Ranger. Take the Archery combat style, then use your normal feats (the ones that ranger levels don't grant as bonus feats) to pick up TWF and mounted combat. Perhaps take a few Fighter levels too, to get some extra feats.
Creating a Red Sonja character is easy:
* Put on a metal bikini
* Cast a remove personality spell.
Seriously, she would pretty much be a straight Barbarian or Fighter, depending on whether you're going off the novels or the movie. (I haven't read many of the comic books, but they probably contradict each other.) You probably could do a Barbarian/Fighter.
About Charisma, I don't know if Red Sonja really had that much Charisma, especially if you're in a campaign like my homebrew of Audor where the GM kept stressing "Charisma is [u]not[/u] beauty."
Red Sonja is certainly very beautiful, and as a DM I offered an "Extraordinary Beauty" feat that granted bonuses when dealing with the opposite sex. Ask your GM about that.
I think especially if you go off the movie she would have a low Charisma score, since the movie version had her not very sociable and rather distant and aloof. From the novels, it is harder to judge her Charisma score but considerin that my comment above is based on the novels, I'd say her Charisma score is rather low.
If you go by the movie version, she actually wore armor that would be sensible for a Barbarian to wear, but then you lose the Warrior in a Bikini factor. If you maximize Dexterity and max out skills that carry an armor check penalty such as Acrobatics, then you have an excuse to minimize the armor you wear. Get yourself bracers of armor and then you don't really have a reason to wear any armor, since it doesn't stack.
(In fact, the iconic barbarian in the core rulebook has a pretty big gap in her coverage. It's as if she is wearing as much armor as she can without incurring penalties, but wearing it on her arms and legs.)
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Cheapy, Space Titanium:
Thank you, both, for replying so quickly!
What feats would you select with your suggested builds?
UGM
I honestly don't know for sure. I know nothing about Red Sonja specifically, so I'll take a guess.
If you want to be able to brawl, Improved Grapple or Improved Unarmed Strike are going to be necessary. As Cheapy mentioned, take the Two-Weapon Fighting tree if you want to focus on melee, and definitely pick-up Mounted Combat. If you also want to be able to shoot a bow better, you can pick-up the Point-Blank Shot tree as well.
As Utgardloki mentioned, it seems like Red Sonja works as a barbarian, but if you want to take it a different route then fighter or ranger will be your best bet. The fact that she has three or four distinct combat styles will leave you all over the place for feats, but the fighter or ranger bonus feats will help give you more coverage. There are also some archetypes that could help, but it would depend on what you really want to go for (the Mounted Fury Barbarian or Two-Weapon Fighter stand out in my mind right now).
I probably would not dip into Monk. Dipping into Full BAB classes may make sense since you get to keep up your BAB, plus build up saving throws, although your Will Save will probably suffer. Also, there is probably no reason to pick up more than 3 levels of Fighter since you won't be using Armor Mastery.
I would do her as pure Barbarian with rage powers: clear mind, increased damage reduction, guarded stance, internal fortitude, low-light vision, mighty swing, night vision, powerful blow, raging climber, raging leaper, raging swimmer, renewed vigor, rolling dodge, roused anger, scent, strength surge, surprise accuracy, swift foot, and unexpected strike, although not necessarily in alphabetical order.
She's not a barbarian, she comes from a fairly civilized land as a Hyrkanian. She's a fighter-ranger. She-Devil with a sword, not a bow.
Make her a straight longsword fighter spec, with a level or two of ranger in there with FE: Human or something. Give her lots of ranks in intimidate, she wasn't diplomatic at all. She never went barbaric, she was highly skilled more then anything, and senses you can take care of with scattered ranger levels.
Sword and board, follow the spec tree for longsword. Her unnatural strength and speed are just high ability scores that make her equal to a man. Maybe give her a str bonus that applies until a man defeats her in single combat as a sacred vow.
remember the key thing about Sonja is very high stats...she's all 18's on physicals, although she looks like a supermodel.
==Aelryinth
I think some of those requirements can be safely dropped as class abilities while keeping character concept.
1) No Armour, good AC Get Bracers of Armor, a good DEX (14 for TWF) and an archetype fighter to trade out armor training, its not like your'e gonna need it.
2) Mounted Combat, TWF, Archery, Brawling Well, heres the thing, if you try to specialize in all of these, you will be disappointed. I'm not familiar enough with Red Sonja to tell which of these is most important, but any full BAB will be decent at any of these without trying. Pick one or two to be the main tactic (Hint: Not Brawling) and then just use the rest when appropriate. Human with fighter levels will give you more feats to throw around for stuff like Improved Unarmed Strike. Should be enough to generalize without falling behing expected returns on any given tactic.
