I count 50 posts on this page. Did they just not load for you?

Trust me it's been removed with no reason as to why. It why Toz posted what he did.. the first was in response to my now missing post...

Looks like that was another change in the site upgrade, used to be you could tell a post was missing by the count. Or maybe I miscounted.

I just really don't like feeling being silenced...if I violated a rule...tell me and I will do what i can not to do that again...but to just kill my post cause it seems to pull things into question and may paint paizo in a bad light...sorry we got hustled out of alot of cash with nothing to show for it and still don't have an end game answer....so yea im going to post showing my displeasure in how things are still not answered.

Any comment on the posts disappearing? It seems to only be things that can be interpreted as disparaging toward Paizo. Used to be the old mods would leave behind a comment when they disappeared something explaining that something was missing at least...

We understand that folks are frustrated and need a place to vent but that venting needs to occur without attacks against Paizo or Paizo staff and shouldn't contain unneeded vitriol. Posts that don't adhere to these guidelines will be removed so if you're looking for an outlet to tear Paizo down then please use an alternative social media forum.

As for updates on this project, we have no new news for this week.

So in before the nothing new to report...

Can we get some kind of assurance that ninja division can really cover the shipping in some kind of Timely matter...or will it be 2030 before this little adventure is completed....

Or will this posted be deleted or ignored cause someone feels attacked by a question.

Thanks for the passive aggressive post, <REDACTED>. It serves perfectly to outline the kind of behavior that we are trying to avoid in this thread, so I'm going to leave it up for now as an example of what not to do.

As for any assurances from ND, well you'd have to ask them. They manage their business themselves and we have had very little communication so your guess is as good as mine. I will remind you that there are no assurances or guarantees when it comes to crowdfunded projects and that risk is inherent in every single one.

And there's nothing new to report this week on the status of this project.

Wow...so you are going to use my real name which isn't listed anywhere before and not my community id....

That seems very passive aggessive...you going to put my address out next?

And as far as ND communications....no kidding they don't talk to anyone...ever...

Wow...so you are going to use my real name which isn't listed anywhere before and not my community id.....

You may want to fix your Druid alias’ name then.

Yea...im sure the president of a.company went digging thru my society place holders to find a name...and just happen to pick that one at random...has nothing to due with my account which is held on your side due to past purchases...

Still doesn't answer why it was used over my ghost725 id.. like every other time I was addressed

No I mean I literally know your name now and if you don’t want that you should update it.

Nice save by doing a edit to your post by removing my intials...

Still ...seems you are the ones being passive agressive...by using players real names like that...and for the record I never said that was my last name was just my first...but strange how you got it right.

You going to put anyone else on blast when you don't like what we say

Nice save by doing a edit to your post by removing my intials...

Just wanted to confirm that the alias was correct without leaving your full name out there. (Like a link to the profile would. Thanks for confirming it. But if you’re fine with having your name out there, I apologize for wasting your time. Edit: Ah, there we go. Hope that was helpful.

Still can't understand why a company president and a 5 star venture leiutent seem so keen on digging up my name let alone using it in a thread where it has never been mentioned before...

Look, I don’t like you, but that doesn’t mean I can’t point out things you might not be aware of to help you.

You don't like me...the only interaction have with you is this...so as a venture leiutent It feel like your trying to attacked and intimidated me....if you were trying to help why not send a private message...

Hey anyone else want to weigh I on this attempt to intimidate a player

The PM system sucks. But fine, carry on then.

Thanks for the passive aggressive post,

Ok, that was seriously not cool. I get that folks on your end aren't any happier about this than the folks on this end, but some people are a little concerned about online privacy. Outing even part of someones real name is disproportionate retribution, and just plain not fighting fair. You're not limited by the editing window, you can and should remove/replace that reference ASAP.

Passive aggressive or not, there's a legitimate point that part of the plan is ninja division spending money on shipping. Ninja division has shown every willingness to simply pocket money and then just say "No" when asked to deliver on an agreement. Having some assurance, contract, escrow, or alternative plan if they go back on their word (again) would go a long way towards assuring people that the end is near and that luci won't be yanking the football away again.

If worse came to worse could pazio stuff the minis in their warehouse and send them out for shipping costs/ ship with another order?

I will remind you that there are no assurances or guarantees when it comes to crowdfunded projects and that risk is inherent in every single one.

If Ninja divisions delivery ship had sunk, the factory had been struck by lightning, they got a freak plastic that melted to all their machinery or...something outside of their control I don't think you'd be seeing this level of rancor. A lot yes (its geeks. Someone will be horribly upset that SOMETHING isn't perfect) but not the full on torch and pitchfork mob you have here.

