Penny from "The Big Bang Theory" is how I'd play that character.
Maybe Stanley from Erfworld?
Penny from "The Big Bang Theory" is how I'd play that character.
Penny has way too much common sense to have a Wisdom score that low.
@Black Raven: wait...are you agreeing or disagreeing with me?
@Illydth: the problem I have is that we shouldn't have to make vague exceptions to when and how a character's attributes apply, or worse: ignoring them all together.
The six attributes honestly just don't do much to lend an idea of who a character is.
In Deadlands, you've got Deftness, Nimbleness, and Quickness instead of Dexterity. So you can have an old prospector with terrible arthritis, but a damn steady hand. Or a cowpoke with lightning-quick reflexes and no grace.
In World of Darkness, there's Intelligence, Wits, and Resolve instead of Intelligence and Wisdom, and Presence, Manipulation, and Composure instead of Charisma. A Charisma of 20 tells you absolutely nothing specific about the character. Presence 1, Manipulation 2, and Composure 4, however, tells you a great deal.
So, instead of having more attributes to explain the infinite facets of a sentient being, in Pathfinder, it's simply up to the player to get some stats that make sense.
To the OP: how did you come across these scores, anyway? If this is a less-than-serious game, have at it, but if those numbers are supposed to represent a Real Live Person...they don't. Finlanderboy had the best point of us all: the only person who is anything like this character is Zhaphod Beeblebrox--a person who is not a believable person.
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One possibility is a fetchling who while wouldn't do good in school, still is sociable and can hold a convo and function in a normal society (this convies 7 int and 5 wis)
He is over trusting, Doesn't understand more then simple tactics, and day dreams a lot which causes him to miss some of the most important detales.
He can never tell when someone is lieing to him, but trys his best to be helpful to others. When he does want somthing he can easily find out who and can help him and get them to help him. People like him, but they know he can some times do really stupid things.
He seeks help from his "horse" a lot. To explain things to him. His horse seems to be the only one that can dumb things down to him to a point where he could understand.
He is really charismatic, and is good at giving speeches, but they always use the most simple of concepts and ideas. People love him tho.
Some common phrases he uses
"Trade is good"
"The shadows will provide."
"To Serve is to Gain."
"The great Umbral will be please."
"GREAT Umbral!"
With his high charisma, when he was young we was chosen to be the face of a great Umbral dragon, to her servants. he gave the orders and was the middle man between the servants, the fetchlings and the master.
Most of the "faces" died for not understanding the socialness needed to be servants, But this fetchling has survived, which is why he was chosen.
He has loyal served his people in this roll for 13 years, longest personal servant in over 250 yea
(the dragon is like "build me this, or i want this" and he goes tell his people that.... and they figger out how todo it.)
Having to run errands back and forth has caused him to grow which is how he got to level 10.
If seen on the material plain he is most likely on some mission for his master.
I wouldn't. That build is anything but heroic and it's nearly impossible to play a low Int unless you really are stupid, or a low wis without annoying your fellow players. Good for a one nite joke game, nothing more.
Just sounds like Elan, from Order of the Stick.
I dunno. I played a 5 int Half Orc and my party wasn't annoyed. Also, he was heroic, and arguably the most heroic on the team. I think his stats were 18 STR, 14 DEx, `14 Con, 5 Int 10 Wis and 15 Cha. He was rolled, but Taz my favorite character thus far. Good for some laughs, good in a fight, and good at saying "You attack friends. Taz no like you." Taz was good hearted strongman with a questionable grasp on language among other things.
Also, the High Int, Low Wis Wizard? Absentminded. "Now..where did I put that eye of newt.?" "Oh dear...I misplaced my wand...oh, wait, wrong pocket." I think I've heard of Rincewind as this wizard.
For that one, i have to agree with most of the folks. "Uhh...I thought dragons were are friends, I mean, he doesn't look -too- dangerous..*cue party looking horrfied* "Yes, I knew the duke of Risewater. Funny little man. Had a strange nose though....I'm sorry, I think I forgot somethi-oh..you want my autograph..? ..Okay. *few seconds later*...what was I going to do?"
