Well, if you're just going to ignore everything that doesn't fit your preconceptions, then yes, you're exactly right about Tolkien's writing. :P
Adric died, man. Adric died!
My local CBS station showed Tom Baker as The Doctor on saturday afternoon. OMG, that junk was terrifying. Two or three years later, the BBC licensed Dr Who to PBS, and I would watch it on weekday afternoons, if I got home from school in time.
Years later I saw the Christopher Eccleston reboot, and was all, "Wow, production values have increased a lot."
Hey man, if it sounds like you'll enjoy it, go for it. The thing about Delany's dyslexia is, he has to really work to write anything at all, so his writing is really, really clear. You'll probably go through his stuff faster than other writers of the same page length. (Then again, say what you will about goblins, you don't seem like a slow reader.)
Oops, beer. My point at the beginning was that I actually prefer Delany's nonfiction to his fiction, but I can't just recommend it on the interwebz, because I'll be legally culpable for emotional distress to the lily-livered. (Look it up, it's crime a these days.)
If you really want to see where it all started*, try to find Atlantis: Three Tales and read "Citre et Trans."
*This is a horrible way to describe anything, but I've been drinking beer. At this point I don't know what "it" is, and don't have the energy to work out a more nuanced explanation. Sorry, dude.
The changeover from classic Traveller to Megatraveller was like that for me. I mean, the Third Imperium was about as dynamic as a pre-internet setting could get, what with the JTAS News Service or whatever the hell it was called. I was fine with the Travellers' Digest revelation about the origins of the Aslan jump drive, but when the Megatraveller box set came out I was all, "That's not how the next 5 years played out in my Third Imperium . . ."
Oh please, The Jewels of Aptor is barely even weird enough to be considered part of Delany's oeuvre; come back when you've read Empire Star.
(Seriously, JoA is his first book. Delany's very dyslexic, so he has to put a lot of care into his writing, but at that point he hadn't developed the cool stuff that makes his writing truly out there. Just, for God's sake, stay away from his porn until you're used to his voice; it's even crazier that the stuff that I scared everyone away from the Advanced Reading in D&D thread by mentioning.)
(As you can tell from the above sentence's structure, I am not dyslexic, and put no care whatsoever into my writing.)
. . . So Europe's full of socialist heathens who drink wine for breakfast and require their children to read pornography in the guise of education? Tell me something I don't know! :P
I haven't read Offutt's adult stuff, but when I was twelve or so I managed to get ahold of an omnibus edition of The Image of the Beast and Blown by Philip Jose Farmer. The first time I read it, I was all, "This is like having sex during a bad acid trip, and I haven't done either of those things yet!" Man, I read that book over and over again, until the binding fell apart and it was just a stack of pages. I think my roommate stole it when he packed up his stuff at the end of freshman year.
Speaking only for my own campaign setting, but someone who travels as much as PCs do, with the obvious signs of wealth (in a pseudo medieval world, I'm not talking about magic swords, I'm talking about shoes) that PCs have access to is going to be so far outside the norms that prejudice against homosexuals just won't be an issue. Class is the primary differentiating factor, and anyone new in town (well, depending on how large/cosmopolitan the settlement is) is going to warrant a dinner with the local noble, where they'll be treated as peers by said noble.
In my own campaign world, heterosexual and homosexual aren't a part of the conceptual landscape the way they are in modern america. Same sex partnership exists, but most cultures don't have a term for homosexuality they way we don't have a term for someone who sleeps exclusively with brunettes. (Paizo forum posters, please don't go all crazy listing such terms, it was just an example.)
No, usually I'm the one who has to change my mind. :)
Adamantine Dragon wrote:
I agree with all of that. My point with the above post was, if people repeating it over and over is the problem, maybe the solution is to just realize that some people get it, some people don't, and to stop repeating it over and over yourself.
Edit: On reflection, that my read like I'm telling you where and what to post. I'm not, I just think we passed the beating a dead horse point weeks ago.
But AD, you started this thread. :P
Not that we haven't danced to this tune before, but here goes. A problem player is obviously a problem; it's right there in the name, like rowboat or bus-stop. At a certain level of incompatibility, there's no other answer than finding a different group to play with.
On the other hand, this seems to be a subject you care about enough to keep discussing, and starting new threads on, so I've got to ask, does this come up at your games often enough that it's even worth this amount of energy? It doesn't at mine, and if game-ruining problem players are something that you talk about a lot that doesn't affect your own game play very often, I think the answer is to just get to over the fact that everyone on the internet doesn't play RPGs in a way that meets with your approval.
If you are dealing with a problem player at your table, no amount of venting on the internet can solve your problems, but talking to that player (and maybe parting ways entirely) will.
I hope that didn't come across as too harsh, or unsympathetic.
My fault for using it as much everyone else, but Gods be feathered, I hate the term plot armor. But I'll keep using it, just 'cause we all know what we're talking about when we say it.