People crowdfunding a project are entitled to a good faith effort to see that project completed. There is the (not completely unfounded) sense that that simply did not happen here. To all appearances ninja division took the money that was supposed to be for a particular project and instead used it as a general investment in their company... and since they're largely a middleman between the artists and the production that largely involved paying themselves to be at work and cover their overhead while they worked on a sequel to their big hit.

Ninja division had done this before. Paizo was warned repeatedly that Ninja division had done that before. Paizo said they were sure that Ninja Division would deliver on this promise. People would not have trusted ninja division to do this without Paizos say so. People trusted that Paizo had some way of seeing this through.

To all appearances ninja division took the money that was supposed to be for a particular project and instead used it as a general investment in their company...

According to Ninja Division's 2018 reply to the Iowa Attorney General's inquiry about possible fraud around their Super Dungeon Explorer kickstarter ( here), they almost certainly robbed Peter to pay Paul:

Raising the funds needed was attempted (and continues to be attempted) through profits of non-Super

Dungeon projects as well as outside investor funding.

ND has been able to design and produce an expansion for Super Dungeon Explorer since then, despite being $750K behind on the base game and having multiple late kickstarters, such as our Starfinder miniatures.

No updates for this week.

No updates for this week.

Guess we cant get answers to legit questions asked by other players here...

Nor can you come up with a reasonable answer or reason for calling me out by my real name...

I called you by your real name because I wanted to outline how serious we do take this and I don't want folks thinking they can hide behind the anonymity of the internet. All of us Paizo folks are here, no anonymity what-so-ever, and you guys have zero qualms about calling us out, so I wanted to show that we don't either.

And yes, we are taking this seriously, as you can tell because Paizo's President is personally handling this thread. I have a ton of things that occupy my time and I'm choosing to spend some of it here communicating with you guys because this is important.

I called you by your real name because I wanted to outline how serious we do take this and I don't want folks thinking they can hide behind the anonymity of the internet.

I get trying to remind people that there's a fellow human being with thoughts and feelings on the other end of the words, but that came across as a little -muhahaha I know where you live-.. and the above statement is not helping that perception. You can't hide from us so... don't say perfectly true but bad things? Thats not resolving an issue.

We give you that information along with address credit card info etc. because we trust you to keep it private. Not put it out in the open.

All of us Paizo folks are here, no anonymity what-so-ever, and you guys have zero qualms about calling us out, so I wanted to show that we don't either.

Which is a choice you make. Some people make a different choice. They have a right to make that choice. It's against your own rules to divulge personal information about other posters that they don't want disclosed.

So I guess rules for us but not for thee right....

So terms of service only apply to us peons...

cause let me tell you I feel oh so safe with your company having any of my personnel info or credit card info in your system.

I play this game to escape the demons that haunt me...i used anonymity of callsigns so the real world doesn't come crashing down when the pain starts.

While norsewolf may not be too far off about the idea of me avoiding stalker type...thats my story..which I will never share on here...ever...but hey...thanks for exposing me and possible my family to that danger..

As far as calling paizo out I ask question which have no easy answers. I get that but play by your rules...but it seems it's easier to attack me then answer others legit questions and conserens.

Did we just get "We Know Where You Live"d by the president of Paizo?

Checking in, still nothing. Still not buying Paizo.

PEACE

I called you by your real name because I wanted to outline how serious we do take this and I don't want folks thinking they can hide behind the anonymity of the internet. All of us Paizo folks are here, no anonymity what-so-ever, and you guys have zero qualms about calling us out, so I wanted to show that we don't either.

And yes, we are taking this seriously, as you can tell because Paizo's President is personally handling this thread. I have a ton of things that occupy my time and I'm choosing to spend some of it here communicating with you guys because this is important.

Sorry, did you just admit that as the president of Paizo that you are willing to reveal personal information about your customers publicly?

Shame.

Serious Shame. I have supported your company most of my adult gaming career and I wonder just what Lisa would think of this.

Wow.

As a customer I am telling you it is my opinion that this is wrong. I agree that the anonymity of the internet should not protect someone who is abusive. Give their account a ban, remove posting privilege's.

But what exactly do you think your actions here are?

Benign?

This is internet bullying.

I called you by your real name because I wanted to outline how serious we do take this and I don't want folks thinking they can hide behind the anonymity of the internet. All of us Paizo folks are here, no anonymity what-so-ever, and you guys have zero qualms about calling us out, so I wanted to show that we don't either.

