I Throw a Rock at it!


Advice

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Green Smashomancer wrote:
So, what would one enchant a rock with? Returning is the obvious choice, next maybe, keen? agile? (would it work with weapon finesse? my first thought is no, but how big is the rock in question?) Flaming Burst?

I like Disruption for this.

Shadow Lodge

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All I can say for this entire thread is bravo. gives evil, slow-clap applause

Dark Archive

Now, Take the elf favored class bonus that allows her add 1/2 to her level concerning one revelation. If the rock throwing allows you to use your oracle level for the BAB, then by level 12, you would have an 18 as your BAB, which means 4 iterative attacks by level 11.


Rock throwing does not allow you to use your oracle level for the BAB.

Spoiler:
Rock Throwing (Ex): You are an accomplished rock thrower and have a +1 racial bonus on attack rolls with thrown rocks. You can hurl rocks up to two categories smaller than your own size. The range increment for a rock is 20 feet, and you can hurl it up to 5 range increments. Damage for a hurled rock is 2d4 for a Medium creature or 2d3 for a Small creature, plus 1-1/2 your Strength bonus.

Also, since I'm just reading this thread today:

AndIMustMask wrote:

throw anything and a few traits (seriously, the improvised weapon traits are deceptively good)

[...]
optionally, grab the body bludgeon rage power and throw PEOPLE at each other (they're treated as a two-handed improvised weapon, which throw anything lets you then toss at folks).

I always got a laugh out of that rage power, but I never thought about combining it with Throw Anything. Ha, that's just too good to pass up. :)

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Zathyr wrote:

Rock throwing does not allow you to use your oracle level for the BAB.

** spoiler omitted **

Also, since I'm just reading this thread today:

AndIMustMask wrote:

throw anything and a few traits (seriously, the improvised weapon traits are deceptively good)

[...]
optionally, grab the body bludgeon rage power and throw PEOPLE at each other (they're treated as a two-handed improvised weapon, which throw anything lets you then toss at folks).
I always got a laugh out of that rage power, but I never thought about combining it with Throw Anything. Ha, that's just too good to pass up. :)

Yeah bout that,

Sometimes I read things that are not really there,
like schizophrenia but with writing.

Dark Archive

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I'm barely resisting the urge to have my players run into Armstrong, a dwarven Oracle / Warpriest devoted to Rocky (patron of rocks, boxing, and training montages). His rock-throwing technique was likely passed down his family line for generations.


LuniasM wrote:
I'm barely resisting the urge to have my players run into Armstrong, a dwarven Oracle / Warpriest devoted to Rocky (patron of rocks, boxing, and training montages). His rock-throwing technique was likely passed down his family line for generations.

Or perhaps this god...

http://pathfinderwiki.com/wiki/Kurgess


Imbicatus wrote:
Green Smashomancer wrote:
So, what would one enchant a rock with? Returning is the obvious choice, next maybe, keen? agile? (would it work with weapon finesse? my first thought is no, but how big is the rock in question?) Flaming Burst?
How does one make a masterwork rock?

Masterwork Transformation.

Profession (rock-banger)*, yields "rock" as a tool.

Rough and Ready trait. This grants rock proficiency.
EDIT 3: dang, it! Not taking penalties is not the same as proficiency. That'll teach me to read instead of only remember. Alright, continuing to think about this...
EDIT 4: Okay, as noted in the other thread, the ranger who selects natural weapon combat style could get the weapon focus feat sans prerequisites. Hm. That nets us the weapon focus (and a level earlier, too!), but drops two feats; fighter Weapon Training doesn't apply in any event. Anyway, hm...

Sacrifice Strong Arm, Supple Wrist because, while nice, that extra +10 ft is going to prevent you from full-attacking.
EDIT 3:This advice still stands...

Does that solve any questions, hesitations, or problems we might otherwise have?

* Rock-banger: "Look, I don't know, man, but I just keep banging these rocks together as hard and loudly as I can - the more people nearby the better -, and after, like, seven days or so, about eight hours a day, a bunch of people just get together and tell me to, "Stop, because we're done'. Then they throw money at me, to make me quit! That sounds like a profession to me."

R-B's buddy: "No, it's not, it's called being annoying."

R-B: "... that sounds like a profession to me.

R-B's Buddy: "Look, professions aren't 'stop, because we're done', they're 'stop because you're done.' See?"

R-B: "Than what about middle management?"

R-B's buddy, a middle manager: "... okay, we're done here."

R-B: "I don't think we've solved the underlying issues inherent in the soul-crushing social dynamic of middle manage-"

R-B's former buddy: "Look, if I give you money, will you just shut up and go away?"