Thanks Ronnie. We got past the guards. Um. Ronnie? Quit staring...
I imediately think of Brock from The Prince's New Groove (may have the name of the bodyguard and the name of the movie wrong.....) But dammit, I know who I'm thinking of.
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To the OP: how did you come across these scores, anyway? If this is a less-than-serious game, have at it, but if those numbers are supposed to represent a Real Live Person...they don't. Finlanderboy had the best point of us all: the only person who is anything like this character is Zhaphod Beeblebrox--a person who is not a believable person.
This is actually a really good point. The fictional examples people have suggested are all parodies. The only D&D/PF character I've heard playing with that sort of int/wis problem almost became a parody of himself by the end of the campaign. Everyone loved the character, which proves you can pull it off - but don't expect it to be serious.
my first thought seeing the thread title and the little preview text was "Play a loveable retard (as in, literally mentally handicapped)."
big guy, loves childish things (flowers, small animals, absolutely fascinated by insects, etc.), terrified of others (the dark, thunder, spiders, etc.). laugh whenever something is funny and cry when sad or disappointed. be slow on the uptake but semi-competent when learned (you know to stay away from pointy things/fire/etc, how to open doors, and so on.), and, by extension, make a point to say when you dont understand.
though, it takes a deft hand to roleplay it without coming off as suicidal or laying it on too thick, and also takes a good deal of patience from the party early on.
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I wouldn't take it to the extremes of a mental handicap.
A stat of 7 is as likely as a stat of 14. Do characters with Int 14 get role-played like Sheldon from Big Bang Theory?
A stat of 5 is as likely as a stat of 16, or a 14 for a race that takes a -2 penalty to that stat.
Playing a loveable airhead is fine. The remarkable stat here is not the 7 Int or the 5 Wis, but the 20 Cha! It's the Charisma that should get your attention!
My latest PFS character, Niamh Snowmane, is a Dawnflower Dervish bard with Str5, Int7, Wis7 and Con8. She doesn't see herself as 'simple', more like 'not overly complicated'. Mental agility is for wimps! Much better to focus on one thing at a time!
In her only adventure so far, she started to negotiate with some gnomes who asked us who killed the Druid. She thought they were talking about the fay we had just killed instead of the ally the fay had previously murdered. That got...er...'complicated' for a while, but her natural charm still averted disaster.
When she insisted that the party sleep in sight of the Stone Circle (she was sleepy, alright!) she managed to get 15 minutes before the ranger woke her up to deal with the developing situation. She thought that they had slept for 24 hours! When she found out the truth she was not a happy teddy bear/halfling!
When the ranger unwisely fell into the lake she refused to use Prestidigitation to dry him, but her soft heart soon won out and she was friends with him again and she dried him.
Despite her low stats, the high stats are the remarkable ones. Dex and Cha of 20 are the ones thateave the lasting impression. A score of 20 is as likely as a score of 1, after all!
To me this is like many professional actors or singers.
Gorgeous, likeable, incredible sense of self, but not an intelligible thought to be found. Absolute confidence in everything they do (contrary to experience). Can convince almost anyone of almost anything no matter how idiotic. Think about the commercials where some good looking entertainer is promoting a product that they really don't know anything about. Thousands of people will buy it anyway.
Think Zaphod Beeblebrox.
@Malachi Silverclaw: the problem isn't the existence of low or high stats; it's the fact that they've been arranged in a way that just doesn't make sense.
No one has ever actually been like that. Promise.
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@Malachi Silverclaw: the problem isn't the existence of low or high stats; it's the fact that they've been arranged in a way that just doesn't make sense.
No one has ever actually been like that. Promise.
We disagree.
If you're saying that no-one has ever had 20 Cha, then I won't argue.
