KC's Age of Worms

Game Master Kobold Catgirl

Congrats, everyone! You made it. I hated to have to make the selection, but I'm very pleased with who we got.

Roster:
Rynjin (Farrukh Al'Khatel, Human Slayer)
Dragoncat (Carina Viera, Tiefling Alchemist)
Feral (Tanith, Human Warpriest)
GM Jelani (Cuetzpalli, Human Barbarian)
Gark (Erip, Dwarf Necromancer)
Draconic Cow (Robin O'Haranson, Human Hunter)

Now, to remind everyone, here's the adventure's setup: There are three adventurers in town from the Free City. Staying at the Emporium, these adventurers have made no secret of their intentions to raid the Stirgenest Cairn—an area known to any native of Diamond Lake to be completely barren.

However, another cairn was rediscovered ten years ago by a Diamond Lake teenager. Called the Whispering Cairn for the strange noises heard within, the secret of its location was held as a dear secret by the youths of the town. They dared each other to spend a night within its depths, using the place as a test of mettle. These visits tapered off about six years ago, when a local girl vanished while sleeping there.

The Whispering Cairn is the last of its kind at Diamond Lake: the last cairn left unexplored. The last expedition was sixty years ago, and it failed miserably. Hopefully, you'll do better.

One of you (perhaps Farrukh) has decided to take advantage of this opportunity while it lasts. He might have recruited Tanith as someone who would know about the Cairn's existence, and the others could have followed through associations and chance encounters.

Again, congrats. I will be trying to post the IC thread within the week. I don't know about you, but I'm really looking forward to it. :)

Greetings everyone!

I'll get this alias updated tonight. When did you want to start?

Gark is going to be in Sweden, so we'll be starting at Monday at the earliest.

Ah, plenty of time to fiddle with crunch then.

Do you mind opening the gameplay thread for dotting purposes so it'll start showing up in our campaign summaries?

A red-skinned, petite brunette with pointed ears and a tail walks into the thread.

"Someone call for the doctor?"

Glad to be here!

Honestly, I'd rather wait until we officially start before making the Gameplay thread.

Understood.

Kobold are you of the opinion that stuff that improves unarmed strikes improves grappling?

Can you give an example?

In this case, warpriest is considered full BaB for weapons they have weapon focus in. If Tanith takes weapon focus (unarmed strike) will his grapple checks be full BaB or do I specifically have to take weapon focus (grapple)?

The reason this is an issue is because Paizo has been negligent is clarifying the issue. If you take weapon focus (longsword) and you use your sword to trip someone, you get to take advantage of your weapon focus. The question is if grappling is considered an extension of unarmed strikes.

Hm. In this case, as there don't appear to be any feats to drop in here, I'll rule that you can treat your total Hit Dice as your base attack bonus when calculating your CMB, though only for grappling. Wrestling is Kord's main shtick, after all.

EDIT: Grappling and unarmed strikes aren't meant to be the same thing, though, so Weapon Focus doesn't apply. That's what Improved Grapple is for. ;D

I'm going to get that too. =P

Farrukh, ready to go I think.

I have to say, building this guy, Slayer may be my new favorite martial character. He's so versatile build-wise, sort of. Lots of Feats (if you want them), trap disabling stuff, semi-Smite.

Doesn't have the AWESOME COSMIC POWER of the Barbarian, but I like him better than the Ranger. He has what I like from the Ranger (Combat Style Feats, tracking ability, Favored Enemy, sort of, and Favored Terrain, also sort of since you need to pick it), without the stuff I'm not too fond of (Animal Companion and the Ranger's spells).

It definitely is nice to finally have an official "spell-less ranger".

My only gripe about him (that seemed to have been heard during the playtest, so I expect it to be remedied) is that the list of unique Slayer Talents is very slim. There's a Slayer talent to gain many class abilities from the Rogue or Ranger (can take Rogue Talents in place of them, Combat Style, Favored Terrain, Trapfinding, etc.), but the only unique ones are Slowing Strike, Deadly Range, and Foil Scrutiny.

But other than that? Awesome possum.

Farrukh looks good, though it'd be nice to have his backstory up on the profile. :P

Also, everyone, make sure to mark your Action Points off somewhere--I notice Carina and Erip have, but everyone else is still missing them. It's handy to put them with HP in the "Classes/Levels" bar, if you're using the default statblock, as that makes them somewhat more convenient to access.

Oh, and just because Gark has been pestering me about it off-forum: Yes, I realize the traits aren't perfectly balanced. I'll make sure to throw in a leech swarm or five to balance it out.

