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Hi Ayrphish,
The magus didn't meet enough of the criterion. If you want it added have it meet the following:
1: It will be be hosted externally in pdf or google doc format with a stable link, using the format I have provided.
2: It will have a feat advancement list, showing what feats are taken at each level.
3: It will have a short paragraph or two explaining what the build does, and why it chose what it did.
4: It is either a good build, or it is an interesting build. This should be explained in your paragraph. Additionally, you should be able to drum up interest on the forums about it.
5: It should show items that the player should buy.
6: Showing what the build looks like at some important levels, such as 1,4,8,12,16, and 20.
7: It must be well-written, and well organized.
8: It should be built out to level 20.
Ok, this is your thing, and I'm not gonna 'argue' or fight with you over it... The original guide to the guides says:
"It will have four things:
1: It will be be hosted externally in pdf or google doc format with a stable link, hopefully in the format I’ve provided. Ideally, it will not be in a thread. However, I realize that most builds are, right now, in threads, so don’t be afraid to send me those.
2: It will have a feat advancement list, showing what feats are taken at each level.
3: It will have a short paragraph or two explaining what the build does, and why it chose what it did.
4: It is either a good build, or it is an interesting build. This should be explained in your paragraph.Builds also get extra credit for having the any of the following things:
5: It should have items that the player should buy.
6: Showing what the build looks like at some important level, such as 1, 4, 8, 12, 16, and 20.
7: It must be well-written, and well organized.
8: It should be built out to level 20."
So, number 1.
It is. There is a link to a pdf of just the stat block, as well as the detailed character write-up.
I don't know how a blog is different than a forum post...
2. It does, magus arcana and feats are suggested up to level 9. I didn't go further as a lot of campaigns don't go further... If this is the only hold up, I can add the other 11.
3. There are several paragraphs about the character.
4. I guess I didn't use the word "interesting" but again, if this is a hold up I can go add it...
5. I have this.
6. I do not have this, but it was "extra credit"
7. I'd like to think it is at least acceptable in this regard.
8. nope, but again, this is "extra credit"
If you would like to continue this discussion, or anything, I'd prefer to do that through email or through messaging on here. I'm sure the community could care less how we hash this out, so I'd like to spare them of that... You can email ayrphish@gmail.com
At the end of the day, it's your thing, if you don't want to list it, just say so. I didn't write it or post it just so it could be in a guide, but I would love to share it. I do think it meets the 4 things you said it needed, and hedges towards SOME of the extra credit.
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@ Ayrphish, I gots no idea how to pm people on this forum, so I'll make this brief. It's a good build, but not quite what I'm looking for in it's current form. If you want me to include it then I'll be happy to - just complete the numbers that you haven't (in your opinion, 2, 6, & 8).
FYI, the link to the statblock is broken. Make sure you've set the share settings to "Everybody with the link."
I guess that the extra credit bit was misleading, so I've removed that wording. As it stands, I am looking for builds that meet the following criteria:
1: It will have a feat advancement list, showing what feats are taken at each level.
2: It will have a short paragraph or two explaining what the build does, and why it chose what it did.
3: It is either a good build, or it is an interesting build. This should be explained in your paragraph. It would be helpful to make a forum post to see if others find it interesting.
4: It should have items that the player should buy.
5: It should show what the build looks like at and handful of important levels, such as 1, 4, 8, 12, 16, and 20, or 5, 10, 15, and 20.
6: It must be well-written, and well organized.
7: It should be built out to level 20.
I tried to make a thread like this back in summer, but no one took the bait. I'll just repost a few fun builds I had.
Barbarian:
Fiend of Terror Via Greater Fiend Totem, make adjacent non-evil opponents shakened without needing a check, and use Shatter Defenses to attack their flat-footed AC (20PB, lvl10)
Monk:
The Flash Gotta go fast (25PB, lvl10)
Ranger:
Critfisher Use Butterfly Sting, TWF, and high crit range to pass crits to allies frequently (20PB, lvl6)
I generally use the Notes section at the bottom of the sheet to discuss how the character works, as well as possible directions/alternatives. I'll take a closer look at the first page guidelines and maybe refine them a bit.
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Barbarian:
Fiend of Terror Via Greater Fiend Totem, make adjacent non-evil opponents shakened without needing a check, and use Shatter Defenses to attack their flat-footed AC (20PB, lvl10)
barbarian’s
your sheet amuses me. definintely taking this for a BBEG's brute squad commander.
i only wish totem warrior actually existed and worked, since it'd allow this and beast totem for easy defence shattering and pouncing (as well as claws while raging for a possible natural attack build).
