Serpentfolk Seeker

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Hey everyone,

So a Hag-Haunted Spiritualist's Phantom is the spirit of a dead hag. Could this Phantom form a Coven, and fulfill the requirement that the Coven contains a Hag?

One the on side, its a Phantom and nothing in the archetype mentions forming a Coven. On the other, it is specifically a Phantom that is the soul of a deceased hag.

I put it in General for more discussing on the pro's/con's than a straight up RAW thread.

Dreamweaver Witch (requires Changeling) with Mind, Nightmare, or Stars patron

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Since it has already been necro'ed.....

There is a half-succubus template on pg 54 of Demons Revisited.

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John Murdock wrote:

the mount do not have 10 ft reach, only large biped has 10 ft reach, quadruped need to be huge to have 10 ft reach, unless stated otherwise

And since we are specifically discussing huge mounts, they would have reach.

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Dawnflower Anchorite (9/10 casting; can progress channel energy, domains, animal companion, etc).

Evangelist advances all Cleric class features 9/10, plus faster Obedience benefits

Stargazer full spell progression; domains progression (and 3rd domain); channel progression with The Mother's arcana; other fun stuff

Keep in mind that Souldrinker will be changing when it is reprinted in the upcoming Book of the Damned in September. The Energy Drain ability will be significantly different...

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As Java Man says, the rules state you "share your mount's space during combat."

That pretty much answers all your questions.

1) You occupy all the mount's squares.

2) You aren't any specific height, you occupy all the mount's squares.

3) You have 5' reach from any/all of your mount's squares. You get a +1 to attacks, for higher ground, on any Large or smaller unmounted combatant in melee.

4) It works just fine.

Saldiven wrote:

Heck, why not both? Give the sucker some class levels while we're at it :D

Sadly, you cannot. Both template can be applied to "any living creature."

Regardless of which template you apply first, it turns the creature Undead, and thus not a legal target for the other template.

As a DM, you could do whatever you want, but normally the templates cannot be combined.

Would a swarm be a legal choice for Entothrope?

It is treated as a single creature, but made of many different creatures....

That would be really cool!

Spellstrike, itself, isn't any kind of action. It simply allows you to use a weapon attack to deliver a touch spell.

This can be the "free" touch when casting, or an attempt to touch later while holding the charge.

Since the ring is a standard action to use, you would have to cast the spell and hold the charge, then use the ring to make a melee attack in the next round, delivering the spell with the attack.

But that is because casting the spell is either an action in its own right, or as part of the full round action for Spell Combat, so you can't also use a Standard action to activate the ring in the same round.

But on subsequent rounds, it would work just fine to delivery the spell at range with a melee attack.

Louise Bishop wrote:
Or you can put it on an archer's arrow.

Well, ammunition that hits its target is "destroyed" so I have had DM's not allow it with the arrow.

But rocks, a martial friend, etc are all valid. I like the "Master Key."

doc the grey wrote:

Also, does anyone know of a Giant Moth being statted anywhere?

Actually, that's a good point. I don't know of any Vermin type moths/butterflies. Not Paizo published at least. Such a shame.

There is the Star Monarch, but it is a Magical Beast...

The Sideromancer wrote:

Secondly, you said they were a rapier fighter, i.e. focused on putting a single point in the right spot? Why not mosquito?

That seems like a great suggestion! Giant Mosquito

I don't remember the template mentioning any innate connection to fey, I thought that was just an element of the OP's character, but maybe I am not remembering something...

Once thing I think is interesting is that the template works with any Vermin. So while insects/arachnids are the first thing that jumps to mind, other creatures that are Vermin type are also options.

Maybe even a were-Worm that Walks!

I would think a were-dragonfly would look basically the same as the picture of the were-wasp.

Only with a long "tail" instead of the stinger.

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Vermin Tamer Cavalier (Heroes of the Darklands)


Darklands Mount (Ex): At 1st level, a vermin tamer chooses a creature native to the Darklands as his mount. This functions as a cavalier’s mount. He can choose a giant beetle, giant centipede, giant gecko (Pathfinder RPG Bestiary 3 186), giant slug, or giant spider as his mount. These mounts (except the giant gecko) and the rules for vermin companions are detailed on page 36 of Pathfinder RPG Ultimate Magic.

The selected mount is combat trained. The vermin trainer does not take an armor check penalty on Ride checks while riding his mount. If the vermin tamer’s starting mount is large enough to act as a mount, it gains
Light Armor Proficiency as a bonus feat. If the selected animal companion is too small to act as a proper mount, then the vermin tamer gains Undersized Mount (Pathfinder RPG Advanced Class Guide 159) as a bonus feat.

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PossibleCabbage wrote:
that Witch archetype that has to sleep on a pile of treasure inherently don't really travel well,

It's 1,950 gp worth of treasure at 20th level. You can carry it as a single gem stone. It isn't even enough to cast Raise Dead.