3) good stealth and perception skills A few levels in ranger will sort this out. You will already want good DEX for TWF and Archery so just don't tank WIS. Tip: Take the Fighter levels first, and spread the few points you have, then ranger later and fill to cap. If you take ranger early then you will be forced to spread the points to not go over the Max ranks= Level barrier.
4)her third highest (or higher ability score) in Charisma You know, appearence is not CHA. They don't have to be related at all, so unles you want to use the CHA skills, maybe reconsider how important this is. As is your concept is pretty MAD, so I say, roll and hope for a good set. You want STR,CON,DEX/CHA,WIS,INT. in that order, about. But INT can't go below 10, DEX needs a 14 and the rest want bonuses. So, Good Rolling.
5) On Mounts I say unless you go for a mounted ranger and ditch the fighter levels, youre better off buying mounts as needed and taking fighter levels for more feats rather than cavalier or such to get a bonded mount. EXCEPTION: If your gonna create a custom Cavalier order and archetype for her, in which case the challenges and order requirements are thematically appropriate. But that is the realm of homebrewing so please mention if you are open to that.
In conclusion I feel you will be happiest with a fighter build, with an archetype and 3 levels of ranger sprinkled in.
Brambleman
Ninja Stuff
Yeah, ninjaed for most of my post.
*Sigh* Brambleman
Remember, you can take skill focus to boost skills whether or not you have a high skill in the key ability. That's one way to excel at something, such as Perception, without having a high Wisdom. One skill focus feat gives the same bonus as +6 to an ability score.
Also, you don't want to spread everything around. The way I remember it, Red Sonja was not necessarily that good at things like gaining the initiative (oftentimes the evil wizard would get the initiative so that Sonja would have a more interesting fight on her hands). Even in the intimidation department, I don't know if it was that she was that good at making threats, or if it was that if people knew what she could do, she could intimidate.
In the movie, she couldn't even intimidate a 10 year old emperor. She just made his bodyguard afraid that she actually would carry through on her threat to turn him over her knee and spank him (And wouldn't you?) and the bodyguard knew that if she did, there would be nothing he could do about it.
So I'd pick a few skills that she actually has to have, and a bunch of skills that might be nice. I find it helpful to put just one rank in basic skills like Swim, Climb, and Escape Artist just to get the training bonus and so that you can try to make a basic check, and then maximize a few after that. So taking your first level as Ranger could actually help you because then you can start out with a rank in basic skills.
Forget Improved Unarmed Strike --- Catch Off-guard, the bar-fighter's friend.
I'm going to assume that the novelized Red Sonja is based on the Marvel comic books as the character appeared in only one tale by Robert E. Howard in which you would have to say that she had a pretty high charisma. The Marvel character is actually closer to Howard's Sword Woman, Dark Agnes. In fact, many of Marvel's tales were based on her short stories. She was a straight swordswoman with a distinct code. They called her "Death's Mistress".
Red Sonja would be a straight fighter. The sword was her chosen weapon though there might be some debate as to whether it was a saber or scimitar or a longsword. Speed, dexterity, and an intense, often savage, desire to inflict damage were her stock in trade. I would look into some of the fighter archetypes and perhaps dip into those weapons that react to Weapon's Finesse. It would require a feat but the Elven Curve Blade might work.
I would look into some of the feat trees based off of Combat Expertise, especially Improved Trip. And I would get Combat Reflexes.
I don't have enough background in the system to give a recommendation but Mobile Fighter might work. She would also work with a sword and board. But fighter is the way to go. Unlike Howard's barbarian Sonja has never been multi-classed.
Although if you wanted to go barbarian (it need not be a cultural thing - there are barbarian ragers in many civilized countries) then Invulnerable Rager or Savage Barbarian might work.
But I would stick with a Fighter.
My reason for thinking of her as a Barbarian is from the novels by David Smith. In those, she does seem to get angry at times, and its as if she gets into a martial mode which is different from her normal mode. Although it's been a while since I've read the novels, and it could just be the "lack of personality" aspect I noticed in them, where it seemed that she did what she needed to for the plot.
On the other hand, her martial ability was established as being partially of divine origin, and she doesn't seem to be a Paladin (although if based off the movies, you could make an argument for the Paladin class). Given that I've already considered cultures in which Barbarians attribute their rage abilities to a divine connection with their totem, imagining Red Sonja as having a divine connection to her goddess, granting her increased Strength and other abilities when she needs them, seems to be fitting with the way she is portrayed in the novels.
Would you consider dropping TWF. As this would free up several feats and let you take the Free Hand Fighter archetype. Among other benefits, it grants a scaling dodge bonus to AC. It's also got some good stuff for combat maneuvers.
