Yeah, I just got my notice about Dungeons and Lasers, so here's to hoping.

I'm still kinda sad that I only got 8 minis for all the money I sunk into this, but I know some people haven't gotten anything.

Slowly...slowly, third wave just announced (announcement)

Saw that. At this rate (Completely discarding the last couple months due to the plague) those of us who haven't paid extra for what we already paid for will be getting the first portion of our consolation prize for this debacle sometime in January of 2021

It will take 4 years to fulfill this project at its present pace, assuming absolutely no disruptions whatsoever. Still no clear answer about whether we'll get the duplicates we paid for. Still no communication on Kickstarter. Goodwill is a nonrenewable resource.

174 days without an official update or post on the kickstarter page...as is we have to hunt across multiple websites to find any information on this project..at the rate this is going im going to be working on my 2nd retirement before the minis are done and Lord knows how long it or if Ninja Division will even follow through in the promise deliver (which they already charged and over charged for)..

Can someone with some level of authority and ability to manange a kids check book please get the user name and password for the kickstarter page and atleast give updates and answer people on there.. cause it's really starting to look like theses fools skipped town

Yes. Communications have been much worse than we'd like, but we're not giving up. We continue to work with Archon Studio and Ninja Division to communicate more frequently with the backers, and they've just told us they're still struggling under restrictions from the coronavirus in Poland.

This is primarily driven by shipping restrictions from FedEx in Poland:

FedEx Service Impacts for Poland

Archon Studio has nearly 3 months of shipping backed up right now due to the 100kg daily shipping limitations. They're looking for other shipping options to fulfill their other business obligations, but it's still ravaging their business.

I'll keep you posted as I hear more updates.

-Jim

And you say you've actually been in contact with ND?

And you say you've actually been in contact with ND?

Yes. John Cadice responded to my email today and said he'd update the Kickstarter. There won't be anything new other than listing the upcoming minis (which you can see on the Archon website).

Starfinder Wave 3 Minis

-Jim

kadance wrote:

And you say you've actually been in contact with ND?

Yes. John Cadice responded to my email today and said he'd update the Kickstarter. There won't be anything new other than listing the upcoming minis (which you can see on the Archon website).

Starfinder Wave 3 Minis

-Jim

While I appreciate the communications from you here at paizo...6months with no contact on the kickstarter page is beyond ok...its total garbage.. I'm sure most rational people understand the limits due to corvid19 but be transparent on what is going on...not wait half a dam year to give a 5min update just to ghost for another 6months...

well they updated the Kickstarter. I hadn't seen what Jim had said was coming down the pipe and was... underwhelmed. If I had read this here first I would have had my expectations set. But as it was I saw a ping from the kickstarter and got my hopes up. Then down.

Still just waiting at this point.

Yeah, popping on for 2 minutes and copypasting something from Archon, then vanishing again is a bit underwhelming. I guess if you aren't searching for information or following the comments it is helpful, but it is FAR below what is to be expected at this point. Your colleagues should be doing everything in their power to avoid doing further damage to your credibility as a company, because at this point even once I've been made whole I can't trust QC on anything you license out to a 3rd party anymore.

Still nothing... still ridiculous

Month later. Paizo should go take a look at the kickstarter comments. The absolute lack of progress has got to be affecting the bottom line by this point. I know that I have no intentions of getting into Starfinder now, this was my launch point. Fell flat. I have gone basically full in on 2E and happy so far with what I have gotten. But every time I think of this project I get angry that those of us here in the beginning warned Paizo of what they were getting into. We were told Paizo had full confidence in Ninja Division and that we should to. And to this day I feel like we have received nothing but lip service for solutions.

People have gotten mini's by paying for new minis. This shouldn't need to happen. The length of time it is taking Archon to sculpt and deliver is far exceeding any schedules listed and at this point I'd be happy with store credit for the amount of money I put into the kickstarter and I wouldn't raise another complaint again.