In fact, I thought it would be a cool idea to make a "Leprechaun" character as a Gnome Wyrmwitch with a "pot" of holding for his hoard.

Sorry, to clarify, I was agreeing with you. Especially the "silly" part.

A rhetorical "why can't you" if you will. (Obviously the answer is because the rules, but as you mention the rules don't make a lot of sense in this regard).

Sphynx wrote:
Seems a good TWF really requires a Fighter (or tempered paladin) because my calculations say I won't be doing any damage against anything with DR... Tried building a slayer, that I really like, but his damage is terrible without specialization and penetrating...

Well, TWF works best when you are adding something to your damage for each hit. This can be Sneak Attack, Weapon Training/Spec, Smite, etc.

I would suggest an alternative option that could work is Cavalier.

With Challenge, you are adding your class level to the damage of each hit. This can further be enhanced with the order specific bonus to attack or damage.

While you can only Challenge so many times per day, Order of the Flame or the Chain Challenge feat do a lot to keep the effect in play.

Material components are not the same thing as Focus components.

Yes, you would still need the divine focus.

mdt wrote:

No, you can't do that.

You can take a quadruped mount, give it an extra set of limbs, and call it arms, get the same effect, and it's valid.

I don't make the rules, I just interpret them. I think it's kind of silly once you add extra legs to the humanoid.

Note : I don't care in my own games, I allow it, but it's house ruled, RAW you can't.

There is also the Tauric base form from Cohorts and Companions for a third option to achieve the same idea. Or even Serpentine with [Limbs] x 3 for Legs, Legs, Arms.

Why couldn't you put Mount on a Tauric base form? For that matter, I can easily see a Biped mount (various dinosaur/bird forms, like riding a velociraptor or ostrich). Especially once they get bigger (a Huge Biped Eidolon based a on T-Rex).

I think a DM could easily argue that an entire castle is more than "one object."

Yes, you change back to normal.

SU are suppressed by Anti-Magic. Change Shape is SU. Change Shape is suppressed.

Change Shape has been changed to an unlimited duration. But that, by definition, means it is an on-going effect and not an instantaneous transformation.

Novels are not rules books.

Hello MaiMaltril.

So, there isn't really a clear question in your post. The board could more easily offer advice if you clarify what you are looking for.

Agree with Chess Pwn and Murdock.

The "or similar class feature" covers abilities that work like Animal Companion, but with a different name (like Lunar Oracle's Primal Companion, Mammoth Rider's Steed, etc).

It would not apply to any Familiar granting ability as those are not similar to Animal Companion.

Thomas Seitz wrote:
Not sure about wizards, but druids joining a coven would be kind of neat. or else Shamans.


Shamans can already join covens.

As for Wizards, they already get so close. There is a Wizard archetype to have a Witch Patron, multiple Wizard archetypes to store spells in your Familiar, and a Wizard archetype that lets them gain Shaman Spirit Hexes.

Just no way to get the Hex coven specifically.

A 1 level dip isn't too onerous, so if they don't add an option it's not the end of the world, I just think it would be nice.

Especially since only Wizards (and Arcanists, but it doesn't help in this case) can take Arcane Discoveries. Which allows Truename so you can have a Night Hag buddy.

I guess that would be a great option instead, add a Greater or Grand Hex to access an Arcane Discovery.

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Scrapper wrote:

there is White Dragon and Red Dragon

Does a DM really need a Gargantuan Red Dragon on the table as a player? Gawds! the figure investments!


You're right, I don't see anything specific in the rules. I don't even see anything that would actually show real connection between the bodythief and podspawned beyond telepathy.

I guess I would go with B/D.

The podspawned just continue to go about their lives like before, but with no bodythief to propagate more.

At some point, they may be able to grow a new bodythief from a seed recovered from the destroyed bodythief. Or your idea that the oldest podspawn could evolve into a bodythief.

Maybe a new bodythief will naturally be drawn to the location of an established colony of podspawned.

We don't have any information about bodythief reproduction, so it's not clear if they come from podspawned or seeds or what. But they are plants so either option makes sense.

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I don't know, I can't think of any wiggle-room or loopholes here....

Polymorph subschool wrote:
In addition, other spells that change your size have no effect on you while you are under the effects of a polymorph spell.

So no spell, [Polymorph] or otherwise, can change your size while under the effects of a [Polymorph] spell.

So no combining Form of the Dragon with any spell that increases size.

There is no general rule printed that non-[Polymorph] size increases don't stack, but every size altering spell I can find includes the text that they don't stack with other magical size changes.

And of course, you have this FAQ that does kinda codify that size changes don't stack (though it references "rules on size changes" which don't actually exist anywhere).