Ah, I copy and paste from the SRD and sometimes that causes a formatting error I guess. I'll fix that.
just thought i'd point it out. seriously, great build though.
Yeah, it's a fun combo. I'm glad you'll get some use out of it, since it doesn't mesh to well for standard PC adventuring.
Don't neglect his Profession (Fashion Designer) skill though. You wouldn't want to waste the other part of the Heart of the Fields trait. Though feel free to change it to Profession (Interior Decorator)
kicking around a paladin/sorc/DD build in notepad now, i'll post it if i get anything good made.
okay, basics laid out, it's looking like a paladin 2 / (lore) oracle 1 / sorc 4 / DD 10 / sorc 3
probably either tongues or lame for curse, lore mystery obviously.
EH feats (because it uses your character level-2 instead of your sorc level, which will be significantly lower) for orc bloodline paired with optimistic gambler trait for morale goodness and a scaling strength increase (plus the stat increases from DD) making your physicals pretty good (+10 str total, +2 con, +2 int at 20th before stat increasing equipment), and the +4 total natural armor by then (before items) is pretty nice too.
magical knack trait to bump that caster level a bit for spells.
.
main cons im running into are: he'll be getting 7th level sorc spells when he hits 20th, which feels bad. and he has an abysmal 13 BAB at 20th (the massive strength bonuses offset that a little).
i could swap out the oracle level for another paladin one:
GAIN 1st mercy, immunity to fear/disease, +1 BAB
LOSE sidestep secret, access to free wands/scrolls for the oracle spell list
or trade the last three sorc levels out for more paladin:
GAIN +2 BAB overall, +1 divine bond, 1st mercy, immunity to fear and disease, basic paladin spells
LOSE 6th and 7th level spells, draconic bloodline feat
the latter pairs well with lame curse for immunity to fear, disease, and fatigue, as well as not being slowed by armor
.
by-level is looking like:
feats:
pal 1 noble scion (scion of war), power attack
2
3 skill focus (survival)
sorc 4 claws
5 eldritch heritage (touch of rage)
6 draconic defenses
7 (feat)
DD 8
9 (feat), toughness (bloodline)
10
11 improved eldritch heritage (strength of the beast)
12 improved initiative (bloodline)
13 (feat)
14
15 (feat), blind-fight (bloodline)
16
17 (feat)
sorc 18
19 (feat)
20 quicken spell (bloodline)
im also pretty sure a good number of DMs wouldnt allow this, either on principle or since it takes a local feat with cheliax affinity, and a trait from second darkness (though im not sure if the two are mutually exclusive).
dot
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Hey Ohako et. al - those are some great builds, but I would love it if you had them fit a few more of the requirements before I post them. The sniper should be built out to level 20, and it would be great to see Calvin at some different level, to see how he plays.
Thanks, here's the requirements for reference.
1: It will have a feat advancement list, showing what feats are taken at each level.
2: It will have a short paragraph or two explaining what the build does, and why it chose what it did.
3: It is either a good build, or it is an interesting build. This should be explained in your paragraph. It would be helpful to make a forum post to see if others find it interesting.
4: It should have items that the player should buy.
5: It should show what the build looks like at and handful of important levels, such as 1, 4, 8, 12, 16, and 20, or 5, 10, 15, and 20.
6: It must be well-written, and well organized.
7: It should be built out to level 20.
I must say I am very intrigued by the Vacuum wizard. I just wish I had the full build to pick apart and see if I can shift my Wood Wizard to anywhere close the Vacuum is at.
Also, I know I said this before, but I'm actually surprised that there isn't a Master of Many Styles build up here. I shall continue to look for a solid one, or perhaps make one up (even though I doubt it'd be as good as other character builders on here).
I must say I am very intrigued by the Vacuum wizard. I just wish I had the full build to pick apart and see if I can shift my Wood Wizard to anywhere close the Vacuum is at.
Also, I know I said this before, but I'm actually surprised that there isn't a Master of Many Styles build up here. I shall continue to look for a solid one, or perhaps make one up (even though I doubt it'd be as good as other character builders on here).
psshaw, i'm terrible at building and even i got on there! i'm sure you'd be fine (just use the template BZ has at the beginning of the guide to the guides doc, iirc).
seems I lied, here's a cleaving sword saint:** spoiler omitted **...
Seems I made a mistake in saying you hit touch AC with surprise follow-through and improved surprise follow-through feats in this build. You go against their flat-footed AC, not their touch AC.
Thank you to Splitlip for pointing this out (zenith, if you could append a small note of this to the description of the build in your document, that would be awesome).
So I finished that CHA-centric build.
