Will this party makeup have a lot of difficulty with Rise of the Runelords>?


Advice


Will a Cleric, TWF fighter, Skald, and wizard have a lot of difficulty getting through the AP? The edition in question is the anniversary edition.

Should I make any adjustments to the encounters scaling up or down, and is there any advice I should tip them at character creation?

Sovereign Court

The party will be fine. It isn't difficult. The only difficulty is at the beginning, there isn't a lot of loot but well, your cleric and skald will largely make up for it with buff and invest into a wand of cure light wound to heal post battle.


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You have a Cleric and a Wizard. The other two party members don't really matter at that point. They'll be fine.


I had read that this particular AP was a 'killer-AP', and so was looking at preemptive advice on whether it needed adjustment. I should also point out that the players involved are all relatively new, with minimal game time.

Also, the only one I expect to be taking the skald buffs are the fighter, since the cleric and wizard see the restrictions of the raging song as A VERY BAD THING, so will not take it, even after it was explained on when you should take it and when you shouldn't. There response is bad, not taking it.

So, with that in mind, is it still, have no worries and carry on?


Yeah, you should be good.

If the Wizard/Cleric screw up spell picks that can still upset things, but that's... honestly pretty hard to do.


There is a lot of fighting in Runelords, so suggest that one or both of the spellcasters specialise in summoning otherwise the party will regularly be getting eg giants in melee range of the squishy types.

And there are 2 or 3 encounters early on (book 1) which can become TPKs solely due to dice rolls.


They will be okay IMO. They don't have trapfinding which could hurt in certain locations during the path, but generally, if they work together and don't just try to hammer their face into every challenge until something gives, they'll be fine. Most parties will. ROTR is pretty forgiving, accessible to most combinations of party-members. There are exceptions to this rule, and the path features some of the most notorious encounters in pathfinder, but with that said, it's not impossible.

Teamwork is the name of the game. If the party synergizes, and use their ressources smartly they'll triumph. Unless Nuffle wills otherwise, of course :]

-Nearyn


As others have said. There should be no problem. Fighter, wizard and Cleric are all solid/classic choices. There is more to the Skald then raging song. Many parties go without trap-finding. They will be without some skills and just need to co operate between themselves to cover the important skills.


They should do fine, only consider tampering with the AP if you notice them having a hard time or too easy of a time.


Whether or not Runelords is a killer mainly depends on the skull level of the players. Do they pick up on clues? Do they balance role play and combat? Do they use sensible combat tactics? How optimized are the character builds?

The AP is designed for 4 PCs of average optimization, with players of average RPG experience.

I've run it twice, both with five PCs. The first had very experienced players, with very optimized characters. It was a cake walk where the PCs curb-stomped the bad guys. I had to beef up just about every encounter to make it a challenge. I either maxed out the boss' hit points, added half again (or double) the mooks, or both. If I'd run it after Mythic had come out, I would have given some bosses the dual initiative mythic ability.

The second time also had experienced players, who were more interested in storytelling than combat. The PCs were not nearly as optimized. I ran that one straight with few adjustments.

As long as you have the four basic PC roles covered (arcane caster, divine caster, martial, skilled), you should be fine.

My parties were:
#1: Barbarian, wizard (universalist), cleric, paladin, rogue/ranger

#2: Fighter, sorcerer, druid, rogue, oracle.


Not playing four Commoners, then you should be fine.


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I think their makeup needs the addition of some rouge . . . .


Gilarius wrote:

There is a lot of fighting in Runelords, so suggest that one or both of the spellcasters specialise in summoning otherwise the party will regularly be getting eg giants in melee range of the squishy types.

And there are 2 or 3 encounters early on (book 1) which can become TPKs solely due to dice rolls.

Yes, that is what I thought too. Also twf fighter may die horribly and fast later on if his AC is rubbish and not bolstered.


UnArcaneElection wrote:

I think their makeup needs the addition of some rouge . . . .

To the lips?


At least you'll get to set off the traps. ;)


DM Under The Bridge wrote:
UnArcaneElection wrote:

I think their makeup needs the addition of some rouge . . . .

To the lips?

To the kidneys

Grand Lodge

Quote:
You have a Cleric and a Wizard. The other two party members don't really matter at that point. They'll be fine.

