All's Well that Ends in a Well

Game Master Choon

Good luck.

Are all the rats in the deeper cave dire too?

Yup. :)

YAY! It was finally more damage not to throw a bomb at the floor haha

You forgot to add your int mod to damage

You forgot to add your int mod to damage

On review I incorrectly added a 2 damage.

On direct hit my bonus damage is +INT, +1 Point Blank Shot.

I accidently double counted PBS, forgot that my +6 I had in my notes already included that. On review I found that Throw Anything only adds to Atk, not Dmg.

So my 2d4+6+1 should of been 2d4+5

Ouch, looks like I missed the rat. Hope I don't burn the woman...unless she wants to kill us too. I guess strategically we want to kill all the rats and have the woman at like one hit point, although we also don't know how many hit points she has in total so uh...probably just want to keep her alive and see what's up.

Assuming its a miss (most likely) I believe you or GM roll a 1d8 to determine direction change by 1 square. 1 = toward you and clockwise from there, with all taking splash damage only with reflex. If I understood that correctly, 25% chance (a 4 or 5) will hit the princess with splash of either 3 or 6 fire dmg depending on her save.

whew.... I really need to just save my weapon rolls, that is a lot to put in even with copy and paste

Me: I can get a post up at work!
Work: HHAHHAHAHAHA*cough*... heh...

Sorry for the silence guys. Just married and a favorite game (Divinity Original Sin 2 - great game, big recommendation) was released.
So me and my gamer-wife just spend three-days straight gaming, eating pizza and generally slacking off hard after the last months of preparation and planning.
Things will go slowly back to normal in the coming days due to pressing issues of university-stuff. Can't give a fix day for the next post, probably Friday (?) but I'll be back soon.
Feel free to bot me whenever necessary Choon.

No worries! Have fun! ;)

Three days of no food but pizza? You must be pretty desperate.

Three days of no food but pizza? You must be pretty desperate.

It was only two days.

So back-to-topic.
Am I still up, or do I have to wait after the next round resolution after being bot-ed?
Just to make sure ŵe're on the same page (I think I'll have to wait, right?)

You can act if you want. I haven't rolled anything yet.

Update to come tomorrow morning.

That intimidate check went about as well as expected. Great opportunity for anyone with a charisma score not in single digits to play good cop.

This is the infusion to which I was referring.

Choices are made at the time of drinking, so she's going to be the one choosing from between all of those options. Not sure if I can make it in such a way to incentivise one choice over another, I'd probably choose sleep or pleasant hallucinations.

Maglins are you trying to get Dalkk to lower his bow or communicate something else?

I love that Vuzi can roll a 1 on diplomacy and beat my best cha skill even with a boost

Trying to get him to lower his bow. Figured he probably wouldn't know that until it happened, however.

I somehow have no ranks in diplomacy, despite having roughly one million skill points and a positive ability score. Amazing.

Reflecting on it now I'm not sure we have much of a party face as far as stats are concerned. Anyone have a particularly solid diplomacy, bluff, or intimidate? If not, anyone can afford to pour skill points into it next level? I have the skill points but at best I'm barely canceling out the negative ability mod.

I have intimidate and sense motive

Your marks have been tallied.

I can drop a few points into diplomacy, and I've got a positive modifier so I wouldn't be terrible at it. It's not a class skill for me though, so at best I'm going to be passable.

I have a racial penalty that is exactly balanced by my charisma except for intimidate

Vuzi has a +5 cha mod and a couple ranks already in both Diplomacy and bluff. Vuzi on your next level can you afford a few more ranks in bluff at least? Your also our only divine mage so dont go so far that your hurting that, but if Vuzi can rank up Bluff and Diplomacy (probably best in that order), and maglin adds a few diplomacy, and Cain keeps up Intimidate...

Then Vuzi will be the face with the best roll for all 3 (off ability and skill alone as it sits right now) +12 Intimidate, +6 Bluff and Diplomacy. Cain can work as backup Intimidation, Maglin a few ranks at for backup Diplomacy, and just have to live without a backup bluffer.

Does that work for everyone?

Not sure if intentional or not, but I didn't anticipate this much social interaction, so well done GM Choon

:D

Vuzi has the Oracle's wasting curse so she gets a -4 to all CHA basked skills except for Intimidate otherwise I would totally be the face. She's also dumb as a rock so she gets almost no skill points.

If I thought she was undead, I'd zap her in a heartbeat. I think she's alive. Probably evil and trying to lure us to our dooms, but alive.

You could cast disrupt undead to be sure

The message about vuzi helping was not that this lady was undead, but that we might get our answers faster if we kill her so that you can control her haha

Oh, I assumed you were talking about some interaction in town I couldn't remember...uh...pretty sure Maglin would just ignore that comment though.