Credit to Damocles Guile for the basis of the paladin chunks in this--i.e. 95% of it. His is a simple yet startlingly effective build, and I just went in and mucked about with a dip and switching around the feat order pretty much.
"put cha to ALL the things!"
Oracle who takes a 19-level dip in paladin to use his CHA for AC, reflex saves, and initiative (at first level), as well as attack(smite) and saves (gets to legally double-dip his cha for reflex) (at third level) and various immunities as he goes.
As he levels up he becomes more and more durable/powerful thanks to lay on hands and oath of vengeance for lots of self-healing and smites.
The DEX dump means his CMD is gonna take a dive though (you can easily swap it to wisdom and be fine, but your will save will suffer).
.
Attributes (with Racial Modifier):
Cha>Str>Con>Int>Wis>Dex
15 Point Buy (AC will be 1 lower than listed below until 4th level)
STR: 14 (5pts.)
DEX: 7 (-4pts.)
CON: 14 (5pts.)
INT: 12 (2pts.)
WIS: 10 ()
CHA: 17 (7pts. +2 racial)
20 Point Buy
STR: 14 (5pts.)
DEX: 8 (-2pts.)
CON: 14 (5pts.)
INT: 12 (2pts.)
WIS: 10 ()
CHA: 18 (10pts. +2 racial)
25 Point Buy
STR: 15 (7pts.)
DEX: 10 ()
CON: 14 (5pts.)
INT: 13 (3pts.)
WIS: 10 ()
CHA: 18 (10pts. +2 racial)
.
Traits:
(magic) Magical Knack (paladin) - treat CL in selected class as +2 higher (up to your max HD). will help mitigate the later entry and paladin CL penalty somewhat.
(combat) Reactionary (or (religion) Purity of Faith) - your choice on whether you want a starting init of +6 or +1 to will saves and a +1 to all saves against evil outsiders' spells and effects.
Feats/Class Choices:
ORC 1: Fey Foundling, Noble Scion (scion of war), Sidestep Secret (revelation)
PAL 2:
PAL 3: Power Attack
PAL 4: +1 into cha (or str/int instead for 25pb)
PAL 5: Extra Lay on Hands
PAL 6:
PAL 7: Lunge
PAL 8: +1 into cha (or str/int for the 25pb)
PAL 9: Greater Mercy, '5th level' curse ability.
PAL 10:
PAL 11: Ultimate Mercy
PAL 12: +1 into cha
PAL 13: Extra Lay on Hands
PAL 14:
PAL 15: Radiant Charge
PAL 16: +1 into cha
PAL 17: Extra Lay on Hands
PAL 18:
PAL 19: Extra Lay on Hands, '10th level' curse ability
PAL 20: +1 into cha
All favored class bonuses (choosing paladin, obviously) go into skill points.
.
Suggested Gear:
get a beefy one-handed weapon, mithral full plate, and perhaps a mithral buckler if you're worried still worried about your AC for some reason.
enchant them as you like (holy on the weapon, righteous/champion/rallying/warding on the armor, heavy fortification on the buckler) and grab the usual amulet of natural armor, ring of protection, cloak of resistance.
other items to look out for include:
-Ring of Freedom of Movement (top priority with your bad CMD)(ring)
-Merciful Baldric (chest)
-Robe of Runes (body)
-Vudran Ashak Helm/Tri-faced Helm (+4 perception, immunity to flanking, 360' view with no inherent weakness gaze attacks unlike the robe of eyes) (head)
-Bracers of the Merciful Knight (Bracers of the Avenging Knight are fine too, but merciful knight adds more/better lay on hands) (wrist)
Keep a lookout for other neat things, as there's tons of great stuff to have for your character.
-if you can afford it, a Ring of Splendid Security blows the ring of protection and cloak of resistance out of the water, freeing up the latter slot for a lesser cloak of displacement.
.
What the Build Looks Like (assuming nonmagical gear) at:
-Level 1: You're a casty oracle with decent str/con. your AC is respectable thanks to sidestep secret, as is your initiative and reflex saves.
AC 18 (armored coat, buckler), 0/0/2 saves (not counting stats/traits)
-Level 4: Now you're a paladin with the above. You've finally got your basic damage/healing kit from PA, smite, and LoH
AC 20 (breastplate, buckler), 3/1/5 + cha saves (not counting stats/traits)
-Level 8: Finally have pladin spells to add even more to yourself and allies, as well as your iterative attack and lunge.
AC 21 (fullplate, mithral buckler), 5/2/7 + cha saves (not counting stats/traits)
-Level 12: another iterative and more spells/smites/LoH, your LoH is more effective, and now you can raise he dead!
