Vendor - Fantasiapelit Tampere
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I kinda dig what the Klingon's look like now. I have never been married to that one idea of what Klingon's should look like (and the Worf-style Klingons tended to look kinda dumb from time to time imho) and I really like their artistic design, ship design and armors. It is exceedingly aggressive, which fit's their culture.
Sarek all but disowned his biological son for joining the violent babby-killers (Starfleet) instead of joining the Vulcan Science Academy. But he has a secret adopted human daughter that he is ok with joining?
Well, I think the keywords "biological" and "adopted" kinda answered that question.
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Also, Burnham isn’t even adopted, she’s his ward, which is quite different.
The first two episodes are a single pilot, and it's weird they split them in half and hid the second half behind a paywall in the US. Here in the UK we just got both episodes on Netflix, which is a much cleverer idea.
Overall, I like the casting, but some of the character choices are iffy and the new Klingon make-up is simply too stiff and unemotional, inhibiting the actors' performances. The lack of beams is also weird (beams are cool). Some of the dialogue was also really stiff. The early-episode banter between the bridge crew was quite good but then it got all serious and stolid. Burnham arguing the computer into allowing her to escape the brig was amusing though, like something from TOS but more believable (the Federation AIs having ethical programmes makes sense).
The weirdest thing is that this pilot is really unrepresentative of the series as a whole. The Discovery itself and her captain are nowhere to be seen, and we have no idea what the show is going to look like episode-to-episode.
Overall, among ST pilots better than Encounter at Farpoint, The Cage, Broken Bow and Caretaker, not as good as Emissary.
Didn't like the XO going from dissenting to publicly insubordinate to actually committing mutiny in the space of a few minutes, knowing that this character will be the Captain going forward.
She's not the Captain.
In other countries, how is it being streamed?
Outside of the USA and Canada, it's available on Netflix.
So, the first redesign then.
Which was controversial when he first appeared.
Not so much. When they brought in the Klingons in the original series they wanted them to act and look more alien, but they had absolutely no money, so just went with them looking human. Roddenberry was never happy with it and when they were developing Phase II he ordered a revamp of how the Klingons looked, which resulted in the MP Klingons, who led to Worf.
Yes, a few fans grumbled but they went with it because Roddenberry was in charge of it and everyone understand that TOS had no money to realise its vision, whilst later on they clearly did (also why the Enterprise looked much more impressive, although that at least had an explanation off the bat). Also, I believe fans kept asking Roddenberry about an in-show explanation for the change and he said there would be one, which we eventually, 25 years later, got.
The Discovery Klingons are a much bigger shift away from that. There was a suggestion this was a remote, mutated sect, but when the heads of all 24 Klingon houses showed up and they looked exactly the same, that kind of went out the window. Clearly all the Klingons are supposed to look like this now and there is no way they can square that with either the augment Klingons (who look human) or the "standard" Klingons.
It'll be on iTunes eventually. I'll watch it then.
Found it to be quite ok. It had a good mix of action, social interaction and philosophy. If you listen and look closely, it tries to combine the old and the new, for example when it comes to ship sounds. The characters might have been not totally convincing, but hey, Babylon 5's start was much worse with its stiff actors - and the show turned out to be amazing.
The klingon redesign was unnecessary, but it's only one very obvious detail. I will give it a chance...
So after the first double part episode I have mixed feelings.
They also seemingly killed off the Klingon "Messiah" just after introducing him, which doesn't make sense to me.
Not being able to binge a streaming series is also a weird choice.
And having the main character being court martialed isn't a great way to build sympathy for her. She basically refused to accept that anyone but her could be right, it seems weird for a career officer to act like she does.
She's not the Captain.
Okay, that does somewhat mitigate that particular objection.
** spoiler omitted **
[Terry Jones in drag]
'es not the Messiah, he's a very naughty boy.[/TJid]
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I’m confused on the Klingon politics here.
I’m also wondering why Sci-Fi Writers Have No Sense Of Scale is getting worse. In Star Wars VII, the First Order destroys the solar system where the Republic government is based and Han Solo and everyone else on another planet in another solar system in another part of the galaxy watches it as it happens in the daytime sky. In Star Trek 2009, Spock is forced to use his Kryptonian Superman eyes to watch Vulcan get consumed by a black hole, again while standing on another planet elsewhere in the galaxy. And in the Discovery pilot, Sarek is talking about how scientists are taking notice of a new star. Yeah, the
None of these things should have been visible to anyone’s naked eye for thousands of years, if that.
