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Bringing Out the Big Guns in Starfinder

Friday, June 16, 2017

As a science fantasy game, Starfinder has a wide range of high-tech weapons. Cryo guns, plasma weapons, lasers, full automatic projectile weapons, grenades, and many more categories of high-tech weapons cram the equipment chapter, ready for players to select what they need to stay alive in the adventures to come. But as soon as you mention that lasers are an option, and that Starfinder is supposed to maintain fair backward compatibility with the monsters of Pathfinder, players wonder how a goblin is supposed to be any kind of threat to PCs armed with advanced ranged weaponry. After all, realistically, a laser has to do more damage than a short sword, right.

Well, in a word, no.

Where realism impinges on making a fun and robust game, we're more than happy to deviate from realism—but in this case, it's not really necessary. Modern real-world laser pointers are lasers, for example, and do no damage to speak of when fired at your hand. And while it may seem unrealistic for laser pistols and plasma rifles to do low enough damage that you can be shot 4 or 5 times before you're in serious risk of death, that logic also applies to archaic weapons. It's not hard to make a 1st-level barbarian in Pathfinder who can easily survive four blows from a short sword and still be conscious. Certainly most people would agree that "realistically," being stabbed four times with 18 inches of sharpened steel isn't going to leave anyone in the condition where they can just walk away.

So, since we know lasers (and, by extension, most other energy weapons) can exist at a level where they do little to no damage, we can go ahead and make low-powered versions appropriate for the threats and foes low-level characters are most likely to encounter, letting your character start the game with that laser pistol they've been coveting.

But of course it wouldn't be any fun to restrict characters to such low-powered options forever.

Starfinder assumes there is almost always a better version of any weapon you can imagine—the trick is convincing people to sell it to you (and having the credits to afford it). In many cases the most advanced of these weapons don't make sense for rank-and-file troops. After all, why would an army buy a single avalanche-class zero rifle, when it can buy forty hailstorm-class zero rifles for the same amount of money? Sure, the avalanche-class does three times as much damage. But if you have an army to equip, it's better to have forty guns doing 2d8 damage than one gun doing 7d8 damage.

Of course there are exceptions to that thinking, including elite forces, commandos, assassins, snipers... and player characters.

As characters advance, they'll have the money, and connections, to buy more and more powerful versions of their early weapons. To keep this process simple, every piece of equipment in the game has an item level. That level has no effect on who can use the equipment—if a 2nd-level soldier gets hold of an 18th-level banshee sonic rifle, there's no reason he can't use it to full effect—just as a 2nd-level fighter could use a +5 flaming keen vicious bastard sword in Pathfinder. But by giving every piece of equipment an item level, we can tie numerous rules—including hardness, Hit Points, save DCs, and item creation rules, to name just a few—to a single mechanic. Item level is also a useful baseline to help determine what gear a character has the licenses, connections, and trust to buy. While circumstances and GM fiat can make any adjustment desired, in general a player character in a major settlement is free to buy any gear with an item level up to his character level +2. This gives characters freedom to decide if they are going to focus on just a few pieces of key gear, or do their best to have a variety of slightly less-effective options available, without a GM having to spend a lot of time checking tables and making availability rolls.

In general, there's no need to upgrade your weaponry at every level (though you certainly could if that was exciting for you), but over the course of a character's career they are likely to buy better, more dangerous, more powerful versions of their weaponry. The azimuth laser pistol is 1st level, and does 1d4 damage with an 80 ft. range increment and the ability to set things on fire with critical hits. The next lowest level laser pistol presented in the Core Rulebook is the corona model at 6th level, which does 2d4 damage. Of course, a player might run into a number of other weapon options along the way, ranging from the static arc pistol at 2nd level to the thunderstrike sonic pistol at 4th level or the frostbite-class zero pistol at 5th level.

Of course, for this system to work, feats and class features can't be tied to a specific model or level of a specific weapon. Instead, everything is geared to work with all the weapons for a specific proficiency, or all the weapons of the same category. Weapon Focus, for example, can be applied to all small arms, or all longarms, and so on. The soldier's gear boosts tend to work with categories of weapons, such as laser accuracy applying to all lasers, or plasma immolation working with all plasma weapons.