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I'd suggest a straight Barbarian build - it has the skills, the mobility, and not so much reliance on armour. Rage also ups Strength and Constitution, so you can still be impressive in those Ability Scores when you need to be, but focus on a Dex-based combat build otherwise (for Two-Weapon Fighting, archery, and general AC and Skill boosts). How 'civilised' you are doesn't really come into it - Pathfinder Barbarians aren't illiterate! ;)
For the comic-book babe-factor I'd suggest taking a look at the Charming Trait (page 330 of the APG), with some Charisma and Charisma-based Skills, but not focusing on them too much.
Archery and mounted combat can be done by anyone - Feats spent on these are just gravy, unless they're a real focus for the character. Two-Weapon Fighting, on the other hand, relies on Feats to work at all.
Improved Unarmed Strike isn't a bad call, since it can be used nicely in Two-Weapon Fighting as much as any light weapon, and if you take the Brawler rage power (APG page 74) you do extra damage with it too. If you have Two-Weapon Fighting already, then you'll have no need for the Greater Brawling rage power either.
For armour, just take a Chain Shirt and call it a chain-mail bikini - Bracers of Armour are a real waste for any class who can actually wear real armour, and if you look at most of the pictures in the books you can easily get away with calling Sonja's 'armour' a chain shirt... It's also a good choice for a high-Dexterity Barbarian, since it allows you the full benefits from your Fast Movement class feature and allows you to be a really mobile combatant.
A chain shirt allows you a Dex bonus to AC of up to +4, so you'll be looking at an 18 Dexterity. If you're allowed Mithral items, then a Mithral chain shirt allows a Dex bonus to AC of up to +6, so it's worth boosting that Dex to 22.
With a 20 point buy, starting at level 9 (which gives you two Ability Score increases - at levels 4 and 8), you could get a Dex of 22 by starting with 18 in Dex, boosting it to 20 (with the human racial bonus) then to 22 with the two Ability Score boosts from level. That only leaves 3 points to buy other Ability Scores though. If you're allowed to take magic Ability Score boosting belts during character creation, then it may be worth seeing what the best one you can afford is, and work backwards to see how much starting Dexterity this gal actually needs.
If you hit that 22 Dex then chances are, even raging, this character's Dex will be higher than her Str - so Weapon Finesse looks important as a Feat choice.
She'll have 6 Feats by level 9 (including the human bonus Feat). I'd suggest:
Weapon Finesse (level 1)
Two-Weapon Fighting (human bonus)
Double Slice (level 3)
???? (level 5)
Improved Two-Weapon Fighting (level 7)
???? (level 9)
The ???? Feats will depend a lot on what style she'll be employing most of the time. Stuff like Toughness, Dodge, and Two-Weapon Defense will all add to survivability, whilst Improved Unarmed Strike or Catch Off-Guard will improved the flavour of the character. If you're looking at using a scimitar with your Two-Weapon Fighting, then Improved Critical for the level 9 Feat is really good... unless you already have a magically keen weapon. Otherwise Critical Focus is the gateway Feat into the various 'Critical' Feats - and Two-Weapon Fighting builds tend to rely on getting in more criticals in order to be viable. Weapon Focus and similar 'bread and butter' Feats are never a bad idea, of course.
I'd also suggest looking at either the Heart of the Fields or Heart of the Wilderness Alternate Racial Traits (APG page 23) which are both excellent choices for a Barbarian character.
I seem to recall there being a barbarian archetype aimed at characters with the Conan/Red Sonja dress sense.
Heres a partial statblock for one possible build:
Red Sonja
Female human Free Hand Fighter 7, Guide Ranger 2
Medium humanoid (human)
Init +2; Senses Perception +X
Defense
AC 13, touch 13, flat-footed 10 (+2 Dex, +2 Dodge)
hp (9d10+18)
Fort +10, Ref +7, Will +3
Offensive Abilities: Ranger focus +2, 1/day
Offense
Speed 30 ft.
Melee Longsword +13 (1d8+4)
Statistics
Str 18, Dex 14, Con 14, Int 13, Wis 12, Cha 10
Base Atk +9; CMB +13 (+15 Trip) CMD 25
Feats Power Attack, Combat Expertise, Improved Disarm, Weapon focus (Longsword), Dodge, Furious Focus, Combat Reflexes, Mobility, Combat Patrol, Deadly Aim, Rapid Shot;
Languages Common, one other
SQ Deceptive Strike, Elusive, Singleton, Combat Style: Archery
This is with no gear at all save a nonmagical longsword. I also did not fill in skills. You will want Bracers of Armor with this. But it covers skills, fighting, Brawling via combat maneuvers (disarm because of the free hand fighters ability at lv9), and Archery.
The movie version back in the 80's was a miserable failure
Fun fact: Schwarzenegger himself even said "It's the worst film I have ever made." He joked, "Now, when my kids get out of line, they're sent to their room and forced to watch Red Sonja ten times. I never have too much trouble with them."