More Fanplanation: That's why it's an artifact. It's full spectrum including subspace. Normal light wouldn't mess with the ships systems like that. They couldn't even get it off the monitors easily.
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More Fanplanation: That's why it's an artifact. It's full spectrum including subspace. Normal light wouldn't mess with the ships systems like that. They couldn't even get it off the monitors easily.
Yeah, that was a weird bit, but I'm used to sci-fi movies treating the speed of light as 'instantaneous,' and people being able to see 'splosions a light-year away instantly.
I may have missed in the not-entirely-paying-attention part of 21st century entertainment, but didn't they say multiple times while pooh-poohing Burnham's 'strike first, strike hard' notion that the Federation hadn't heard from the Klingon's for 'a hundred years' while, in the same episode, having flashbacks to the Klingon's blowing up Burnham's Federation colony?
Is Burnham supposed to be 100 years old? 'Cause if so, I've got to get me some of that Federation 'growing up on Vulcan' healthcare.
And I'm totally not kidding about the not-entirely-paying-attention thing. I'm usually watching TV while doing something else these days, and I'm pretty much half-arsing it, at best, as a viewer, so it's entirely possible that I just misunderstood it entirely...
I think the "Worf design" was first introduced in 1979, in "Star Trek: The Motion Picture".
The 'creature design' was, but we had Klingon K7/K'tinga class cruisers in TOS. There were ship classes resembling them and the Bird of Prey of the early movies in Enterprise, as well as an explanation for the human looking Klingons we saw in TOS.
EDIT @Set: They had not communicated with the Klingons for 100 years (an odd callback to the 100 years silence regarding the Romulans in TOS, I believe). The Klingons might see that differently, though. ;)
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I think the "Worf design" was first introduced in 1979, in "Star Trek: The Motion Picture".The 'creature design' was, but we had Klingon K7/K'tinga class cruisers in TOS. There were ship classes resembling them and the Bird of Prey of the early movies in Enterprise, as well as an explanation for the human looking Klingons we saw in TOS.
EDIT @Set: They had not communicated with the Klingons for 100 years (an odd callback to the 100 years silence regarding the Romulans in TOS, I believe). The Klingons might see that differently, though. ;)
Yeah, right now, I gotta say that my current head-canon is going to be that these guys are a religious splinter group, similar to the Klingons who ended up in the Delta Quadrant in Voyager following a prophecy that ended up being about B’Elanna’s baby. Their “24 noble houses being reunited” are not the actual unified Klingon Empire, but a bunch of genetic offshoots acting on what they believe to be behalf of the Klingon Empire. Their actions bring war to themselves and the Klingon Empire which the Empire didn’t ask for but ultimately doesn’t object to because, hey, any excuse for battle.
Otherwise, it just comes across as an entirely new species and culture that got the “Klingon” label slapped on whether it fits or not. Unless that dissonance is something that the second part of the two-part pilot (you know, the part kept exclusive to All Access) explained.
...
I think I need to watch Axanar, again.
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I’m confused on the Klingon politics here.
** spoiler omitted **
I’m also wondering why Sci-Fi Writers Have No Sense Of Scale is getting worse. In Star Wars VII, the First Order destroys the solar system where the Republic government is based and Han Solo and everyone else on another planet in another solar system in another part of the galaxy watches it as it happens in the daytime sky.
In Star Trek 2009, Spock is forced to use his Kryptonian Superman eyes to watch Vulcan get consumed by a black hole, again while standing on another planet elsewhere in the galaxy.
Both of these were part of the shooting script and talked about in the books but didn't make it to the final cuts of the films.
In Star Wars VII, the beam is traveling through hyper-space. The energy is so powerful its energy is bleeding through into normal space.
In Star Trek, there is some sort of wormhole like phenomenon above the ice planet that lets people observe Vulcan. I know it sounds cheesy, but it does make sense. (I wonder if the Andorans of the Archer era knew about it?)
Sarek is talking about how scientists are taking notice of a new star. Yeah, the ** spoiler omitted **was bright, but bright enough to push those photons FTL and into warp?
It's supposed to
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Sarek is talking about how scientists are taking notice of a new star. Yeah, the ** spoiler omitted **was bright, but bright enough to push those photons FTL and into warp?It's supposed to ** spoiler omitted ** It wouldn't be much good if it didn't ** spoiler omitted **
Not the point. Tell me about the massive subspace signal overwhelming all communications relays in and out of Federation space, and I don’t have a problem. The Klingons get their beacon and photons are still light-speed. Tell me about the high intensity tetryon radiation emanating from the beacon and somehow manifesting as spontaneously occurring photons entering normal space even lightyears away, and we’re good to go. At least we still have a nod to the laws of physics.