So on CHA skills...
Intimidate is more then covered with Vuzi and Cain
For Bluff and Diplomacy...
Maglin +2
Vuzi +2 (with ranks)
Simon +0
Cain +0 (with racial penalty)
Dalkk (+2 Bluff -2 Diplomacy)

There is no great choice, but Maglin if you can take both that's awesome, if not then just diplomacy and I'll start taking up bluff since we both get crazy skill points. I can play Dalkk's bluff as him being so horrible that it's distracting? Like someone too distracted by the smell to think clearly and aren't able to pay attention to what he's saying.

If either of us start losing too much in another skill as we compensate we will need to communicate that.

If someone can take on learning Eagle's Splendor as well, that should serve us very well indeed. The one gift to these skills is we can usually stall out a minute to prepare before we have to roll.

The message about vuzi helping was not that this lady was undead, but that we might get our answers faster if we kill her so that you can control her haha

That's always an option. Though I think Simon might have an issue with that particular course of action.

I'm positive he would as well, but if we throw a 50ft ball of twine to distract him first....

Whew, just recovering over a 3dy stomach bug, sorry for not letting y'all know, but just standing was an issue for awhile there

I'm seriously thinking this lady is a spellcaster, would be helpful if someone could silence her either with a spell or a gag. I don't think we've tried detect magic yet have we?

You know, that bag hurt, and I don't know if we get XP for surviving things like that, but I get the feeling that compared to where we would of been lead would of been much worse.

You do get xp, which I will be catching up on soon, and yes. It could have been much worse. ;)

No worries GM, I doubt this would put us near the next level alone anyway. Id love the stats on that bag to use in my own campaign though, cause damn that thing packs a wallop

It's a cursed item, Dust of Sneezing and Choking
It was her panic button for if things went south.

Definitely could have been worse. I maybe should've posted something in the discussion thread along the lines of "I don't think we should trust her too much".

Maglin definitely wanted to trust her an amount he knew was unreasonable, though. He's been lost in a cave before himself, and although he wasn't alone and it wasn't for very long, he really really didn't like it.

Actual post to come but inquiring early...
GM Choon how big are these tunnels? How many? More to the point between high knowledge of stone work and crazy perception boosts, plus maglins insane knowledge of pretty much everything, is it conceivable that in a short time that we could attempt to collapse these tunnels? Or is it so big and wide or numerous that to do so would be a proper constructive undertaking? Or would maglins high knowledge of nature reveal that new ones could be dug easily and our efforts pointless?

Three are six. You could crawl through them, but nowhere near as fast as that lady did. They are petty easily collapsable, but it'll take some time.

I suggest we collapse them then. Not in too terrible a position, and I'd bet more on the lady being a hundred feet ahead of us waiting at whatever trap we were supposed to spring than on her trying to come out of the tunnels with whatever friends she has. Assuming she has friends, which I think is a fair assumption. If it's not then I don't think she'll try to engage directly, in which case collapsing the tunnels is a definite good idea.

I'm sure she has friends. Both IC and OOC I've got some suspicion that she could turn into a rat if she wanted. Powerful magic item suggests more than a front line soldier. These were rats not ratfolk though.. perhaps that suggests rats being a lower hierarchy then her? I feel confident that they both use the same tunnels, and I feel confident that it was a setup. Beyond that it's hard to say. If this is a regular trap they pull then they sacrificed a lot of rat lives for it. The bodies didn't disappear which suggests they weren't summoned. If we weren't special and this is the norm then we're in less danger then if they set this up for us in particular.

It's been maybe two hours at most since the rats swarmed us outside? That's enough time to set a trap. I have no guesses regarding her other allies, but there are probably a massive amount of rats (what do they eat? Who cares?).

I suggest preparing a few infusions of reduce and enlarge person for Thulian and then send him down a few of the tunnels. They might go somewhere with treasure, and he probably won't get attacked by rats since he's undead. Isn't that a thing? Maglin would know.

He would definitely be avoided by them and they could smell him coming a mile away, but as far as I know animals don't have any particular aversion to attacking undead.

Hey Choon, how would you feel about adopting the Long Rest or Short Rest rules from 5e? I'm not sure where we're at as far as passage of time goes, but Long Rest lets people 'camp' for 8hrs or so and reset daily powers. I get the feeling that like today we may burn through daily abilities pretty fast here. Might be nice and convenient for everyone to have the option to effectively rest up to twice in a 24hr period.

5e's short rest only let you recover certain abilities

for example, only warlocks and (I think) eldritch knight fighters got their spells back in that time if memory serves me

5e's short rest only let you recover certain abilities

for example, only warlocks and (I think) eldritch knight fighters got their spells back in that time if memory serves me

Glad to see your still correcting even though your not playing.. that's totally awesome...