If you're saying that there has never been anyone with, say, Cha18, Int7, Wis7 then I think your confusing a 7 Int with some mental handicap. Int7 is no more remarkable or uncommon than Int14.
If you're saying that there has never been anyone with, say, Cha18, Int7, Wis7 then I think your confusing a 7 Int with some mental handicap. Int7 is no more remarkable or uncommon than Int14.
Int 7 is about Forrest Gump level.
Wis 7 is aboue Dan Quail level.
I'd play this as guy who is just unaware of his surrounding and quite forgetful. They type that's so busy socializing but can't remember names and notice nothing and make bad decisions.
This would the type of guy that gets really friendly and loans gold to a friend then can't remember where his gold is when it goes looking for it. I know people like that. I'd just take it little more to the extreme.
This character should be taken advantage of regularly in social circles.
The problem is not the INT of 7, but a WIS of 5 is a major problem. The combination makes it an unplayable character. He is going to be oblivious to things a normal person would not even think of.
Combine the knowledge of Forest Jump, with the actions of Dustin Hoffmans character in Rain Man and that is what you have. He will require constant supervision to make sure he does not harm himself. If it is cold and he has a blanket in his pack he will not get it out unless someone tells him to.
Even animals and insects have a higher wisdom. Think of playing someone with less common sense then a cockroach. Then factor in that he has the understanding of a retarded person and you will not survive.
I don't know what class the character is but figure you need to spend your skill on Perception or you will not survive.
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I imediately think of Brock from The Prince's New Groove (may have the name of the bodyguard and the name of the movie wrong.....) But dammit, I know who I'm thinking of.
Emperor's new groove? I always though his name was Kronk. he is about right on the wis, Int is arguable he actually had some knowledge. Well in the series based off it at least
RPG Superstar 2015 Top 16
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I imediately think of Brock from The Prince's New Groove (may have the name of the bodyguard and the name of the movie wrong.....) But dammit, I know who I'm thinking of.
Kronk in 'The Emperor's New Groove' :P Brock is the actor's (the always awesome Patrick Warburton) character in the also awesome 'Venture Bros.'
Kronk would be a fair fit, assuming the fetchling had the muscles to back it up.
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A Wisdom of 5, even in a race without a wisdom penalty, is no more remarkable than a wisdom of 16.
Assuming the bell graph of 3d6 represents how the different abilities are spread around the population (and that's what the game does), then a score of either 4 or lower, or 17 or higher, exists in one in 54 stats. Each person has six stats, so one in every nine people has a stat of 4 or less, and one in nine people has a stat of 17 or more. The numbers are magnified for scores of 5 or 16.
How many people do you know? More than nine?
Stats of 5 do not require medical supervision.
If you want a correlation to a score of 20, then that is a score of 1! Now that person would need medical supervision!
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A Wisdom of 5, even in a race without a wisdom penalty, is no more remarkable than a wisdom of 16.
Assuming the bell graph of 3d6 represents how the different abilities are spread around the population (and that's what the game does), then a score of either 4 or lower, or 17 or higher, exists in one in 54 stats. Each person has six stats, so one in every nine people has a stat of 4 or less, and one in nine people has a stat of 17 or more. The numbers are magnified for scores of 5 or 16.
How many people do you know? More than nine?
Stats of 5 do not require medical supervision.
If you want a correlation to a score of 20, then that is a score of 1! Now that person would need medical supervision!
Don't need medical attention? Not now, but when you are laying on the ground in a coma or bleeding to death because the barbarian had to put a greataxe in your face because you tried to attack him then you will need medical attention.
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Don't need medical attention? Not now, but when you are laying on the ground in a coma or bleeding to death because the barbarian had to put a greataxe in your face because you tried to attack him then you will need medical attention.A Wisdom of 5, even in a race without a wisdom penalty, is no more remarkable than a wisdom of 16.