And yes, we are taking this seriously, as you can tell because Paizo's President is personally handling this thread. I have a ton of things that occupy my time and I'm choosing to spend some of it here communicating with you guys because this is important.

Really? The president of Paizo just doxxed one of their customers for calling them out on something that is completely true? That is appalling. I was upset at Paizo because they vouched for ND and that clearly meant nothing. Now the president of the company is acting like a petulant child and posting one of their customer's personal information on the forums. Congratulations. Paizo will never see another dime of my money.

Yeah, I know you don't really care, but at least I'll feel better not supporting a company that acts like this.

So, out of curiosity I went over to Amazon. Ninja Division is selling miniatures that are part of the Kick Starter. They're painted and packaged up. So, the backers have gotten the run around for YEARS now and ND is selling the same miniatures on Amazon. This is completely ridiculous. We got screwed!

https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B07JKLQ58K?pf_rd_r=2CEQ61E82KVH77350XCS &pf_rd_p=edaba0ee-c2fe-4124-9f5d-b31d6b1bfbee

https://smile.amazon.com/SFRPG-Mini-Iconic-Heroes-Set/dp/B07JDTRDJ6/ref=pd_ bxgy_img_2/141-1985271-7749824?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B07JDTRDJ6&pd _rd_r=2b96f341-d39b-4d02-8c3a-81827774d4b2&pd_rd_w=KUOfi&pd_rd_wg=L dHyN&pf_rd_p=ce6c479b-ef53-49a6-845b-bbbf35c28dd3&pf_rd_r=C8TR2YMPV ZAX6SY15JRC&psc=1&refRID=C8TR2YMPVZAX6SY15JRC

Shortly someone will be in to tell you that those aren't from the kickstarter, they just look exactly like some of the models you were promised. They were made before the kickstarter to sort of prove to Paizo that ND could do what they claimed to do. And yes they are selling them, and will continue to sell them.

Because there are no repercussions for a company to fail a crowd funding project. Jeff above says that crowd funding inherently has risks and we should all know that when Paizo tells us to have confidence in one of their partners that we should in fact not have that confidence.

I have been quiet lately because Jeff has been fairly active in the thread. Doxing a member of our community, which mind you just by giving out their first name you can cross reference and find out quite a bit about someone.

Jeff needs to go back and edit his post. I don't think he will though because he doubled down on it.

I am telling my friends and my community about Paizo's willingness to put out their customers real information. That is the true repercussion. Word of mouth reputation hits.

Shame.

I am telling my friends and my community about Paizo's willingness to put out their customers real information. That is the true repercussion. Word of mouth reputation hits.

Shame.

Yep, letting all my friends and gaming community contacts know. I took screenshots in case it gets taken down.

Well, funny thing about the new forum is we can see who is reporting the posts. And which ones are getting cleared.

Well, funny thing about the new forum is we can see who is reporting the posts. And which ones are getting cleared.

Wow someone is flagging all our post...wonder why...

Looks like they are rolling back the changes. I found it enlightening to be able to see what posts were flagged and by who though while we could.

Looks like they are rolling back the changes. I found it enlightening to be able to see what posts were flagged and by who though while we could.

So who was flagging us? Or is that against the tos...i don't want you to get in trouble yoshua...also it seems I have some kind of shadow band.. I can't access this threed.. unless I'm in a stealth mode..and use a few other ways just to reach this point to post...

Yoshua wrote:

Looks like they are rolling back the changes. I found it enlightening to be able to see what posts were flagged and by who though while we could.

So who was flagging us? Or is that against the tos...i don't want you to get in trouble yoshua...also it seems I have some kind of shadow band.. I can't access this threed.. unless I'm in a stealth mode..and use a few other ways just to reach this point to post...

Yeah, I am intentionally not naming anyone because that is almost assuredly against the rules. That being said I can't get to this and some of the other blogs by clicking my recent posts. Had to find it by searching for the blog and going through the search. I think it is more likely that this is due to the roll back of the upgrades.

Will say too that I really like the look of the new format, hope they work the kinks out. We definitely should not be able to see who flags posts, and DEFINITELY shouldn't see the cleared flag on the posts reported but deemed ok to leave.

This thread has certainly taken a turn for the worse. If a company executive think that posts are so egregious then warn/ban the poster as per your own existing rules instead of resorting to quasi-doxxing and veiled threats. Just keep in mind that you're likely treating your own customers who cummulatively lost hundreds of thousands of dollars in a harsher fashion than you are the company that took the money.