I made the distinction between the two and suggested being able to use a long rest. In 5E it's phrased as Long Rest vs Short Rest to allow tables to decide what fits for the campaign. In some campaigns a Long Rest may be several days, especially if it's a heavy social campaign where use of daily abilities may come up only once every few days. Without this adjustment there is no incentive for players to hold back or budget their abilities.

Alternatively in a heavy dungeon crawl with a strong combat focus it may be overly taxing on players to stick to a strict 24-hr clock. Rather then do the ridiculous of adventuring for 2-3Hrs and making camp for 20+Hrs this would provide another alternative.

But again- glad to see your active to correct us at least

You crest the last hill and finally the complex comes into view. In stark contrast to the lush greenery of the hills you just fought your way through lies a large sunken graveyard laid out in the shape of a cross. Rather than towering  above the ground, the graves have settled into depressions, and the  main mausoleum, a building of strange green stone, rests in the deepest depression some 40 ft. below the ground on which you now stand. At the other end of the grave-filled hollow stands what appears to be a stone well. There are no gravestones near it. The  normal sounds of wildlife are gone, and large carrion birds circle  overhead. An ominous silence rests about the place.
Each of you knows in your heart that you have found the legendary dungeon of Rappan Athuk. And though none dare speak it, you wonder if you  will live to return to the warmth of hearth and home.

Welcome to this, the time of my Rappan Athuk recruitment! It's only the third one of these I've seen recently. Oh well.
You are like family to me, and because of that I'm going to throw a select group of you out of the frying pan of this recruitment and into the fire of Rappan Athuk!  You're so lucky!

The Setting
Generally Golarion. You may use the Golarion deities outlined in Inner Sea Gods and other locations from Golarion as you will. I am placing Rappan Athuk on an island in the Shackles if you want to include travels in your stories, but that won't really play into the game. The dungeon is deep in the Forest of Hope atop a decent hill.  The Coast Road runs nearby linking the port to the central town on the island.  Finding the dungeon isn’t hard.  Surviving is a different story.
In your backstories, please include what experiences you have had to achieve fourth level. Don't get too grandiose. You may have overcome a local menace but that's about it. Think of it as the ability level at the end of the first book of an AP.
This time could have been spent wandering the wild and dangerous lands around the entrance to the dungeon or guarding wagons on the Coast Road. We will be skipping that part of the book as it doesn't interest me all that much. It's nice and deadly and all, but I wanted to start a bit later than level 1.

This recruitment will remain open for at least two weeks with a projected end date of August 2nd.  

As for tone, I will be playing this one pretty hard and not fudging in your favor.  Your advantage in the partial gestalt allows me to take the gloves off.  Death is possible, especially if I roll well...poorly… whatever.  If, when, a PC death happens we will discuss how to bring in a replacement.

I tend to post at least 1/day, sometimes much more.  If that needs to fall off for a time I will notify everyone.

Dot! I've got an idea for a ratfolk wizard; I'm not sure what his ".5" class will be yet. Let's go with 18 in Intelligence (of course), and 8 in Charisma. Other stats:
4d6 ⇒ (1, 4, 1, 2) = 8 = 7
4d6 ⇒ (2, 4, 3, 2) = 11 = 9
4d6 ⇒ (5, 3, 2, 2) = 12 = 10
4d6 ⇒ (4, 3, 3, 6) = 16 = 13

Um. Yeah. I'm thinking a 15 point buy for the other four stats is definitely the way to go!

So, that's 18, 17, 14, 12, 11, 8

I have a question about this 1.5 gestalt. Let's say I'm a Wizard 4//Barbarian 2. I get BAB and saves of the wizard, 2 levels of Barbarian HP and skills and 2 levels of Wizard HP and skills. On the 5th level, I get everything from wizard. On the 6th, I get Barbarian HP and skills. Did I get that right?

Dotting!

4d6 ⇒ (2, 2, 3, 4) = 11 9
4d6 ⇒ (2, 3, 5, 4) = 14 12
4d6 ⇒ (3, 5, 5, 6) = 19 16
4d6 ⇒ (2, 5, 1, 6) = 14 13

I think that's 14 points? Am I right there? I wouldn't mind just taking that 9 up to a 10, but it isn't super important, probably. I've got a few ideas floating around, but it's a shame Avowed didn't make the cut. Likely something psionic, in any case.

4d6 ⇒ (6, 5, 3, 2) = 16 = 14
4d6 ⇒ (1, 2, 6, 5) = 14 = 13
4d6 ⇒ (4, 1, 6, 4) = 15 = 14
4d6 ⇒ (4, 2, 5, 6) = 17 = 15

20 point buy...it's a keeper.