Yeah, that's what I get for using PCGen...

I used Adopted to get World Traveler, a human race trait.

Erip's memory of the last 20-30 years is still a little hazy, but he's here.

Thanks for the pick, I'm ready to rumble.

Edit:I guess I should scour the avatars for something vaguely Aztec/Mayan looking...but I hate when the avatar doesn't match what the character looks like.

Tanith's ready to go.

I'll go over Erip's and Cuetzpalli's later.

In the meantime, you guys might want to start discussing how you each got roped into this adventure. I suggested Farrukh be the initiator, since he's the one who arrived with an interest in cairn desecration, but feel free to decide for yourselves. As long as someone goes to rob some dead guy's tomb, I'm cool with anything. ;D

Erip would be a ready recruit for such an adventure - he's kind of tired of being the henchman. He might have heard about the plan while gossiping outside the general store; alternatively, if Farrukh visits Allustan to ask about the cairns, Erip might intercept and offer his own knowledge (and access to the library) for free, as long as he gets to tag along.

Maybe Wierus heard about the venture, and he wanted a representative of his flock involved, so he dispatched Cuetzpalli to aid Farrukh.

** spoiler omitted **

Tanith is a local who certainly would have heard of the cairn as a bit of an urban legend. He's been trying to get away from the mines and Balabar Smenk for a couple years now. Some honest coin as a guide to intrepid explorers sounds like a good reason to meet up to me.

Edit: Damn it Cosmo!

Ah, half level things are normally minimum 1 in Pathfinder, I was assuming this was the same.

Erip would be a ready recruit for such an adventure - he's kind of tired of being the henchman. He might have heard about the plan while gossiping outside the general store; alternatively, if Farrukh visits Allustan to ask about the cairns, Erip might intercept and offer his own knowledge (and access to the library) for free, as long as he gets to tag along.

Ooh, I like that idea. Forgot Allustan was a guy.

Seems like the only real course of action for finding info on the cairns around here, and Farrukh's no idiot.

There is also the cartographer at the Garrison, but he's only really accessible if people work there. Otherwise, some sort of covert operation would be required. Had there been no apprentice to Allustan, that might have been the route the game had taken. Anyways, it's all moot.

And yeah, Cuetzpalli, half level things often break the general "always round down" rule. Action Points are one of the exceptions to that exception, though. ;D

Carina probably wouldn't initiate this on her own, but she'd be eager to go along with it, if only to get out of town for a few days. Constant pestering from Zalamandra to join the Emporium will do that to a person.

Still, she's going to have to let her mother know where she's going; don't want her to worry too much, after all. ;)

I'm liking the party thus far.

My only concern is that the front line is going to get crowded at times. We're looking at 3-4 melee characters plus an animal companion that's going to potentially become large later on. Cuetzpalli, will you be heartbroken if Spiny has to be benched on occasion?

Robin will also have a horse, though he may generally ride it.

I wouldn't worry too much. This is The Whispering Cairn, after all, and you'll be glad of the extra manpower soon enough.

I'm more worried about the long term. I've been through too many PFS scenarios where folks had to sit out because the ranger insisted on his animal companion fighting. =(

Trust me, it only gets harder. Especially as I'll be adjusting for the larger party. The idea is to challenge the PCs, and if people are sitting out, I'm doing something wrong.

This ain't PFS. If modifications are needed, they get made. ;D

Well it’s usually not a matter of sitting out because things are too easy. The problem is usually more a matter of space (only 3 melee spaces and the animal companion is taking up 2). I’m also anxious about the ever creeping Deos theory.

But I’m willing to trust you… for now. =P

I'm not sure I totally agree with your theory (was tricky looking it up, since there's a guy named Deos on these forums), but that's beside the point. :P

There are six melee spaces, not accounting for size (and size only comes up if the creature both lacks reach and isn't fighting from a corner). And that's assuming you're facing only one enemy, which will be pretty rare in a six-man party game.

If it becomes an issue, adjustments will be made, but forcing someone to have one of their class features "sit out" a combat is an absolute last resort.

In short, the Deos theory refers to the problem where a DM has to scale things to challenge a specific character and indirectly invalidates or steamrolls other characters as collateral damage. I’m not saying that’s going to happen here. It’s just something that comes to mind when I see especially vicious animal companions. =)

An enemy in an open space isn’t usually a problem. The space concern is more a problem in dungeons or other tight corridors. For example, in my Rise game, there’s three melee and the party is currently fighting ogres in 10-foot wide hallways. One of the melee is already stuck sitting out on occasion. I’d feel bad if he was sitting out because someone’s class feature was occupying that space.