And that's not even talking about magic weapons! The Starfinder Core Rulebook has several pages of weapon fusions, which are special magic abilities that can be added to a weapon to gain a bonus in specific circumstances, or grant new combat options. For example, the anchoring fusion allows a weapon to immobilize a foe on a critical hit, while the holy fusion allows a weapon to bypass DR/good and ignore all energy resistance of evil dragons, evil outsiders, and evil undead. Fusion can also be placed in fusion seals, special weapon augmentations that can be moved from weapon to weapon if you decide to change your primary attack preference.

Nor does all of a character's increase in damage come from buying bigger guns and more powerful melee weapons. At 3rd level, every character class grants specialization with all the standard weapons the class gives proficiency with. This allows the character to add their level to damage dealt (or to add half their level in the case of small arms or operative melee weapons, the latter of which have the special property that anyone can use their Dexterity rather than Strength to determine their attack bonus). And of course class features, feats, and spells can grant further bonuses, depending on the choices a player makes while building their character.

All of this is tied to our rebalancing of combat math to make the game faster and simpler, while keeping weapon choice important and keeping the importance of treasure acquisition as a feature of the game. It also gives us flexibility when working in the weapon creation design space. The various weapon categories mean that characters with no access to magic abilities can still pick up weapons that do various forms of energy damage; create cones, lines, or explosions; or even stagger, blind, stun, or ignite foes. A soldier might decide their primary fighting style is to use a big two-handed melee weapon, but still carry a few grenades and a flamethrower for situations where they need to affect multiple targets in an area, or just deal a different damage type. It also removes the need to constantly chase pure accuracy bonuses, since doing more damage in a round is no longer dependent on having a 3rd or 4th (or 6th!) attack in a full attack action reliably connect with foes.

Most of the math and design work behind how Starfinder's weapons, attacks, feats, and more isn't particularly obvious to a typical player—quite intentionally—but we've put a lot of time into creating options that work well together, and making sure equipment and weapons generally come into play right at the point when it's appropriate for characters to access them. Hopefully this will allow players to focus less on finding some theoretical perfect combination of game elements for effectiveness, and more on interplanetary adventure!

Owen KC Stephens
Developer

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Pathfinder Maps, Pathfinder Accessories Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

I think we are all missing the answer to the most important question about guns in Starfinder, though, and that is... where in the Nine Nova Hells is the Caster Gun!?! My Arcane Assailant Soldier Phrenic Adept Bounty Hunter inspired by "Outlaw Star" wants to know!

... and me.

I want to know, too.

Pretty please?

:)

I asked before, but it seems to have gotten lost, so I'll ask part of it with a rephrasing: What options are we going to see for hiding and/or disguising Starfinder weapons(*)?

(*)Including potentially disguising them as archaic weapons.

I cast detect science.
3 people marked this as a favorite.
Lemartes wrote:
I cast detect science.

You definitely detect science. In all directions... at once.

Aww...

I cast detect guns???

No wait I cast detect high tech!!!
1 person marked this as a favorite.
Vidmaster7 wrote:
With guns scaling so high in damage will unarmed be at all viable at higher levels?

The level 5 Soldier sheet had 1d3+12 unarmed strikes, which was about competitive with her other melee weapon.

Grand Lodge
Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Society Subscriber

It would mean unarmed would need to get damage dice upgrades.
Personally I think that unarmed will be something for the solarian or maybe the soldier, those classes feel like they will have options to increase their unarmed damage dice.
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Damanta wrote:

It would mean unarmed would need to get damage dice upgrades.

Personally I think that unarmed will be something for the solarian or maybe the soldier, those classes feel like they will have options to increase their unarmed damage dice.

Kind of hoping there will be a unarmed archetype that can be used on all the classes.

If unarmed scales competively than... robot punchers are a thing?

do you want an actual, viable, really, really no weapons combat style or are you thining more of wearing some kind of high tech glove weapon and maybe getting some cyber implants to boost your weak little meat fists to be competitive with the man portable black hole generator?
Grand Lodge
Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Society Subscriber

I'm guessing that solarians will be able to strenghten their body (kinda like monks, but then by using their class abilities), and for soldier I image glove weapons (I realized I need a powerfist to complete my fallout weaponry anyway :P)
Torbyne wrote:

If unarmed scales competively than... robot punchers are a thing?

do you want an actual, viable, really, really no weapons combat style or are you thining more of wearing some kind of high tech glove weapon and maybe getting some cyber implants to boost your weak little meat fists to be competitive with the man portable black hole generator?