AC 23 (mithral fullplate, mithral buckler), 7/3/9 + cha saves (not counting stats/traits)
-Level 16: another iterative and more spells/smites/LoH, and you can burn LoH for extra damage (other than smites) if need be. You're also probably finished with your adventure path already.
AC 23 (mithral fullplate, mithral buckler), 9/5/9 + cha saves (not counting stats/traits)
-Level 20: more spells/smites/LoH.
AC 23 (mithral fullplate, mithral buckler), 11/6/13 + cha saves (not counting stats/traits)
.
Tactics:
Rush in, power attack/smite things, LoH yourself or others as needed.
You've got lots of basic utility covered from your oracle spells, and your paladin spells are great as wel, particularly with oath of vengeance's additions.
Here's some suggested spells, courtesy of Damocles Guile:
1st level - Hero's Defiance (let's you cast Lay on Hands as an immediate action - its good to hang onto a couple of these to be truly unkillable)
2nd level - Litany of Righteousness (swift action spell that doubles the damage you deal for 1 round against evil creatures - combined with Smite its pretty much a death spell)
3rd level - Blessing of Fervor (normally not a Paladin spell but Oath of Vengeance gets it for you - probably one of the best group buffs out there)
4th level - Bloodsworn Retribution (+5 attacks, +5 saves, +5 skill and ability checks, pretty much all the time? Yes, please)
In Conclusion/Notes:
Fluff the two first-level feats as you being found in the wilderness with that mark by some noble somewhere, and them seeing it as a sign, adopted you.The oracle curse you choose is actually up to you--clouded vision works well since your dex is okay to be neglected, but legalistic, tongues, and haunted are all very good curse choices as well.
Wrecker might be interesting to try out as well (you'll only be able to get the 10th-level ability at 19th, but it removes that pesky construct problem for paladins), particularly for a mirrored antipaladin build.
Remember that you use CHA for your reflex saves as well, which stacks with divine health since DH is a typeless bonus equal to your CHA, and sidestep secret actually uses your CHA instead of DEX for AC/Reflex saves.
If anyone spots any bad math, please say so.
This is my first try with a build: a cleric-divine scion fire blaster.
Being new at this, I accept gladly any comment and suggestion!
Just to add a little bit to the Hangover Cleric idea. Cayden Cailean is the only official Pathfinder God with the Ale/Wine portfolio, and therefore the only one who's clerics can take the variant channel option of that same name. He's Chaotic Good, so his Clerics can only channel positive energy, therefore not a rules legal option for Versatile Channeler. So under the existing official rules you could not nauseate anybody (except Dhampires maybe).
.....Unless, you use the Alignment/Elemental Channel feats, the you can Harm/Heal (with associated buff/debuff from the variant ability) to that alignment or elemental subtype to your hearts content, or at least untill you run out of channels!
here's the statblock here (with a few modifications):
"Not-a-Ninja" ** spoiler omitted **...
Opinions on replacing one level of rogue with one level of monk? Wis to unarmed AC, and flurry for rounds when you're not using spell combat. Use rimed frostbites instead of intensive shocking grasps as your main spell and Entangle / Fatigue a bunch of times per spell slot - more controller, less nova cannon.
Opinions on replacing one level of rogue with one level of monk? Wis to unarmed AC, and flurry for rounds when you're not using spell combat. Use rimed frostbites instead of intensive shocking grasps as your main spell and Entangle / Fatigue a bunch of times per spell slot - more controller, less nova cannon.here's the statblock here (with a few modifications):
"Not-a-Ninja" ** spoiler omitted **...
the 4th level for rogue was mostly for the talent, iirc. but since theres open feat slots you could grab the talent with the Extra Talent feat. you've got a good idea, but there's a few things to note:
wis to AC seems neat at first, but takes investment in WIS to get any benefit from that (which the build currently doesn't have), and you can spellstrike with arcane mark (or Brand via two-world magic if your DM wants to get snippy about it) which you have an infinite number of, so you dont really need flurry (which in itself is a TWF clone, like spell combat).also, you can only flurry with monk weapons (unless you wanna take another level off to go into cleric for crusader's flurry), so you'd need to use a temple sword or something unless you were going all punchy-fisty to begin with (which this build doesnt at the moment).
as for the rimed frostbite: theres room to pick up the rime spell feat if you move some stuff around, so that's a great direction to go with as well--never can have too much control.
also, you can only flurry with monk weapons (unless you wanna take another level off to go into cleric for crusader's flurry), so you'd need to use a temple sword or something unless you were going all punchy-fisty to begin with (which this build doesnt at the moment).