I bring it up only to help us plan for the future. If he’s especially attached to having Spiny around all the time, we can compensate by having a few of us pick up reach and/or dedicated ranged weapons early on (as an example).

Ah, I see what you're saying. That theory's not half bad, then, though since everyone here is fairly optimized, I doubt it'll be an issue.

Fortunately, the Whispering Cairn is a pretty wide dungeon. So space-wise, there should be no problem. I won't say anything more about that, though.

As a random example, at level one Spiny does ~27 damage on a full attack. To compensate, the DM triples all monster HPs. Suddenly, the party rogue (sneak attacking with a rapier for ~7-8 damage per round) comparatively does little more than scratch the monsters now.

That’s the Deos theory at work. I don’t think we actually even have a rogue. =P

No rogue? Like I said, it's an optimized party. ;D

Also, on a full attack, that estimate assumes Spiny hits on all three attacks. With Power Attack, that's a rather generous estimate.

Regardless, Spiny and Cuetzpalli (especially Spiny) are supposed to be the best damage dealers. If a warpriest, hunter or slayer (secondary melee classes) could do more damage in a fight than a barbarian, there's something terribly wrong going on. ;D

EDIT: Couple things: First, Spiny's bite damage hasn't yet been adjusted for the replacement of Improved Natural Attack.

Second, Feral, make sure to fix your Flat-Footed AC.

My AC goes up when I'm flatfooted! (Also, fixed. =P)

There's the the best damage and then there's so much damage that the others aren't really even there. But I don't think the latter will be a problem.

There's the the best damage and then there's so much damage that the others aren't really even there. But I don't think the latter will be a problem.

Agreed. If it is, it's a very easy problem to rectify. Spiny may be a good melee fighter, but he's only a melee fighter--spinosauruses don't even get Scent, and that Will Save's not pretty.

If those weaknesses start to taper off as time goes on, it'll be more of an issue, but for now, it's just a barbarian with a crazy DPR. You've seen one, you've seen 'em all. ;D

Since we're just theorycrafting, what kind of encounters would you throw at us that could challenge Spiny without steamrolling or frustrating the rest of the party? This kind of problem is always a fun DMing challenge.

It is, but I'm not sure I want to share the ideas I have, because some of them may happen. :P

One of the more generic solutions, however , is a "swarm". A large number of weak enemies allows Spiny to use his full attacking skills and do the majority of the fighting, but still leaves room for other characters to shine (especially the alchemist, since lots of weak enemies = bomb fodder).

Just trust me here--the gap is not that large. Even without me making modifications, I can think of one particular module in the AP where Spiny is not going to have fun times.

Spiny will probably fall off pretty quick. By 4th or 5th (or definitely 6th) you'll be wondering why you ever even worried in the first place, as the rest of us level up, get more HP, BaB, Feats, and especially gear.

He'll become competitive again around 7th when he gets his size boost and attribute bonuses, and then by 9th he'll have peaked and be exactly what he was supposed to be to begin with, an added bonus to the class.

He's actually not even technically as good as a 2H Barbarian at 1st level now anyway. Raging Power Attacks can hit 2d6+15 easy at 1st level. Minimum damage of 17, on a single hit, more than enough to obliterate most 1st and 2nd level creatures, leaving Spiny's "Slightly more damage IF I hit all of them" largely irrelevant, since the thing's dead either way.

We'll be glad of the extra body on the field for now considering how squishy 1st and 2nd level characters are.

Heh. I suppose I’m gun-shy because PFS mostly happens around those sweet spots where animal companions are at their peak and I’ve played with too many inconsiderate players. I also see too many DM Advice threads that involve punishing the rest of the party because of an overly powerful character.

Problem: “The barbarian one-rounds everything.”

Solution: “Use lots of flying enemies!”

The Reality: That hurts all the melee.

Problem: “The fighter’s AC is too high.”

Solution: “Use lots of incorporeal enemies with touch attacks!”

The Reality: That hurts everyone.

Problem: “The wizard’s spell DCs are too high.”

Solution: “Boost everything’s saving throws!”

The Reality: Now the monk’s stunning fist never lands.

I trust KC to handle things in a graceful manner that manages Spiny without marginalizing the rest of the melee.

Character's been fully updated.

Now with her progression plan!

Problem: “The wizard’s spell DCs are too high.”

Solution: “Boost everything’s saving throws!”

The Reality: Now the monk’s stunning fist never lands.

Well to be fair Stunning Fist never works anyway, so small loss. =)

In my experience it works just fine. =)