Any tips on hot to take on high HD undead that arent subject to spells like Undeath to Death?
I was hoping there are some spells that severely hurt even zombies with high HD.
Take them out with ranged weapons. Typical zombies cannot move and attack so keep them moving. Very boring fight, all in all, but should prove quite easy if you can avoid being cornered. They are just big bags of hps, so just deal damage in as efficient a manner as possible. Hope that helps. Good luck!
Disintegrate is very good on undead. They typically have lousy fortitude saves so they usually get the whole can of whupass.
Take them out with ranged weapons. Typical zombies cannot move and attack so keep them moving. Very boring fight, all in all, but should prove quite easy if you can avoid being cornered. They are just big bags of hps, so just deal damage in as efficient a manner as possible. Hope that helps. Good luck!
Now imagine facing a necromancer with over 100 HD worth of undead >_<
But Disintegrate DOES look good. Why do zombies have low fort? A sidefect of being a zombie? Because I think there are zombie Ogres in there and such. And some of the zombies are even the fast variety.
They have a low fortitude save because they have Consitution '-' by default as undead. Undead instead get their charisma bonus towards HP.
For example, typical stats for a zombie:
Str 17, Dex 10, Con —, Int —, Wis 10, Cha 10
So, how is their fort calculated then? Do they get negatives, or only their base fort from racial HD.
They have a low fortitude save because they have Consitution '-' by default as undead.
And Fort is a weak save for them.
This is mitigated by the fact that undead are immune to most effects that require a Fort save (Disease, Poison, etc).
But if they aren't immune to it, then something targeting Fort is great against undead. They aren't immune to Disintegrate, so......
Yeah, basically just the base save from HD, but possibly also feats.
Hehe... So an undead would have a very very low Fort eh? Excellent :D
HEY! Another good idea! Burn baby burn!
Depending on the size of the target, the pit spells are also likely to be good. Undead don't have much climb skill, and the solid ones don't fly.
Polymorph Any Object functions on Undead.
So, how is their fort calculated then? Do they get negatives, or only their base fort from racial HD.
Undead creatures use their Charisma score(modifier) for things like bonus hp per HD and bonus to fortitude saves.
Polymorph Any Object functions on Undead.
It doesn't to my knowledge. Undead creatures are not objects, they are creatures.
On a similar subject:
Plants are objects unless they are plant creatures :)
To my understanding: It's a creature if it has WIS and CHA scores, and an object if it doesn't.
(I believe intelligent items are an exception to this - I think they are objects.)
So, how is their fort calculated then? Do they get negatives, or only their base fort from racial HD.Undead creatures use their Charisma score(modifier) for things like bonus hp per HD and bonus to fortitude saves.
Polymorph Any Object functions on Undead.It doesn't to my knowledge. Undead creatures are not objects, they are creatures.
On a similar subject:
Plants are objects unless they are plant creatures :)To my understanding: It's a creature if it has WIS and CHA scores, and an object if it doesn't.
(I believe intelligent items are an exception to this - I think they are objects.)
Undead can be subject to any fort save that could target a creature and an object. Polymorph Any Object targets both.
I typically just scold them and tell them to go to go home.
Earlier I thought you were talking about a single high-HD zombie. My mistake.
If you're talking about an army of regular zombies then think AOE spells. Wall of fire has already been suggested. Spike stones is partially useful, too. Very large area, lasts for a very long time, but will only nickle and dime zombies as they cross through the affected area. Best used in a narrow, long ravine or hallway.
If you're fighting an army, though, there may be better rules to simulate those types of combats. I don't run those types of encounters in my games.
Any tips on hot to take on high HD undead that arent subject to spells like Undeath to Death?
Control Undead is a 2nd level spell and flat out owns mindless undead.
Undead creatures use their Charisma score(modifier) for things like bonus hp per HD and bonus to fortitude saves.
HP yes, Fort saves no.
Your average undead has a poor Fort save and no way to add a bonus to it, so they're pretty screwed by the very few effects that require Fort saves that work on them.