I thought kukri's were a monk weapon; now that I actually looked it up, and see that there's not a single 18-20 monk weapon, I withdraw my suggestion entirely. It's simply not worth using a lower crit range weapon just to be able to flurry to use up all the rimed frostbite touches quicker.
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Goodness, this has fallen all the way to the sixth page. I'm certain people have interesting builds to suggest.
To prevent it being a completely shameless bump, here's an updated cha-centric paladin build (again, most of the credit goes to damocles guile for the skeleton for this):
Oracle who takes a 19-level dip in paladin to use his CHA for:
AC three times (sidestep secret, osyluth's guile, smite), reflex three times (sidestep secret, divine grace, bestow grace), fort/will twice (divine grace, bestow grace), attack rolls (smite), initiative (scion of war), casting, and various immunities as he goes.
As he levels up he becomes more and more durable/powerful thanks to lay on hands and oath of vengeance for lots of self-healing and smites.
The DEX dump means his CMD is gonna take a dive though (you can easily swap it to a wisdom dump and be fine, but your will save will suffer).
.
Attributes (with Racial Modifier):
Cha>Str>Con>Int>Wis>Dex
15 Point Buy (AC will be 1 lower than listed below until 4th level)
STR: 14 (5pts.)
DEX: 7 (-4pts.)
CON: 14 (5pts.)
INT: 12 (2pts.)
WIS: 10 ()
CHA: 17 (7pts. +2 racial)
20 Point Buy
STR: 14 (5pts.)
DEX: 8 (-2pts.)
CON: 14 (5pts.)
INT: 12 (2pts.)
WIS: 10 ()
CHA: 18 (10pts. +2 racial)
25 Point Buy
STR: 15 (7pts.)
DEX: 10 ()
CON: 14 (5pts.)
INT: 13 (3pts.)
WIS: 10 ()
CHA: 18 (10pts. +2 racial)
.
Traits:
(magic) Magical Knack (paladin) - treat CL in selected class as +2 higher (up to your max HD). will help mitigate the later entry and paladin CL penalty somewhat.
(combat) Reactionary (or (religion) Purity of Faith) - your choice on whether you want a starting init of +6 or +1 to will saves and a +1 to all saves against evil outsiders' spells and effects.
Feats/Class Choices:
ORC 1: Fey Foundling, Noble Scion (scion of war), Sidestep Secret (revelation)
PAL 2:
PAL 3: Power Attack
PAL 4: +1 into cha (or str/int instead for 25pb)
PAL 5: Unsanctioned Knowledge
PAL 6:
PAL 7: Greater Mercy
PAL 8: +1 into cha (or str/int for the 25pb)
PAL 9: Osyluth's Guile, '5th level' curse ability.
PAL 10:
PAL 11: Extra Lay on Hands
PAL 12: +1 into cha
PAL 13: Extra Lay on Hands
PAL 14:
PAL 15: Ultimate Mercy
PAL 16: +1 into cha
PAL 17: Extra Lay on Hands
PAL 18:
PAL 19: Radiant Charge, '10th level' curse ability
PAL 20: +1 into cha
All favored class bonuses (choosing paladin, obviously) go into skill points.
.
Suggested Gear:
get a beefy one-handed weapon (preferably with the courageous enchant), mithral full plate, and perhaps a mithral buckler if you're still worried about your AC for some reason.
enchant them as you like (holy on the weapon, righteous/champion/rallying/warding on the armor, heavy fortification on the buckler) and grab the usual amulet of natural armor, ring of protection, cloak of resistance.
other items to look out for include:
-Ring of Freedom of Movement (top priority with your bad CMD)(ring)
-Merciful Baldric (chest)
-Robe of Runes (body)
-Vudran Ashak Helm/Tri-faced Helm (+4 perception, immunity to flanking, 360' view with no inherent weakness gaze attacks unlike the robe of eyes) (head)
-Bracers of the Merciful Knight (Bracers of the Avenging Knight are fine too, but merciful knight adds more/better lay on hands) (wrist)
Keep a lookout for other neat things, as there's tons of great stuff to have for your character.
-if you can afford it, a Ring of Splendid Security blows the ring of protection and cloak of resistance out of the water, freeing up the latter slot for a lesser cloak of displacement.
.
What the Build Looks Like (assuming nonmagical gear) at:
-Level 1: You're a casty oracle with decent str/con. your AC is respectable thanks to sidestep secret, as is your initiative and reflex saves.