4d6 ⇒ (4, 4, 3, 2) = 13 =11
4d6 ⇒ (2, 1, 3, 2) = 8 =7
4d6 ⇒ (6, 4, 5, 5) = 20 =16
4d6 ⇒ (3, 5, 4, 4) = 16 =13

I'll go with point buy.

Dotting; will have to roll later when I'm at my computer.

Dotting.

4d6: 4d6 ⇒ (5, 4, 3, 1) = 13 12
4d6: 4d6 ⇒ (6, 1, 1, 6) = 14 13
4d6: 4d6 ⇒ (6, 1, 1, 1) = 9 8
4d6: 4d6 ⇒ (1, 2, 2, 2) = 7 6

Rerolling:
4d6: 4d6 ⇒ (6, 6, 6, 3) = 21 18
4d6: 4d6 ⇒ (5, 4, 2, 6) = 17 15
4d6: 4d6 ⇒ (6, 1, 2, 1) = 10 9
4d6: 4d6 ⇒ (5, 6, 2, 1) = 14 13

I can work with that one.

Interesting. :)

Ability Score 1: 4d6 ⇒ (5, 6, 5, 6) = 22 = 17
Ability Score 2: 4d6 ⇒ (2, 3, 3, 5) = 13 = 11
Ability Score 3: 4d6 ⇒ (1, 2, 6, 2) = 11 = 10
Ability Score 4: 4d6 ⇒ (3, 2, 2, 5) = 12 = 10

Wow, weird one. I think that is close, but less than 15, so I will try again. :)

Ability Score 1: 4d6 ⇒ (1, 4, 2, 6) = 13 = 12
Ability Score 2: 4d6 ⇒ (6, 6, 2, 5) = 19 = 17
Ability Score 3: 4d6 ⇒ (5, 6, 2, 4) = 17 = 15
Ability Score 4: 4d6 ⇒ (3, 3, 4, 1) = 11 = 10

Not sure what I will go with yet, but I will come up with something soon. Sounds like a fun, challenging game.

What do we use for hit points per level? Average? Roll?

Dotting!

4d6 9
4d6 12
4d6 16
4d6 13

I think that's 14 points? Am I right there? I wouldn't mind just taking that 9 up to a 10, but it isn't super important, probably. I've got a few ideas floating around, but it's a shame Avowed didn't make the cut. Likely something psionic, in any case.

Whoops! Forgot my reroll.

4d6 ⇒ (4, 3, 2, 4) = 13 11
4d6 ⇒ (6, 6, 4, 2) = 18 16
4d6 ⇒ (1, 6, 1, 1) = 9 8
4d6 ⇒ (6, 6, 2, 5) = 19 17

Wow. I'll take it.

Dotting. Very interesting setup!

4d6 ⇒ (2, 3, 4, 5) = 14 = 12
4d6 ⇒ (3, 3, 2, 6) = 14 = 12
4d6 ⇒ (3, 5, 5, 5) = 18 = 15
4d6 ⇒ (6, 4, 3, 5) = 18 = 15

I like that just fine! Will consider options and get something posted soon.

Also I second madcaster's question about future levelling.

edit: Are background skills in play?

You are like family to me, and because of that I'm going to throw a select group of you out of the frying pan of this recruitment and into the fire of Rappan Athuk! You're so lucky!

Something about that sentence just really does it for me. And based on a small sample of your past posts, I can expect more like this if I am selected.

Totally unrelated to my extreme luck, I've begun to wonder if I should prepare a backup character. I will be going for the 15 point buy.

Is the 18 and 8 we get before racials, or can we modify them? I guess it's not my first choice to play a character with an 8 in an ability score, mostly because I'm so perfect in every way myself. I've got all the qualities, like uh...modesty and stuff.

If I write a really great backstory which took me many hours and is over a thousand words, will it be any better for my odds of getting in than a ten minute version? I tend to prefer the former, mostly because I like to write about myself (because pride and arrogance), but also a little bit also because I just like to write in general.

4d6 ⇒ (2, 2, 2, 1) = 7
4d6 ⇒ (6, 2, 3, 5) = 16
4d6 ⇒ (6, 3, 1, 6) = 16
4d6 ⇒ (2, 2, 6, 1) = 11

Let's see what that amounts to.

6, 14, 15, 10. I'll grab the point buy real quick.

Edit: Are we allowed to multiclass? This half gestalt thing might well be an opportunity to get a mystic theurge to work.

I love me some high lethality, Choon... or may I say Thoon?

And I feel specially heroic, so before even rolling for my stats I proclame that my submission will be modelled after Arthur Pendragon and his Knights.

