Starfinder Masterclass Miniatures Partnership

Starfinder Masterclass Miniatures Partnership

Thursday, July 25, 2019

Three flaming skeletons with mouths open wide attacking a 4-armed, bipedal alien with grey skin and an angular face and dark pits for eyes. The alien's upper left arm is wielding some sort of yellow energy bolt. The silhouette of another adventurer looking on in horror can be seen in the foreground.

We have some really good news to share about the Starfinder Masterclass miniatures Kickstarter! Paizo is pleased to announce that Archon Studio will be taking over the license to produce Starfinder Masterclass miniatures, formerly produced by Ninja Division. As part of the agreement, Archon will fulfill backer rewards from the Starfinder Masterclass Kickstarter.

About Archon Studio: With their Unicast technology, Archon Studio has published several board games with miniatures, including League of Ancient Defenders, Vanguard of War, and Chronicle X. Recently, Archon Studio advanced its technology to hard plastic, which resulted in even more highly detailed miniatures.

Archon Studio also recently moved into the production of tabletop terrain with Rampart Wargaming. In August this year, its second tabletop terrain project, Dungeons & Lasers, is being launched on Kickstarter.

There are a few areas we want to highlight:

Archon Studio will be producing plastic miniatures instead of resin. They will also be starting over with Kickstarter fulfillment; this means that backers who have already received resin miniatures from Ninja Division will receive those minis again from Archon, this time in plastic.

Archon Studio plans to ship Kickstarter rewards in waves. Approximately every 6 months, the pledge rewards produced during the previous 6 months will be shipped to backers free of charge. Additionally, any time a Kickstarter backer purchases any Starfinder mini from Archon Studio—whether that’s a new mini or a duplicate of a Kickstarter mini—they will also ship any released Kickstarter miniatures due to that backer for no additional charge. Details of which minis are shipping when, and how to purchase other miniatures, will be posted on the Kickstarter page.

Archon Studio will be fulfilling backers in Europe, and Ninja Division will be shipping to the rest of the world. Paizo does not have specific answers to fulfillment questions: if you’re a backer with a question about your order, you’ll need to post the question to the Starfinder Masterclass Kickstarter page.

Thanks for all of your patience as we worked with Ninja Division and Archon to get this done. We’re looking forward to some epic minis!

More Paizo Blog.
Tags: Licensed Products Miniatures Starfinder
401 to 450 of 753 << first < prev | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | 14 | next > last >>
Shadow Lodge

2 people marked this as a favorite.
Yoshua wrote:
Thanks.

You’re welcome.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Pathfinder Accessories, Rulebook Subscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber
Dragnmoon wrote:
Yoshua wrote:
I've also been very clear on how I think it could be fixed.

Do you mean the Store Credit?

I doubt that would happen since they are only the Licensee and not the actual developer of the product. Ninja Division is wholly responsible for the money we gave them. Sure Paizo suggested we get into the Kickstarter and some like me would have not gotten into it in the first place if it was not for that recommendation. But still this kickstarter is a Ninja Division Farce not a Paizo Farce.

Even if Paizo got any money from the licencing of Starfinder it would have been small in comparison to what Ninja Division took in from the Kickstarter.

I doubt it would happen either. Doesn't mean it isn't my preferred solution as someone who at this point doesn't have a desire to play Starfinder (this was supposed to be my big buy in) and am fully vested in PF2.

My second preferred is that Archon be pushed to make this a priority. They are about to start up a second Dungeons and Lasers campaign that from what I can tell already has a large portion of the modeling work done.

We have seen very little progress on the SF mini's side. People who backed this have been given carrots on a string. Cut the string and be honest about it or get us the carrots.

At this point, and many points in the past, all I am asking for is communication. Not getting communication shows just how low on the totem pole we have fallen. Barely a mention at GenCon for Archon starfinder minis, and not even by company name, also shows me just how much faith Paizo is putting in their current 'solution'


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Pathfinder Accessories, Rulebook Subscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber
TOZ wrote:
Yoshua wrote:
Thanks.
You’re welcome.

This made me smile

Liberty's Edge

Paizo Charter Superscriber; Pathfinder Companion, Pathfinder Accessories Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

My guess is that Archon is losing too much money on Starfinder Minis and are in discussion on if they want to even continue it.