That's just evil!
If this helps:
Red Sonja
Fighter: 11
Strength: 14
Intelligence: 17
Wisdom: 10
Dexterity: 17
Constitution: 11
Charisma: 18
Hit Points: 75
Sonja is surprised only on a 1 in 1d6.
Equipment: broadsword, dagger, leather armor
Stats are based of the AD&D 1e rules (1986) for RS1 Red Sonja Unconquered. PC pre-gen.
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Sorry... I forgot to mention weapon choices for the 'Finesse Barbarian' concept...
Weapon Finesse limits your choices of melee weapons to light weapons and those specifically called out as 'finessable'.
A scimitar, using the Dervish Dance Feat (if you have access to it - it's on page 286 of the Inner Sea World Guide), and Improved Unarmed Strike would be one possibility for Two-Weapon Fighting, and a couple of ranks in Perform (dance) probably isn't out of character.
An Aldori dueling sword (Inner Sea World Guide page 290) is basically a Finessable longsword if you take the Exotic Weapon Proficiency with it.
Otherwise it's limited to short swords and similar.
If you're looking specifically for a longword-using build, then it's better to forget the Weapon Finesse, lower the Dex to what you need for the Two-Weapon Fighting Feats (min 17 for Improved Two-Weapon Fighting, although an 18 would be better for the extra +1 on AC, Reflex saves, Dex-based Skills, and ranged attacks), and build-up the character's Strength instead. In which case, it's probably worth taking a look at the sawtooth sabre (Inner Sea World Guide page 290 again) which, with the Exotic Weapon Proficiency, is basically a longsword which allows you to use two of the things in Two-Weapon Fighting using the lower penalties for fighting with a one-handed and a light weapon.
fighter 5 duelist 4 possibly, or maybe fighter 5 duelist 2 (ex)monk 2, might be LN or N
templesword, longsword or possible scimitar
As a DM I'd allow a longsword to be wielded with flurry and the dervish feat. Go for the free hand fighter and be liberal with kicks to the groin, punches with the pommel of ur sword, free hand or flat of the blade any of which might qualify for stunning fist. A decent AC should be possible though it works more smoothly with a little houseruling for style
I do not consider her a barbarian, but possibly a straight fighter or fighter / duelist.
str, pretty high, though str 13 might be enough if dervish dance is allowed
dex, highest if dervish is used or otherwise just behind strength most likely
constitution, just a fair score 12 to 14 most likely
intelligence 14 would be suitable
wisdom 14 would be alright I guess
charisma not terribly important, unless you go by 1st edition stats where every woman in fantasy had at least cha 15, a 10 or even an 8 would not ruin the character, ranks in intimidate and good looks doesnt need charisma.
str 13
dex 20
con 12
int 14
wis 14
cha 08
this set might work in my campaign with a 20 point buy, pb 25 will likely see str and con raised to 14, without duelist int would drop to 13 and str to 14
The movie version back in the 80's was a miserable failure
Fun fact: Schwarzenegger himself even said "It's the worst film I have ever made." He joked, "Now, when my kids get out of line, they're sent to their room and forced to watch Red Sonja ten times. I never have too much trouble with them."
That's just evil!
I must be the only guy in America who liked the 1980s Red Sonja movie.
This is actually a feat-heavy build any which way you slice it. I think RS as a mix of warrior classes (Fighter, Ranger, Barbarian all seem plausible) is interesting. I was able to get the below -
This gives you a good mix of skills and options - Duelist for the Int to AC is cool here... I think eventually fighting one-handed is more appealing as a duelist, so that's kind of a shame for the TWF abilities... but good to have options?
Normal:
Rapier & Dagger +16/+11 and +15 (1d6+7 and 1d4+5)
AC 26
Dagger set to defend:
Rapier & Dagger +16/+11 and +13 (1d6+7 and 1d4+3)
AC 28
Combat Expertise up:
Rapier and Dagger +14/+9 and +13 (1d6+7 and 1d4+5)
AC 29
Set the Dagger to defend and Combat Expertise: AC 31
Here's the full stat block:
RED SONJA CR 8
Female Human (Keleshite) Fighter 6 Ranger 2 Duelist 1
CG Medium Humanoid (Human)
Init +5; Senses Perception +12
--------------------
DEFENSE
--------------------
AC 26, touch 18, flat-footed 19 (+7 armor, +1 shield, +6 Dex, +1 deflection, +1 dodge)
hp 73 (9d10+9)
Fort +9, Ref +11, Will +2
Defensive Abilities Bravery +2, Canny Defense +1
--------------------
OFFENSE
--------------------
Spd 30 ft.
