Star Wars The Last Jedi


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I would not be surprised if he had some ideas about where the story would go once it seemed like SW was big enough to get more than one movie, to the point of a couple of pages of plot/events for each installment. I doubt he had a detailed and finished script for each movie.


He didn't have a trilogy plotted when the first movie came out. Or at least not the one we got.

By the time the original trilogy was done, it was pretty obvious that the prequels would be about the corruption of Anakin and the fall of the Republic, but I doubt there was all that much detail beyond that.

I don't know if he ever had even that much for the third trilogy. If so, I don't think anything's ever leaked.

Shadow Lodge

DM_aka_Dudemeister wrote:


Luke was meditating at the temple to become a powerful “Grey” Jedi?

This was my pet theory that I wanted to be true. Not so much that he was trying to become a Grey force user, but that he'd decided that a society which cares so much about balance would unbalance itself by only using one side of the force. Upon coming to this revelation, he'd help teach Rey to actually develop with both sides in harmony.


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Knight who says Meh wrote:
How many people seriously believe Lucas charted a 9 piece movie?

Hopefully no one, because he very obviously didn't. He was still writing the first one when it started filming, and a lot of people weighed in on things that were wrong with it and had to change, both during filming and post production editing. There are enough documentaries and 'behind the scenes' footage that this is simply factual.

ESB and RotJ were still unrealized concept sketches, if that.


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Serum wrote:
DM_aka_Dudemeister wrote:


Luke was meditating at the temple to become a powerful “Grey” Jedi?
This was my pet theory that I wanted to be true. Not so much that he was trying to become a Grey force user

Obi-Wan, being portrayed by Alec Guinness and Ewan MacGregor, certainly could have been. But Mark Hamill is American -- his Luke would be a Gray Jedi instead.

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Stuffy Grammarian wrote:
Serum wrote:
DM_aka_Dudemeister wrote:


Luke was meditating at the temple to become a powerful “Grey” Jedi?
This was my pet theory that I wanted to be true. Not so much that he was trying to become a Grey force user
Obi-Wan, being portrayed by Alec Guinness and Ewan MacGregor, certainly could have been. But Mark Hamill is American -- his Luke would be a Gray Jedi instead.

Well I’m Australian, so I’m happy with grey, colour and mum.

Shadow Lodge

As a former french colony wouldnt tatooine have a gris jedi?

Dark Archive

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Secrets of The Last Jedi.

Grand Lodge

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This is what I have been waiting for.

Silver Crusade

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TriOmegaZero wrote:
This is what I have been waiting for.

Yeeee!

Shadow Lodge

Smack talks review is as hilarious as it is insightful as it is not safe for work.


Serum wrote:
DM_aka_Dudemeister wrote:


Luke was meditating at the temple to become a powerful “Grey” Jedi?
This was my pet theory that I wanted to be true. Not so much that he was trying to become a Grey force user, but that he'd decided that a society which cares so much about balance would unbalance itself by only using one side of the force. Upon coming to this revelation, he'd help teach Rey to actually develop with both sides in harmony.

Who says he didn't? The example he offered Rey seemed a perfect balance of Obi Wan's "Here's a light saber, use the force, when you're old and beat to hell, occupy the bad guy so the younger generation can escape," and Anakin's self aggrandizing whininess. Having achieved such perfection, he transcended physical existence to become one with the Force. It's all right there in the movie! :P

(More seriously, we haven't yet seen how Rey is going to comprehend/understand/account for the dark side/light side dichotomy, but this movie has at least raised the issue.)

Shadow Lodge

Hitdice wrote:


(More seriously, we haven't yet seen how Rey is going to comprehend/understand/account for the dark side/light side dichotomy, but this movie has at least raised the issue.)

I don't think that they've written it yet. If they're going to.


Anyone else kind of creeped out out that Rose kissed Finn without his permission or nonverbal consent?


We're not there yet. Close, but not yet.

Silver Crusade

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Delightful wrote:
Anyone else kind of creeped out out that Rose kissed Finn without his permission or nonverbal consent?

I'm pretty sure Finn was creeped out :-).


Well since men have been kissing,hugging,groping women for so long in movies, turn about is fair play.


MannyGoblin wrote:
Well since men have been kissing,hugging,groping women for so long in movies, turn about is fair play.

Not really. It was horrible and gross when dudes thought they could get away with (looking at you Han) and its horrible when woman try to get away with it. We should break the cycle because there is no such thing as fair play when it comes to this.