Yes, it looks like Tyrion and Daenerys are in it until the end of the series, but how would you say their plot armor is blatant? I don't feel like their survival is any more contrived than other characters in the series.
Though, having finished A Dance with Dragons I do have to admit that Jon Snow should definitely be added to the plot armor list.
Charles Evans 25 wrote:
Game of Thrones spoiler, just in case anyone reading this lives under a rock:
Or where the hero's son takes up his father's cause only to get assassinated at his uncle's wedding a book and a half later . . .
GRRM is a funny writer to consider when taking about plot armor. He can't be writing his characters' deaths as arbitrarily as it feels as it he is when you're reading ASoIaF, but at this point, I'm completely unwilling to say who has plot armor, or even what plot armor looks like in Westeros.
Doodlebug Anklebiter wrote:
Sugar Candy Mountain has been a big disappointment thus far. Don't get me wrong, it's been tons of fun, not being supervised, smoking cigarettes and dancing, but not much reading has been going on, I'm afraid. I did get to read a whole commie newspaper, though, and finally finished off "The Death of Ivan Ilych" which made me very sad. And then I realized that there are only three weeks between Thanksgiving and Christmas this year, and, thus, even less time to read at Sugar Candy Mountain and I got even sadder.
So you're not even trying to read any Samuel R. Delany, or the Riddle Master of Hed while shirking your duties? Badly done, Doodles. Badly done!
It sounds like you ran this encounter by the book, Morph. I'm just reading your descriptions of gameplay on the interwebz, so I may have missed some of the ins and outs of the encounter, but if the entire party survived and came back with the right buffs to deal with it quickly at the start of the next play session, that honestly sounds a little bit epic; all I can picture is Ripley suiting up in the cargo loader at the end of Aliens.
it also sounds like The Gunslinger is a player who likes to stay well within his safety zone. Players like that get very ornery when when the GM throws an encounter out them that they aren't specialized for.
(Kirth, weren't we going to talk about the difference between optimization, and specialization, with DM collusion taken into account, on some other thread?)
Why would we want to measure 0.2 (we'll just save commas vs decimal points for a later date, I guess) mm? That's metric! :P
(Serious answer, the smallest gradation I've ever seen on a imperial measure ruler was thirty-seconds of inches, but if you go to the drafting section of the art supply store, you can find all sorts of whacky increments.)
I think the simplicity of either system (that is, ease of use) just comes down to what you learn as the standard system at an early age.
Having grown up in the US, the imperial units of various sort are so ingrained that I don't find a decimal system any easier to use. The other day I was working on some RPG scenery scaled to factions of inches, and I had very little trouble finding the common denominators of halves, quarters, eighths and sixteenths. (Don't get me wrong, I think both factions and decimals and the conversion between the two should be taught in grade school.) The only thing that really throws me for a loop is that every temperature scale out there is measured in "degrees"; it's as if the US had centimeters that were two and a half times the size of metric centimeters instead of "inches."
I do enjoy the feet and inches of imperial measures because twelve is evenly divisible by two, three four and six, rather than only two and five, but I'm also the sort of nerd who likes to think about how a dozen dozen is a gross.
Can I ask all the metric users out there, is there a common unit that falls between the centimeter and the meter, or do you guys just look at what I would call a foot and say, "Meh, looks like about thirty centimeters."
Doodlebug Anklebiter wrote:
That movie appears to be based on a different book with the same name, Doodles. Joseph Delaney is listed as the author on IMDB, and the synopsis didn't ring any bells.
As for the OP's questions, I'll usually finish a book even if i don't enjoy it, but won't pick up other books by an author I don't enjoy. I'm not quite sure why outside influences should be more or less relevant to whether or not I enjoy a book, though. I mean, whatever the reason I'm not enjoying a book, if I'm not enjoying it, then I'm not enjoying it.
OMG Tactics, for a second there I thought you were talking about Elric! (No, seriously.)
My fear, when it comes to name brand D&D movies, is that the name-brand movies have performed so badly in the past (due to mishandling, don't get me wrong) that now any production company that would even entertain the idea of producing a movie can't see D&D as anything but low budget crap.
On the other hand, maybe I'm just whining because fantasy is fricken huge right now, and D&D is still used for an easy laugh on Big Bang Theory.
All it takes is one African Studies major seeing a Drizzt movie and writing on his blog, "So the black skinned elves worship an evil spider goddess and get turned into hideous spider monsters? That looks like a demonization of Anansi," and the movie studios worst fears are realized. Mind you, I don't think that's very likely to happen, just that it's that sort of example that make drow a non-starter for the studios.
To be fair Sis, that's why all the good aligned PCs in my campaigns murder goblins. :P
Yeah, Tactics, I don't think it's valid concern, I just think the typical movie studio is too conservative (little c) to be bothered when they can just put out something like Taken 3 or whatever.