That is just speculation.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Pathfinder Accessories, Rulebook Subscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber
Dragnmoon wrote:

My guess is that Archon is losing too much money on Starfinder Minis and are in discussion on if they want to even continue it.

That is just speculation.

Your speculation is a good one. Mine too. Which is why I kick up dirt asking for communication.

With Wizkids coming out, the chances of Archon fulfilling is an even longer shot, which is one of the reasons people seeing it coming out are getting angry again.

Liberty's Edge

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Paizo Charter Superscriber; Pathfinder Companion, Pathfinder Accessories Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

Also the reason WizKids Minis and Ninja Division Minis look similar if they do would be because they are going off the same Art.

Particularly WIzKids loves making their miniatures based on the Art from the books.


Got excited...saw lots of action here. Thought Paizo might have had something to add but see that nothing’s changed.
Will go back to regularly scheduled disappointment in them along with ND.

Liberty's Edge

2 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

This is my very first post about this whole business. I've just been silently following the forum threads ever since the first posts on the original thread that has since been closed. I was one of the big kickstarter supporters (over $200 in), and I would still be silently waiting if not for one major facet about Archon.

I finally caved in and purchased one of their minis, Zo!, with my information about the kickstarter. After two weeks and my order still being 'Processing in Progress', I sent them a message. I got a response basically saying, 'Covid, etc, you'll just have to wait' but obviously written in the nice business style.

The order was placed on 6/21. In two more days, my order of one figure plus hopes of whatever kickstarter stuff they have done will have been 'Processing' for two months. It's kinda disheartening to hear they're working on another project and not shipping out orders.


Dragnmoon wrote:

My guess is that Archon is losing too much money on Starfinder Minis and are in discussion on if they want to even continue it.

That is just speculation.

If they bow out and bail there is going to be atleast 2300 backers from kick start and sarenrae know's how many other silent and late backers calling for blood and fire...

That level if bad PR is enuff to shut down entire future sales and projects..hard to sell products to your fans you have not only burned once but twice...

It saddens me..i was here at the start...i had a bad CRB with the binding issues...i saw great customer service and had my book replaced. I expect that when something is rolled out defective..its what kept me around and part of why I bought into the KS...paizo vouched for this...we helped fund it. If this fail and not a word is spoken or something to make it right I'm sure large parts of the community are going to bail and this once amazing system will be just a bad story told at cons and around gaming tables of what could have been..

Liberty's Edge

2 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Actually, I stand corrected. In a spark of total unexpected convenience, I received a package from Archon today with the one figure I ordered from them, plus what looks like 11 figures from their first two waves. So I have to sincerely apologize to Archon, it looks like they're on top of their stuff!


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Pathfinder Accessories, Rulebook Subscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber
illumina3 wrote:
Actually, I stand corrected. In a spark of total unexpected convenience, I received a package from Archon today with the one figure I ordered from them, plus what looks like 11 figures from their first two waves. So I have to sincerely apologize to Archon, it looks like they're on top of their stuff!

Glad to hear you received them! Most people I heard received orders they just arrived with little/no notice. Glad that worked out.

Still should have had at minimum the first 6 waves done by now, 12 waves really, and people should be receiving minis without having to order them.

I will say that Archon has been VERY limited by their countries postal system. They could only send a very limited number of packages per day. Their Kickstarter deliveries were hampered by this as well. They are saying that the restrictions should be lifted by the end of their up coming kickstarter so heres hoping they will be able to ship store orders faster too.

Paizo Employee VP of Marketing & Licensing

1 person marked this as a favorite.

Greetings, all. I received an updated from Archon Studio about where they're at with the Starfinder miniatures.

Archon Studio uses Global Express to offer low-cost shipping worldwide, and they have extended their shipment restrictions due to the pandemic. If you have good Polish language skills, or use Chrome and auto-translate, you can see the updates here:

Global Express Services

There are faster and more expensive services (FedEx and UPS) available to them, but they can't absorb those costs for shipments. They continue to hold Wave 3 until they get to the point where they can offer less expensive shipping; they can't afford to absorb the additional costs via more expensive alternatives.

Good Gaming!