Delightful wrote:
Anyone else kind of creeped out out that Rose kissed Finn without his permission or nonverbal consent?

No, i wasn't creeped out by that. Honestly, I don't see that as a Star Wars relevant issue.


It does seem off topic.


Any word on Rose's trial in the next film?


Delightful wrote:
Anyone else kind of creeped out out that Rose kissed Finn without his permission or nonverbal consent?

not in the slightest.


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Orville Redenbacher wrote:
Any word on Rose's trial in the next film?

I think it got leaked that she'll get a stiff chewing out by the higher ups and demoted to janitor but she'll still have plenty of important side jobs to do because the brass likes her. Then she and Finn will combine their janitorial knowledge of the First Order and the Resistance to save the Republic.


Tarik Blackhands wrote:
Orville Redenbacher wrote:
Any word on Rose's trial in the next film?
I think it got leaked that she'll get a stiff chewing out by the higher ups and demoted to janitor but she'll still have plenty of important side jobs to do because the brass likes her. Then she and Finn will combine their janitorial knowledge of the First Order and the Resistance to save the Republic.

Can't we just write her out of the story entirely? I think Star Wars can only handle so many characters and Rose is one to many.

This new trilogy should be about Rey, Finn, Kylo and maybe Poe. That's it. We don't need three different storylines and multiple arcs occurring all at once.


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Delightful wrote:
Tarik Blackhands wrote:
Orville Redenbacher wrote:
Any word on Rose's trial in the next film?
I think it got leaked that she'll get a stiff chewing out by the higher ups and demoted to janitor but she'll still have plenty of important side jobs to do because the brass likes her. Then she and Finn will combine their janitorial knowledge of the First Order and the Resistance to save the Republic.

Can't we just write her out of the story entirely? I think Star Wars can only handle so many characters and Rose is one to many.

This new trilogy should be about Rey, Finn, Kylo and maybe Poe. That's it. We don't need three different storylines and multiple arcs occurring all at once.

Supporting characters are fine and I don't exactly give many grudges to Rose on that front. Her having as much spotlight as say Lando isn't a bad thing in theory. Her getting as much importance as Finn/Rey/Kylo (Poe falls well into the support category as well) would be a waste of time unless they really give her an overhaul next movie since frankly she doesn't have enough plot importance or interesting character features to pull that off.

Liberty's Edge RPG Superstar 2008 Top 32, 2011 Top 16

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Tarik Blackhands wrote:
Orville Redenbacher wrote:
Any word on Rose's trial in the next film?
I think it got leaked that she'll get a stiff chewing out by the higher ups and demoted to janitor but she'll still have plenty of important side jobs to do because the brass likes her. Then she and Finn will combine their janitorial knowledge of the First Order and the Resistance to save the Republic.

With a special crossover appearance by Roger Wilco from the Space Quest games. If it's well received by fans, I hear the next stand alone could be a Lando movie featuring Leisure Suit Larry.

Shadow Lodge

Delightful wrote:
Anyone else kind of creeped out out that Rose kissed Finn without his permission or nonverbal consent?

Too busy facepalming over the plot armorthat keeps the ATATs from blowing them to smithereens

Silver Crusade

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BigNorseWolf wrote:
Delightful wrote:
Anyone else kind of creeped out out that Rose kissed Finn without his permission or nonverbal consent?
Too busy facepalming over the plot armorthat keeps the ATATs from blowing them to smithereens

In fairness, if you don't like HUGE amounts of plot armour then Star Wars may not be the series for you :-).

At least in the movies (haven't watched the TV shows or read the books) there has always been absolutely huge amounts of plot armour for anybody considered a "named character".


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pauljathome wrote:
BigNorseWolf wrote:
Delightful wrote:
Anyone else kind of creeped out out that Rose kissed Finn without his permission or nonverbal consent?
Too busy facepalming over the plot armorthat keeps the ATATs from blowing them to smithereens

In fairness, if you don't like HUGE amounts of plot armour then Star Wars may not be the series for you :-).

At least in the movies (haven't watched the TV shows or read the books) there has always been absolutely huge amounts of plot armour for anybody considered a "named character".