100 HD gets us into Mass Heal territory. The other spells mentioned above are great. If mindless undead are the problem, any sort of tactics should work to maximum effect, from pits to webs to bull rushes and such. Otherwise, summoned monsters can be a good investment too, if getting a wall of hit points down is an issue.
Hrm. I've never seen that before. And I've been looking at undead a LOT lately.
Is it new? Or have I just glossed over it repeatedly?
It is fairly difficult to give a catch-all solution, when the only thing to go with is a total of 100 HD worth of undeads, some of which are high HD.
Generelly though, flying tends to render undeads useless (apart from zombie dragons), since they haven't got a flying speed, and possibly not any ranged weapons (and even so, those are going to be weak).
It is also relevant that if you have a lot of low-HD undead, these often work in your favour as blockers against the big bads.
Leadership + All Followers with UMD + cart of Wands of Disrupt Undead = Undead Volleyfire Brigade (Also works if all followers are 1st level sorcerers/wizards). :)
In my campaign threnodic feeblemind and thanatopic finger of death are finding some use.
Hrm. I've never seen that before. And I've been looking at undead a LOT lately.
Is it new? Or have I just glossed over it repeatedly?
Can't access my 3.5 books but after looking at the d20srd.org site I'd guess, at least on my part, it's another slight change between 3.5 rules/text and PF. It merely says under Undead traits:
"No Constitution score." and "Uses its Charisma modifier for Concentration checks." No other mention of Con or Cha in the text
** spoiler omitted **...
Never played 3.5, so that's not my issue.
I'm just blind, it seems. =)
Take them out with ranged weapons. Typical zombies cannot move and attack so keep them moving.Staggered creatures can always charge and five foot step, so this isn't actually trueI do not believe Staggered creatures can charge. Here are some quotes from the PRD:
Charging is a special full-round action that allows you to move up to twice your speed and attack during the action.Staggered: A staggered creature may take a single move action or standard action each round (but not both, nor can he take full-round actions). A staggered creature can still take free, swift and immediate actions. A creature with nonlethal damage exactly equal to its current hit points gains the staggered condition.(Bolding mine)
You can charge as a Standard if you're Staggered or otherwise are limited to only a single Standard action (you just only go up to your speed, not double it).
Undead can be subject to any fort save that could target a creature and an object. Polymorph Any Object targets both.So, how is their fort calculated then? Do they get negatives, or only their base fort from racial HD.Undead creatures use their Charisma score(modifier) for things like bonus hp per HD and bonus to fortitude saves.
Polymorph Any Object functions on Undead.It doesn't to my knowledge. Undead creatures are not objects, they are creatures.
On a similar subject:
Plants are objects unless they are plant creatures :)To my understanding: It's a creature if it has WIS and CHA scores, and an object if it doesn't.
(I believe intelligent items are an exception to this - I think they are objects.)
To flesh out this thought, what would be some cool funny things to turn undead into and would they lose their undead traits?
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@stray
Problem with Channel energy is that Will is the strong save and there is channel resistance. So unless you are Sun/glory you are better off with something else. The ultimate undead blasting route is
Quick Channel Feat
Extra Channel
Improved Channel (But you are still rocking a strong channel due to Sun/Glory domain)
Drop Blessing of Fervor on your team
Activate Nimbus of Light(level in damage every round)
Next round(Or in emergency, just do this)
Move Action:Quick Channel (2 channel uses)
Standard Action: Channel
This is the nova option and will drain you quick, but if you really need to clear out undead RIGHT NOW this is not a bad move.
Combine damaging effects like wall of fire with slowing effects like difficult terrain (through black tentacles, ice storm or the like) or pit spells.
and indeed use spells for battle field control like grease and entangle. This will make sure that all of them will not reach you at the same time.
Did anyone mention disrupting weapons yet??????
If there's a horde, I'm a huge fan of Firestorm.
Is there way to take command w/o using that command undead feat? Is there something else I can use if im confident in my ability to beat a CL (or casting stat) check.
Because yeh... I'd like to be able to just steal one of the enemy's zombies :D
cant you just use the Heal spell to insta-KO them?