-Jim


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Pathfinder Accessories, Rulebook Subscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber
Jim Butler wrote:

Greetings, all. I received an updated from Archon Studio about where they're at with the Starfinder miniatures.

Archon Studio uses Global Express to offer low-cost shipping worldwide, and they have extended their shipment restrictions due to the pandemic. If you have good Polish language skills, or use Chrome and auto-translate, you can see the updates here:

Global Express Services

There are faster and more expensive services (FedEx and UPS) available to them, but they can't absorb those costs for shipments. They continue to hold Wave 3 until they get to the point where they can offer less expensive shipping; they can't afford to absorb the additional costs via more expensive alternatives.

Good Gaming!

-Jim

Jim. I appreciate the shipping update, but the question is the time line for the 6 month shipments. It was supposed to be enough waves for shipments to kickstarter backers every 6 months and we are over a year in at wave 3... With no shipments to kickstarter backers... It is more of a question of progressing on the sculpts and timelines than it is on how long it will take them to ship store orders.....

I want to thank you again for taking time to stop in and give the update you have.... was just hoping for timelines on development more than how long it will take for them to ship out store orders.

Will also say, as a backer of their Dungeons and Lasers lines their next kickstarter which starts at the end of this month has the reward that they are shipping out any DL1 items ordered in DL2 pledgemanger within 72 hours of closing your pledge.... They are advertising this on their 'preview' kickstarter page that they emailed out for DL1 backers to take a look at.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Pathfinder Accessories, Rulebook Subscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber
Jim Butler wrote:
Ghost725 wrote:

- If you are a Kickstarter backer, all you have to do is purchase any one of these minis and we will send you all of the original Starfinder ones. For example: order Zo! And you will get the other 6 minis for free. More info about Kickstarter fulfilment can be found.....

All I have to say is WTF...now I have pay more to get my order...

You don't have to make a purchase to receive your miniatures. The minis will be sent out in waves (roughly every 6 months) after they've produced enough of them to make the shiping viable.

-Jim

This is the post I am referencing for those every 6 months after they produced enough to make shipping viable. Feels like they stopped production at this point on the models.


I guess "13 months and counting" and "6 months" are "roughly the same?"

This is more a question of manufacturing timing than anything. Unless the conclusion is that Archon and Paizo lied to us about the timing of the shipments, and are deliberately stalling on fulfillment in hopes they'll be in better shape financially later?

The answer provided emphatically does not answer the question of why the waves are so far apart...


I strongly suspect there are multiple issues at play but that's just conjecture on my part. I frequent several minis specific forums and European boutique minis companies have had ALOT of problems with delayed shipments with non-essential international shipping closing down for weeks to months at a time and then having to deal with backlog. People are just now reporting getting shipments confirmed by postal services as received back in march and arriving in mid to late August.

Then there is the issue of whether or not Archon actually sent out waves to those who didn't pay to order other items from their catalog. The waves themselves are running significantly behind with them only being on wave 3 when they should be IIRC at over 6 now (wasn't it initially monthly?). Backers are unfortunately at their discretion and they're not going to run their company into the ground for someone else's mistakes. Heck, they didn't want to make good on their own mistakes with the AVP kickstarter that didn't deliver full pledges to roughly half the backers despite the products being on the market for years until they were on the cusp of ending their license and would have been forced to destroy the remaining product.

If there is someone to blame, it's definitely ND and to a lesser extent Paizo for not having enough failsafes/oversight in their contract to prevent the debacle in the first place. I fully admit that they may not have been in a position to demand them but that doesn't help backers either. At this point, unless you feel like ordering something else from Archon, you should consider the amount pledged as a loss and anything you might possibly get in the future as a bonus. Archon is IMO disincentivized from releasing too much now that there is a competing minis line in roughly the same scale for the same game from a bigger company. I know I'll probably get anger directed at me from backers but you deserve to hear what is likely the truth even if it hurts. I've been there as a backer of a massively blundered minis project and I know how it sucky it feels.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Pathfinder Accessories, Rulebook Subscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber

No anger Sitzkrieg, so long as you understand that the cost of me accepting this as a loss does not mean I will accept it quietly or contently.