Now onwards to the rolling!
Statty Stat: 4d6 - 1 ⇒ (1, 2, 3, 4) - 1 = 9
Statty Stat: 4d6 - 2 ⇒ (3, 6, 2, 4) - 2 = 13
Statty Stat: 4d6 - 3 ⇒ (3, 3, 3, 4) - 3 = 10
Statty Stat: 4d6 - 2 ⇒ (2, 4, 4, 5) - 2 = 13
Unless you meant 'under 15 point buy' while taking into account the Focus and Foible, I think this guarantees a reroll.

Statty Stat: 4d6 - 1 ⇒ (3, 5, 1, 1) - 1 = 9
Statty Stat: 4d6 - 1 ⇒ (4, 6, 3, 1) - 1 = 13
Statty Stat: 4d6 - 1 ⇒ (2, 5, 1, 2) - 1 = 9
Statty Stat: 4d6 - 4 ⇒ (4, 6, 6, 6) - 4 = 18

Well, this is nice. Not the nicest, as the character will be flawed as all heroes should, but nice indeed.

Love lethality. Let's see what the dice say.

4d6 ⇒ (6, 5, 2, 4) = 17
4d6 ⇒ (4, 6, 6, 6) = 22
4d6 ⇒ (4, 4, 4, 6) = 18
4d6 ⇒ (3, 3, 4, 6) = 16

That'll do.

18 / 18 / 15 / 14 / 13 / 8

1.5 gestalt... weird but whatever
I'll be going aegis 2/soulknife 4

I missed the rerolls being allowed. Here goes:

4d6 ⇒ (2, 2, 5, 4) = 13¨
4d6 ⇒ (6, 6, 5, 5) = 22
4d6 ⇒ (3, 2, 3, 4) = 12
4d6 ⇒ (3, 6, 2, 6) = 17

11, 17, 10, 15 - that's a 20 point buy.

Edit: Any chance you'd allow me to reverse the FAQ about wizards and prestige classes? It says they don't get extra spells known when gaining new spellcaster levels from PRCs, which is pretty hard to deal with, given the fact that we're stuck in the wilderness.

Was Spheres of Power allowed?

Was Spheres of Power allowed?

Paizo material is allowed. Dreamscarred Psionics material is also allowed. The Technology Guide is not allowed. Path of War is not allowed. Spheres of Power or Might are not allowed.

There you go.

I have a question about this 1.5 gestalt. Let's say I'm a Wizard 4//Barbarian 2. I get BAB and saves of the wizard, 2 levels of Barbarian HP and skills and 2 levels of Wizard HP and skills. On the 5th level, I get everything from wizard. On the 6th, I get Barbarian HP and skills. Did I get that right?

Gestalt gives you the best of the two, so yes.

What do we use for hit points per level? Average? Roll?

Ahh. I had a feeling I was forgetting something. Use average for simplicity's sake. I've already made it more complicated than normal.

GM Choon wrote:

You are like family to me, and because of that I'm going to throw a select group of you out of the frying pan of this recruitment and into the fire of Rappan Athuk! You're so lucky!

Something about that sentence just really does it for me. And based on a small sample of your past posts, I can expect more like this if I am selected.

Thanks. I do my best.

Edit: Are we allowed to multiclass? This half gestalt thing might well be an opportunity to get a mystic theurge to work.

As long as you're clearly documenting where your moving bits are/are coming from I'm game.

Edit: Any chance you'd allow me to reverse the FAQ about wizards and prestige classes? It says they don't get extra spells known when gaining new spellcaster levels from PRCs, which is pretty hard to deal with, given the fact that we're stuck in the wilderness.

I'll have to look into that one. I hadn't seen that FAQ...

1.5 gestalt... weird but whatever

What can I say, I'm feeling experimental.

I'm delighted with so much interest already! Maybe two weeks was too long a time frame!

4d6 ⇒ (1, 1, 4, 5) = 11 = 10
4d6 ⇒ (1, 5, 4, 1) = 11 = 10
4d6 ⇒ (1, 3, 3, 5) = 12 = 11
4d6 ⇒ (3, 6, 2, 3) = 14 = 12
So 3-pt buy

Reroll:

4d6 ⇒ (1, 2, 4, 3) = 10 = 9
4d6 ⇒ (3, 5, 5, 1) = 14 = 13
4d6 ⇒ (2, 6, 5, 5) = 18 = 16
4d6 ⇒ (2, 5, 1, 5) = 13 = 12
And 14-pt buy

I'll see if I can come up with something...