AC 18 (armored coat, buckler), 0/0/2 saves (not counting stats/traits)
-Level 4: Now you're a paladin with the above. You've finally got your basic damage/healing kit from PA, smite, and LoH
AC 20 (breastplate, buckler), 3/1/5 + cha saves (not counting stats/traits)
-Level 8: Finally have pladin spells to add even more to yourself and allies, as well as your iterative attack and lunge.
AC 21 (fullplate, mithral buckler), 5/2/7 + cha saves (not counting stats/traits)
-Level 12: another iterative and more spells/smites/LoH, your LoH is more effective, and now you can raise he dead!
AC 23 (mithral fullplate, mithral buckler), 7/3/9 + cha saves (not counting stats/traits)
-Level 16: another iterative and more spells/smites/LoH, and you can burn LoH for extra damage (other than smites) if need be. You're also probably finished with your adventure path already.
AC 23 (mithral fullplate, mithral buckler), 9/5/9 + cha saves (not counting stats/traits)
-Level 20: more spells/smites/LoH.
AC 23 (mithral fullplate, mithral buckler), 11/6/13 + cha saves (not counting stats/traits)
.
Tactics:
Cast Bestow Grace on yourself, rush in and power attack/smite things, LoH yourself or others as needed.
If things go south, fight defensively for a huge boost in AC and touch AC (-4 to attack/+2(+cha mod) to AC (dodge)).
You've got lots of basic utility covered from your oracle spells, and your paladin spells are great as wel, particularly with oath of vengeance's additions.
Here's some suggested spells, courtesy of Damocles Guile:
1st level - Hero's Defiance (let's you cast Lay on Hands as an immediate action - its good to hang onto a couple of these to be truly unkillable)
2nd level - Litany of Righteousness (swift action spell that doubles the damage you deal for 1 round against evil creatures - combined with Smite its pretty much a death spell)
3rd level - Blessing of Fervor (normally not a Paladin spell but Oath of Vengeance gets it for you - probably one of the best group buffs out there)
4th level - Bloodsworn Retribution (+5 attacks, +5 saves, +5 skill and ability checks, pretty much all the time? Yes, please)
Bestow Grace (Also 2nd Level, is a standard action spell with minute/level duration that adds your CHA to all the subject (see: yourself)'s saves as a sacred bonus)
In Conclusion/Notes:
Fluff the two first-level feats as you being found in the wilderness with that mark by some noble somewhere, and them seeing it as a sign, adopted you. Bloodsworn Retribution works rather nicely with the legalistic curse since oaths are a big deal for you, and being a lore oracle gives some fluff reasons to have discovered some Unsanctioned Knowledge.
The oracle curse you choose is actually up to you--clouded vision works well since your dex is okay to be neglected, but legalistic, tongues, and haunted are all very good curse choices as well.
Wrecker might be interesting to try out as well (you'll only be able to get the 10th-level ability at 19th, but it removes that pesky construct problem for paladins).
Remember that you use CHA for your reflex saves as well, which stacks with divine health since DH is a typeless bonus equal to your CHA, and sidestep secret actually uses your CHA instead of DEX for AC/Reflex saves.
a more well-rounded alternative would be to swap lore oracle (sidestep secret) for nature oracle (nature's whispers) to effectively trade out triple-dipping their reflex save to get CHA to CMD, which (CMD i mean) is rather low in this build.
an evil alternative would be to make a lich antipaladin with this build (effectively trades some spells such as bestow grace for CHA to HP instead of CON and EVEN MORE IMMUNITIES).
If anyone spots any bad math, please say so.
Goodness, this has fallen all the way to the sixth page. I'm certain people have interesting builds to suggest.
To prevent it being a completely shameless bump, here's an updated cha-centric paladin build (again, most of the credit goes to damocles guile for the skeleton for this):** spoiler omitted **...
pardon the double-post, but I cant edit the post anymore to clarify:
in the build-by-level section, the "raise the dead" comment should be moved to the level 16 section, and the "burn LoH for more damage" comment should be moved to the level 20 section.
And also that you meant Divine Grace, not Health here:
Remember that you use CHA for your reflex saves as well, which stacks with divine health since DH is a typeless bonus equal to your CHA, and sidestep secret actually uses your CHA instead of DEX for AC/Reflex saves.
yes that (cant really fix it now, stupid post edit timer), my mistake.
thought i'd bring this thread back upstream with this:
a neat little catgirl bard who has obscenely high bardic knowledge bonuses, among other things.
i've got an odd gulch gunner/(myrmidarch) magus build im toying with in my head, once i get something more concrete i'll throw it upon your mercy.
something like MoMS monk 2/Gulch Gunner 5/Myrmidarch Magus 13.
end result with that level setup is (before gear):
15/10/5 BAB (16/11/6 if you use that alt BAB rule for multiclassing)
15/11/12 saves
crane style/wing for free hand shenanigans and free grit regain
dex to damage
5th-level magus spells (1 less/day from AT, CL15 from magical knack for max intensified shocking grasp damage)
spellstrike at range with all the wonderful touch AC goodness of firearms
fighter weapon/armor training
fighter feats available (ECL 10)
and you can cover most of the losses for the archetype by investing in pearls of power.
honestly it'd probably be better off as a straight monk 2 / gunner 18, I like me some gun magic (that isn't the wizard's hilariously terrible attempt at it), so sue me.