Which means I will vocalize it every time a new kickstarter or crowdfunding campaign starts up from Paizo until Paizo makes what they did here right for the backers on their end.

Doing nothing is not acceptable in this situation if they do not want me to be vocal then they should be providing the solution. I hold no blame on Archon for this, I feel Paizo needs to apply whatever pressure they can to make the Starfinder line a priority. If they have no weight to press? Then we are at an impasse in which I will remain vocal until I am happy with a solution.

That is the way of things. Accepting it as a loss does not mean I won't remind people of what I lost when the opportunity arrives.


I came here to hopefully find out some info.

I, like many others, feel the shear lack of communication is appalling. I have also seen where it has been told that posts disappear. So i may be wasting my time. Not that i may have much time left, since cancer is a mofo.

When i saw that Paizo was making a sci-game i was ecstatic, and then i saw the mini's, and was like heck yeah! And when it became what was supposed to be a successful project i was even happier.

Oh boy was i mistaken. Yeah, i am more than a little bit unhappy, like everyone else. And with the release of the wizkid figures...

Archon maybe having shipping problems, but i have to question ,Is the mini design program only on 1 computer that's bolted to a desk at the office? At least throw a picture at me or something?!

But i won't expect much. This has been just another time i rolled a 1 on the d20..

Liberty's Edge

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

There's one thing you all have to keep in mind, it was stated that Archon would be shipping waves to backers around their location in Europe. Their products were supposed to be shipped worldwide outside Europe by Ninja Division. The fact that I got my figures up to this point from Archon by ordering Zo! and Zo! alone (even though it took two months) just goes to show how messed up shipping is due to the pandemic right now.

I have much restored faith in Archon delivering what we want. I can't shame them for wanting us to cover the exhaustive shipping it takes to go worldwide from Europe on a courtesy they picked up at no apparent profit to themselves. Not to mention they also working to give us figures to buy for Starfinder that aren't in the kickstarter or already designed by Wizkids.

Twenty bucks to get a new figure plus all my up to current backer awards made by them? I'll pay Archon for stepping up to the plate.


Ok fine, we get it, shipping is cool, shipping is great, shipping is awesome. We all love shipping, whatever.

That still leaves us over half a year behind schedule on miniature design. And the process should be easier because the miniatures are coming to us disassembled. Pays to remember that unwanted Alteration.

Yet even with that entire step of the process removed we are still behind, and when the powers that be do step in to acknowledge this thread it is to elaborate on a virtual non sequitor. We get that wave 3 shipping is problematic.

My questions are simple: Where are waves 4-12? Will we ever get a straightforward answer to why Archon is working at quarter-speed? Why were posts disappearing a while back? How long would you be willing to wait for information like this?

Liberty's Edge

Looking in, same situation. Big fat nothing.

Paizo Employee VP of Marketing & Licensing

2 people marked this as a favorite.
technarken wrote:
My questions are simple: Where are waves 4-12? Will we ever get a straightforward answer to why Archon is working at quarter-speed?

I've asked Archon Studio to respond to that and will get back to you when I hear more.

technarken wrote:
Why were posts disappearing a while back? How long would you be willing to wait for information like this?

I have no idea why posts would disappear outside of a violation of the community guidelines or some technical gremlin.

Good Gaming!

-Jim


1 person marked this as a favorite.

So let me get this strait...no one other than the players thought that maybe something was off about the fact we are only in wave 3 vs wave 12ish...??

This is a joke right....

Not one person at paizo for months after reading our posts thought that...hey this seems off..shipping is one thing but models should still be worked on...lets check and be proactive...not one person before this week...really...

At this point in 2020...2 months between models waves wouldn't be a hard pill to swallow and seem more than reasonable currently...

but 4 plus months between waves means 2 years for Kickstarter backers to even get this first care package....and that's even if Ninja Division can even hold up there end...

Btw...while we are asking, anyone check with them shady boys at ninja...cause last I checked they are begging on Kickstarter for people to buy more crap so they can try and fill stuff they still owe...makes me worried they can't hold up their end for shipping any more....even thou we paid for it already

Or worse....we will be waiting years more just for shipping of waves 1-6 after they fill up their garage with our minis.