FAQ wrote:

Size increases and effective size increases: How does damage work if I have various effects that change my actual size, my effective size, and my damage dice?

As per the rules on size changes, size changes do not stack, so if you have multiple size changing effects (for instance an effect that increases your size by one step and another that increases your size by two steps), only the largest applies. The same is true of effective size increases (which includes “deal damage as if they were one size category larger than they actually are,” “your damage die type increases by one step,” and similar language). They don’t stack with each other, just take the biggest one. However, you can have one of each and they do work together (for example, enlarge person increasing your actual size to Large and a bashing shield increasing your shield’s effective size by two steps, for a total of 2d6 damage).

From a very strict reading of the rules, you could argue that a non-spell size increase could stack with a [Polymorph] effect.

Oddman80 wrote:

on another note, it is not surprising that going the monster cohort route could be a weaker option than going with the normal humanoid npc leadership route.

Sorry, but no. The table doesn't make sense.

By the rules, a PC Blood Hag is a 8th level character. But the same Blood Hag is a 16th level cohort. That is ridiculous.

A level 16 Tiefling Magus is a 16th level cohort, and also 16th level as a PC.

There is no defense for the Monster Cohort rules.

But, if we are discussing RAW (such as Awaken not increasing CR) then we also must acknowledge the RAW that Monster Cohorts use the table, not the Monster as PC rules.

Lady-J wrote:
that table is all kinds of wonky and is a terrible source for level judgement there's no way in hell that those creatures are worth the levels they are assigned many of which are about 5 levels to high on their given "level of cohort" especially when compared to classes who can get them as companions as class features lets take the babau as an example its treated by that list as a level 11 cohort which means an character would need to be level 13 to get it as a cohort were as an anti paladin gets it at level 9 which would make it a level 7 cohort but using monsters as pc rules it should be a level 6 cohort and monsters as pc are way more flushed out rules than some arbitrary chart that laughably attempts to give none conventional creatures as cohorts but screws it up royally like a cr 8 creature as a level 18 cohort like wth is that

While I very much agree with you, RAW you don't use the Monsters As PCs rules when determining the equivalent level of a monstrous cohort.

As you note, a CR 8 Blood Hag is given a cohort level equivalent of 16(!).
Comparing to the table, I agree with Oddman80 that it seems like it should be equivalent to about a level 7, based on the examples in the table.

I think that you should probably ignore this bit of RAW, but then I would also say to ignore the RAW that the extra HD from Awaken wouldn't affect the level of the gorilla too.

Lifesense, maybe.

Works as blindsight, but only sees living creatures.

Lady-J wrote:
they are not the same bloodline as they give you different abilities they may come from the same lineage but are different, the wording of the feat was ment to prevent sorcerers from trading out abilities with archetypes and getting them back with the feat

If Aberrant (Sorc) must match Aberrant (BR) when multiclassing, I don't see why it wouldn't also match (and therefore be prohibited) when taking Eldritch Heritage.

But that is why I said "questionable" rather than "not allowed."

Green Smashomancer wrote:
Worth noting is that a successful grapple automatically pulls a creature towards you.

Not necessarily the case with Greater Whip Mastery

It's written kinda strangely. "Rather" would indicate you replace the normal rule, but adjacent is still "within your whip's reach" so I guess you could still decide to pull them adjacent.... Maybe?

Lady-J wrote:
bloodrager with aberrant bloodline and eldritch heritage aberrant bloodline

I think that's questionable, as Eldritch Heritage say

This bloodline cannot be a bloodline you already have

You could argue that Bloodrager Aberrant is different from Sorcerer Aberrant, but then I think you run up against the text in Bloodline that says

If the bloodrager takes levels in another class that grants a bloodline, the bloodlines must be the same type, even if that means that the bloodline of one of the classes must change.

Which certainly implies that Aberrant is the same, regardless of the class you are receiving it from.

Lady-J wrote:
the bloodrager build above will have about 30+ feet of area they can effect so way better than the 15 feet from the feat

But Roadhog doesn't reach out with 30' arms, he throws a hook, so..

The whole "person from long ago preserved as a statue" is a pretty well established trope.

In some works, petrification may also be used as a magical equivalent of Human Popsicle by simply turning a person into stone and wait after a certain amount of time has passed to unpetrify him or her. Your body can't physically age if it's turned to stone.

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Raynulf wrote:

The few times I have seen Leadership in play and it not proven disruptive/ludicrously overpowered, it was always the GM creating and controlling the NPCs (because a cohort is a Non Player Character, regardless of the fact the PC spent a feat). It is a decent compromise between getting some backup to the party without overshadowing the PCs or having one player hog inordinate amounts of spotlight time.

The handful of times I've seen Leadership be utterly broken, it was when the GM (myself in one occasion) allowed the player(s) to create and control their own cohorts and followers.