R-B: "See? It's totally a valid profession!"

EDIT 1 and 2 and 5: to clarify something super-important.

Dark Archive

strayshift wrote:
LuniasM wrote:
I'm barely resisting the urge to have my players run into Armstrong, a dwarven Oracle / Warpriest devoted to Rocky (patron of rocks, boxing, and training montages). His rock-throwing technique was likely passed down his family line for generations.

Or perhaps this god...

http://pathfinderwiki.com/wiki/Kurgess

Huh, never noticed this deity before. Perhaps Rocky will allow him into his pantheon.


strayshift wrote:
LuniasM wrote:
I'm barely resisting the urge to have my players run into Armstrong, a dwarven Oracle / Warpriest devoted to Rocky (patron of rocks, boxing, and training montages). His rock-throwing technique was likely passed down his family line for generations.

Or perhaps this god...

Linked for the convenience


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On the subject of Proficiency, funny thing, did you know that feats like 'Simple Weapon Proficiency', 'Martial Weapon Proficicency', and 'Exotic Weapon Proficiency', don't actually grant proficiency with the weapon?

Feats wrote:

SWP: Benefit: You make attack rolls with simple weapons without penalty.

Normal: When using a weapon with which you are not proficient, you take a –4 penalty on attack rolls.

MWP: Benefit: You make attack rolls with the selected weapon normally (without the non-proficient penalty).

Normal: When using a weapon with which you are not proficient, you take a –4 penalty on attack rolls.

EWP: Benefit: You make attack rolls with the weapon normally.

Normal: A character who uses a weapon with which he is not proficient takes a –4 penalty on attack rolls.

Nowhere in the feats does it actually say you actually become proficient with the weapon, you simply don't take the penalty. So in the context of Pathfinder, I would have to say that not taking the penalty on the attack roll is the same as being proficient with the weapon.


... okay, that's awesome. Well played, Tels. Well played.

EDIT: Linkage!
Simple
Martial
Exotic

Yeah, that pretty much seals it. There's non-standard English ways of explaining the RAW and noting that the feats don't grant proficiency, but then you're being pedantic for... no real purpose. PFS would almost have to accept the ruling that not taking the penalties is the same as being proficient.


dot

Are not children proficient with rocks?

Scarab Sages

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An orphanage full of Stone Oracle children would be a deathtrap. =)


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dots, dots everywhere


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Another proffession for rocks might be a miner, a quarryman, gemcutter, bricklayer, many many kinds of general construction-worker, and dwarf.

"wait, you cant have profession: dwarf!"

"do you think you can get that drunk, dig a moat around the camp, and still murder twenty orcs before sunrise that easily boy? It takes practise. Dwarf isnt a race--it's a lifestyle."


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One level of warpriest gives weapon focus rock. Unless of course the argument is now that ricks aren't weapons.


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What did Rick ever do to you?

Silver Crusade

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He rolled me.


H.P. Makelovecraft wrote:
One level of warpriest gives weapon focus rock. Unless of course the argument is now that ricks aren't weapons.

It's always been the problem with the build, the rock isn't on any the weapon charts, so while a GM could houserule the creation of the rock weapon, it would still only be a houserule. I thought with the introduction of the Tech Guide that finally the rock weapon would be introduced, but it seems that while the Androff have developed nanotech and lasars they have not reached the tech level needed to use the rock as a weapon. How much sophistication does it take to use a rock as a weapon instead of an improvised weapon?

Scarab Sages

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The rock. Millions of years to create, an incomprehensible amount of time to perfect.

Scarab Sages

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I did the calculations for a Level 20 Rock Thrower. This includes a Greater Belt of Mighty Hurling, Gloves of Dueling, a Cracked Pale Green Ioun Stone, and Boots of Speed.

+31/+31/+31/+31/+26/+26/+21/+21/+16 (2d4+37/19-20 x2, Auto-Confirm Critical), Range - 400 ft. (80 ft., 5 increments, No Distance Penalty)

To get 80 ft:
Belt of Mighty Hurling
Hurler Barbarian
Unfolding Wind Strike

To get no range penalty:
Distance Thrower
Far Shot
Hunter's Sight

Attacks:
Base + 3 iterative
TWF, ITWF, GTWF
Rapid Shot
Boots of Speed

Manual of Gainful Exercise is not applied to the data.

Scarab Sages

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Cao, would you be so kind as to put together a level 12 version of this, with the progression level by level? I really want to spring this on my local PFS group.

Scarab Sages

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The first page has both possible builds to choose from. If you have trouble with DR or hardness, you can swap Splintering Weapon with Clustered Shot.

