, allows you to add some strength to damage, can have the adaptable enchant.
Only for the purposes of "weapon proficiency and similar feats" is it considered a longbow. Deadeye Bowman is not a feat.
But if you are Str 10 and don't plan on getting an enhancement bonus to Str... Sure it's still less then half IPS.
I am not sure that is anywhere near rules as intended as the pfs pregen hunter uses this trait with a composite longbow.
I am not sure that is anywhere near rules as intended as the pfs pregen hunter uses this trait with a composite longbow.
The pregen's aren't really what you should look to for rules clarifications. If I recall correctly, Hayato has greater weapon focus before he can legally get it.
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I am not sure that is anywhere near rules as intended as the pfs pregen hunter uses this trait with a composite longbow.The pregen's aren't really what you should look to for rules clarifications. If I recall correctly, Hayato has greater weapon focus before he can legally get it.
Maybe not, but looking at the stuff that's plain as day in the CRB/PRD is a good place to start.
LONGBOW
Price 75 gp
Type martial
At almost 5 feet in height, a longbow is made up of one solid piece of carefully curved wood. You need two hands to use a bow, regardless of its size. A longbow can't be used while mounted. If you have a penalty for low Strength, apply it to damage rolls when you use a longbow. You can apply your Strength modifier to damage rolls when you use a composite longbow, but not a regular longbow. A longbow fires arrows.
Clearly a Composite Longbow is a Type of Longbow. This is one of those overlapping circles you learned about as a child... Not all Longbows are Composite Longbows, but all Composite Longbows are Longbows.
I think I'm just gonna go Inquisitor with Friendly Fire Maneuvers and avoid Soft Cover from allies.
I'm also thinking on going Sanctified Slayer because I get permanent Studied Target, unlike Judgment that works only 1 time a day.
Plus at level 9 I can take Extra Slayer Talent and grab IPS.
This is like saying that Sanctified Slayer can't take Extra Slayer Talent because the name of the Class Feature is called Talented Slayer