Cottonseed Lodge (PFS2)

Game Master Redelia

@Brenael- I would post your recruitment in the recruitment tab. This way more eyes will get on it and you post won't get buried in the discussion.

@Brenael- I would post your recruitment in the recruitment tab. This way more eyes will get on it and you post won't get buried in the discussion.

Thanks, yes I'll do that in a bit over a week once I have things set up. But yes but it does look like it will be buried pretty quickly here :)

I also don't buy the PDF's because it is much easier for me to find things in physical books (and to read them from cover to cover) than in PDF's and I have yet to find a (free) PDF viewer on a tablet that could have more than one PDF open at a time.

Foxit Phantom Reader does this on PC tablets.

I've always brought every non-Core book, printed PDF page, or laptop with the PDFs for the character(s) I was planning to use that day at my physical locations. It was the culture where I was introduced to PFS.

Nobody is saying that you or anyone else has to start doing audits. However, it is an expectation that one can show that they have the non-Core resource for the options they're using, and if someone asks you to show proof, that's not a negative on them and the asking shouldn't be vilified.

By all means lobby to change the rule/expectation on the PFS forums, but don't make the rank-and-file GMs who are doing what they feel is right feel bad about it.

For a change of subject, all my current tables are done. Does anybody have anything they would like to see run?

I was contemplating 1-18 Lodge of the Living God. I have run it once, but playing in person or on VTT this scenario runs 5 to 6 hours. It seems made for PbP, but it will take quite a while.

I'm planning to take the plunge and start GMing here in a few weeks. I've enjoyed the games I have played so far (thanks to some great GMs and fellow players) and would like to contribute back. I'll start with Q15: In the Footsteps of Horror and be running the low tier.

Looking back I've seen a few other people have started with an experienced GM playing at the table and mentoring them. Would anyone be interested in doing that?

Save me a seat. I'm running 3 tables but have yet to play it! :)

For a change of subject, all my current tables are done. Does anybody have anything they would like to see run?

I was contemplating 1-18 Lodge of the Living God. I have run it once, but playing in person or on VTT this scenario runs 5 to 6 hours. It seems made for PbP, but it will take quite a while.

That's a long one. Doug Hahn's "management system" is pretty good though.

Given that the discussion on what is required for players has ranged rather far into opinions, just to be clear, the actual rules for ownership and what is needed can be found here Character Options and can be summarised for most non AP content as;

To use an option from any source other than those discussed above in Pathfinder Society play, you must bring any one of the following to your game table:
• • A physical copy of the book you wish to use
  
• • A name-watermarked PDF copy of the book
  
• • Name-watermarked printouts of all relevant pages you wish to use from the PDF
  
• • Access to the rules you wish to use in the form of either electronic access to the Pathfinder Reference Document (paizo.com/prd) or a photocopy of the relevant pages, along with proof of purchase, such as a receipt from a game store or a screenshot of your My Downloads page on paizo.com.

Society GMs are always enabled to check this whenever they feel it is needed, both to ensure players actually do have the sources required for their character, as well as to have a means to check precise wording when it is important.

if someone asks you to show proof, that's not a negative on them and the asking shouldn't be vilified.

By all means lobby to change the rule/expectation on the PFS forums, but don't make the rank-and-file GMs who are doing what they feel is right feel bad about it.

Me posting here is exactly lobbying to change the expectations around this. I have long given up on trying to change the rules - I'm focusing on expectations.

Let's start by setting the context. A huge fraction of PFS numbers have 0 or 1 games attached to them, and a large part of that is overly-bureaucratic rules such as this one, forcing players to go through a significant barrier for a tiny modicum of benefit. PFS has a terrible reputation outside of PFS, and guess what - GMs pulling surprise inspections on whole tables does nothing but add to the general distrust of the system.

Reasonable expectation: Players should never have a surprise audit. If a GM wishes to spend time auditing the whole table, that should be on the sign-up, people know that 6:00-6:30 is show and tell, and the game begins at 6:30. If a region wants to do audits, just go ahead and do them every session, so players know they're lugging their books for some reason, not for a 0.1% chance they get audited. Better yet, announce audits every session but have a Saturday session or something where regulars can bring allll their stuff in for "pre-auditing" and just get all their characters cleared.

If someone has a targeted problem, send a targeted solution. Have the VO pull problem players aside for whatever the PFS equivalent of a corporate Performance Improvement Plan is, while the GM moves on with other players. Just ban anyone who needs repeat warnings, quietly and efficiently. No need to make a stink about it, no need to involve the table.