Yes! but mostly the second thing.

Mashallah wrote:
Vidmaster7 wrote:
With guns scaling so high in damage will unarmed be at all viable at higher levels?
The level 5 Soldier sheet had 1d3+12 unarmed strikes, which was about competitive with her other melee weapon.

If it was the iconic Vesk, that's likely because her unarmed strikes represent her bite- she has a racial feature to treat her unarmed strikes as non-archaic.

3 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Torbyne wrote:
If unarmed scales competively than... robot punchers are a thing?

Their punches are as strong as kicks!

Damanta wrote:
I'm guessing that solarians will be able to strenghten their body (kinda like monks, but then by using their class abilities), and for soldier I image glove weapons (I realized I need a powerfist to complete my fallout weaponry anyway :P)

In a live stream of a Starfinder adventure, one of the players was using a Solarian, and at one point it was mentioned they use weapon crystals(iirc the name correctly) for their powers... Perhaps those will need to be upgraded just as normal weapons would?

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Dead Phoenix wrote:
Damanta wrote:
I'm guessing that solarians will be able to strenghten their body (kinda like monks, but then by using their class abilities), and for soldier I image glove weapons (I realized I need a powerfist to complete my fallout weaponry anyway :P)
In a live stream of a Starfinder adventure, one of the players was using a Solarian, and at one point it was mentioned they use weapon crystals(iirc the name correctly) for their powers... Perhaps those will need to be upgraded just as normal weapons would?

I think the word you are looking for is "Kyber".

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Torbyne wrote:
Dead Phoenix wrote:
Damanta wrote:
I'm guessing that solarians will be able to strenghten their body (kinda like monks, but then by using their class abilities), and for soldier I image glove weapons (I realized I need a powerfist to complete my fallout weaponry anyway :P)
In a live stream of a Starfinder adventure, one of the players was using a Solarian, and at one point it was mentioned they use weapon crystals(iirc the name correctly) for their powers... Perhaps those will need to be upgraded just as normal weapons would?
I think the word you are looking for is "Kyber".

I cast detect copyright?

Torbyne wrote:
Dead Phoenix wrote:
Damanta wrote:
I'm guessing that solarians will be able to strenghten their body (kinda like monks, but then by using their class abilities), and for soldier I image glove weapons (I realized I need a powerfist to complete my fallout weaponry anyway :P)
In a live stream of a Starfinder adventure, one of the players was using a Solarian, and at one point it was mentioned they use weapon crystals(iirc the name correctly) for their powers... Perhaps those will need to be upgraded just as normal weapons would?
I think the word you are looking for is "Kyber".

Only at high levels. You're probably starting with a run-of-the-mill Ilum crystal at level 1.

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Pathfinder Maps, Pathfinder Accessories Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

Wow, I can't believe folks are now discussing Dragon Ball Z style Starfinder!

Are you sure? I thought they were discussing harry potter style

I don't know about the rest of you, but I'm talking Star Wars. Specifically, lightsaber construction.
Pathfinder Maps, Pathfinder Accessories Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

It was only a matter of time...
1 person marked this as a favorite.

I was going to cast detect Starwars but I thought detect copyright was funnier.

I cast detect sense of humour... :(

So what's everyone's favourite weapon so far?

The dimensional curve blade seems pretty cool, besides that it is hard to say much about the weapons
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Ashanderai wrote:
Wow, I can't believe folks are now discussing Dragon Ball Z style Starfinder!

Well, those planets weren't going to explode themselves!

Lemartes wrote:
So what's everyone's favourite weapon so far?

I still want to know whats up with Navasi's other pistol since it doesnt seem to be on any of her character sheets and its so out of place compared to the other gear we've seen. i am still betting its some kind of magic blaster from her ex-girlfriend or something... Other than that, i am not too taken yet with anything they've officially previewed. has anyone seen anything about SMGs or shotguns yet?

Lemartes wrote:

I was going to cast detect Starwars but I thought detect copyright was funnier.

I cast detect sense of humour... :(

Your spell returns no results. ;-)

bugleyman wrote:
Lemartes wrote:

I was going to cast detect Starwars but I thought detect copyright was funnier.