Melee +2 Defending Dagger +15 (1d4+5/19-20/x2) and
+2 Rapier +16/+11 (1d6+7/15-20/x2) and
Unarmed Strike +14/+9 (1d3+2/20/x2)
Special Attacks Precise Strike, Weapon Training: Blades, Light
Ranger Spells Known (CL 0, 11 melee touch, 14 ranged touch):
--------------------
STATISTICS
--------------------
Str 14, Dex 18/20, Con 13, Int 14, Wis 10, Cha 12
Base Atk +9; CMB +11; CMD 29
Feats Combat Expertise +/-3, Dodge, Double Slice, Improved Critical: Rapier, Mobility, Spring Attack, Two-weapon Defense, Two-weapon Fighting, Weapon Finesse, Weapon Focus: Rapier, Weapon Specialization: Rapier
Traits Charming, Threatening Defender
Skills Acrobatics +16, Bluff +6, Climb +6, Escape Artist +9, Handle Animal +5, Heal +4, Intimidate +10, Knowledge: Dungeoneering +6, Knowledge: Geography +6, Knowledge: Local +3, Perception +12, Perform: Dance +6, Ride +9, Sense Motive +7, Stealth +16, Survival +10, Swim +6
Languages Common, Dwarven, Kelish, Osiriani
SQ Armor Training 1 (Ex), Enemies: Humanoids (Human) (+2 bonus) (Ex), Track +1, Wild Empathy +3 (Ex)
Combat Gear +2 Defending Dagger, +2 Rapier, Chain Mail Bikini; Other Gear Belt of Incredible Dexterity, +2, Ring of Protection, +1, Wand of Cure Light Wounds
--------------------
SPECIAL ABILITIES
--------------------
Armor Training 1 (Ex) Worn armor -1 check penalty, +1 max DEX.
Bravery +2 (Ex) +2 Will save vs. Fear
Canny Defense +1 (Ex) +INT bonus to AC (max Duelist level).
Charming +1 Bluff/Diplomacy/save DC for a language-dependant spell vs. targets who could be sexually attracted to you.
Combat Expertise +/-3 Bonus to AC in exchange for an equal penalty to attack.
Enemies: Humanoids (Human) (+2 bonus) (Ex) +2 to rolls vs Humanoids (Human).
Mobility +4 to AC against some attacks of opportunity.
Precise Strike (Ex) Extra damage when using light / 1-handed Piercing weapons.
Spring Attack You can move - attack - move when attacking with a melee weapon.
Track +1 +1 to survival checks to track.
Two-weapon Defense +1 to AC while wielding 2 weapons. +2 when doing so defensively.
Weapon Training: Blades, Light +1 (Ex) +1 Attack, Damage, CMB, CMD with Light Blades
Wild Empathy +3 (Ex) Improve the attitude of an animal, as if using Diplomacy.
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I think a one-handed scimitar fighter would be interesting too, and less feat intensive with the TWF deal.
Ok, so a one-handed Scimitar fighter is actually really cool:
BAB is way up as is damage.
Normal:
Melee +3 Scimitar +20/+15 (1d6+15/15-20/x2) and AC 31
Combat Expertise:
Melee +3 Scimitar +18/+12 (1d6+15/15-20/x2) and AC 34
RED SONJA CR 8
Female Human (Keleshite) Duelist 3 Fighter (Free Hand Fighter) 6
CG Medium Humanoid (Human)
Init +8; Senses Perception +12
--------------------
DEFENSE
--------------------
AC 31, touch 24, flat-footed 19 (+7 armor, +9 Dex, +2 deflection, +3 dodge)
hp 64 (9d10)
Fort +6, Ref +10, Will +3
Defensive Abilities Canny Defense +3, Parry
--------------------
OFFENSE
--------------------
Spd 30 ft.
Melee +3 Scimitar +20/+15 (1d6+15/15-20/x2) and
Unarmed Strike +16/+11 (1d3+2/20/x2)
Special Attacks Precise Strike, Singleton +1
--------------------
STATISTICS
--------------------
Str 12, Dex 20/22, Con 11, Int 14/16, Wis 10, Cha 12
Base Atk +9; CMB +10 (+12 Disarming); CMD 34 (36 vs. Disarm)
Feats Combat Expertise +/-3, Dervish Dance, Dodge, Improved Critical: Scimitar, Mobility, Spring Attack, Vital Strike, Weapon Finesse, Weapon Focus: Scimitar, Weapon Specialization: Scimitar
Traits Charming, Threatening Defender
Skills Acrobatics +17, Bluff +6, Climb +5, Escape Artist +10, Handle Animal +5, Heal +1, Intimidate +10, Knowledge: Dungeoneering +7, Knowledge: Geography +4, Knowledge: Local +4, Perception +12, Perform: Dance +6, Ride +10, Sense Motive +7, Stealth +14, Survival +6, Swim +5, Use Magic Device +10
Languages Common, Dwarven, Kelish, Osiriani, Polyglot
SQ Deceptive Strike +2 (Ex), Elusive +2 (Ex), Enhanced Mobility (Ex)
Combat Gear +3 Scimitar, Chain Mail Bikini; Other Gear Belt of Incredible Dexterity, +2, Headband of Vast Intelligence, +2: Use Magic Device, Ring of Protection, +2, Wand of Cure Light Wounds
--------------------
SPECIAL ABILITIES
--------------------
Canny Defense +3 (Ex) +INT bonus to AC (max Duelist level).