4d6 ⇒ (6, 3, 4, 2) = 15 13
4d6 ⇒ (4, 5, 1, 3) = 13 12
4d6 ⇒ (4, 1, 6, 4) = 15 14
4d6 ⇒ (3, 4, 4, 3) = 14 12

That's pretty solid stats there but it's 12 point buy so I might as well check the re-roll

4d6 ⇒ (5, 6, 5, 3) = 19 16
4d6 ⇒ (5, 3, 3, 2) = 13 11
4d6 ⇒ (3, 5, 2, 5) = 15 13
4d6 ⇒ (4, 2, 5, 6) = 17 15

I'll go with that one

Stats after racial mods

Str 8
Dex 13
Con 15
Int 16
Wis 20
Cha 11

Level 20 build
Soulknife 10/soul forge 10/aegis 5/psiwarrior 5

I'll have to look into that one. I hadn't seen that FAQ...

This link should take you to the FAQ. Also the text of it here:

Prestige Classes and Spellcasters: Does a wizard (or other character that uses a spellbook), receive bonus spells to add to his spellbook when he gains a level in a prestige class that grants an increase to spellcasting?

No. The increase to his spellcasting level does not grant any other benefits, except for spells per day, spells known (for spontaneous casters), and an increase to his overall caster level. He must spend time and gold to add new spells to his spellbook.

Definitely interested. Let's see what I can come up with

4d6 - 1 ⇒ (6, 1, 6, 6) - 1 = 18
4d6 - 1 ⇒ (1, 4, 3, 2) - 1 = 9
4d6 - 1 ⇒ (6, 1, 2, 3) - 1 = 11
4d6 - 2 ⇒ (5, 2, 5, 5) - 2 = 15

That would give me 18 18 15 11 9 8
That should give me something pretty interesting.

Ierox, you could just go spontaneous casting

Ierox, you could just go spontaneous casting

Yeah, I'll definitely do it if I have to. I just like prepared casting better.

I will keep the FAQ in place, however, there is a town nearby where you could purchase spells. Retreating from the dungeon is a possibility. Running away in this one isn't a sign of cowardice. Usually.

What do you know... just missed the cutoff in another gestalt RA recruitment.

FYI I was in a RA campaign that started at first level and died around when we made second level. I remember a few encounters, vaguely.

This is how we roll:

18 = 18
8 = 8
4d6 - 2 ⇒ (6, 2, 4, 5) - 2 = 15
4d6 - 1 ⇒ (6, 1, 5, 4) - 1 = 15
4d6 - 2 ⇒ (6, 2, 3, 6) - 2 = 15
4d6 - 1 ⇒ (1, 4, 5, 2) - 1 = 11

Yeah, that is totally workable.

The 1.5 gestalt idea is interesting. How does it work with Saves? Do you just take the better of the two even though one is 2 levels behind the other?

The idea that I just tried to submit (but missed the deadline) was an Oracle/Ranger. I don't think that idea would work well with the 1.5 thing since the animal companion would fall badly behind (ranger would be the 2nd class there).

I think I will go Oracle 4/Paladin 2. Make a healer Oradin, basically.

Dotting in, since I showed my interest in the other thread. The half gestalt thing is kind of interesting.

Roll: 4d6 ⇒ (3, 2, 2, 2) = 9 => 7
Roll: 4d6 ⇒ (2, 3, 5, 5) = 15 => 13
Roll: 4d6 ⇒ (2, 4, 4, 5) = 15 => 13
Roll: 4d6 ⇒ (5, 3, 6, 3) = 17 => 14

7 point buy, there, rerolling.

Roll: 4d6 ⇒ (6, 6, 6, 6) = 24 => 18
Roll: 4d6 ⇒ (1, 6, 4, 3) = 14 => 13
Roll: 4d6 ⇒ (3, 3, 5, 4) = 15 => 12
Roll: 4d6 ⇒ (5, 6, 1, 1) = 13 => 12

Well, I think we'll take that one. Makes the spread a bit odd, but I can come up with something to do with 18, 18, 13, 12, 12, 8.

I am interested and it looks like a lot of others are too! Seems you'll have a good game of Rappan Athuk on your hands Choon.

I feel the half Gestalt may end up being... not worthless, but a bit finicky. Since it doesn't grant BAB it can't really give fighting ability to a caster. As for casters as the half-gestalt, for say a Sorcerer you would't have 2nd level spells until 8th level! That's later than a Paladin with high Charisma or Ranger with high Wisdom or just a Bloodrager. So it also doesn't give much casting ability to a martial. I would almost rather not have it, but I can see it grants a bit of versatility (and possibly some survivability depending on the class you choose) with very little power boost, so maybe that's what you are going for? I don't mean this little rant to offend! I am interested in the thought process behind this half gestalt.