3 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Pathfinder Accessories, Rulebook Subscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber

Love Pathfinder. Really do. Subscribing more than I ever have.

However I am feeling a lack of commitment to loyal customers who put money up front to support new product lines. This feels like they hope we will eventually go away and stop bringing this up.

Let me tell ya, the people burned by Prodos, and then Archon, for the Aliens vs Predator debacle still show up everytime Prodos/Archon start up a new venture to warn people that they should be aware of the companies history.

This is going to stick with Paizo. It will be talked about in the community every time Paizo promotes new lines that require crowd funding. The communication in the last 10 days has been appreciated. The fact that there IS some communication.... But Ghost is right. If this is what it takes for someone on the inside to say 'hey archon, why you taking so long?'.... There is absolutely zero support for your loyal customers until we kick up the dirt and make noise.

I hear you. I see you. This lets me know the level of support Paizo will give to the people they told to trust the process after the process Paizo believes in caves in on itself just like the people previously burned by Ninja Division warned.


7 people marked this as a favorite.

Hi Archon, here, I wanted to give you an update about Starfinder releases.

But before, as I see a lot of misunderstanding of the situation I wanted to clear it up.

Firstly Archon is not legally obligated to fulfill your orders placed with Ninja Division Kickstarter, thus, if you looking for a refund please contact Ninja Division.

We have also been a victim of bad business practices by ND, with a net loss of 150k USD.

We approached Paizo for the license with hopes that we will recoup some of the losses generated by ND with the Starfinder retail release.

Later, we proposed to manufacture more models, out of our cost for backers.

No one, ND or Paizo paid for this to Archon. So any profit/sale we made on the Starfinder via retail channels is allocated to making mode models for ND backers.

Sound crazy? I know.

@Yoshua, thanks for your concerns, Archon's team is doing the best to help ND backers, please understand we, as a company and backers are on the same boat.

COVID and shipping.

The master plan included several factors, one of them being able to use "cheap" postal service out of Poland. Unfortunately, due to COVID, this service is currently not available.
We have other options. However, the cost is x3 higher, plus FedEx still has not lifted shipping limits for parcels shipped from Europe to USA.

Due to these reasons, we have closed our online store or limited shipping only to the EU.

We have also limited our online store releases.

Tooling.

We have made two tools with nine models to be released (2 waves in one go). And as soon as Global Express (the "cheap" shipping option) is available, we will release them.

There is a question about how long it takes to turn STL model to plastic injection:

1. Engineering(preparing a single model for plastic) takes about 24 working hours/ per model.
2. CAD (tooling) that about 40 working hours.
3. Tooling, this is about 2 weeks to cut on CNC machine.
4. The injection takes about 1 week to set up everything and about 1 week of production.

If you have any questions, please email me directly on KS@archon-studio.com.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Pathfinder Accessories, Rulebook Subscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber

PapaYaroo this is the update I have been hoping for. Thank you for taking the time to stop in and give us some word of the progress.

I personally do not hold any blame on Archon for this project. I fully understand that Ninja Division screwed everyone around and you guys are trying to make the best out of a bad situation.

My only advice/hope is that you guys keep communications open as much as possible as everyone here who was burned hasn't been healed. Including you. But the customers have no way of knowing the status without someone on your end pulling back the curtain a bit.

Most of us, me specifically, have our grievances with Ninja Division, and to some degree Paizo for moving forward with and exuding confidence in Ninja Division in the first place. You guys are going to see us vent from time to time but I don't think the majority of us hold you at fault, just frustrated with the circumstances all the way around.

Ninja Division has been very clear that they have no money and have no intentions of issuing refunds. The only last concern other than production schedules is if you guys are still depending on Ninja Division to ship the last leg of the waves to American backers that hopefully that doesn't fall through because at that point there may be alot of vocal disappointment.

Our faith in Ninja Division is zero, well mine is at least.


First, YAY for PapaYaroo!

but, contacting ND is.... pointless. They do not answer, and they do not respond.

Do you (Archon) have any luck when contacting them? If so, can you share the method you use to contact them?


PapaYaroo wrote:

Hi Archon, here, I wanted to give you an update about Starfinder releases.

But before, as I see a lot of misunderstanding of the situation I wanted to clear it up.