I agree with both your drow-racism side conversation and your points on the Disney version of red martians. But we're talking about an industry that frequently casts blondes, brunettes and redheads as costars because they're afraid that their audience won't be able to tell women with the same color hair apart.
I don't know. On the one hand, I think anyone who looks at baseline D&D drow and sees a racist caricature is stretching, to say the least. On the other hand, I'm a white dude, so a lot of stuff that bothers other people isn't even on my radar, and someone who thinks that that something shouldn't bother other people because it doesn't bother them is boorish, to say the least.
But given how the red martians were handled in John Carter (safely ethnically non-denominational rather than red-like-a-fire-engine-is-red red skinned) I'm betting that drow on the big screen is just a non-starter, because Hollywood wants to leapfrog any potential misunderstanding, rather than because those misunderstandings would even happen.
I can't believe you would buy the first volume of The Baroque Cycle, and put C.J. Cherryh back on the shelf because you couldn't figure out which book went with which series. Badly done, Doodles. Badly done.
No, but seriously: have you read any Stephenson before? He's a really good writer, but you sort of have to go to that special Neal Stephenson place in your head to even understand what the hell he's describing. Don't get me wrong, The Baroque Cycle is totally worth reading, but you should be aware of what you're getting into.
Dude, the Goodwill in your town has an extensive book department. Nice!
EDIT: Omigod, omigod, omigod, wait! If you happen to find a copy of Cryptonomicon just lying around, read that before Quicksilver. Because, (spoiler alert) reasons.
I certainly agree about the badgering and being pushy.
It's just that when I personally think of a pirate campaign, the things I think of (equatorial seafaring adventures, sailing ships, tricorn hats, flintlock pistols) have a lot more to do with the setting and encounters than anything that would limit race and class options.
Full disclosure, my gaming group meets about once a month at this point, so I'm much more likely to come up with a pirate scenario than a pirate campaign. When I'm working on a scenario, I can design for my play group's existing characters rather than having to worry about character creation at all.
It was soccer, not hockey.
See, I should have known that one, I was even on the soccer team junior high. My position? Benchwarmer. Look whatever, it gets really cold in the fall here in New England, the Benchwarmer is a necessary member of the team!
My point was, the level dependent bonuses don't bridge the optimized/non-optimized gap in Pathfinder. There comes a certain point where what's challenging for an optimized character is auto-kill for a non-optimized character, and what's challenging for a non-optimized harmless-unto-boring for an optimized character. Neither of these are right or wrong so much as incompatible.
I will however gladly second Kirth's point about optimization =/= DPR. Personally I think optimization = overspecialization, which I why I mentioned DM collusion in my first post.
Well, to overwork the metaphor in RPG terms, what if your goalie is so good that the opposing team's striker kills one of your defenders, who happens to be in the way, with a slap shot? (I'm sorry, I live in New England but I don't know hockey; hope I got some of those right.)
Oh that's totally, in and of itself, a communication problem. Or maybe a personality problem, but yeah, some sort of problem. Of course, it's worth considering (and I'm sure you're aware, 'cause you wrote it) that that can be said by a GM to a player, or by a player to a GM.
Hug it out, b+~#@es!!
Not that I'm Ciretose, but I'd say that optimizers who use their optimization to leapfrog over other players abilities (a high Con fighter who walks through traps instead of waiting for the skill-monkey to disarm them, for instance) and the GMs who design encounters to suit that optimization, are the problem. (That's assuming there's only one problem.)
Well, this is very much a how many angels can dance on the head of pin type question, but is there a definable difference between a character you don't like but don't mind running a game for or having in your party, and one that would just drive you from the table no matter what? Let me say, if someone wants to play a druid who spends all their time in wildshape, I really don't care, but if one my players shows up with the Ponyfinder 3PP (yeah, it's out there) he and I are probably going to have a talk that doesn't end with us playing RPGs together.
I'm reminded of a thread where a GM brought his girlfriend into his playgroup as a good drow outcast type, and the players in his group killed her character claiming that their characters had plenty of in game reasons to kill drow on sight. On the one hand, if the GM's girlfriend comes to her first session playing a noble outcast from drow society with tears of loneliness running down s/her androgynous cheekbones, that has so many GM favoritism red flags on it that I think the snark in my description is warranted. On the other hand, killing someone's character during their first play session isn't a crappy thing for one player's character to do another player's character, it's a crappy thing one one person seated at the game table to do another person seated across the table. I'd be very surprised if that GM's relationship, playgroup, or both, didn't split up before too long.
That example doesn't have anything to do with you, Cire; I guess I'm just saying that sometimes everyone makes what they feel is a perfectly reasonable decision, and it all adds up to an unworkable situation. But in those situations, everyone really means everyone, not just "everyone I disagree with."