PLEASE DONT ADD THIS TO THE GUIDE UNTIL SOMEONE CAN DOUBLE-CHECK MY WORK AND I DO A PROPER WRITEUP IN THE CORRECT FORMAT FOR IT
alright, threw together an incredibly dwarfy dwarf fighter build today (though im a little shaky on it's AT combo's legitness right now, since the pfsrd's dervish of dawn AT might be different from the dawnflower dervish AT, but im not sure as i dont have the book)
it's a straight 1-20 fighter using the armored fighter and the 'dervish of dawn' (their bland-name product to avoid lawsuits from paizo over using golarion-specific stuff) AT listed on the d20pfsrd site, so if there's weirdness or incompatibility there blame that and inform me so i can change it--not that it's too crippling to lose, since this build will work with any archetype(s) that dont make you trade out any of your fighter bonus feats)
the build works very well with plain old fighter, as well as the two-weapon fighter, foehammer, shielded fighter, armored fighter and dawnflower dervish fighter archetypes (others as well)!
anyway, here's the link to the build
the gist is it's a sword and board (well, dwarven waraxe and board) TWF fighter that is pretty freaking hardy (especially when magic is involved), as well as a possible equipment loadout with prices (the gloves would be duelist gloves instead in any AT with weapon training, naturally).
if you get an AT with weapon training, swap the weapon focus/specializations from the waraxe to the shield.
if i could fit another feat, i'd add in hammer the gap to add more to that delicious TWF hitty goodness (especially in tandem with the foehammer AT's ability if you have it)
once more at the bottom to make sure it didn't get missed the first time:
PLEASE DONT ADD THIS TO THE GUIDE UNTIL SOMEONE CAN DOUBLE-CHECK MY WORK AND I DO A PROPER WRITEUP IN THE CORRECT FORMAT FOR IT
okay, realized a few things about the build linked above:
if he's going dwarven waraxe/shield then he doesnt need TWF, since one only works at reach and the other only works in melee. which would free up 4 feats--(Imp/Gtr) TWF and rend, allowing those to be filled with things like lunge, hammer the gap, and maybe shield focus/greater shield focus.
i you swap to the warhammer or something you can keep the TWF (this is a great choice if youre going foehammer). since youre not using reach with this one, you can swap combat reflexes for lunge.
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i've got an odd gulch gunner/(myrmidarch) magus build im toying with in my head, once i get something more concrete i'll throw it upon your mercy.
something like MoMS monk 2/Gulch Gunner 5/Myrmidarch Magus 13.
end result with that level setup is (before gear):
15/10/5 BAB (16/11/6 if you use that alt BAB rule for multiclassing)
15/11/12 saves
crane style/wing for free hand shenanigans and free grit regain
dex to damage
5th-level magus spells (1 less/day from AT, CL15 from magical knack for max intensified shocking grasp damage)
spellstrike at range with all the wonderful touch AC goodness of firearms
fighter weapon/armor training
fighter feats available (ECL 10)and you can cover most of the losses for the archetype by investing in pearls of power.
honestly it'd probably be better off as a straight monk 2 / gunner 18, I like me some gun magic (that isn't the wizard's hilariously terrible attempt at it), so sue me.
Correct me if I'm wrong but do you mean the Trench Fighter, a Fighter archetype, instead of the Ratfolk Gunslinger archetype, Gulch Gunner?? Otherwise it seems kind of cool and not overly powerful, just flavorful.
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I tip my hat to you guys. You have built some amazing characters. Im pretty new to pathfinder and don't have all the resources available to me to be able to build characters like this. Ive played DnD 3.0/3.5 for the past 10 years and got damn good at minmaxing in it but pathfinder has changed some things just enough that i can't recreate some of my epic builds from back in the day. I currently play society and was wondering if you guys in your amazing abilities to build min maxed characters could help me bring one of my favorite anime characters and one of my favorite DnD builds into pathfinder society.