My issue isn’t the what, it’s the how.
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Well, just saw it yesterday on Netflix and I really liked it. Apart from the Klingons' Klingon, I must say, because they all sounded as if they didn't know their own language. maybe I'm remembering it wrong, but to me it used to sound much more natural when spoken in the older series.
Also thought it was a great way to introduce us to a new character. Now we already know her when the actual series begins and don't need to find out over the course of a whole season (or probably even more) what she's all about but instead can concentrate on her development from this point onward.
I saw the first episode...meh.
I can get around the different-looking Klingons, though I really see no reason not to use Movie/NextGen Klingons.
The higher-tech bridge also fair for an update. Though I wish it weren't higher tech than the NextGen bridge.
A little harder to get around the already established TOS canon that women were not *allowed* to be Starfleet captains at that point
Stupid? Yes. Sexist? Yes. But it was explicitly established. The difficulty in any prequel is in trying to keep true to the source. I can live with this one only because our society would make this a really unpalatable piece of history...but it strikes me as revisionist.
I can't forgive the robot on the bridge. It doesn't follow within the established continuity at *all*, and seems to be there for just cool factor.
...and that last part is likely the issue that drove me away from enjoying the episode. There were too many things added for cool/atmosphere that weren't sensible/justified.
Coffins on the outside of the vessel were an interesting cultural item that didn't detract from the plot...but open flames inside a starship? I don't buy it from even from Klingons. The captain's 'I made a Starfleet badge in the sand' that could be detected from orbit when the people could not was another example of 'added for cool factor, but ultimately nonsensical'.
Oh no women captains and robots!?
I broke down and watched it.
It was a decent sci-fi show, but don't know that it really did Star Trek well.
So the previews fir the rest of the season show Jason Isaacs taking her in after she's been given a life sentence in jail. Hopefully it's not to run experiments on near death experiences...
I watched it and liked it. But not enough to subscribe to a new service to continue watching it.
Oh no women captains and robots!?
A fine thing in SF, just not in pre-TOS Star Trek (ignoring continuity takes me out of the moment, and reduces my enjoyment).
Oh no women captains and robots!?A fine thing in SF, just not in pre-TOS Star Trek (ignoring continuity takes me out of the moment, and reduces my enjoyment).
I don’t know that we really should be considering the “no women captains” to be firmly established canon for this point in the franchise’s history. Yes, that was a plot point for one episode, but it was only a thing in that one episode, and IIRC, “Turnabout Intruder” was the last episode to air before TOS got cancelled. Personally, I’d consider the Enterprise functioning under the auspices of the UESPA to be more canonical than that. And Enterprise did establish Captain Erica Hernandez as the captain of one of the NXs in its last season.
Also, the robot. I took that character to be an alien in a robot-looking life-support suit, not a robot at all (though I only remember seeing him for a moment so maybe he was?).
I was, however, wondering about how those tracks on the sandy dunes even held up, considering it probably took them a fair amount of time and there was an approaching storm...
Also, the robot. I took that character to be an alien in a robot-looking life-support suit, not a robot at all (though I only remember seeing him for a moment so maybe he was?).
I was, however, wondering about how those tracks on the sandy dunes even held up, considering it probably took them a fair amount of time and there was an approaching storm...
Pretty sure he's a robot. His face was pulsing the Red Alert indicator, and a still of the head showed a lighted label on the side with the name of the ship. (Could be he's just really enthusiastic :) )
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No women being a captain was less canon and more a sign of the times when the original series was first produced. No amount of pleading or begging on the part of Roddenberry was going to change that. Otherwise if he was given the permission we would have seen more woman captains. He had already received a decent amount of flak for having Captain Pike second in command a female character by the network execs of the time.
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Also, the statement about female captains not being allowed did come from a seriously insane woman.
I am sure that Starfleet tried its best to avoid having seriously insane captains of either gender.
Also, the statement about female captains not being allowed did come from a seriously insane woman.
I am sure that Starfleet tried its best to avoid having seriously insane captains of either gender.
In fairness, it did work spectacularly well when they gave a captaincy to Mackenzie Calhoun. Of course, they also surrounded him with a crew of Bunny-Ears Lawyers...