Assuming the bell graph of 3d6 represents how the different abilities are spread around the population (and that's what the game does), then a score of either 4 or lower, or 17 or higher, exists in one in 54 stats. Each person has six stats, so one in every nine people has a stat of 4 or less, and one in nine people has a stat of 17 or more. The numbers are magnified for scores of 5 or 16.
How many people do you know? More than nine?
Stats of 5 do not require medical supervision.
If you want a correlation to a score of 20, then that is a score of 1! Now that person would need medical supervision!
What barbarian? The one in our party? Why would I attack my friends? A Wisdom of 5 won't prevent me from knowing something so basic as who I like or don't like!
Do you mean the NPC barbarian? That's what the Charisma of 20 is for, to charm my way out of the trouble my low Wisdom got me into.
Remember, the opposite of a Wisdom of 5 is a Wisdom of 16! Statistically, just talking about this one stat alone, there will be one person with a Wisdom of 5 or less in every 21 people or so. How many people do you know? More than 20? One of them has that low a Wisdom.
The opposite of a Wisdom of 20 is a Wisdom of 1. Now that person is being supervised!
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If you're saying that there has never been anyone with, say, Cha18, Int7, Wis7 then I think your confusing a 7 Int with some mental handicap. Int7 is no more remarkable or uncommon than Int14.Int 7 is about Forrest Gump level.
Wis 7 is aboue Dan Quail level.
I have said many times this is not true.
7 int is dumb jock in school.Forest gump is more of a 4 int.
If you're saying that there has never been anyone with, say, Cha18, Int7, Wis7 then I think your confusing a 7 Int with some mental handicap. Int7 is no more remarkable or uncommon than Int14.Int 7 is about Forrest Gump level.
Wis 7 is aboue Dan Quail level.
I have said many times this is not true.
7 int is dumb jock in school.
Forest gump is more of a 4 int.
Forest Jump's IQ was listed as 70.
I would disagree about the WIS 5 needing medical care. There are far more people in mental institutions then there are geniuses. Below are the stats for a cockroach swarm.
Str 1, Dex 15, Con 14, Int -, Wis 10, Cha 2
They do not even have an INT score but still have a WIS of 10. With a WIS of 5 you have a -3 on all Wisdom based skills including perception. Let's look at some very easy tasks and see how often they will miss them
Hear the details of a conversation of someone next to you. 0 which means a 10% chance of failing
Notice someone standing next to you 0 again a 10% chance of failure.
Notice food is spoiled 5 which gives a 40% chance of failure.
So here we have a person who will often not notice someone standing next to him, who has trouble following simple instructions, and will eat food that has gone bad.
Character in a dungeon and a monster jumps out and fails to notice it 10% of the time. The party decides to flee because they can't defeat it, that character has a 50% chance of not fleeing or running the wrong way. This is assuming a DC 0 perception roll to hear the other players tell him to run, and a DC 10 INT roll. After a long day the party camps and the character does not notice his food has gotten wet and spoiled and eats the food. Next day he is sick. This character needs a keeper.
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Forest Jump's IQ was listed as 70.If you're saying that there has never been anyone with, say, Cha18, Int7, Wis7 then I think your confusing a 7 Int with some mental handicap. Int7 is no more remarkable or uncommon than Int14.Int 7 is about Forrest Gump level.
Wis 7 is aboue Dan Quail level.
I have said many times this is not true.
7 int is dumb jock in school.
Forest gump is more of a 4 int.
Thank you, this supports my claim :)
so more of a 3 int then
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My Halfling Bimbo Sorceress fits this build (though WIS could not get lower than 7).
She is gorgeous, jaw-dropping and loveable.
...
I portray her (as much as I can) as a gullible starry-eyed childish person, who can easily throw a trantrum and forget about it 10 seconds later if something more interesting happens (the "Ooh, shiny" syndrom).
Being 5th-level, her Thrush familiar (Arcane bloodline) is now more intelligent than she is, to the delight of the rest of the party.
Really, the biggest problem I have RPing her is that I tend to think things through and make strategic decisions and carefully thought course of actions that my character would just not even contemplate.