Charming +1 Bluff/Diplomacy/save DC for a language-dependant spell vs. targets who could be sexually attracted to you.
Combat Expertise +/-3 Bonus to AC in exchange for an equal penalty to attack.
Deceptive Strike +2 (Ex) +2 to Disarm CMB/CMD, Bluff checks to feint or create a diversion to hide.
Dervish Dance Use Dex modifier instead of Str modifier with scimitar
Elusive +2 (Ex) +2 Dodge AC
Enhanced Mobility (Ex) +4 AC vs attacks of opportunity while moving out of a square.
Mobility +4 to AC against some attacks of opportunity.
Parry (Ex) Forego an attack to defend against enemy attacks.
Precise Strike (Ex) Extra damage when using light / 1-handed Piercing weapons.
Singleton +1 (Ex) +1 to hit and damage when weilding a one-handed melee weapon.
Spring Attack You can move - attack - move when attacking with a melee weapon.
Vital Strike Standard action: x2 weapon damage dice.
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Pathfinder® and associated marks and logos are trademarks of Paizo Publishing, LLC®, and are used under license.
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The subject says it all.
How can we create a full (or nearly full) BAB character with no armor but a High AC, Archery, mounted combat, Two weapon fighting, brawling, good stealth and perception skills and her third highest (or higher ability score) in Charisma...WHEEEEE!
We are trying to create characters based upon movie-comic arch-types and this is one my wife choose. I usually play a thief (uh...I meant "rogue." Showing my age...) and am out of my depth in D&D 3.5--Pathfinder.
The materials used should (MUST) be Paizo or "Pathfinder" compatible. VERY rare exceptions might be made for allowing WotC 3.5 material in.
I'm relatively new to 3.x - Pathfinder. I own the Core Rules and APG. My follow gamers and DM have all the Paizo published works and materials between them for our use.
I would very much appreciate ANY insight or suggestions that you may have on the matter.
Thank you for your (timely) consideration!
UGM!
Ranger/Barbarian using the invulnerable barbarian variant.
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/barbarian#TOC-Invulnerable-Rag er
I should mention this: in many of the pictures I've seen of her, it looks like she has a large sword that she sometimes wields one handed, and sometimes two. This suggests she has a bastard sword and the Exotic Weapon Proficiency feat that lets her use it one handed when she wants to, leaving her other hand free to do other things, like punch and grapple and stuff. Thus, I'd consider the feats:
* Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Bastard Sword)
* Improved Unarmed Attack
* Two Weapon Fighting.
+1 invulnerable rager.
This picture and this one scream barbarian to me.
Take the mount and the defensive stance rage powers. If possible the pounce ones (more AC, and I see her jump and savagely kill a lot of times).
Take the TWF, ITWF and quickdraw line of feats. Take mounted combat feats. Power Attack, double Slice. Just quickdraw the bow and shoot when needed, away.
If needed, dip 2 levels fighter.
Done.
The argument against Invulnerable Rager is the loss of the uncanny dodge and improved uncanny dodge class features, which also seem really in keeping with the character.
Uh, good catch. She's often portrayed surrounded by a bunch of people she slaughter... so I guess lose UD is a no-no.
O_o ho to improve her AC then? Force the fighter dip and refluff the bikini as suggested I guess :/
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Fighter levels always seem a waste to me if the character's not planning on using heavy armour... but that's more of a personal thing.
In this case some levels of the Two-Weapon Warrior archetype would seem like a reasonable idea... Barbarian 6 / Fighter (Two-Weapon Warrior) 3 looks like a good mix (Fighter levels would give 2 extra Feats and a +1 dodge bonus whilst two-weapon fighting) - but I'd only do it if the extra Feats were really needed, otherwise Pathfinder characters tend to benefit more from sticking to single-class builds.
High Dex bonus to AC and a magical chainmail bikini (plus any rings of protection and amulets of natural armour going spare) seems the way to go for AC. She really just needs to kill all the bad guys before they get a turn... ;)
Also, a straight level 9 Barbarian will have 4 rage powers - Guarded Stance or Rolling Dodge will get her back the 2 AC she loses when raging (Vs melee and ranged respectively) if AC is a concern.