Nothing has been done to make this right, not when it comes to action. I love Paizo. I love the products you produce. But I am burned, severely burned, by this. Every time I remember that I was told we could trust Ninja Division I get angry all over again.

Please DO something to make this right. Actions speak louder than words.

Jim, Vic, Lisa, Glenn? You were all active day 1 here in this blog. Would be nice to get an official update on what is actually being done...

Hey Paizo,please don't forget that there's schmucks like me who joined the kickstarter after it closed, so I can't comment on the actual kickstarter page!

I think that Archon has me on their list of backers, but I'm not 100% on that as their reply to me was a little "auto-translate"-y, and I certainly have not received any miniatures from them.

At least I didn't put as much into this one as I did the Confrontation re-re-re launch kickstarter that seems to be going nowhere either.

Ah! Bird's of a feather. I'm in that confrontation quagmire as well.

I was in on the starfinder kickstarter pre-close and still haven't received anything from Archon. I try to tell myself it's just a failed kickstarter, and if I eventually get anything from Archon, it is more than I should expect.

Don't get me wrong, I still believe Ninja Division committed fraud. Straight up fraud.

Well I fear the end is near for this project....quick trip around the internet and I see John Candice has removed all traces of him linked to ninja division...not sure if he is trying to hide his past or they are just walking away and saying thanks for all the fish suckers...

I think the end of this project will likely be due to the competing Wizkids prepainted minis hitting the market after Archon/Prodos lost 6+ months of potential sales due to Covid. I think we'll still see one more wave but I'll be shocked if anything is announced after a potential wave 4 that is likely already in development. YMMV. And, yes, it sucks for backers and Ninja Division really screwed over their customers/the Starfinder fanbase.

ND couldn't have done it alone.

So if whole thing goes belly up and dies...does paizo have a back up plan for the backers...or we just strait up out of luck after they vouched for them...

What a joke this has been. Still to receive anything

The added Insult to injury is the release of the Wizkids prepainted line.

At this point I think I’ll just shelve starfinder.

Paizo I hope you realise the damage this has done both to the brand and your own reputation.

Sadly this fiasco ruined my love of Paizo products. I've moved on to other games. I can reflect fondly of my old days with 1E but really feel no inclination to give them more money after getting burned on this kickstarter.

I've also moved on thanks to how thoroughly this fiasco has soured me on Paizo as a company. I never thought these guys of all people would prioritize profits to this degree, but here we are. ND gets to smoke bomb away with half a million, Archon is left with responsibility for the mess.

I'm waiting on a CSR or jim bulter to weigh in on what you did tech...or well just an answer in general.

I would like some kind of proof ND can really follow through with the shipping in some timely matter when the time comes or did they really cut and run..

And if they do bail is there a back up plan to fix this or should I start looking to spend my time and money somewhere else.

Its Gen-Con weekend, so we aren't likely to get anything out of them for a while, unless this project should somehow wind up seriously detrimental to their bottom line or something.

It hasn't so far, I don't see what would change that. :(

Well, we are an entire year out from this announcement, so let's see where we are...

Archon has yet to distribute anything to the bulk of backers, despite not 1 but 2 six month periods elapsing.

At no point have any of us been informed if we will get the duplicate miniatures we were promised.

Ninja Division has yet to provide any sort of proof they can handle the shipping obligations they still have stateside.

The local community I game with has dropped Starfinder entirely, so even if I was to obtain everything on my doorstep tomorrow I would have basically no use for them.

Paizo's new policy of just quietly memory holing comments they don't like is troubling, and seems to indicate that someone is monitoring the thread, but would rather gaslight than engage.

60 days since last update with ninja division on the waste of a project.

No transparency on if they can handle shipping..(which we already paid for)

Still nothing from from paizo for how they plan on moving forward when this project comes to a full stop after its current derailment.