This typically is true unless they are first time players who don't know much about the spellcasters they are playing and spell selections.

As for the TWF and the Skald-

They should not have too much an issue and will work well together. My only advice if you're playing with less veteran players is offer them 20-25 point buy. Most APs are designed for a party of 4 on a 15 point buy. But also the creators are veteran players and it isn't their first rodeo when it comes to test running it.

Lastly to help the skald I might suggest offing this trait as a Basic trait choice: Trap Finder There are a handful of traps spread out among the books. This will definitely help the Skald shine more during the Adventure. My home Group house Ruled this into a general trait so you can avoid the mindset of:

Quote:
I think their makeup needs the addition of some rouge . . . .

It opens up the playing field for people to play other classes for the Sheer trapfinding that the rogue had to offer. Some groups always demanded a rogue because of that 1 ability but did not realize how bad the rogue class was.

Other than that this is a very good AP with some very monstrous and deadly fights. Enjoy it and Make sure you as the DM go to the RotRL forum here and look into the Mis-types that are listed. There are several throughout the books. One in book 3 that if done as written is TPK worthy.

Grand Lodge

My players are about 60% through book 5 right now. They have little to no trouble and only a few character deaths (same character 3 times). The party comp is Divination Wizard, sword and board Paladin of Iomadae, Cleric of [changed god 3 times], and a ranged Inquisitor of Erastil with the Animal Domain (Big Cat fcompanion). The traps were handled by 1 level of ranger for the Inquisitor. Bane was also a huge boon in the campaign, which attributed to the easy of it (Taking down a dragon in 1 round and most BBEGs in 2). Book 5 has posed significantly more problems for them as they have had to deal with far more casters, which they have experienced very little of through the first 2/3 of the AP. Overall, coming from a GM, the players should be good if the GM matches their skill level. I am ruthless with my PCs, but they are very experienced players. Overall, just make sure everyone is having fun, Book 4 can tend to be a drag.


I agree that a wizard and cleric will cover many potential issues. Just look out for the wizard as sometimes a bad initiative roll can be really dangerous for him.


4 different gods to the same cleric?

If I was a god I'd be like "no. You're disloyal."


Xen wrote:
My players are about 60% through book 5 right now. They have little to no trouble and only a few character deaths (same character 3 times). The party comp is Divination Wizard, sword and board Paladin of Iomadae, Cleric of [changed god 3 times], and a ranged Inquisitor of Erastil with the Animal Domain (Big Cat fcompanion). The traps were handled by 1 level of ranger for the Inquisitor. Bane was also a huge boon in the campaign, which attributed to the easy of it (Taking down a dragon in 1 round and most BBEGs in 2). Book 5 has posed significantly more problems for them as they have had to deal with far more casters, which they have experienced very little of through the first 2/3 of the AP. Overall, coming from a GM, the players should be good if the GM matches their skill level. I am ruthless with my PCs, but they are very experienced players. Overall, just make sure everyone is having fun, Book 4 can tend to be a drag.

Little to no trouble, except one guy keeps dying, lol.


What character keeps dying? Lol


Absinthium wrote:
What character keeps dying? Lol

The hero I'd guess. Who else can die 3 times and still be in the story?


Absinthium wrote:

I had read that this particular AP was a 'killer-AP', and so was looking at preemptive advice on whether it needed adjustment. I should also point out that the players involved are all relatively new, with minimal game time.

Regardless of the party makeup, you might end up wanting to tinker with encounters: Some players build better characters, some play them better, some parties work better together and vice versa. That's just part of proactive GMing and doesn't have anything to do with the classes or AP involved. So keep an eye out for that.

I wouldn't make many/any changes to encounters in the first part of Book 1, those are there to ease the players into the adventure and get the ball rolling. They're supposed to be easy. Keep an eye on how things go in the last chapter of book 1, that will give you an idea of how well they can handle the challenges later books will throw at them.

The class balance is fine, you have arcane and divine casters covered and a couple people who can apply HP damage to bad guys. Trapfinding isn't a full-time job and all you need for that is Perception anyway. A bypassed trap is just as good as a disabled trap, after all.

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