Personally I'd skip the mounted combat Feats - you just need to buy a combat trained horse. I'd also skip any ranged combat Feats - a good Dex and full BAB will cover her in that department.
If not going the Weapon Finesse route, then maybe...
Strength 14 (5 points)
Dexterity 18 (5 points for 14 to start, +2 from human, +2 from levels)
Constitution 14 (5 points)
Intelligence 10
Wisdom 12 (2 points)
Charisma 13 (3 points)
... Which is a broad spread, but still viable. All three physicals will be 18 when she's raging.
Then for Feats...
Two-Weapon Fighting (level 1)
Double Slice (human bonus)
Two-Weapon Defense (level 3)
Dodge (level 5)
Improved Two-Weapon Fighting (level 7)
Combat Reflexes (level 9)
And for rage powers...
Guarded Stance (level 2)
Rolling Dodge (level 4)
Brawler (level 6)
Increased Damage Reduction (level 8)
... or something along those lines.
AC is 20 (24 Fighting Defensivly, assuming using Two-Weapon Defense and at least 3 ranks in Acrobatics) with a chain shirt / bikini, before figuring-in magic, and she has DR 2/-. At 46,000 standard wealth-by-level a +4 or +5 mithral chain shirt isn't out of the question, maybe...
+4 mithral chain shirt (17,100gp)
+2 ring of protection (8,000gp)
+2 amulet of natural armour (8,000gp)
... for 33,100gp, and a total AC of 28 (32 Fighting Defensivly). Dropping each of those items by 1 AC saves 19,000gp and lowers her AC to 25 (29 Fighting Defensivly) if the gold's needed elsewhere.
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I must be the only guy in America who liked the 1980s Red Sonja movie.
Not at all. That movie is the reason I play D&D. My dad took me to see in theaters when I was ten and about a month later bought the Red Box Basic.
Red Sonja is definitely a Barbarian. I'd build her with the Savage Barbarian archetype. But you need the Barbarian's fast movement. Guarded Stance, Rolling Dodge and Raging Leaper are all essential powers.
I'd also give a her a unique rage power that gives her Favored Enemy (Human Males) while raging, treating her as a Ranger of her level. Because she really hates men. Really, really hates them.
And she should have a high CHA not because she's so hawt, but because her zealotic commitment to whatever has gotten a bug up her skirt this time tends to be infectious - there are many stories in which Red Sonja is leading a group of warriors and demonstrates the sort of leadership skills that will get men to follow you through the gates of hell.
Red Sonja does not strike me as a man-hater. In the movie and in the books she has good relations with some males.
She just hates the normal run-of-the mill man who upon seeing her will first think of how to get her out of her bikini. But if a guy treats her as a warrior, not a wench, she can develop a decent friendship with him.
Red Sonja does not strike me as a man-hater. In the movie and in the books she has good relations with some males.
She just hates the normal run-of-the mill man who upon seeing her will first think of how to get her out of her bikini. But if a guy treats her as a warrior, not a wench, she can develop a decent friendship with him.
Red Sonja has always been described as stronger then most men, part of her divine oath to her goddess. Said Oath also says no sexual relations with a man who does not beat her in battle. Thus, she can form platonic friendships, but if you want more then lip service you MUST beat her in a fight.
And no man ever really did. Conan made a half-hearted attempt, but he doesn't like fighting women and didn't put his heart into it.
She's also VERY fast, and a master swordsman, not a rager. She's not a barbarian. I believe she's the daughter of a smith, but she might even be noble born.
----
Note that the only serious woman swordsman in the core Conan novels is Valeria of the Red Brotherhood.
==Aelryinth
Incredible advice! I thank you all.
My wife's concept is based on the four comic book editions of Red Sonja, Queen Sonja, A one shot Red Sonja (entitled Break the Skin, I think...) and another issue...all of which I just picked up from my favorite local comics and games shop this past week.
The movie version back in the 80's was a miserable failure (and the Mrs. did not see that anyhow--not a gamer then!) I've seen a trade paperback featuring R.E. Howard's fighting women along the lines of Kull and Conan and El Borak (my favorite!) but I haven't picked it up yet.
I'd drop the mounted thing featured in this month's comic, because (as most of you have pointed out) this character concept is wicked MAD and is based on a character build we are NOT going to see anytime soon. We are building with 20 points per Pathfinder Core Rules and starting at 9th level. We will be ending at 16th level maximum. System breaks down at 15, this group has found (8th level spells, I've heard...) so no (PC) arcane magic user is a full caster class--they have at least ONE level of a non-casting class. The NPC's are under no such restriction.
I was hoping that we'd use Pathfinder with the d20 Conan RPG as it seems more fitting to the character types the players are creating, but we are playing in a heavily magic'd (all low level stuff (<4th level) is common and stuff beyond/requiring 5th level spells is rare.
