Guide 4.2 and Changes to Pathfinder Society Organized Play

College life

We always seemed to find a few student loan dollars to go towards "keeping our sanity", and thus deemed it an educational expense. :)

Not necessarily wise, but sometimes wisely necessary.

I hate to ask, but are bastard swords considered always available equipment?

I was told exotic equipment is not considered always available. Is that true? What about whips and nets?

I have a wizard who took a bastard sword as his bonded item, is he legal?

Tetsu is right about it being always available, but just remember...a bastard sword, in and of itself, is not exotic. It is, in fact, quite common. Merely the ability to use it one-handed is considered exotic for combat purposes.

Lakesidefantasy wrote:

I hate to ask, but are bastard swords considered always available equipment?

I was told exotic equipment is not considered always available. Is that true? What about whips and nets?

I have a wizard who took a bastard sword as his bonded item, is he legal?

Tetsu is right about it being always available, but just remember...a bastard sword, in and of itself, is not exotic. It is, in fact, quite common. Merely the ability to use it one-handed is considered exotic for combat purposes.

Bastard sword is a 1-handed exotic melee weapon, with specific rule text that allows it to be used as a 2-handed martial weapon. It is, in and of itself, an exotic weapon.

zohaletha wrote:

Lakesidefantasy wrote:

I hate to ask, but are bastard swords considered always available equipment?

I was told exotic equipment is not considered always available. Is that true? What about whips and nets?

I have a wizard who took a bastard sword as his bonded item, is he legal?

Tetsu is right about it being always available, but just remember...a bastard sword, in and of itself, is not exotic. It is, in fact, quite common. Merely the ability to use it one-handed is considered exotic for combat purposes.

Bastard sword is a 1-handed exotic melee weapon, with specific rule text that allows it to be used as a 2-handed martial weapon. It is, in and of itself, an exotic weapon.

There is no mention of "exotic" equipment not being always available in the guide.

The only mundane equipment called out anywhere as not always available, as a category, are Firearms.

Lakesidefantasy was misinformed.

TetsujinOni wrote:

zohaletha wrote:

Lakesidefantasy wrote:

I hate to ask, but are bastard swords considered always available equipment?

I was told exotic equipment is not considered always available. Is that true? What about whips and nets?

I have a wizard who took a bastard sword as his bonded item, is he legal?

Tetsu is right about it being always available, but just remember...a bastard sword, in and of itself, is not exotic. It is, in fact, quite common. Merely the ability to use it one-handed is considered exotic for combat purposes.

Bastard sword is a 1-handed exotic melee weapon, with specific rule text that allows it to be used as a 2-handed martial weapon. It is, in and of itself, an exotic weapon.

There is no mention of "exotic" equipment not being always available in the guide.

The only mundane equipment called out anywhere as not always available, as a category, are Firearms.

Lakesidefantasy was misinformed.

So, my Undead Lord is shifting to some other type of cleric, or maybe an oracle of bones; that's fine.

Unless Mike or Mark object, I'm going to build that change into his history. That is, he still spent his first five levels as an Undead Lord, and then something happened, and he changed.

So, here's what happened.

Just a question regarding the Resource books. I really love paper copies and as such own all my books as real physical books, bought in game stores, at conventions and from amazon UK to avoid postage from the US.

Obviously I can take copies of pages to take to a convention/game, but those will not be watermarked. Instead of hiring a Porter (with or without Statblock :) ) to carry all my books, or invest in a trolley, I was wondering if it was Ok to do the following....

Take a picture of the book with you're ID on a corner and use this as proof of owning the required resource....obviously you need to have the pictures on you :)

Obviously this could give problems with people taking pictures of other people's books, or even photo-shopping in and ID....I'm just looking for a valid way to not having to bring source books for a single page I need to be able to show....without having to buy all the books again as PDF.

Unfortunately, that is not legal at this time. You either need the book or need a watermarked pdf, photocopies are not acceptable as they do not prove ownership.

With that said, campaign leadership has promised to revisit this issue (perhaps to see if there's some way ownership could be proved once and then photocopies used afterwards) once they come back from Gen Con.

There's a very long thread on it if you want to see it HERE.

Sighs, my only question of Paizo is why give options to players that you then ban them from using. More, if it is because of balance issues why not have the issue fixed and then unban was was disallowed?

It is how Paizo handles their own rules that I haven't had much interest in Pathfinder Society, it leaves a bad taste in my mouth how some issues dealt with.