My character is modeled after vash the stampede from the show trigun. He's not a gun slinger like in the show he just has the same alignment and play style. For those who haven't seen the show the main things i want from the build is a high armor class preferably light to no armor all dex and wisdom if you use monk (it's what i used for him before). He also doesn't kill ANYBODY. He is a pasifest (spelled wrong). I was thinking of having him minmaxed on his ability to deal nonlethal damage with high AC. If you could get his diplomacy skill way up also it would be nice.
For those that played DnD i originally built him as a monk with vow of poverty,peace,and nonviolence. He was a very flavorful character to play and was great at taking people alive to get information out of them. I looking through some of the feats i think a rouge wielding dual saps would work well too i just don't have all the resources available to minmax him properly.
The final catch that makes this build even more of a challenge to build and might make it impossible is that it has to be society legal. Any push in the right direction would be very helful.
I tip my hat to you guys. You have built some amazing characters. Im pretty new to pathfinder and don't have all the resources available to me to be able to build characters like this. Ive played DnD 3.0/3.5 for the past 10 years and got damn good at minmaxing in it but pathfinder has changed some things just enough that i can't recreate some of my epic builds from back in the day. I currently play society and was wondering if you guys in your amazing abilities to build min maxed characters could help me bring one of my favorite anime characters and one of my favorite DnD builds into pathfinder society.
My character is modeled after vash the stampede from the show trigun. He's not a gun slinger like in the show he just has the same alignment and play style. For those who haven't seen the show the main things i want from the build is a high armor class preferably light to no armor all dex and wisdom if you use monk (it's what i used for him before). He also doesn't kill ANYBODY. He is a pasifest (spelled wrong). I was thinking of having him minmaxed on his ability to deal nonlethal damage with high AC. If you could get his diplomacy skill way up also it would be nice.
For those that played DnD i originally built him as a monk with vow of poverty,peace,and nonviolence. He was a very flavorful character to play and was great at taking people alive to get information out of them. I looking through some of the feats i think a rouge wielding dual saps would work well too i just don't have all the resources available to minmax him properly.The final catch that makes this build even more of a challenge to build and might make it impossible is that it has to be society legal. Any push in the right direction would be very helful.
Sounds like you want something like Batter McShieldbash by protyotype00. While his build is a 20 level build, I'll give you something slightly different, and up to level 12.
It's a Ranger/Rogue that dual-wields shield bashes. Alternate Ranger and Rogue levels, netting a Range 6/Rogue 6.
Feats you're going to want are:
Bludgeoner
Shield Focus
Improved Shield Bash
Sap Adept
Sap Master
Power Attack
Improved Initiative
Range Bonus feats:
Two-Weapon Fighting
Shield Master
Your ability scores should start off with:
Strength 16 (18 with +2 Human)
Dexterity 15
Constitution 14
Intelligence 8
Wisdom 10
Charisma 10
Put level 4 and 8 points into Strength with your level 12 point into Dexterity.
The important Feats listed above, are Bludgeoner, Sap Adept/Master, Shield Master and Improved Shield Bash.
Bludgeoner allows you to deal nonlethal damage with bludgeoning weapons, and deal nonlethal sneak attack damage with lethal bludgeoning weapons. Shields are bludgeoning.
Improved Shield Bash allows you to keep your shield bonus while shield bashing.
Shield Master allows you to add your shield enhancement bonus as an enhancement bonus to attack and damage when you shield bash. This is effectively allowing you to get weapon enhancement bonus, for armor enhancement prices. It also allows you to take no penalties on the attack roll when wielding a shield and another weapon (dual wielding shields counts as using another weapon.
Sap Adept gives you a bonus on nonlethal bludgeoning damage equal to the number of sneak attack damage dice rolled on the attack. Sap Master allows you to roll the sneak attack damage dice twice, before totaling the damage, which then double the bonus from Sap Adept.
At 12th level, using the feats above and two shields with a +2 enhancement bonus and the Bashing property, you have an attack routine of the following.
Shield Bash +16/+11 1d8+15/x2
Shield Bash +16/+11 1d8+15/x2
when sneak attacking
Shield Bash +16/+11 1d8+15+6d6+12/x2
Shield Bash +16/+11 1d8+15+6d6+12/x2
Note: I did not include the RAW vs RAI tidbit in the above attack routine, except for negating the TWF penalty.
As for Traits, take Keleshite Princess and Slave Taker. Keleshite Princess requires you to play a female, but it gives a +1 trait bonus to both Diplomacy and Intimidate (and Vash can be scary as hell when he wants to be). Slave Taker allows you to deal an extra +1 nonlethal damage whenever you deal nonlethal damage to an opponent.
So, that's all I've got for now for your Nonlethal PFS specialist. I might come back and add to this more later.