And last...cause I'll be lucky to see this in my life time...when should we expect wave six to be done...You know the first milestone when we should be getting minis...cause at the current rate we will be well onto summer of 2021 before I see my first mini' s from this project.

Cause by current treniding time tables...it will be 2026 before all backers are squared up with..and probably on 2ed of starfinder by then.

I think "squared up" may have to have to be taken loosely. Archon's not confirmed (that I recall) that pledges that included duplicate minis, such as from the encounter packs, will be sent out.

And, if anyone from Archon is reading this thread (and understands English), thank you for graciously taking up this burden. I hope everything works out well for your company.

I want to sincerely wish Archon well, but this debacle seems to purge all parties involved in fulfillment of full competence. Absent a look into their heads it feels like they took on the task, swiftly realized that Ninja Division had no sculpt files (necessitating full sculpts of all miniatures), and have decided to join ND in walking in place until we all give up.

Communicate, for heavens sake! Do something with my words besides ignore them! I'm begging you, please make me eat these words by keeping your promises...

I'm with technarken. I would love to be proven wrong that this is a lost cause.

I watched most of the twitch feeds over GenCon weekend and Eric Mona mentioned ONE time about Archon, don't even think he mentioned them by name, but talked about 'the first starfinder minis campaign' and that it is 'taking longer than expected' he asked the guy in charge of SF creative development to elaborate on a few things, including this, and it wasn't mentioned again.

I am not expecting anything at this point. Store credit would leave me with the feeling that Paizo took ownership of the situation in the end. Miniatures would leave me with the feeling that I got 'something' even if it wasn't what I ordered. Communication would leave me feeling informed.

Right now I feel uninformed, unhappy, and just keep checking in every month or so to see the status.

Status: No Status
Connection: No Status
Ninja Division: Lieing Thieves
Archon: Well Intentioned
Paizo: Culpable

Ok now this is just salt in a bleeding wound...wiz kids battle packs for starfinder are avaiable on amazon...love how everyone is able to profit from our kickstarter but we get nothing..this is how you lose players pazio...no comms...no plan forward...we are going to be waiting years just to get our 1st batch at wave six...and longer with ninja divisions handling deliver..

WizKids Product and the Product from the Kickstarter have absolutely nothing to do with each other.

WizKids Product and the Product from the Kickstarter have absolutely nothing to do with each other.

So?

Water is Wet.

People who were burned are not going to have warm and fuzzies about the wizkids line.

I don't begrudge wizkids in the slightest, and people who are playing SF definitely deserve a mini's line.

Sad reality is that wizkids didn't have space in their schedule for it when Paizo wanted this done. Paizo didn't have the patience to wait. Paizo went with a company that they were warned would take the money and run. Paizo stated they had full faith in Ninja Division to get the job done regardless of their track record.

But all of that aside? It has been radio silence far too long and no communication is doing more harm than good. Especially considering we KNOW someone has seen this thread recently with the removed posts.

But. You know what? Wizkids has nothing to do with this kickstarter. Water is wet.

That was in reply of Ghost725 stating Wizkids was profiting on the kickstarter, which they are not.

That was in reply of Ghost725 stating Wizkids was profiting on the kickstarter, which they are not.

Gotcha, you and I can agree to disagree on that. They got the publicity from achieving what this kickstarter failed at.

Riding coat tails is a way of profiting. Had this kickstarter succeeded then Wizkids would be late to the game. As it is, they are definitely benefiting, if not profiting, from the failure of Ninja Division and the delay of Archon.

Dragnmoon wrote:

That was in reply of Ghost725 stating Wizkids was profiting on the kickstarter, which they are not.

Gotcha, you and I can agree to disagree on that. They got the publicity from achieving what this kickstarter failed at.

Riding coat tails is a way of profiting. Had this kickstarter succeeded then Wizkids would be late to the game. As it is, they are definitely benefiting, if not profiting, from the failure of Ninja Division and the delay of Archon.