I wanted to have a character with a zombie thread minion, I wonder if the undead lord cleric is legal in PFS?

This was the thread I was pointed to when doing a search on what as legal for Pathfinder Society... I could have perhaps spend a bit more time searching for the most up to date thread where I might voice thoughts.

I apologize if I posted in the wrong thread, can you point me to the right thread?

There is this button... "Make a new thread..."

... I didn't think I should when it comes to a subject such as this. I thought, as a blog, is was open for commenting since it was made by Paizo staff at that I should post in the most up to date on the subject.

...you think a 2012 blog post is the most up to date source?

RISE FROM YOUR GRAVE!

It is what a quick search brought up, it may seem silly but this thread came up first and I didn't pay attention to the date... I made a mistake.

Hey, if you have the 16 PP to spend go ahead and bring this back from the dead.

it seems to be a perfectly sensible place to bring it up to me

it seems to be a perfectly sensible place to bring it up to me

Not to me. I am not sure what issue the OR (Original Resurrector) of this 700+ post thread is referring to in his comment, so...

Several archetypes being removed from the campaign over two years ago? Not being able to make photocopies of your hardcovers? Something else mentioned during this thread?

oh i have no idea what aspect he is resurrecting im just giving him the benefit of the doubt that its something relevant

This was the thread I was pointed to when doing a search on what as legal for Pathfinder Society... I could have perhaps spend a bit more time searching for the most up to date thread where I might voice thoughts.

I apologize if I posted in the wrong thread, can you point me to the right thread?

here you go the complete list

http://paizo.com/pathfinderSociety/about/additionalResources

Got me all excited , I saw the new art and the words bringing back the Aasimar adn Tiefling

Mainly my issue is that PFS bans certain resources they create/bring out instead of going back and fixing the issues they have with these resources.

For example, the Synthesist Summoner and Master Summoner or the Leadership feat... really the feat is what gets me, what was the point of carrying leadership over from D&D if one can't use it. Also, Brew Potion seems to be an odd and annoying ban.

Really, more and more that I read on Pathfinder Society play I more begin to see it in the same light as gaming tournament... I don't think I want anything to do with it.

Pathfinder Society is not run by the game developers. Mike and John are not responsible for writing the game rules, just the houserules that allow everyone in the world to play a character together. So PFS bans resources precisely because they DON'T create them and have to make judgements about what is good for their campaign. Just like any GM has to.

You can still use Leadership...in a home game with a GM that allows it. The GM of this campaign doesn't allow it. If that's a deal-breaker for you, then I hope you find another group that suits your preferences better. Organized play is a different style than home campaigns, and not every campaign is suitable for everyone. We certainly try to accommodate the widest range of players, but you can't please everyone.

Mainly my issue is that PFS bans certain resources they create/bring out instead of going back and fixing the issues they have with these resources.

Pathfinder Society Organised Play is a campaign set on the world of Golarion, which uses the Pathfinder RPG rules.

Some options in the Pathfinder rules are not suitable for use in a campaign set on Golarion, due to not fitting the canon (e.g. the spellslinger archetype).

Some options in the Pathfinder rules are not suitable for use when the majority of tables need to complete in 4-5 hours (e.g. those that rely on a large number of summons, like the master summoner archetype).

Some options in the Pathfinder rules are not suitable for use in a campaign trying to avoid the issues previous organised play campaigns have had with PC wealth spiralling out of control (e.g. crafting feats like brew potion).

Some options in the Pathfinder rules are not suitable for use in a campaign where a lot of play is in public and 'evil'/distateful options would potentially lead to bad publicity (e.g. vivisectionist and undead lord archetypes).

The options allowed in Additional Resources are still vastly more permissive than many home campaigns. I'm sure there are some GMs who allow their players to go hog-wild when building their PCs (including 3rd party resources) but I imagine they're in the minority. I'm sure they don't have to cater to 70,000 GMs and players with different preferences and opinions.

more and more that I read on Pathfinder Society play I more begin to see it in the same light as gaming tournament

Nothing could be further from the truth. I suggest you give it a try before dismissing it.

Hmm... I will take closer look and consideration Pathfinder Society.

Hmm... I will take closer look and consideration Pathfinder Society.

That's great!

One of the things that the campaign management has tried to do is keep the campaign fresh, and always moving forward. Sometimes there are options in published Pathfinder materials, as others have said, that do not play well with their vision of what the campaign should have. This is just like what a GM would do for their home game.