4d6 ⇒ (5, 4, 4, 4) = 17 = 13
4d6 ⇒ (4, 4, 6, 5) = 19 = 15
4d6 ⇒ (3, 6, 2, 1) = 12 = 11
4d6 ⇒ (1, 2, 2, 4) = 9 = 8

4d6 ⇒ (5, 2, 5, 1) = 13 = 12
4d6 ⇒ (3, 2, 1, 1) = 7 = 6
4d6 ⇒ (5, 6, 4, 4) = 19 = 15
4d6 ⇒ (3, 5, 4, 5) = 17 = 14

That is basically it. I wanted to give some options and versatility to a class without me having to re-write half or more of the dungeon. So a martial could gain a few useful spells or a caster could get a HD bump and everyone ends up with more skills overall. It's a bit awkward, I'll readily admit, but with some careful attention to what came in where I feel that it could be a kind of middle ground between full gestalt and normal progression. This will naturally favor secondary classes that have more going for them early like monk or fighter, but I don't know for sure. So I'm going for it to see if it sticks. What better way to test a crazy idea than with a super dungeon!

Fair enough! Thank you for answering. I'd like to give it a shot then and see how it pans out.

4d6 - 1 ⇒ (3, 2, 3, 1) - 1 = 8
4d6 - 2 ⇒ (2, 6, 5, 3) - 2 = 14
4d6 - 2 ⇒ (2, 5, 6, 4) - 2 = 15
4d6 - 3 ⇒ (5, 3, 5, 5) - 3 = 15
13 point buy... Reroll here I come! (Oops, completely miscounted, that's a 17 point buy, no reroll for me, ignore the great stats below... :( )

4d6 - 5 ⇒ (6, 5, 6, 6) - 5 = 18
4d6 - 1 ⇒ (1, 3, 1, 5) - 1 = 9
4d6 - 4 ⇒ (4, 5, 4, 6) - 4 = 15
4d6 - 3 ⇒ (3, 6, 4, 6) - 3 = 16
I cannot say anything bad about a 33 point buy on four stats.

That gives me an array of 18, 18, 16, 15, 9, 8
18, 15, 15, 14, 8, 8

Choon, how do you feel about Paladin and Unchained Rogue together, do you think Sneak Attack goes against what a Paladin should be?

Sneak attacks may go against your code depending on how you define honor. It's a shaky paring at best unless you include a casing of Redemption (Atonement?) in your things purchased and in your backstory.

I think I will go Oracle 4/Paladin 2. Make a healer Oradin, basically.

GM Choon:

Question #1: Would you allow a Gillman character? It's a relatively weak race overall.

Question #2: Would you allow a Gillman character to use the human favored class bonus for oracles? The four FCBs for Gillmen that are listed are all identical to the human bonuses for the same class. They are also only core classes.

If not I would probably go for a planetouched race.

Quick question: DSP Psionics are allowed, does that include the psionic races or are races restricted to Paizo?

Quick question: DSP Psionics are allowed, does that include the psionic races or are races restricted to Paizo?

Races, feats, etc. Are allowed.

Looking into the Gillman

I'll keep thinking on it, but I'm drawing a bit of a blank, to be honest, regarding this. I have ideas, but I can't really get behind any of them as of yet, unfortunately. It's really interesting to see everybody's concepts, though!

Cool.
4d6 - 2 ⇒ (2, 1, 1, 1) - 2 = 3
4d6 - 2 ⇒ (6, 1, 6, 5) - 2 = 16
4d6 - 2 ⇒ (3, 1, 3, 1) - 2 = 6
4d6 - 2 ⇒ (5, 5, 6, 5) - 2 = 19
I don't even think there is a point-buy for "3". Wouldn't know how to play that anyway. Rerolling....

4d6 - 2 ⇒ (1, 3, 3, 5) - 2 = 10
4d6 - 2 ⇒ (6, 3, 4, 3) - 2 = 14
4d6 - 2 ⇒ (6, 2, 1, 3) - 2 = 10
4d6 - 2 ⇒ (1, 6, 2, 1) - 2 = 8

And again...
OK. Well Looks like I'm buying...

St 13 Dx 18 Cn 12 iT 16 wS 12 cH 08 Elven Archer/Transmuter

4d6 - 1 ⇒ (2, 3, 1, 5) - 1 = 10
4d6 - 2 ⇒ (2, 2, 2, 6) - 2 = 10
4d6 - 3 ⇒ (4, 3, 5, 3) - 3 = 12
4d6 - 1 ⇒ (5, 1, 2, 6) - 1 = 13

Reroll:
4d6 - 1 ⇒ (4, 5, 1, 3) - 1 = 12
4d6 - 1 ⇒ (4, 2, 2, 1) - 1 = 8
4d6 - 1 ⇒ (4, 1, 4, 2) - 1 = 10
4d6 - 3 ⇒ (3, 6, 6, 5) - 3 = 17

Will take point buy.