Watery Soup, I think you're missing the point. If audits are only when announced, then those who chose not to purchase resources will simply not sign up that day, or sign up with a character who is legal.

It is actually for that reason important that there occasionally be unexpected checks. It's not overly bureaucratic to check that people are following the rules. The rules say that you need to bring proof of ownership for the character you will be playing to every game. If you are following the rules, a quick check will not be a big deal.

(most of the unexpected character audit's I've seen have been very quick; the GM just picks one thing that a character uses and asks the player to show the ownership of that source. That's far quicker and simpler than checking everything on a character.)

Let's stop criticizing or trying to make guilty GMs for doing what they can to keep the community working well and following the rules.

On a more positive note, thank you to those GMs who occasionally make time to check on character resource ownership. It's a pain, but it's important.

I'm planning to take the plunge and start GMing here in a few weeks. I've enjoyed the games I have played so far (thanks to some great GMs and fellow players) and would like to contribute back. I'll start with Q15: In the Footsteps of Horror and be running the low tier.

Looking back I've seen a few other people have started with an experienced GM playing at the table and mentoring them. Would anyone be interested in doing that?

Thank you for asking! I can think of several of our experienced GMs who would be happy to do this. Make sure you include a request for this in your recruitment post, along with some way for interested mentors to identify themselves. If you don't have any takes (and I would find that extremely unlikely), then DM me and I would be happy to join in.

Brenael wrote:

I'm planning to take the plunge and start GMing here in a few weeks. I've enjoyed the games I have played so far (thanks to some great GMs and fellow players) and would like to contribute back. I'll start with Q15: In the Footsteps of Horror and be running the low tier.

Looking back I've seen a few other people have started with an experienced GM playing at the table and mentoring them. Would anyone be interested in doing that?

Thank you for asking! I can think of several of our experienced GMs who would be happy to do this. Make sure you include a request for this in your recruitment post, along with some way for interested mentors to identify themselves. If you don't have any takes (and I would find that extremely unlikely), then DM me and I would be happy to join in.

Save me a seat please. I can help you out.

Watery Soup, I think you're missing the point.

I disagree, I think I'm seeing the big picture, and you all are missing the point.

So what if people only bring legal characters on days audits are announced? So what if cheaters stop signing up? What's so bad about that? If cheating is rampant and a huge problem, then just audit every week and build the audit time into the schedule. Schedule fewer games if people drop out en masse after audits are announced. On the other hand, if cheating is not rampant, then you're just wasting everyone's time to catch some very determined cheaters.

Anyone using the "spot check" method is tacitly admitting that cheating isn't rampant. To be a rational deterrent, audits have to be done at a frequency higher than cheating is taking place. The lower the burden of the checking, the less cheating the checker thinks is going on. I contend that everyone agrees - tacitly or explicitly - that the number of intentional cheaters is low. So why would we have a system where the assumption of cheating is high?

Making everyone at the table bring in books for any character they might use (not everyone decides up front exactly what character they're playing) to catch a vanishingly small number of people who intentionally cheat is grossly inefficient. The number of false positives - people who didn't know the rules, misunderstood the rules, or misapplied the rules - is going to swamp out the number of true positives (people who intentionally cheat).

I believe the auditing system that you all have implemented will end up driving away new players and new GMs.

To be clear: the ownership rule is fine, it's the enforcement that needs to be done differently. I've given my suggestions, so don't accuse me of not coming up with alternatives.

Actually, you are still advocating changing the rules. The rules are that you need to bring proof of ownership to every game.

And the problem with people only bringing legal characters on days that character audits are announced is that they may be bringing illegal characters on other days. If there is at least some possibility that an audit may happen, people will just not bring illegal characters at all. Or else they are risking being caught.

The point of auditing isn't to catch cheaters, it's to prevent people from cheating in the first place.

Watery Soup, your lobbying efforts go here: Organized Play Forum.

This is the local discussion board for a single PbP lodge. So unless you are arguing that the GMs of this lodge should be doing something different from the rules--and you have your answer the from the VOs on that--it belongs on the more appropriate forum where the more appropriate audience will see it and interact with it.

The point of auditing isn't to catch cheaters, it's to prevent people from cheating in the first place.

Auditing is a collective punishment for a crime which may or may not be occuring. It's an indirect method. The more direct way to do enforce ownership rules is to help people build legal characters.