I prefer to pretend that "Turnabout Intruder" does not exist. It's my least favorite episode of any Star Trek series.
I'd rather watch Star Trek V.
On a side note, I'm enjoying watching the other Star Trek series on Fox. It gets a bit silly at times and is lower budget, but it's not behind a paywall.
I'm viewing it as a soft reboot. In this version, Klingons have a different political structure and different faces. Relations between the Federation and the Klingons aren't quite the same. The Federation has different technology, is less sexist, etc.
I don't expect consistency with TOS or the movies. I think its better this way. It saves us from prequel syndrome, where nothing major can change because that wouldn't match the known timeline.
Hes right you know^^
Maybe that was all part of standard procedure in that era of the Federation. "The captain has fallen for a green-skinned alien woman. I know they want us to investigate Romulan activity in the Neutral Zone, but that can probably wait. Relationships come first."
Well with Kirk I think that is fair to say. Even casual relationships.
Or its just an element that dates TOS, much like how some elements of TNG date that show. While I feel annoyed at the Klingon redesign (the version we saw in TNG and later were fine, and arguably allowed actors playing Klingon to emote better than the new design), I don't have a problem with most of the other updates.
Random note...I am enjoying how the spellchecker here catches "klingon" if I don't capitalize it :)
Oh no women captains and robots!?A fine thing in SF, just not in pre-TOS Star Trek (ignoring continuity takes me out of the moment, and reduces my enjoyment).When was it established that women couldn't be captains in TOS?
Edit: Ok, it was from "Turnabout Intruder". As someone wrote above, I don't think that it was gender (although Lester seemed to think that it was) but rather temprament that disqualified her from captaincy.
I've defended that statement in the past.
1) There were only 13 starships in the fleet. Fewer at that point with the losses of several during the series.
2) One of Kirk's classmates, Merak, hesitated a fraction of a second on one test. And it barred him from ever commanding a starship. (Bread and Circuses).
3) When two officers aboard Enterprise married, one of them was going to have to leave the service - the woman. (Balance of Terror). This is echoed in other episodes, so it can't just be ignored.
4) Unlike Picard's era, where ships are only away from a Federation port for short trips, Kirk's ship was expected to be out for as much as five years without resupply. This function was never utilized, but they carried supplies for that length of time. Also in Kirk's era, ships did not have facilities (or space) for families.So there are very few positions. Qualification for those 13 posts are incredibly selective. Starfleet also has to make decisions about those postings with an assurance their Starship Captains wouldn't suddenly need to turn the ship around, run weeks out of their way, to reach a starbase where a replacement captain can come aboard. A female officer might find that need (marriage or pregnancy).
Yes that is a sexist attitude. It is not an attitude that would make sense in a late 20th/early 21st century (real world) navy. But, if women served in the navy in 1800 - where circumnavigating the globe took weeks or months, would it have made...
1) The Federation was fielding 13 Constitution-class starships at the time (and yes, at one point, they were referred to as Starship-class ships). But it is not within even the remote field of marginal plausibility that Starfleet had 13 starfaring ships total. Heck, they already had almost as many starbases.
2) That still speaks to temperament.3) We do not know all the circumstances behind those events. They could be leaving due to a cultural imposition independent of the service. Remember, between its member home planets and colony worlds, there are hundreds of cultures those crew members could have come from, even taking into account that they were primarily human. Yes, it’s possible that the behind-the-scenes reason was a sexist one, but it’s just as possible that the reason had nothing to do with gender.
4) Agreeing with the above comments regarding other life-changing medical events that can force a captain change independent of gender (hello, Captain Pike in the beeping wheelchair) as well as the likelihood of contraceptives.
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Maybe that was all part of standard procedure in that era of the Federation. "The captain has fallen for a green-skinned alien woman. I know they want us to investigate Romulan activity in the Neutral Zone, but that can probably wait. Relationships come first."
"Kif, I have made it with a woman. Inform the men."
Sending Kirk to the Neutral Zone just ensures that his next causal relationship will be with a Romulan. (Although, again, that was Spock that flirted with a Romulan commander... Gosh, Spock ninja's all the great plots!)
Now I'm picturing a bunch of xenobiologists and xenosociologists drawing up detailed research grant proposals to send to Starfleet command:
Admiral: {seeing fresh new stack of requests on his PADD} Oh good lord, where do you guys want us to send Kirk now?! No, no, no. I think even Kirk draws the line at hortas.