1: 4d6 ⇒ (5, 2, 5, 4) = 16 = 14
2: 4d6 ⇒ (5, 6, 5, 4) = 20 = 16
3: 4d6 ⇒ (4, 1, 6, 4) = 15 = 14
4: 4d6 ⇒ (4, 1, 4, 2) = 11 = 10

I'll stick with that. :)

Question about the Traits.

Did you mean a final total of 2 Traits and 1 Drawback?

Just wanted to clarify since taking a Drawback gives an additional Trait.

Sneak attacks may go against your code depending on how you define honor. It's a shaky paring at best unless you include a casing of Redemption (Atonement?) in your things purchased and in your backstory.

actually it really depends on the deity

In pathfinder there are specific paladin stuff for each deity

For example Apsu

Paladins of Apsu valiantly follow the dragon god’s tenets of holy vigilance against evil. Those following the rigid code of a paladin must sacrifice the sedentary lifestyle of living in a single place in exchange for continuous travel and hardship. The tenets of such paladins include the following maxims.

I am the talon of Apsu’s wrath. I strike where I am needed, but only when evil has been unmasked and there can be no doubt of my enemy’s malice.
When my purpose is unclear, I will walk the roads of the world to find a fresh focus. Every road leads to a new beginning.
Nothing is worth sacrificing my life for, except protecting the lives of others. I will retreat when needed, and come back to vex my foes once again.
Mercy is offered, but only once. Should I be betrayed in my moment of kindness, I will not stop until I have put my enemy down.
It is not enough to slay evil and carry on. I will spend the time necessary to help those I’ve protected to fend for themselves.

Hmm... thinking of Rogue/Aegis

I think I'll try for my stat reroll

4d6 ⇒ (1, 5, 4, 5) = 15 =14
4d6 ⇒ (6, 6, 6, 6) = 24 =18
4d6 ⇒ (4, 5, 3, 5) = 17 =14
4d6 ⇒ (2, 2, 2, 3) = 9 =7

hmmm...

18, 18, 14, 14, 8, 7.

Interesting.

Question about the Traits.

Did you mean a final total of 2 Traits and 1 Drawback?

Just wanted to clarify since taking a Drawback gives an additional Trait.

Yes, that's the final total.

18 / 18 / 15 / 14 / 13 / 8

Rough draft.

Quite happy with him. Paladin, so he has good saves. Great rolling means that he hits hard. 1.5 gestalt gives him enough lvl0 and lvl1 Spells to be interesting. Oracle revelation is misfortune...a truly amazing ability for any party to have.

However, he has serious limitations. (1) He can't lie. Well, he can...but it will make him sickened. (2) In times of stress he can only speak Celestial. That is the opposite of good. (3) He is not very smart. (4) He is heroic! And again, not very smart. While the drawback is vainglory, what this means is that he is loud, confident and tends to take direct approaches. Even when he shouldn't. (5) He is pretty slow...20ft movement in his armor. Comes with the style, but due to Mystery choice he can't really improve that.

So a lot of strengths. Has some pretty glaring weaknesses. Will get an alias and background up soon.

Neat, I may just pitch my hat in the ring.

GM Choon wrote:

Sneak attacks may go against your code depending on how you define honor. It's a shaky paring at best unless you include a casing of Redemption (Atonement?) in your things purchased and in your backstory.

actually it really depends on the deity

In pathfinder there are specific paladin stuff for each deity

For example Apsu

Quote:

Paladins of Apsu valiantly follow the dragon god’s tenets of holy vigilance against evil. Those following the rigid code of a paladin must sacrifice the sedentary lifestyle of living in a single place in exchange for continuous travel and hardship. The tenets of such paladins include the following maxims.

I am the talon of Apsu’s wrath. I strike where I am needed, but only when evil has been unmasked and there can be no doubt of my enemy’s malice.
When my purpose is unclear, I will walk the roads of the world to find a fresh focus. Every road leads to a new beginning.
Nothing is worth sacrificing my life for, except protecting the lives of others. I will retreat when needed, and come back to vex my foes once again.
Mercy is offered, but only once. Should I be betrayed in my moment of kindness, I will not stop until I have put my enemy down.
It is not enough to slay evil and carry on. I will spend the time necessary to help those I’ve protected to fend for themselves.

Very well. That would be acceptable. It still strikes me as slightly odd, but it is within the rules I set out, so ok!

I'm going to have to say no to the Gillman. I'd prefer to stay within the constraints I set up above. Sorry.

Edit: I recognize that it's not a strong race, but I've had a hard time closing that can of worms in the past.

Some other deities would not appreciate sneak attack/dirty tricks but Apsu says "do whatever it takes to survive/save others"