Watery Soup, your lobbying efforts go here: Organized Play Forum.

Sure.

Auditing is not a punishment, just like maintaining chronicle sheets is not a punishment.

I think this discussion has run its course and we probably should move on. At this point I don't think anyone's mind is going to be changed, the rules have been cited, and GM's/VO's are free to enforce the rules as they see fit. We don't have to see eye to eye on the purpose or method of auditing ownership resources or characters, and that's okay.

Anyone else having issues with the https://organizedplayfoundation.org/ web site?>

I'm getting an "account suspended" message.

It's a known issue and being worked on.

Here's the post about it along with links to some archived PDF's for interim use:

https://paizo.com/threads/rzs43w6c?OPF-WebsiteGuide-Outage

bigrin42 wrote:

Brenael wrote:

I'm planning to take the plunge and start GMing here in a few weeks. I've enjoyed the games I have played so far (thanks to some great GMs and fellow players) and would like to contribute back. I'll start with Q15: In the Footsteps of Horror and be running the low tier.

Looking back I've seen a few other people have started with an experienced GM playing at the table and mentoring them. Would anyone be interested in doing that?

Thank you for asking! I can think of several of our experienced GMs who would be happy to do this. Make sure you include a request for this in your recruitment post, along with some way for interested mentors to identify themselves. If you don't have any takes (and I would find that extremely unlikely), then DM me and I would be happy to join in.

Save me a seat please. I can help you out.

Thanks GM Tiger, will do.

Are there alternate starting consumables you can claim at the start of a scenario? At one point there were schools as per this link, but I vaguely remember that they are no longer a thing.

The schools became optional IIRC.

since the guide to organized play is down, I can't link to it, but the schools still exist. The points system was changed, now you just choose one of the schools (scrolls, swords, spells or generalist, or commissioned field agent) and each school has consumables to offer besides a healing potion(s)

The Organize Play Website is down, but there are >PDF copies< of the PF2 and Starfinder 1st Edition in the status thread here.

Pages 28-33 in the guide have information in the current set up of the school consumables.

Well, I'll be. Did a search on starting consumables, but I needed to search on schools.

I know Gen-Con is far away and they haven't asked volunteers yet, but I'm asking cause 2024 might actually be the first year I get to go since I now have a friend in my location that also plays Paizo games. I'm going off of previous blogs.

7 Blocks Housing: It says 2 Gms per room. Question is where is the housing? Does the 2nd GM also have to gm 7 blocks? Say I want to bring a friend with me. I have to GM 7 blocks and my friend has to GM 7 blocks?
3-7 Blocks Player Badge: Do I only get 1 player badge regardless of how many blocks I GM. Again this is the, give a player badge to my friend question.

Same type of questions for Origins in Columbus.

I know Gen-Con is far away and they haven't asked volunteers yet, but I'm asking cause 2024 might actually be the first year I get to go since I now have a friend in my location that also plays Paizo games. I'm going off of previous blogs.

IDK about Origins but for Gencon---

7 Blocks Housing: It says 2 Gms per room. Question is where is the housing?

Does the 2nd GM also have to gm 7 blocks?

Yes

Say I want to bring a friend with me. I have to GM 7 blocks and my friend has to GM 7 blocks?

Correct

3-7 Blocks Player Badge: Do I only get 1 player badge regardless of how many blocks I GM. Again this is the, give a player badge to my friend question.

The player badge has your name on it and can't be given to a friend. You should be wearing your badge at all times while at the convention and this is ESPECIALLY enforced while you are running/playing paizo games. Gen Con Staff does check tables to make sure badges are out, and the Paizo con organizers will also be checking so they don't get in trouble when too many people don't have their badge on.

You didn't ask, but I'll offer my advice. If you are GM'ing enough blocks to get a hotel then you will be living and breathing in the Sagamore ballroom. You will have very few to no slots to spend with your friend unless they happened to sit at your table as a player. I'm not saying don't do it, I've had some great times at Gen Con running 7+ blocks, but I also was arranging for my SO to play at my table so we could spend time together. Otherwise My morning and afternoons were running games and in the evening I had a few hours with her to get food, explore expo hall and/or find other games to play before I needed to get to bed and do it all over again. This would be further complicated if your friend is also running games and may have a different schedule than you.

Same type of questions for Origins in Columbus.