So, out of curiosity I went over to Amazon. Ninja Division is selling miniatures that are part of the Kick Starter. They're painted and packaged up. So, the backers have gotten the run around for YEARS now and ND is selling the same miniatures on Amazon. This is completely ridiculous. We got screwed!

https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B07JKLQ58K?pf_rd_r=2CEQ61E82KVH77350XCS &pf_rd_p=edaba0ee-c2fe-4124-9f5d-b31d6b1bfbee

https://smile.amazon.com/SFRPG-Mini-Iconic-Heroes-Set/dp/B07JDTRDJ6/ref=pd_ bxgy_img_2/141-1985271-7749824?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B07JDTRDJ6&pd _rd_r=2b96f341-d39b-4d02-8c3a-81827774d4b2&pd_rd_w=KUOfi&pd_rd_wg=L dHyN&pf_rd_p=ce6c479b-ef53-49a6-845b-bbbf35c28dd3&pf_rd_r=C8TR2YMPV ZAX6SY15JRC&psc=1&refRID=C8TR2YMPVZAX6SY15JRC

Just for your information, theses minis were done before the Kick Starter and were available in any game store at the time (and certainly still are in some of them). There were not part of the Kick Starter.

Sandoz wrote:

So, out of curiosity I went over to Amazon. Ninja Division is selling miniatures that are part of the Kick Starter. They're painted and packaged up. So, the backers have gotten the run around for YEARS now and ND is selling the same miniatures on Amazon. This is completely ridiculous. We got screwed!

https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B07JKLQ58K?pf_rd_r=2CEQ61E82KVH77350XCS &pf_rd_p=edaba0ee-c2fe-4124-9f5d-b31d6b1bfbee

https://smile.amazon.com/SFRPG-Mini-Iconic-Heroes-Set/dp/B07JDTRDJ6/ref=pd_ bxgy_img_2/141-1985271-7749824?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B07JDTRDJ6&pd _rd_r=2b96f341-d39b-4d02-8c3a-81827774d4b2&pd_rd_w=KUOfi&pd_rd_wg=L dHyN&pf_rd_p=ce6c479b-ef53-49a6-845b-bbbf35c28dd3&pf_rd_r=C8TR2YMPV ZAX6SY15JRC&psc=1&refRID=C8TR2YMPVZAX6SY15JRC

Just for your information, theses minis were done before the Kick Starter and were available in any game store at the time (and certainly still are in some of them). There were not part of the Kick Starter.

@Sandoz

There it is. Took longer than I thought it would though ;)

@Ilmakis

Absolutely true, every word of it. But they were used as proof of concept which Paizo used to tell us they had confidence in ND and we too should have confidence in the company they were partnering with.

I can see what Jeff was possibly trying to convey, but even in that case it was not appropriate to use customer info in that manner. I agree with Yoshua and the rest that it should be corrected immediately.

I can see what Jeff was possibly trying to convey, but even in that case it was not appropriate to use customer info in that manner. I agree with Yoshua and the rest that it should be corrected immediately.

Been sitting on this a bit. What exactly is your interpretation of what Jeff was trying to convey?

The reasons he said he outted Ghost is not apparent or reflective of Ghosts actual post in question.

So by outting Ghost he is what?

Honestly, not really relevant to the problem of the Kickstarter. And I could certainly be wrong about the goal, so probably better not to air speculations.

This is not the first time Jeff has done this. He did it to me last year. To be honest at the time I didn’t really care but I did think it was offside a bit. He clearly took offence to my comment which I’ll admit was a bit snarky.
I think at the time I commented about him finally showing up to the forums.

And now we are here, with months of Paizo no show and a little dissatisfaction from customers and he handles it the same way.

Classic Paizo? Maybe...trending that way it seems.

Honestly, not really relevant to the problem of the Kickstarter. And I could certainly be wrong about the goal, so probably better not to air speculations.

No need to speculate. He was very clear about what he was doing and I am flabbergasted that anyone could read that and try to justify it. He said in the post it was because of a passive aggressive post. His double down post says it is because us customers shouldn't be able to hide behind the anonymity of the internet when his employees have suffered at the communities postings. Neither of which has anything to do with the post that Ghost made, and is a clear warning shot to the rest of us that if we don't fall in line we could be outted too.

Not to mention all the follow up reports of people calling attention to the issue at hand and a venture captain bringing up Ghost's real name being tied to a character in a public form.

I agree that it isn't relevant, but you brought it up. And I am sincerely wondering what your interpretation of what Jeff said was. But I am used to disappointment, I backed this project and get to deal with people who had nothing to do with it come in and attack the backers because they have the gall to ask for results.

Seriously, every community member should be inflamed that a Paizo employee with access to our personal and financial information has done this and doubled down.