The Primary Stat to focus on is Strength. It is vital when using the (Greater) Belt of Mighty Hurling, since that belt converts your Ranged Attack rolls from using Dexterity to Strength. The other essential items is the Gloves of Dueling. Because the static damage increases by 4 (2 via fighter, 2 via gloves), you are sharply increasing your rock damage output (on top of the Strength and a half from the Rock Throwing extraordinary ability).

At Level 12, you get your second Iterative attack. Top that with Haste and Rapid Shot, and you have 5 attacks. +22/+22/+22/+17/+12 (2d4+27/19-20 x2, Auto-Confirm Critical)

To get a bit more damage, I suggest getting a trait that has a scalable SLA. That way when you get something like Arcane Strike (Can Swap Far Shot or Distance Thrower), you get a +3 to damage and your rocks are considered magical.

If you do not mind a 30 ft range increments, you can swap the Hurler Barbarian to another Fighter Level, which in turn, adds another point into Weapon Training.

For the level by level breakdown, it might be in about a week before I can post it (a convention is coming up)

Scarab Sages

I don't mind the 30 ft range increment at all. I'm used to trying to get within 30 ft on my archer just for the bonuses from PBS. I'm also patient enough to wait until you have all the time you need. I have more than enough characters to dink around with for now.


this is brilliant and I will be using this.


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Here is a short build I stashed away a while back. This was preluded by a milder gnome version called "Dinki Rock Tosser", hence the name.

*********************************************

Knotso Dinki Rock Tosser

S: 19 D: 14 C: 12 I: 10 W: 8 Ch: 12 (20 pt basic human)

Traits:
- Fate's Favored (+1 to all luck bonuses)
- Dangerously Curious

Feats:
- Quick Draw (Human)
- Point Blank Shot (1st)
- Rapid Shot (Fighter 1)
- Precise Shot(3rd)
- Weapon Focus: Rock (Fighter 2)
- Deadly Aim (5th)
- Weapon Specialization: Rock (Fighter 4)

Items:
- Belt of Mighty Hurler (equipped @ 6th)

Level 1: Oracle (Stone Mystery)
- Revelation: Rock Throwing
- Spells: Cure Light Wounds, Divine Favor, Abundant Ammunition
Level 2: Fighter (Weaponmaster Archetype)
Level 3: Barbarian (Hurler Archetype)
- Skilled Thrower
Level 4: Fighter (Weaponmaster Archetype)
Level 5: Fighter (Weaponmaster Archetype)
Level 6: Fighter (Weaponmaster Archetype)

Theme - Rock Thowing!

Level 1:
+4 to hit = +0 BAB + 2 DEX + 1 revelation + 1 Point Blank Shot
2d4 + 7 (= +6 STR + 1 PBS)

Level 2:
+3/+3 to hit = +1 BAB + 2 DEX + 1 revelation + 1 PBS - 2 RS
2x 2d4 + 7 (= +6 STR + 1 PBS)

Level 3:
+4/+4 to hit = +2 BAB + 2 DEX + 1 revelation + 1 PBS - 2 Rapid Shot
2x 2d4 + 10 (= +6 STR + 1 PBS + 3 Rage)

Level 4:
+6/+6 to hit = +3 BAB + 2 DEX + 1 revelation + 1 PBS - 2 RS + 1 Weapon Focus
2x 2d4 + 11 (= +7 STR + 1 PBS + 3 Rage)

Level 5:
+6/+6 to hit = +4 BAB + 2 DEX + 1 revelation + 1 PBS - 2 RS +1 WF -2 Deadly Aim + 1 Weapon Training
2x 2d4 + 16 (= +7 STR + 1 PBS + 3 Rage + 1 Weapon Training + 4 Deadly Aim)

Level 6:
+13/+13 to hit = +5 BAB + 6 STR + 1 revelation + 1 PBS - 2 RS + 1 WF - 2 DA + 1 WT + 2 Rage
2x 2d4 + 20 (= +9 STR + 1 PBS + 3 Rage + 1 WT + 4 DA + 2 Weapon Spec)

NOTE: Divine Favor adds +2/+2 to the above numbers.
NOTE: Free Action draw a Great Sword as needed in Melee.
NOTE: Thrown rock range increment- 20 ft @ 1st, 30 feet @ 3rd, 40 feet @ 6th
NOTE: Shields can be used while tossing rocks.

******************************

Rock Throwing (Ex): You are an accomplished rock thrower and
have a +1 racial bonus on attack rolls with thrown rocks.
You can hurl rocks up to two categories smaller than your
own size. The range increment for a rock is 20 feet, and you
can hurl it up to 5 range increments. Damage for a hurled
rock is 2d4 for a Medium creature or 2d3 for a Small
creature, plus 1-1/2 your Strength bonus.