IDK about origins but I imagine it is pretty similar

Only 2 Weeks Left!
GMs, with only 2 weeks left in Gameday XII play, you should be winding down your tables (assuming you aren’t already finished) and getting them ready for reporting by our HQ crew. Hopefully you are in a good place to finish by the Nov 20 end date, but if not, please go ahead and mark your tables Ready for Reporting by Nov 20 so we can wrap up the convention. Then, finish your games as soon as you can. If you need assistance in pushing your game to the finish, please contact your PBP lodge Venture Officers.

To those in my games (either as a player or as a GM):

Internet at work is currently down so there will be delays in my updates.

Origins is more sane - smaller game room, quieter space, easier to play together or apart. I found it easier to get in and out of food options too.

For GenCon - If your friend doesn't want to GM, HQ is always needed. It fills up fast, though.

Hmm

disregard my previous post. Internet was just restored.

IMHO, if you guys want to do auditing, I'd suggest the following:

Pick a random player at any time, offer him to auction his whole character folio.

Do it, step by step. If anything is missing, give him the chance to fix it in a reasonable timetable (say 1 week).

Keep track of who has been audited.

You'll go crazy otherwise. How many players are there? how many characters? I'm looking at you Goji~Tsu ;)

That would be my 2 cents.

Hi, everyone!

The Guide has been restored on the internet, so I've fixed the link in the campaign header.

Hey folks, do someone have a link to pregen bb codes? I think it was pinned some time ago, but I couldn't find a working link

Hey folks, do someone have a link to pregen bb codes? I think it was pinned some time ago, but I couldn't find a working link

It's in the campaign info tab for this campaign.

Hi, everyone!

The Guide has been restored on the internet, so I've fixed the link in the campaign header.

Something's off about that link. It goes to the right place, but the label isn't right.

Something's off about that link. It goes to the right place, but the label isn't right.

Fixed. It was a silly copy/paste error. Thanks for letting me know.

Gameday XII - That’s A Wrap!

187 games were registered, split almost evenly between GM Choice and First Come First Served recruitment. 96 GMs ran the games and hundreds of players joined them. What a great turnout!

Once the last few games get reported, we will be mailing out 50 randomly drawn prize vouchers, so make your offerings to the gods of chance, and may fortune be on your side. Also, at the same time we will be sending out those PF1 boons to the GMs and lucky players.

We want to hear your feedback, so please fill out this feedback form. Let us know what you liked, and how we can improve in the future. This form is anonymous, but if you want us to get back to you, please let us know how (paizo forum message, discord DM, or email).

Gameday XII feedback survey

Thank you all for participating in Gameday XII, and be on the lookout for the next PBP event, Outpost VII, coming this spring.

Hopes for a door prize... Sacrifices bigrin42 to the gods of chance...

@GM Redelia

I'll bite. What is GM School?

@GM Redelia

I'll bite. What is GM School?

Massee watches with interest as Computerpro82 eyes and then nibbles the bait... he sits waiting for Redelia to snap the rod up, driving the hook deep inside Computerpro82's top lip. She's got one!

GM school is our training program for new GMs, or at least new-to-PbP GMs. We have a classroom time first where we talk about what makes a good GM as well as how to do mechanical things like set up maps. Then we continue that discussion while everyone involved gets a chance to GM a short adventure (or part of an adventure) for a table of other students and a mentor.

GM Computerpro82 wrote:

@GM Redelia

I'll bite. What is GM School?

Massee watches with interest as Computerpro82 eyes and then nibbles the bait... he sits waiting for Redelia to snap the rod up, driving the hook deep inside Computerpro82's top lip. She's got one!

ouch! :)

Though in my case, since I use circle hooks, I just wait for Computerpro82 to swim off with the bait, only to find a large hook lodged at the corner of his mouth...

Yes, I'm a Sucker and I freely admit it.

I am interested, but confused whether I should sign up as a student or a Mentor, since I have been GMing here almost 2 years, but I've never been to school

Yes, I'm a Sucker and I freely admit it.

I am interested, but confused whether I should sign up as a student or a Mentor, since I have been GMing here almost 2 years, but I've never been to school

I'm signing up as a student -- like you, my GM background is mostly "figure things out as you go along"... and there's always something to learn in a beginners class...

I'm signing up as a student -- like you, my GM background is mostly "figure things out as you go along"... and there's always something to learn in a beginners class...

I quite agree. I almost wonder whether this could be an experienced GM's compare notes on how they like to do things class as opposed to a class oriented towards teaching students. Or maybe there is room for both?

I should have my 5th Glyph by then, so I may have a hard time being viewed as a student.