Im mad...

im mad when I see the wizkids models that look alot like the ones we were promissed...

im mad that in a fraction of the time..they were able to make them, have them painted and boxed for sale long before any one has gotten a single mini worth a dam from the kickstarter..

Im mad that the necrovite looks dam near the same other that the KS one has a rife and the wizkids doesnt...and you want me to believe stl. Files were not shared...which we helped fund..

Im just mad it's taken this long for something which should have been wrapped up by now.

Be mad at whatever you want to be mad at. No one should be able to regulate your emotions.

I feel that Dragnmoons suggestions are how he feels about the situation more than a declaration of what someone else in this situation SHOULD feel. I mean, that is what I hope anyways.

Telling people how they should feel is a good way to minimize their emotions, and nullify their very very very valid complaints about this entire process.

I am personally grateful for Wizkids stepping up to the plate. I am angry that Paizo jumped at the chance to go with Ninja Division considering we, and by we I mean everyone here who had prior dealings with Ninja Division, knew exactly how it would go. And very loudly declared it early on.

Mind you, I also warned that Archon, previously Prodos, also had a very shady background. While I am happy with their Dungeons and Lasers lines, delivered and well produced, I am not oblivious to the fact that they also shorted a crap ton of backers from Aliens vs Predators kickstarter. I warned on day 1 here that Paizo was linking up with yet another company that has a history of not following through.

And here we are. Not even 1 mini sent out at over a year when at least 2 sets were promised by now.

Be angry at whoever you want, we were robbed and Paizo told us to trust the thieves. While I believe Archon is well intentioned when it comes to this? Actions speak louder than words, and we are not being given ANY words.

I don't blame Archon at all...wish they would talk to us more.

Im not happy with paizo but they got hoodwinked with the rest of us...

Do i believe files were not shared...no...sorry too much of a coincidence on how close the wizkids models look to the KS stl files... they can make that claim all day and I have a hard time trusting the claim.

I have grown tired of the constant missed dead lines...lack of communication for all involved..we are now over 60 days again With out a word on what is going on...or some form of update. As someone said this was a 3min topic at the con and nothing heard from it during the rest of the time..gets old being left in the dark holding an empty box asking for items we paid shipping for to be treated like we don't matter any more.

Sorry but yes we expect people to regulate their emotions all the time. Or the pile of bodies would be very large. Periodically posting for months on end about how your done with Starfinder is empirically not helping you deal with the situation. It is obviously OK to be upset, even still holding feint hope might be OK, but this level of vitriol is not helping you be happier or get your stuff.

Sorry but yes we expect people to regulate their emotions all the time. Or the pile of bodies would be very large. Periodically posting for months on end about how your done with Starfinder is empirically not helping you deal with the situation. It is obviously OK to be upset, even still holding feint hope might be OK, but this level of vitriol is not helping you be happier or get your stuff.

Seriously?

Expecting someone to regulate an emotion is one thing. Dictating how someone should regulate their emotions is outside of your lane.

Want me to stop posting about how I am upset with the situation?

Fix it. You provide no solutions and add oil to the fire you are self righteously whining about.

Majority of the people who come in here to tell those of us who were robbed to get over it -didn't even back the project- Your apology is not accepted.

lol

I've also been very clear on how I think it could be fixed. But seeing as this is somewhere to just post and be ignored. I will continue using the tools they provide.

I've also been very clear on how I think it could be fixed.

Do you mean the Store Credit?

I doubt that would happen since they are only the Licensee and not the actual developer of the product. Ninja Division is wholly responsible for the money we gave them. Sure Paizo suggested we get into the Kickstarter and some like me would have not gotten into it in the first place if it was not for that recommendation. But still this kickstarter is a Ninja Division Farce not a Paizo Farce.

Even if Paizo got any money from the licencing of Starfinder it would have been small in comparison to what Ninja Division took in from the Kickstarter.