Skilled Thrower (Ex): The hurler is skilled at throwing
objects in combat. Increase the range increment of any
thrown weapon or object by 10 feet. This ability replaces
fast movement.

Belt of Mighty Hurling, Lesser
Aura moderate transmutation; CL 8th
Slot belt; Price 14,000 gp; Weight 1 lb.

DESCRIPTION
This thick leather belt is buckled with a bright bronze clasp in the shape of a fist.

When worn, it grants its wearer a +2 enhancement bonus to Strength and allows him to apply his Strength modifier as a bonus on attack rolls instead of his Dexterity modifier when making ranged attacks with thrown weapons. Also, the range increment of any weapon thrown by the wearer gains a +10-foot bonus. Treat this Strength bonus as a temporary ability bonus for the first 24 hours the belt is worn.

Liberty's Edge

My other concepts for the next PFS character are not working out as well as I'd like. So I am reconsidering this.

Long back there were a bunch of arguments about whether or not any of this really was PFS legal since rock isn't on any weapon list.

Did that get cleared up?

Scarab Sages

Cao Phen wrote:
So, I had the question asked at a convention I am at now and my local VC and 2 VLs state that the Stone Oracle is proficient in the rock. I do not know if this would be effective as a ruling for pfs.

This was posted a while back, but I would suggest you ask your local VC/VL as well.

In my area, the officers reach covers half a state, mind you that my state is one of the larger ones.

If you are still hesitant, the second build (the dwarf one) covers the possible proficiency issue.

Silver Crusade

Couldn't you make a chakram throwing build and end up with something similar? I'm sure the dasmage wouldn't be as high, but you wouldn't have all the arguments about legality.

Scarab Sages

Yay can, but you won't be able to see your GM's puzzled face when you crit with a Rock for 4d4+74. =)

Silver Crusade

Yeah, I really want to make the rock thrower, I just don't want to get embroiled in a huge rules debate.

Edit: Damn it all to hell, I'm going to make the rock thrower.

Now to find a punny name for him.


thought I should add this in as this giant has weapon focus (rock)
https://sites.google.com/site/pathfinderogc/bestiary/monster-listings/human oids/giants/giant-true/giant-cliff
if some one could link it that would be nice.... new here and dont know the forum linking stuff :)

and the official prd

http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/bestiary4/giant.html#giant-cliff

they have a +12 to hit with the thrown rock
+1 from dex bonus
+10 from base attack
+1 from weapon focus
-1 from being large
+1 from the rock throwing EX ability
since the cliff giant is proficient only in simple and great club that means that rock is a simple weapon. damage for rocks is listed in universal monster rules with the damage dice in the specific entry take precedence over the general damage.
Rock Throwing listed here
http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/monsters/universalMonsterRules.html

Rock Throwing (Ex) This creature is an accomplished rock thrower and has a +1 racial bonus on attack rolls with thrown rocks. A creature can hurl rocks up to two categories smaller than its size; for example, a Large hill giant can hurl Small rocks. A “rock” is any large, bulky, and relatively regularly shaped object made of any material with a hardness of at least 5. The creature can hurl the rock up to five range increments. The size of the range increment varies with the creature. Damage from a thrown rock is generally twice the creature's base slam damage plus 1-1/2 its Strength bonus.

Format: rock throwing (120 ft.); Location: Special Attacks (damage is listed in Ranged attack).

Dark Archive

What do you think? Is it punny enough?

I think I'm going to go:
Str: 18
Dex: 14
Con: 14
Int: 8
Wis: 10
Cha: 12 (for casting a couple of divine favors out of my oracle slots)

Stone oracle 1: Rock Throwing, PBS, Precise Shot
Weapon Master Fighter 1: Quick Draw
WMF 2: Rapid Shot, Weapon Focus (rock)
WMF 3: whichever Weapon Training fits
WMF 4: Weapon Specialization (rock), Deadly Aim

I'm considering dumping Int and Cha down to 7, though, and just foregoing any casting at all.

The image in my head for this guy is Charlie Sheen's character from Major Leaue, except Flint throws baseball-sized rocks. He's not very bright, I just can't decide if I want to even bother trying to make it look like he's anything other than a physical brute. I could conceivably go:

Str: 20
Dex: 16
Con: 14
Int: 7
Wis: 7
Cha: 7

The will save would be absolutely awful, but since most bad guys in PFS are evil, a clear spindle ioun stone would take care of most of those problems.