On the other hand, the greatest enjoyment I feel in playing such a PC is that I can act on impulses even when doing so would not be the careful thing to do, such as running into an obvious ambush when her familiar was shot by a sniping archer. As long as it does not put the rest of the party at risk of course.
I tell, you, that girl is evil, evil. No kidding, I should know, we play on the same table.
First, she is BLONDE ! How worse can it get ?
Then again ... she is really an heretic (like most of our party sadly). She does not worship the good god Aroden !!!! (Or any of his faithfull proxies like Iomedae or even beloved St Milani).
And then ... She steals the good looking boys of our party with her wild and promiscuous ways. That is not acceptable. The good looking paladin is not even looking at me anymore !
Grumble, grumble ... maybe we should try her ?
:)
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Don't need medical attention? Not now, but when you are laying on the ground in a coma or bleeding to death because the barbarian had to put a greataxe in your face because you tried to attack him then you will need medical attention.A Wisdom of 5, even in a race without a wisdom penalty, is no more remarkable than a wisdom of 16.
Assuming the bell graph of 3d6 represents how the different abilities are spread around the population (and that's what the game does), then a score of either 4 or lower, or 17 or higher, exists in one in 54 stats. Each person has six stats, so one in every nine people has a stat of 4 or less, and one in nine people has a stat of 17 or more. The numbers are magnified for scores of 5 or 16.
How many people do you know? More than nine?
Stats of 5 do not require medical supervision.
If you want a correlation to a score of 20, then that is a score of 1! Now that person would need medical supervision!
What barbarian? The one in our party? Why would I attack my friends? A Wisdom of 5 won't prevent me from knowing something so basic as who I like or don't like!
Do you mean the NPC barbarian? That's what the Charisma of 20 is for, to charm my way out of the trouble my low Wisdom got me into.
Remember, the opposite of a Wisdom of 5 is a Wisdom of 16! Statistically, just talking about this one stat alone, there will be one person with a Wisdom of 5 or less in every 21 people or so. How many people do you know? More than 20? One of them has that low a Wisdom.
The opposite of a Wisdom of 20 is a Wisdom of 1. Now that person is being supervised!
No the barbarian on your team is going to end up murdering you when you get dominated after you fail your Will save and end up losing control of your character.
This isn't real life. This is a game where people shoot magical rays of acid out their finger tips, and risk having someone take control of their actions. If you walk into a room of 21 PFS players and ask them to raise their hand if one of them has a WIS 5 character I'm willing to bet your stats go out the window.
So I stand by my statements that the character is a weak willed dead weight that will only be there to suck up my personal wealth.
There is a problem with comparing animal wisdom to human wisdom. For animals, wisdom basically equates to sharpness of senses because the other aspects of wisdom do not really apply to non-sentient animals.
The normal distribution of human (NPC) wisdom would be 3 to 18, with those in the 3-6 range being considered unqualified for a life of adventure by the point buy rules. None of the core races have penalties to wisdom, so player characters with wisdom of 5-6 would be reserved for the less common races that have wisdom penalties.
In any case, the only stats that a player can really get away with dumping by the core rules are intelligence and charisma. Characters with low intelligence simply have less access to skills and languages and can usually depend on smarter characters to make intelligence based skill checks. Characters with low charisma can usually rely on more charismatic characters to be the face of the party and/or train themselves in charisma based skills in order to offset their penalties; they are only in trouble when they are separated from the party and forced to make charisma checks that are unmodified by any trained skills. The other four ability scores all govern things that characters cannot really rely on other characters for -- carrying capacity for strength, AC and Reflex saves for dexterity, hit points and Fortitude saves for constitution, and Perception checks and Will saves for wisdom.
How do you play him? Anyway you want to. Seriously, I don't see the need to be constrained by stats- that's what the skill ranks and class bonuses are for. Is a 3 Dex guy gonna open locks like an 18 Dex fellow? Is a 3 Int with however many ranks going to have Knowledge skills like a 24 Int Wizard? But if a character is reeealy motivated, they can work on getting it together to do what they want.