There are also options that they are holding back as things that could be used in future rewards on boons and chronicles, such as races outside of the core races.

I have found that there are no shortage of options that you can use to create yourself a character that you will be able to have a lot of fun with!

JonathonWilder wrote:

Some options in the Pathfinder rules are not suitable for use when the majority of tables need to complete in 4-5 hours (e.g. those that rely on a large number of summons, like the master summoner archetype).

This also is why Leadership is not a good fit. I have one home game that has 3 players with leadership. One player not only has leadership but is a summoning druid with an animal companion, and the cohort is a ranger with an animal companion. Needless to say when the combats are not "6 seconds of death" they are long fights.

Six seconds of death:

The party is led by an arcane trickster. He casts Invisibility ten foot radius Sphere on the party, goes invisible himself they sneak (everyone either has stealth) into a room, get as set up as possible, then BAM. Last week the combat lasted 1.25 rounds. Once the Dex based two rapier weaponmaster gut full attacks the boss dropped and the mooks surrendered.

I don't get it, Tamec. "They sneak (everyone either has stealth)" ?

that was a miss type... "everyone has stealth". I can't go back and edit that post.

What I would like to see is Paizo coming out with a revision of Leadership that could be used in PFS, it is a feat with great roleplaying potential.

What I would like to see is Paizo coming out with a revision of Leadership that could be used in PFS, it is a feat with great roleplaying potential.

If you want it for role playing there's all those follower vanities. We've had fun with the heralds

What I would like to see is Paizo coming out with a revision of Leadership that could be used in PFS, it is a feat with great roleplaying potential.

I very much doubt that will ever happen, but take a look at the vanities in the Pathfinder Society Field Guide, in particular the followers (chronicler, herald, porter, etc.) on pages 60-61. They're pretty close to what it sounds like you're looking for, if roleplaying potential is your primary concern.

What I would like to see is Paizo coming out with a revision of Leadership that could be used in PFS, it is a feat with great roleplaying potential.

Almost everybody has a laundry list it items, they would like fixed (I am quite interested in the new Summoner myself), and while the Leadership feat has some roleplaying potential, it really works best in a home campaign, where the GM has all the freedom to toy with it.

The leadership (not unlike the Summoner) has the nasty effect, of making one player take up more time "in the spotlight"/in combat that the other players. Marginalizing the contribution of some of the players already happens way to often, maybe you could make this some kind of alternative to a mount/animal companion, but it would likely require much more investment than just one feat slot.

I have to admit i have enjoyed role playing having (and losing) an argument with my familiar.

What I would like to see is Paizo coming out with a revision of Leadership that could be used in PFS, it is a feat with great roleplaying potential.

The main issue with Leadership, like the Druid, Summoner and casters with active familiars, is that it very easily eats up the time allotted, and more, while making the game less enjoyable for the other players.

Worst case scenario:
7 PCs
7 cohorts
7 ACs/active familiars/mounts
1d3+1 summoned creatures per PC.

20'x20' room.

Even without the cohorts, and a cap on ACs/Familiars/Mounts per PC, you can still getting into a situation where John Barbarian can never charge, or even get a melee attack off during most combats.

Especially for APs, modules, and Season 3 or earlier scenarios, which were written to handle a party of 4, it just turns it from fun into a game of who has the highest initiative each combat. Or a bunch of Diplomacy Aid Anothers added to a Diplomancer's roll.

What I would like to see is Paizo coming out with a revision of Leadership that could be used in PFS, it is a feat with great roleplaying potential.

The relationship you're hoping for doesn't exist. Pathfinder is the dog, Pathfinder Society is the tail. Tails don't wag dogs. Pathfinder rules are not modified to suit the needs of PFS. PFS applies filters to Pathfinder rules in order to ensure the overall success of organized play.

Pathfinder players can affect Pathfinder rules via posts and FAQ requests as well as meeting and getting to know Paizo people at cons.

In this case, if you've got some idea for how Leadership could be modified to make it a less powerful yet still appealing feat, you should start a new thread and post your ideas. If people are excited in the idea, they'll reply and the thread might hash out a viable alternative that eventually ends up in the Pathfinder rules via some publication.

And then, if it's suitable for organized play, it might be allowed in PFS.

Now would be a good time to end these additions to this old blog's comments and make a new thread for whatever you want to talk about. Very few people will actually see what you're writing here.