Firstly Archon is not legally obligated to fulfill your orders placed with Ninja Division Kickstarter, thus, if you looking for a refund please contact Ninja Division.

We have also been a victim of bad business practices by ND, with a net loss of 150k USD.

We approached Paizo for the license with hopes that we will recoup some of the losses generated by ND with the Starfinder retail release.

Later, we proposed to manufacture more models, out of our cost for backers.

No one, ND or Paizo paid for this to Archon. So any profit/sale we made on the Starfinder via retail channels is allocated to making mode models for ND backers.

Sound crazy? I know.

@Yoshua, thanks for your concerns, Archon's team is doing the best to help ND backers, please understand we, as a company and backers are on the same boat.

COVID and shipping.

The master plan included several factors, one of them being able to use "cheap" postal service out of Poland. Unfortunately, due to COVID, this service is currently not available.
We have other options. However, the cost is x3 higher, plus FedEx still has not lifted shipping limits for parcels shipped from Europe to USA.

Due to these reasons, we have closed our online store or limited shipping only to the EU.

We have also limited our online store releases.

Tooling.

We have made two tools with nine models to be released (2 waves in one go). And as soon as Global Express (the "cheap" shipping option) is available, we will release them.

There is a question about how long it takes to turn STL model to plastic injection:

1. Engineering(preparing a single model for plastic) takes about 24 working hours/ per model.
2. CAD (tooling) that about 40 working hours.
3. Tooling, this is about 2 weeks to cut on CNC machine.
4. The injection takes about 1 week to set up everything and about...

Quoted for posterity just in case Starfinder goblins get to it. I hope this clears up some misconceptions about what is "owed" to backers by Archon. Archon's actions were, for years, reprehensible towards their customers under their Prodos banner (that they largely subsequently ran away from both financially for future projects and physically back out of the UK) but they're frankly the best and more importanly ONLY hope for Starfinder kickstarter backers. They're not going to run their own company into the ground to fulfill someone else's promises though when that's not what they're required to do. I do think that they've proven they're willing to help backers at minimal cost to themselves (i.e. a few pennies material cost for a plastic sprue punched out during an existing production run). Ninja Division has a history of long and ongoing delayed or failed projects and it's unrealistic to think that they'll have the money set aside to ship out to backers waves 1-6 if and when Archon ships it to them. Again, your only realistic hope to receive ANYTHING for your $200 average pledge is to kick in another $20 in shipping and one additional purchase direct from Archon... and even now that option is delayed/limited as per Archon's post above referencing the lack of affordable shipping costs.

I've said it before and I'll say it again... the blame for THIS project is squarely on the doorstep of ND for failing to produce the project as promised and, to a lesser extent, for Paizo for knowing that ND had a public history of doing that at the time of the crowdfunding and not taking the proper precautions (like keeping the funds in escrow and dispersing it as needed for milestones met) to protect their own customers and their own IP. Could that have meant that ND didn't agree and they'd have to settle for another company offering a much smaller project scope? Sure... but backers wouldn't have been left with a multihundred dollar hole in their wallets.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Yoshua wrote:

Let me tell ya, the people burned by Prodos, and then Archon, for the Aliens vs Predator debacle still show up everytime Prodos/Archon start up a new venture to warn people that they should be aware of the companies history.

This is going to stick with Paizo. It will be talked about in the community every time Paizo promotes new lines that require crowd funding.

And, FWIW in reference to your earlier post response, I think both those are reasonable responses by customers. I got screwed over in ND's Robotech project; in that case, I personally consider the simple majority of blame to be on Palladium but given ND's ongoing history of failures that they also played a significant part. I pinky swore that I'd post an accurate and honest warning to potential customers once for each dollar of product promised that I didn't receive when I see their names mentioned in regard to other projects. I'm still probably over 100 posts away from my stated goal by my estimate but at least in my case I got half my rewards (albeit in a finicky, unnecessarily complicated, and inferior way). Regardless, ND's history should have been a red flag for Paizo to put additional safeguards but they didn't. I fortunately found out about the Starfinder minis after the initial funding ended but I was seriously considering becoming a late pledge after the fact; ultimately, it was the involvement of ND (who wasn't yet showing their true colors on Starfinder) and my experience with Robotech that convinced me to instead just wait for the project to potentially hit the shelves or to buy out a pledge on the secondary market once it delivered. I'm glad that I was able to avoid this minefield unlike my first experience with crowdfunding.