I hope this additional information is helpful in making any suggestions you may have.
One last thing--all PC's get the leadership feat automatically. Almost everyone has selected a spell caster if they're playing a non-caster OR a body guard if they are playing a spell caster. The purpose being that we have to create most of the +2 or greater magic items we wish to have/use.
Uh...two last things, actually! The PC's are not always allied with each other. A loyal friend may, due to changes of fortune or the realities of politics become your enemy and vice versa. So playing a PC's cohort tends to be...
Some questions:
B.T.W. here is EnWorld's mock up for her and a proposed level progression.
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Red Sonja does not strike me as a man-hater. In the movie and in the books she has good relations with some males.
She just hates the normal run-of-the mill man who upon seeing her will first think of how to get her out of her bikini. But if a guy treats her as a warrior, not a wench, she can develop a decent friendship with him.
Dude, Red Sonja is the living personification of women's rage at male sexual violence. You're right that she can develop some degree of friendship with men who aren't pigs, but her whole raison d'etre is revenging women.
She got her skills and supernatural abilities (i.e. super strength, toughness, ability to kill trained warriors by the dozen) from the goddess Scáthach, who chose her -- when she was 17, lying half-dead in a snowy field after having been raped and left for dead -- to be the vessel for Scáthach's rage against men. She wanders around the world wearing a chainmail bikini just to tempt men into trying to get fresh with her...so she can "justifiably" kill them.
She's totally a man-hater to the core of her being. She may have male friends, but she has them in the same way a KKK member might have black friends: she doesn't respect them, they have to jump through a lot of hoops to earn anything more than sneering contempt, and she'd let them die by the droves if it would save one girl.
EDITED TO ADD: And she's definitely a Barbarian. Maybe not in the sense of being uncivilized, but in terms of class abilities? Oh yeah, for sure. She's also a rager for certain, that's why they call her the She-Devil With A Sword and men tremble at the fury of Red Sonja.
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She could easily be a fighter, a ranger, or a barbarian.
I would go the route of the fighter, because you're going to need a LOT of feats. Fighters have more feats than they know what to do with, and you're going to need archery, mounted, two-weapon fighting, and unarmed combat feats all on the same person.
Vanilla fighter is a lot better than many folks on the boards give it credit, and the archetypes are pretty amazing.
<link to Inzeladun Red Sonja build by level>
Love that Inzeladun site. She's a straight 3E fighter there.
That site also has a great 3E Conan build by level and of course lots of NPCs.
Dude, Red Sonja is the living personification of women's rage at male sexual violence. You're right that she can develop some degree of friendship with men who aren't pigs, but her whole raison d'etre is revenging women.
Which brings up the question of "What aspect(s) of Red Sonja is she looking for?
If you/she is looking for a strong, capable, warrior-type uber-hottie, without the strong "man-hating" aspects, she should check out the Bêlit (from the Conan story "Queen of the Black Coast")
Oh, and if you are worried about Armor Class, keep in mind, this trope. ... which does apply to Pathfinder.
Fun fact, Red Sonya is almost completely a creation of Marvel comics. Robert E.Howard did write a character called "Red Sonja", but she was a gun-totting swashbuckler in Renaissance Europe who fought against the Ottomans.
So a Fighter/Gunslinger might be more appropriate. :)
Fun fact, Red Sonya is almost completely a creation of Marvel comics. Robert E.Howard did write a character called "Red Sonja", but she was a gun-totting swashbuckler in Renaissance Europe who fought against the Ottomans.
So a Fighter/Gunslinger might be more appropriate. :)
Yup. A Roy Thomas thing as I recall.
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Yup. A Roy Thomas thing as I recall.Fun fact, Red Sonya is almost completely a creation of Marvel comics. Robert E.Howard did write a character called "Red Sonja", but she was a gun-totting swashbuckler in Renaissance Europe who fought against the Ottomans.
So a Fighter/Gunslinger might be more appropriate. :)
Quite right. Red Sonja was created by Marvel to have a "female Conan." She was created around the same time as She-Hulk, Ms. Marvel, Spider-Woman and a few other gender swaps of classic Marvel heroes.
Ah, the 70s. When comic producers were all "What's this feminism thing? Can we cash in on that? Let's cash in on that."
The old TSR module Red Sonja Unconquered gives our heroine the following stats:
Fighter 11
Str 14
Int 17
Wis 10
Dex 17
Con 11
Cha 18
HP: 75
Sonja is surprised only on a 1 in 1d6.
Equipment: broadsword, dagger, leather armor.
The leather armor is surprising. All of the art depicts her in a chainmail bikini. ;)
Does anyone really have a problem with her wearing a chain mail bikini and treating it as a chain shirt or chain mail?
If not, I'd run her as a fighter 11, or maybe fighter 9/ranger 2