I cast detect sense of humour... :(

Your spell returns no results. ;-)

But I cast it on you! ;)

Lemartes wrote:
bugleyman wrote:
Lemartes wrote:

I was going to cast detect Starwars but I thought detect copyright was funnier.

I cast detect sense of humour... :(

Your spell returns no results. ;-)
But I cast it on you! ;)

Detect humour never works, by its very nature it explains comedy to you and jokes never work when you have to explain them. Just FAQ the spell and wait for a dev response.

Pathfinder Lost Omens Subscriber

So, um... iLevel?

is going to get so confused between playing WoW and SF...

:>
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Torbyne wrote:
Lemartes wrote:
bugleyman wrote:
Lemartes wrote:

I was going to cast detect Starwars but I thought detect copyright was funnier.

I cast detect sense of humour... :(

Your spell returns no results. ;-)
But I cast it on you! ;)
Detect humour never works, by its very nature it explains comedy to you and jokes never work when you have to explain them. Just FAQ the spell and wait for a dev response.

I cast detect nerf...

(And that was detect sense of humour not detect humour!)
4 people marked this as a favorite.

{herds all the nerfs back into pen}
2 people marked this as a favorite.

whoops! i knew i should have invested a point into literacy...
1 person marked this as a favorite.
Lemartes wrote:
bugleyman wrote:
Lemartes wrote:

I was going to cast detect Starwars but I thought detect copyright was funnier.

I cast detect sense of humour... :(

Your spell returns no results. ;-)
But I cast it on you! ;)

*head explodes*

I'm really hoping they have elemental blasters.
Some cool poisons. I hope they have good mundane healing as well.
and lastly..

I dearly hope this has an awesome variety of mundane style weapons. variety of neat grenades, traps, tasers..

Since they have that "level" of the items now, that is a great way to have valid neat items. That is one of my saddest details about Pathfinder, alchemical items weren't very useful later.

I dearly want an engineer who is just a mass of tools and items~
Totally excited with the tech weapons.

Really hope I can fight with a rivet gun. or a wielder, or buzz saw sorta thing
Quote:
That is one of my saddest details about Pathfinder, alchemical items weren't very useful later.

Totally understand that and don't even get me started on poisons...

Seisho wrote:
Quote:
That is one of my saddest details about Pathfinder, alchemical items weren't very useful later.
Totally understand that and don't even get me started on poisons...

I heard somewehre Starfinder uses Unchained Poisons? I've never used that but I hear they work better in that system.

I'm hoping medkits and such aren't too weird or rare or inefficient like in Pathfinder. As far as I'm aware there are only 2 real casting classes? So I'm assuming items fills in the blanks on various details.?

Eitehr way terribly excited. So much more into Starfinder setting than pathfinder's

Right, totally forgetting the unchained poisons all the time
the + is they actually work on higher targets
the - is that they become somewhat more generic
Zwordsman wrote:

I'm really hoping they have elemental blasters.

Some cool poisons. I hope they have good mundane healing as well.
and lastly..

I dearly hope this has an awesome variety of mundane style weapons. variety of neat grenades, traps, tasers..

Since they have that "level" of the items now, that is a great way to have valid neat items. That is one of my saddest details about Pathfinder, alchemical items weren't very useful later.

I dearly want an engineer who is just a mass of tools and items~
Totally excited with the tech weapons.

Really hope I can fight with a rivet gun. or a wielder, or buzz saw sorta thing

There are comments on the forums already that seem to confirm elemental blasters. we have seen cold and fire based energy weapons already and the only Tech Guide had electricity so i expect that to make a come back as well. I think it had some Sonic weapons as well. i am curious to see how they work in Acid blasters... maybe some kind of ion disruptor that counts as acidic? Or a payload rifle that fires canisters of powerful acids?

We are also apparently getting ranged weapons that deal slashing, bludgeoning and pieercing damage types. i wonder if they will have over penetrating effects or the like on them. I could see it as a critical effect maybe.
Seisho wrote:

Right, totally forgetting the unchained poisons all the time

the + is they actually work on higher targets
the - is that they become somewhat more generic

To be fair, if you stab a guy and his wound starts burning with poison, he's going to care less about whether it was hemlock or black adder venom and more about what it's actually doing. It's good for ease of play that they streamline it, and it's good for Poison users that the poisons are useful enough that you don't have contort your character like a Kyton to actually make them work.