Since we're sharing totally anecdotal stories, the group I have played with since college (so 14 years or so) has had multiple people take Leadership and the player built and ran the cohort, and its never been a problem.

Reasonable limitations on cohorts make sense. But then, most DM's put reasonable limitations on PC creation too, so it's not a special rule for cohorts.

As for a player with a cohort being a time hog, its no different than the druid with an animal companion, or summoner with eidolon, or wizard who casts summoning spells. Everyone should be courteous of their fellow players' time.

I could see a Roadhog build forming...

Picaroon Swashbuckler, Hook Fighter feat, Dragon Pistol....

Yes, its all falling into place.

I suppose you could also use Greater Whip Mastery to grapple with your whip, then move the grapple.

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Hook Fighter feat, from the new Adventurer's Armory 2

Treat a grappling hook as a heavy pick (including no penalty for improvised weapon).

Can use as a melee weapon or as "whip type" weapon out to 15 ft (but don't threaten). Changing from melee to whip is a move action. You must be proficient with whips to use it this way.

You can Reposition an enemy, pulling them closer to you (as the Reposition combat maneuver).

Basically, Roadhog the feat

Prereq: BAB +1, and that's it :)

Hrothgar Rannúlfr wrote:

Sounds good.

16 attacks without improved/greater two-weapon fighting is awesome.

twelve armed

Who needs ITWF/GTWF when you have 12 arms, lol.

Harry Dresden, Private Investigator and Wizard for Hire!

As a demigod, he should only offer 4 domains, and 4 subdomains.

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Alaric23 wrote:

The feat says your sneak attack damage dice cannot exceed half your character level (rounded up), so it seems getting into Arcane Trickster early won't work with this feat as you'd need to be at least 3rd level rogue to take the feat.

The feat works just fine. SN can't exceed half your character level. Not class level.

So Wizard 2/Rogue 1. Take feat, feat add 1d6 SN (3/2= 1.5 rounded up to 2, so max 2d6 SN). Level to Wizard 3. Enter Arcane Trickster.

Dαedαlus wrote:
because Empower would only tack on an extra +1.5d6, rounded down to +1d6,

That's not how that works.

If you Maximized and Empowered the Awaken spell, you would have an Intelligence of 18 + (3d6/2).

You would roll all 3d6, then halve the sum, and add that to the 18.

So the average would be 10.5, for an increase of 5.25 (rounded to 5), or 23.

Where did you get 24 before Empowering? 3d6 Maximized is 18.

Take Improved Familiar for an Imp Counselor (8th level).

The Imp has telepathy, so it can act as a "translator" between you and the other creature.

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PossibleCabbage wrote:

Per the Archives of Nethys there are 18 CN deities, as opposed to 21 LN, 29 CG, 33 LG, 34 NG, 52 NE, 66 LE, and 79 CE deities. The only alignment less represented is TN with 17 representatives.

To me, the better option to improve the balance would be to stat more of the demigods of the lesser represented alignments.

Protean Lords, Primal Inevitables, Psychopomp Ushers, etc.

The cause of the imbalance is a focus so far on certain types of outsiders, and can be corrected by providing information about the most powerful of other types.

Keep Nocticula CE.

Calth wrote:

Martial Versatility does not qualify for Martial Arts Master. It is not a feat that applies to unarmed strikes or monk weapons. You cant bootstrap it in by stating that the feat you want to select with it does qualify.

I am fine with using Martial Arts Master for Martial Versatility, as long as the weapon group was Monk weapons. Martial Versatility basically says "apply X feat to Y weapon group" so it still a feat that applies to the weapon rather than to the chosen feat. But that's just my reading.

But FCT applies feats to natural weapons, which aren't unarmed strikes or monk weapons. So that wouldn't work.

Bard-Sader wrote:
Rysky wrote:
MGX wrote:
Garbage-Tier Waifu wrote:
Oh wow, you're totally right! I totally didn't notice that. that's style.
Combat Stilettos.
We have stats fro those in Adventurer's Armory 2 now :3
Wait are you being serious? 0_o

Yes, totally serious.

Personally, I really, really hope they never actually make Nocticula a CN goddess. But that's me.

Fromper wrote:
I'd avoid the ones that are known for being undead heavy, like Mummy's Mask. A lot of witch stuff is mind affecting, and many undead are immune.

You could play a Gravewalker, Hex Channeler, or even combine them.

You could use

It groups Hags together. Hags, scroll down to H

Google's your friend....

Pathfinder Chronicler

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He could have a wizard archetype that trades the spellbook for keeping spells in his familiar, like Familiar Adept or Spirit Whisperer.

I really want to play a witch in Hell's Vengeance!

Would be a great chance to play an evil White White from Irrisen.

But most campaigns should fit some type of witch.

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