Well, he doesn't get flurry of blows, and he is restricted to unarmed strikes in response to the missed attack, which is an AoO. If he spends his immeadiate action after hitting with that AoO, then he can attack again. Remind him he is limited to only 1 AoO unless he has combat reflex and higher Dex Mod. Then remind yourself, that an immeadiate action counts as a swift action on his turn and he can't take multiple immeadiate actions per turn. Since he doesn't get Flurry of Blows, he will only be able to his normal repetoire of iterative attacks on his turn.
If these points that he may not be following the rules aren't valid, then throw monsters against him that have DR that his fists can't bypass.
Also, as a monk in armor and with a shield he loses his monk AC bonus and his fast movement bonus as well. So he should be moving 20ft per round. He will also lose evasion because of armor, which means AoE spells will work, because even if he makes his save he will take half damage. If he still poses a lot of problem, enemies will run away. Also creatures, unless mindless, are smart enough to know that if they're missing every attack and getting hit in return that they should stop attacking that thing. They might decide to attack someone else, or they might decide to just plain run away depending on the level on intelligence. Outside of mindless creatures, nothing is stupid enough to just stand there and get slaughtered.
Looks to me like a lot of feats for a pretty small impact. While it would be nice to hit things that miss me (and I often build for AC), the pre-requisite feats are pretty awful really.
A well built tank fighter at that level (without the monk level and snake style) would be quite hard to hit, and hand out good damage. I really doubt this build is appreciably better.
As someone else said, the enemies would likely just start targeting the character, and with all those feats spent on something which no longer counts for anything, he'd be boned.
My tank fighter in PFS (pick and board), has an AC of 32. He does 1d6+11 at +10/+5.
Yes, it is less damage, but it is also a lot more AC. Of course he doesn't get to swing back when he is missed, though I admit the though of finding a way to do it is tempting.
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25 AC right now, they're only at 6th level (we're running the Carrion Crown adventure path). So most critters that they are fighting don't have much better than a +10 to hit, which equates to a 75% chance to miss. So all of these mobs have gone down QUICKLY, leading to my frustration.
Casters and ranged creatures will be more of a problem to him, but they haven't really made an appearance yet in the adventure path. Creatures with reach will also help, but again, they've mostly been AWOL.
This is more DM frustration than anything else! Just feels like the fights are very anticlimactic right now, as mobs come storming in and are cutting down almost immediately by him.
Pump up chances to hit...aid another...use spells that help, when available...catch him flat-footed, or use touch attacks...swarms always hit...spells, rather than physical attacks...ranged attacks...
25 really isn't spectacular at 6th level...it is high, but there are ways to cope. :)
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You know, it really just sound like his character is at a part of the adventure that allows him to shine. It will not always be this way. There will be a day when he has to face spellcasters, swarms and other things that will challenge him.
Look at the adventure like it is a movie. At times, in the movie the heroes have fights where they are allowed to shine and show off thier skills. At other times they are challenged. Don't begrudge him his moment to shine.
As for high AC, though. Remember that their are ways to pump up the enemies' attacks. Flank +2; Higher ground +2; Cat's grace or Bull's strength for +2; Charge +2.
Come on GM. I just think you are not on your toes if you can not handle a guy with an AC of 25 at 6th level. Be glad I am not in your group. You would be on these boards everyday.
lol...I hear ya. Agreed.
Master of many styles allows you to skip the prerequisites but all the snake type styles must be taken in order. So he can't have snake fang. There the problem is fixed.
This is untrue.
At the OP: The Style itself has a large number of downsides and limitations that you need to make sure you're taking into account. He can only do the retaliation so long as he has Attacks of Opportunity leftover from the previous round for one thing. Using his Sense Motive to dodge takes up his Swift action for the next round as well. These two limitations make it much less powerful (though still good) than you seem to believe.
And it doesn't make Crane look like baby stuff either or whatever you said. If he were using Crane his AC would be at least 4 higher and he wouldn't have to roll JACK in order to deflect one attack per round and then return fire.
Also, d6+12 is not a whole lot of damage. Not even at level 6.
Just stop attacking him so much. Is he really doing anything to force foes to melee with him?
I do love Crane Wing + Snake Fang, they're a perfect match. But if you're built on counter-attacking, it does little good if the enemies aren't taking the bait. Same problem the Panther feats have.
Honestly its not that bad BUT it should be that you need to beat the creatures attack roll to be able to successfully land a hit on them.
that way it doesn't remove that factor but it does give it a bit of a weakness and doesn't make it 100%
and yeah i know is not "technically" 100% because you need to beat the creatures ac but i mean in regards to even be able to do it.
It's fine. It's a specialized build in a setting where he got served all the fights he would have wanted.
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Just change up what creatures the group fights. Attack him vs Touch AC, Flat AC, Saves based on Fort, etc. Just don't overwhelm him as that may deter fun, and give him a few martials to nibble on. Play by creature intelligence too. If you just make all melee avoid him, he'll know you're doing it on purpose and that'll kill the fun and probably deter him from playing. Put yourself in his shoes, to understand what he wants and what he's created, and of course think about yourself. Find a middle ground.
Its good to vary the opponents your group faces, so everyone can shine and suffer equally. It helps create a really nice balance. You'll have fun doing it too!
Why are we having this discussion again. It is 17 month old. I suspect the OP have solved the issue:)
Back again?
Eating his Swift action for the next round, only agaisnt enemies he has reach to and it requires 5 feats and level 9 to work? And can use half of the feat once a round and the other half as much as he has dex modifier (which if he does have high str, isnt going to be that often, and if he doesnt he shouldnt be hitting hard at all).
Jokes appart, since MoMS does skip the requirements, it's a problem that smoothes itself as the party get levels. More attacks and more special effects.
You could change around type of critter you use, to Ranged, magic, special attacks. Use things that have touch attacks. Use Area of Effect stuff.
PS: We need a cleric to put down the closet skeletons.
PS2: Posted advice in case someone in the future uses the search function (HAHAHAHAHAAA...).
So, for Snake Fang counterattack, does attacker have to miss due to Snake Style AC replacement, or any miss counts? Say for mirror image or displacement.
Any miss, as long as the Snake Style is active.