Sorry to keep multiposting but it wouldn't let me edit the prior post as some time limit was reached. It might be a good idea for one of the backers to correct Lindon over in the kickstarter comments as he or she is claiming that "Apparently Archon Studios bought the Starfinder miniatures licence from ND for $150k" when that's clearly not what they posted. There is enough misinformation and unrealistic expectations (exacerbated by a lack of timely communication from both Archon and Paizo) floating around and that post only makes it worse.


There is a reply to Lindon's post. Hopefully, it is clear.


2 people marked this as a favorite.
SITZKRIEG! wrote:
I fortunately found out about the Starfinder minis after the initial funding ended but I was seriously considering becoming a late pledge after the fact; ultimately, it was the involvement of ND (who wasn't yet showing their true colors on Starfinder) and my experience with Robotech that convinced me to instead just wait for the project to potentially hit the shelves or to buy out a pledge on the secondary market once it delivered. I'm glad that I was able to avoid this minefield unlike my first experience with crowdfunding.

In all reality, the true colors were WELL known before the Starfinder KS campaign launched. Within minutes of launch, they were being swarmed with users from previous campaigns warning others about ND/SPM's history of lies/delays/failures.

Their initial response? They tried to pretend that ND and SPM were different entities with different employees and different owners. It took 1-2 hours for so many backers to pull public records PROVING that was a lie before they backpedaled on that too.

Numerous users with understandable grievances against them flooded the comments with specific and detailed accounts of why nobody should trust the folks at ND. So much so that others got irritable with them over it. This is realistically the single biggest red flag that a crowdfunded project could have. It started on day one, and ran the entire funding campaign. People saying they didn't know either COMPLETELY ignored the comments or are lying. Only two options on that.


TheHandsomeDan wrote:
In all reality, the true colors were WELL known before the Starfinder KS campaign launched. Within minutes of launch, they were being swarmed with users from previous campaigns warning others about ND/SPM's history of lies/delays/failures.

Agreed and I referenced that in the sentence just before your quote started. There is a difference between "showing" and "knowing" though.

kadance wrote:
There is a reply to Lindon's post. Hopefully, it is clear.

Thanks and I appreciate it.

Wayfinders

1 person marked this as a favorite.
TheHandsomeDan wrote:

In all reality, the true colors were WELL known before the Starfinder KS campaign launched. Within minutes of launch, they were being swarmed with users from previous campaigns warning others about ND/SPM's history of lies/delays/failures.

Their initial response? They tried to pretend that ND and SPM were different entities with different employees and different owners. It took 1-2 hours for so many backers to pull public records PROVING that was a lie before they backpedaled on that too.

Numerous users with understandable grievances against them flooded the comments with specific and detailed accounts of why nobody should trust the folks at ND. So much so that others got irritable with them over it. This is realistically the single biggest red flag that a crowdfunded project could have. It started on day one, and ran the entire funding campaign. People saying they didn't know either COMPLETELY ignored the comments or are lying. Only two options on that.

People trusted PAIZO!


2 people marked this as a favorite.

I know I trusted Paizo. I was in the middle of a period of working 70 hours a week, saw a social media posting from Paizo about a Miniatures Kickstarter for Starfinder. At the time I had money, but, well, no time. I didn't check that Paizo was collaborating with a competent
company, why would I? All I'd ever known was a company whose worst quality to me was occasionally going too far with their errata, not tossing their IP to the wolves.

At this point I haven't purchased a Paizo product since the 2e Playtest book, and have no intention of doing so again until this debacle is concluded and I am made whole (be it through Archon finishing the KS or Paizo issuing compensatory store credit for digital media, or something similar) , or I achieve such a degree of career success that $400 ceases to be a meaningful amount of money.


84 days since the last offical update on the kickstarter....place you bets if they update before xmas with out being forced


1 person marked this as a favorite.