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Remember, the opposite of a Wisdom of 5 is a Wisdom of 16! Statistically, just talking about this one stat alone, there will be one person with a Wisdom of 5 or less in every 21 people or so. How many people do you know? More than 20? One of them has that low a Wisdom.
Within the US, the rate of severe mental illness - resulting in serious functional impairment of the person - is in fact roughly 5%, or 1 in 20. (source) If you know fewer than 1 in 20 people with severe mental illness, that is probably because the worst cases end up institutionalized, in prison, or homeless, making them under-represented in the social spheres of your average middle-class person. And many are treated to reduce the effects. I personally know at least 4 people who take or have taken medication for mental illness.
Wis 5 could definitely represent moderate mental illness. Maybe not quite enough to be institutionalized, but someone having real emotional disorders or a shaky grasp on reality. I don't think that makes them unplayable, because certain mental disorders actually would fit the adventuring lifestyle fairly well. A Manic-depressive in their manic state, for example. A Summoner could easily be Schizophrenic, their connection to other planes hindering their grip on this reality.
That said, if this is the result of point buy, do you really need to min-max that hard?
The opposite of a Wisdom of 20 is a Wisdom of 1. Now that person is being supervised!
Also, it's not quite true that a stat of 20 is the opposite equivalent to a stat of 1. An unmodified 18 is the equivalent of an unmodified 3, but PF races get more bonuses than penalties. Among the core races, +22 worth of ability bonuses and -8 worth of penalties are awarded. A 20 (an 18 with a +2) is thus almost 3x as common as a 1 (a 3 with a -2).
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Ossian666 wrote:-
'No the barbarian on your team is going to end up murdering you when you get dominated after you fail your Will save and end up losing control of your character.'
It's not only the wisdomly challenged among us that fail will saves. That barbarian is going to run out of party soon. I think he has 'issues' of his own!
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I find it funny when people who dont have a creative bone in there body accuse people of min maxing when they try to make an interesting character. :)
Anyway back on subject, i posted a back story and some ideas before, if anyone wants to add on to that feel free :)
Says the guy who has to ask for advice on how to roleplay his character.
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Says the guy who has to ask for advice on how to roleplay his character.I find it funny when people who dont have a creative bone in there body accuse people of min maxing when they try to make an interesting character. :)
Anyway back on subject, i posted a back story and some ideas before, if anyone wants to add on to that feel free :)
Yup, and every writer of every blockbuster thanks his writer group and editors for feed back and ideas.... Guess you dont like reading books ether.
Btw thanks for derailing the subject moreAnyone who wants to add to the rp i posted above feel free ;)
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If you are actually trying to play an interesting character, more power to you. Who knows, you might end up like that Int 3, Wis 4 ranger I alluded to in an earlier post and become a legend among your gaming group.
However, given that you didn't seem to have a strong character concept when you initially posted, don't be surprised when a few people suspect that with a 20 in your key stat and two rock-bottom stats you might have been optimizing first and character concept-building after. Ad hominems are uncalled for (on both sides).
In my case, I was just asking whether you really feel you need to drop your Int and Wis as low as they can go. As you can see from peoples' responses, this is a far-out concept, very difficult to pull off as a "serious" character, and runs the risk of irritating your fellow players with your in-character foibles. I wouldn't take that roleplaying challenge on lightly.
And in fact, though your concept is mostly reasonable, it doesn't have anything that particularly says "this is why I'm playing a character with extreme stats." Using his horse as an advisor is a neat idea, and being gullible makes sense, but the rest of it pretty much boils down to "he's a leader, not a do-er." The role serving the dragon is interesting backstory, but the character makes just as much sense as an Int 9 Wis 8 Cha 18 - and more sense, in fact, since you haven't described quite the level of impairment as would be likely with an Int 7 Wis 5.