Now now then you would have to add in a level of corssbloded wild blooded empyreal/deep earth sorceror for appropriate puns(closest I could find to a geomancer class).....or you could play steve...death incarnate


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Man, am I glad the player who tried throwing a rock at the Mystic Theurge Half-Celestial Unicorn that was giving the party their first story arc didn't have that build.

Dark Archive

William Froh wrote:
Now now then you would have to add in a level of corssbloded wild blooded empyreal/deep earth sorceror for appropriate puns(closest I could find to a geomancer class).....or you could play steve...death incarnate

I've got a level of stone oracle. That's geomancer enough.

And yes, I rock.

>.>

<.<

Sovereign Court

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Pathfinder Card Game, Maps, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

The rock thrower should be a Gnome named Moss.

That way you can have a throwing stone gathered by Gnome Moss.

Grand Lodge

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Pathfinder Adventure, Rulebook Subscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber

I believe the Tome of Horrors stats up using coconuts as thrown weapons. Just throwing that out there.


I really like this build idea. If my Paladin dies i just might give this a try if my DM has no problems with it. Tho i think it would be even more awesome if your race was giant something, like hill giants or even ogre. But not all DM will allow that sort of thing. But it would rock for rock throwing :) hehe.
When you go fighter. Are you a strait up fighter or an archetype?

Silver Crusade

Weapon Master for earlier access to Weapon Training.


Bigdaddyjug wrote:
Weapon Master for earlier access to Weapon Training.

Thank you for your speedy reply. Now where can i find this archetype? Which book is it in. So i can look it up if i can get a hold of this book :).


Razal-Thule wrote:
Bigdaddyjug wrote:
Weapon Master for earlier access to Weapon Training.
Thank you for your speedy reply. Now where can i find this archetype? Which book is it in. So i can look it up if i can get a hold of this book :).

Advanced Player's Guide.


Tels wrote:
Razal-Thule wrote:
Bigdaddyjug wrote:
Weapon Master for earlier access to Weapon Training.
Thank you for your speedy reply. Now where can i find this archetype? Which book is it in. So i can look it up if i can get a hold of this book :).
Advanced Player's Guide.

Many many thanks. I have a friend with that book so i can borrow it so i cant check out the archetype so i can prep the build ahead of time before i bring it to my dm. Thank you again :)

Silver Crusade

So Cao Phen, are we using the oracle Rock Thrower revelation as a base for this chassis once we get it, or are we just using iterative attacks and assuming rocks are simple thrown weapons?


Razal-Thule wrote:
Tels wrote:
Razal-Thule wrote:
Bigdaddyjug wrote:
Weapon Master for earlier access to Weapon Training.
Thank you for your speedy reply. Now where can i find this archetype? Which book is it in. So i can look it up if i can get a hold of this book :).
Advanced Player's Guide.
Many many thanks. I have a friend with that book so i can borrow it so i cant check out the archetype so i can prep the build ahead of time before i bring it to my dm. Thank you again :)

Between the PRD, d20PFSRD, and the Archives of Nethys nearly all of the Pathfinder rules can be found online. All three contain the the rules in the core rule book line, such as CRB, APG, UM, UC, UE, U. Campaign etc. Only the most recent books (Advanced Class Guide for example), aren't included as they still need time to enter them.


Tels wrote:

Between the PRD, d20PFSRD, and the Archives of Nethys nearly all of the Pathfinder rules can be found online. All three contain the the rules in the core rule book line, such as CRB, APG, UM, UC, UE, U. Campaign etc. Only the most recent books (Advanced Class Guide for example), aren't included as they still need time to enter them.

Wow thank you very much. I have been looking for something like that and i have asked in the forums for someone to link me something like that but i got ignored. So i cant thank you enough i will check them all out and see which i like the most. But if i was a betting man i would use all 3 prolly.

Silver Crusade

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I use all 3. Archives of Nethys is best for looking up stuff about deities and domains as well as finding out if something is PFS legal. D20 is. Ice for a quick look up of any spell, feat, or trait. The PRD is useful to get the exact wording, as you can't 100% depend on d20, although AoN is very accurate.

They recently changed the PRD and made it a little less user friendly, but even so it's not too bad.


Bigdaddyjug wrote:

I use all 3. Archives of Nethys is best for looking up stuff about deities and domains as well as finding out if something is PFS legal. D20 is. Ice for a quick look up of any spell, feat, or trait. The PRD is useful to get the exact wording, as you can't 100% depend on d20, although AoN is very accurate.

They recently changed the PRD and made it a little less user friendly, but even so it's not too bad.

Thank you. Thats all very good to know and i shall remember it when i need to look up stuff. It will help me to know who's site i go to when i need help or info about something. Thank you again for all your help :)

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