I keep seeing references to shipping costs being an issue. Though I know some people would balk at it, I honestly would gladly eat a separate shipping cost if it meant I could get my minis from you guys. (I've gotten AvP minis from Prodoss/Archon, and really enjoyed the sculps and quality)

At this time, I feel the kickstarter is a total loss and frankly I've lost all faith that I'll ever see the minis I ordered. While logically I can understand the latest reasons given to delays, etc, but after the never ending string of excuses and stalling messages we've gotten over the... has it officially been years now? or a year? (I honestly can't tell, everything's been kind of a blur lately), I'm honestly excuse fatigued and all joy I held for this project when I first came across it has faded to a tiny ball of numbness.

One of the things that burns me up the most about this is even after ND dropped the ball so often, failed so hard, and ignored us for months on end, Kickstarter refuses to accept reports/complaints for the kickstarter itself despite the long trail of evidence against them, their lack of fulfillment, and even lack of communication. It's one thing to get ripped off, but to have the official process of recourse flippantly dismiss your complaints and concerns and ignore what's going on is a disgrace.

I'm not even angry. At least, not anymore. I'm just really, really disappointed.


If kickstarter admitted that ND failed or even committed fraud, they'd have to give up their cut of the cash, so they have a financial incentive to ignore us. They have a history of this. They're actually a terrible entity.

Paizo Employee President

1 person marked this as a favorite.

I thought I'd start popping into this thread on a weekly basis to share any news we might have. The most likely outcome from each week is no news but at least you'll be hearing it from someone and not just be left wondering.

So as of today, we have no news or updates on this project to share.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Pathfinder Accessories, Rulebook Subscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber
Jeff Alvarez wrote:

I thought I'd start popping into this thread on a weekly basis to share any news we might have. The most likely outcome from each week is no news but at least you'll be hearing it from someone and not just be left wondering.

So as of today, we have no news or updates on this project to share.

lol literally was just coming to check on the status. Good timing on my part. Thanks for popping in. This is better than silence. Much better.

Shadow Lodge

1 person marked this as a favorite.

How much worse could the press get on this?


TOZ wrote:
How much worse could the press get on this?

It can always get worse...rule 1 never ask that question out loud unless you really want an answer. Cause it can always get worse...

Shadow Lodge

How?


TOZ wrote:
How?

Well for starters archon could go we are done...and leave us with nothing to show at all.

Paizo could totally bail on this and be like sorry for you luck...

Any number of things like that... And that is just the short list while I'm commuting.

Scarab Sages

Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Adventure, Maps, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Maps Subscriber
Jeff Alvarez wrote:

I thought I'd start popping into this thread on a weekly basis to share any news we might have. The most likely outcome from each week is no news but at least you'll be hearing it from someone and not just be left wondering.

So as of today, we have no news or updates on this project to share.

Jeff, I appreciate knowing there are still some Paizo eyes on this. Thanks from me...

Paizo Employee President

2 people marked this as a favorite.
sanwah68 wrote:
Jeff Alvarez wrote:

I thought I'd start popping into this thread on a weekly basis to share any news we might have. The most likely outcome from each week is no news but at least you'll be hearing it from someone and not just be left wondering.

So as of today, we have no news or updates on this project to share.

Jeff, I appreciate knowing there are still some Paizo eyes on this. Thanks from me...

To be honest, most of us have never stopped monitoring these threads. It's just hard to comment when there's nothing new to say over the span of months. I decided that, as President, it was my duty to start contributing to this thread on a weekly bases even if there's nothing new for me to relay.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

I appreciate the update even if there is no news. You *WILL* get some flak from some (and honestly for good cummulative reason) for coming in here without tangible progress but I think it is the right thing to do both for the brand and the company. Pazio screwed up in choosing ND and the company and especially your customers paid dearly for that choice (customers in actual lost money and Paizo with potential earnings lost). Posting here on a regular basis is the right thing to do and the first step in earning back some (definitely not all but simply some) of the trust that disappeared along with all the funds put into ND's account.


Wow...really...you deleted my posts...no word on why...liking paizo less and less every day.

Grand Lodge

I count 50 posts on this page. Did they just not load for you?

401 to 450 of 753 << first < prev | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | 14 | next > last >>
Community / Forums / Starfinder / Third-Party Starfinder Products / Paizo Blog: Starfinder Masterclass Miniatures Partnership All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.