That is, as I said, statistically where you would find moderate-to-severe mental illness. The kind of person who not only uses his "horse" as an advisor, but thinks it is speaking with the voice of his god or dead wife.
A nice person who people around him always love, but it's dumb. It's Forrest Gump. It's a nice person, but stupid. Well, Forrest gump is probably int 8, he is "border line", with an IQ of about 75. With int 5 your character has a much stronger mental handicap. Probably Sloth from "The Goonies" is closer to INT 5.
INT 3 would be a person suffering from idiocy (people with an IQ below 25). Int 5 is severe mental retardation, what was called Imbecility a few decades ago (people with an IQ below 50).
Why would you want to play an imbecile, and using "Sloth wants chocolaaaaate" as main sentence is up to you. It's certainly a character hard to roleplay. But that's roughly the IQ range for a person of INT 5.
best way to understand what a 5 in a score is, is using an ability that can be measured.
If your character would have str 5, he would be loaded with 16 lb. He's that strong (or weak, depending on point of view). Extrapolate that to INT. He's that smart.
EDIT: I understood your abilities in the other way. So it's Wis 5 instead of Int 5. That's closer to Forrest Gump, but more gullible and slightly less brilliant.
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7 int is simply the dumb jock, the guy in high school who you let copy your homework and tests so he can pass.... who was slower to speak, and you had to explain ideas more then once
Not Special ed, or anything like that, thats a much lower int.
As for wis, Noticing fighting is a -10 dc,
Someone yelling at you i would put in the same chatagory, so people would raise there voice at first to get your attention... it would become habit...
as for noticing food spoiling he would probably let one of his advisers to taste it first to see , after experience it the first time so long ago.
7 int is simply the dumb jock, the guy in high school who you let copy your homework and tests so he can pass.... who was slower to speak, and you had to explain ideas more then once
Not Special ed, or anything like that, thats a much lower int.
7 in INT is Forrest Gump. He can finish the high school, but not with ease. Forrest Gump finished the high school too.
Int 3 is the minimum human possible. The minimum human possible in real life is an idiot, with IQ about 30. Average human is Int 10, while average human is IQ 100. Best-in-the-world human is 18, or 20 with racial modifier. Best-in-the-world IQ ranges from 180 to 200 (190 is Gary Kasparov IQ, for example). Average intelligence goes from 9 to 11, and average IQ is 90 to 110.
So an easy correlation is multiply your INT score by ten, and you have your IQ. Int 7 is IQ 70+, which means borderline. That's Forrest Gump. Sure, you don't need medical assistance. Forrest Gump didn't either. Your character can be even very succesful (Forrest Gump got medals, military honors, became rich, even made a silent speech and people got fascinated). He has high charisma, and everybody likes to hear his story. But he's dumb. Borderline dumb, actually.
I think a good chunk of the disagreement here is based on the fact that there is a divide between how one group of us interpret INT compared to the other.
One division of gamers (I'm assuming many older gamers) subscribe to the theory that INT multiplied by 10 equals IQ. In which case, the average INT of 10 equals the human "average" of 100 IQ.
The other division of gamers obviously does not subscribe to that estimation. So I will preface my following statements by saying I'm part of the older group that feels INTx10 = IQ.
A Wisdom of 5, even in a race without a wisdom penalty, is no more remarkable than a wisdom of 16.
Assuming the bell graph of 3d6 represents how the different abilities are spread around the population (and that's what the game does), then a score of either 4 or lower, or 17 or higher, exists in one in 54 stats. Each person has six stats, so one in every nine people has a stat of 4 or less, and one in nine people has a stat of 17 or more. The numbers are magnified for scores of 5 or 16.
How many people do you know? More than nine?
Stats of 5 do not require medical supervision.
If you want a correlation to a score of 20, then that is a score of 1! Now that person would need medical supervision!