I'm excited for the possibilities of alchemical items having levels and scaling into the late game.

That would be indeed a big plus, I mean...the only one who could really make combat with alchemical items work was the alchemist...and that only if he got a sh**load of money
1 person marked this as a favorite.
bugleyman wrote:
Lemartes wrote:
bugleyman wrote:
Lemartes wrote:

I was going to cast detect Starwars but I thought detect copyright was funnier.

I cast detect sense of humour... :(

Your spell returns no results. ;-)
But I cast it on you! ;)
*head explodes*

Oops wrong spell. Sorry. :(

*picks up ear*

Can you hear me now?
1 person marked this as a favorite.

dont you mean, "Can you 'ear me now?" ?

*Casts Pun Ward*
Scarab Sages Developer, Starfinder Team
4 people marked this as a favorite.
Torbyne wrote:

There are comments on the forums already that seem to confirm elemental blasters. we have seen cold and fire based energy weapons already and the only Tech Guide had electricity so i expect that to make a come back as well. I think it had some Sonic weapons as well. i am curious to see how they work in Acid blasters... maybe some kind of ion disruptor that counts as acidic? Or a payload rifle that fires canisters of powerful acids?

We are also apparently getting ranged weapons that deal slashing, bludgeoning and pieercing damage types. i wonder if they will have over penetrating effects or the like on them. I could see it as a critical effect maybe.

We have something like one of your acid weapon ideas in the core rules, and something like your other acid idea is already in line for inclusion in a back-matter article in the first few issues of the AP.

Zwordsman wrote:

{. . .}

I dearly want an engineer who is just a mass of tools and items~
Totally excited with the tech weapons.
{. . .}

+1 for wanting R2-D2.

Torbyne wrote:

There are comments on the forums already that seem to confirm elemental blasters. we have seen cold and fire based energy weapons already and the only Tech Guide had electricity so i expect that to make a come back as well. I think it had some Sonic weapons as well. i am curious to see how they work in Acid blasters... maybe some kind of ion disruptor that counts as acidic? Or a payload rifle that fires canisters of powerful acids?

I saw some of them. but I was thinking more like Bolt Throwers, and Acid sprayers. bolt throwers ala Saga Frontier kind. and acid sprayers more like thea ctual sprayers they use in the real world.. but like more scifi. Usually used to strip metals for refinishing or precision melting.. but repurposed to melt some pirates intruding~

UnArcaneElection wrote:
Zwordsman wrote:

{. . .}

I dearly want an engineer who is just a mass of tools and items~
Totally excited with the tech weapons.
{. . .}

+1 for wanting R2-D2.

Haha. Wasn't directly meant to the "literally composed of weapons and tools". (Actually I'm not fond of that lil guy. Don't dislike like.. just not my taste). Though that would make a pretty cool android or cyborg character....

Roll Caskett from Megaman Legends, Lucca from Crono Trigger, Jeff from Earthbound and few others.
Roll Caskett re-purposed is probably my first go of it. Lucca will come next with a more combat stint to her.
Well, it'll depend on the Engineer class.. I'm hoping there will be a version without the robo helper. I'm not big on summon creature style gameplay. Heard there will be though, with an AI helper.
Well, looking forward to that reveal.

but yeah I went off topic. But those kind of concepts I think.
Torbyne wrote:
If unarmed scales competively than... robot punchers are a thing?

The O.G. Robot Puncher

ENHenry wrote:
Torbyne wrote:
If unarmed scales competively than... robot punchers are a thing?
The O.G. Robot Puncher

Dude doesnt even have an AMOF going on there. nice.

Zwordsman wrote:
Torbyne wrote:

There are comments on the forums already that seem to confirm elemental blasters. we have seen cold and fire based energy weapons already and the only Tech Guide had electricity so i expect that to make a come back as well. I think it had some Sonic weapons as well. i am curious to see how they work in Acid blasters... maybe some kind of ion disruptor that counts as acidic? Or a payload rifle that fires canisters of powerful acids?

I might be misunderstanding, we have heard that there will be spray/cone weapons and both plasma and flame weapons seem to also use templates. I cant say for sure there will be acid based template weapons but it seems fairly probable. Or are you looking more for industrial equipment turned into weapons?

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