Except, that bell curve isn't representative of the entire population in most fantasy worlds. That bell curve works to represent adventurer PCs . You'll note that NPCs (especially ones with NPC class levels, such as Expert) rarely use the same point-buy or stat generation as PCs. By that token, that means that those 14's and 16's are exceptional. So are the 7's and 5's. Over 80% of the fantasy population doesn't use PC stat generation with most stats hewing closer to the average of 10 and 11. So yes, 1 in 9 exceptional adventurers have 4's and 17's but that's a huge difference than 1 in 9 people as a whole.
In our world, INT of 7 and 14 is very exceptional. An IQ of 70 or 140 is a massive deviation from the average. Just like a 7 or 14 is from the average Commoner.
I have said many times this is not true.
7 int is dumb jock in school.
Forest gump is more of a 4 int.
Except that Forest Gump is said to have an IQ of 70. So by the INT to IQ standard, Forest Gump does have a INT of 7.
Rather than comparing stats of animals, let's compare humanoids. For example - Hill Giants; please keep in mind that Hill Giants have an INT of 6. Hill Giants are dumb; really, really dumb. The "dumb jock" (a massive stereotype, but that's a discussion for another thread) is well above a Hill Giant. Well above. More in the range of INT 8 to 9, and possibly with a WIS of 8 to 9 as well. Not 7. Not 5.
I have to agree more with Malachi Silverclaw.
People tend to exaggerate what int 7 is and wis 5 is.
People are only exaggerating what INT 7 is if they're using a different standard (which many are). Which is fine and valid. You're welcome to use a different standard just be aware that it's not an exaggeration by their standards.
The only standard that really matters here is the standard held between you and your GM. If your GM wants to maintain that a 7 is not that bad then go with it. Certain other Humanoids from the Bestiaries may require slightly different interpretations in your game but that's not a big shift.
If you're saying that there has never been anyone with, say, Cha18, Int7, Wis7 then I think your confusing a 7 Int with some mental handicap. Int7 is no more remarkable or uncommon than Int14.Int 7 is about Forrest Gump level.
Wis 7 is aboue Dan Quail level.
I have said many times this is not true.
7 int is dumb jock in school.
Forest gump is more of a 4 int.
Int 4 is barely above the absolute human minimum. The absolute human minimum is a person who suffer of idiocy. That means with Int 3 he can barely *talk*.
Int 4-5 is an imbecile. He can talk, but nothing he says has any coherence. He is Sloth, from The Goonies. Or the idiot character in The Sound and The Fury. He can't read, and he probably can`t even learn to read even if people try to teach him. He has an IQ of 40 to 50.
Int 6 you have people who has a mental handicap. What was called a moron decades ago. He can learn to read, with difficulty. He's mentally handicaped, but can learn to do a basic manual job.
Int 7-8 is Forrest Gump. Forrest Gump can finish the school, and pass the exams to enter the marines. Just barely. He is not smart, he is easy to be bluffed, but he can read, he can count, he can multiply and divide, and he know a few capitals from a few countries in the world, even if he sometimes mixes them. He has an IQ of 75, which is just borderline.
Examples of INT 4 creatures are the CHIMERA, the CHOKER, or the GIBBERING MOUTHER.
Examples of monsters with INT 7 are the MANTICORE, the MINOTAUR or the SHAMBLING MOUND.
With INT 6 you have ETTERCAP, the HILL GIANT, or the ETTIN. Forrest Gump is much smarter than a Hill Giant.
Int 5 is the realm of the average MORLOCK, or DRETCH, or OTYUGH. Even a GRIFFON. Forrest Gump is waaaaaay beyond them. A Morlock, or otyugh, wouldn't finish high school as Forrest did.
Relative to the Bell curve, that would be true if players used 3d6. They don't. They use either point buy, an array, or 4d6 and drop lower. The only thing we know for sure is that 3 (minimum human) is about 30 IQ, that 10 (average) is about 100 IQ, and that 18 (close to maximum human, not counting racial bonus or age) is about 180 (close to maximum IQ, but not maximum).