Yeah... it may be odd that none of those walkers bothered to shoot or step on them, but it was also odd that Leia takes the only nonlethal hit from a non-stun settting blaster in the entire original trilogy, that none of the Death Star's fighters bothered to chase and shoot up the fighters that survived the Battle of Yavin (I mean, what did they have to lose?), that the Millennium Falcon routinely outperforms ships that are decades newer than it is (it was a "piece of junk" in the original trilogy, after all), that Han, Luke, Leia, and the droids survive more intense frontline combat than a Stalingrad veteran without taking injuries until the third film, that the star destroyer gunners don't shoot at an escape pod leaving the Tantive IV even though droids are a known quantity in their universe...


Orville Redenbacher wrote:
Any word on Rose's trial in the next film?

She should be put on trial or at the very least be the most hated person in the rebel alliance imo. It's great she saved Finn she also did something truly dumb and allowed the Empire to get through the armored door. Yes I know true love makes for a great scene in a movie not when it's written in such away that it dooms everyone else imo. I do wish they would remember that the Millennium Falcon also carries Concussion missiles and not just the quad cannons. In other sources comics and novels Han and others use them.

Shadow Lodge

pauljathome wrote:


In fairness, if you don't like HUGE amounts of plot armour then Star Wars may not be the series for you :-).

At least in the movies (haven't watched the TV shows or read the books) there has always been absolutely huge amounts of plot armour for anybody considered a "named character".

There are limits and that passed them. At warp speed.

I can't think of any plot armor nearly as bad as stopping for a picinic in front of the entire first order. They didn't even bring a laser sword.

Quote:
that none of the Death Star's fighters bothered to chase and shoot up the fighters that survived the Battle of Yavin (I mean, what did they have to lose?)

Their lives?

I mean their boss just got blown up, are they even getting paid anymore?
They just blew up your base. you don't know how many of them are left or what kind of ships they have, are you really going to chase after them or go try to go get vader from whereever he's going AhahAHahAHahAH

Quote:
that the Millennium Falcon routinely outperforms ships that are decades newer than it is (it was a "piece of junk" in the original trilogy, after all)

Crash a 1952 buick into a prius.

The junk is a deliberate aesthetic to be overlooked, kind of important as a smuggler. Han and chewie made a lot of custom modifications under the hood.

Quote:
that Han, Luke, Leia, and the droids survive more intense frontline combat than a Stalingrad veteran without taking injuries until the third film,

Lukes hand?

c3po got blown apart in 2

But yeah. stormtrooper precision is a running gag (my earth science teacher used it as an example of the difference between precision and accuracy...they're all exactly 3.48292 meters to the left...)

Quote:
that the star destroyer gunners don't shoot at an escape pod leaving the Tantive IV even though droids are a known quantity in their universe...

Its on tatooine. Where's it going to go? We know where it landed just pick it up later. Sand and servos don't mix

Head cannon is they were trying to outfox someone launching an escape pod to see what happened to it.


The Thing From Another World wrote:
Orville Redenbacher wrote:
Any word on Rose's trial in the next film?

She should be put on trial or at the very least be the most hated person in the rebel alliance imo.

To be fair, the Rebel Allian- I mean the Resistance - consists of around 40 people tops and has a navy consisting of x1 Millennium Falcon at this point. I figure they have bigger fish to fry rather than go and hoist Rose by her petard for being a bonehead. If that were the case Finn, Poe, and Poe's pilot buddies who weren't reduced to piles of ash would also be joining her for (retroactive) boneheadedness and treason to boot.

Shadow Lodge

They'd literally have to serve at each others jurors to have a court-martial at this point...

Silver Crusade

BigNorseWolf wrote:
pauljathome wrote:


In fairness, if you don't like HUGE amounts of plot armour then Star Wars may not be the series for you :-).

At least in the movies (haven't watched the TV shows or read the books) there has always been absolutely huge amounts of plot armour for anybody considered a "named character".

There are limits and that passed them.

I'm not really disagreeing but I think you're overstating the amount of difference.

Speaking for myself I know that my ability to ignore total silliness is strongly correlated to how much I'm enjoying the movie. So, if I'm liking the movie I'll notice and scoff at flying up a giant space worms butt and just not let it bother me but if I'm NOT liking the movie a character speaking in a bad Caribbean accent can really make a poor movie unwatchable.

I think that you have lots and lots of valid concerns about this movie. Too much plot armour seems to me like pretty small potatoes compared to your other points :-)


The Thing From Another World wrote:
Orville Redenbacher wrote:
Any word on Rose's trial in the next film?
She should be put on trial or at the very least be the most hated person in the rebel alliance imo. It's great she saved Finn she also did something truly dumb and allowed the Empire to get through the armored door. Yes I know true love makes for a great scene in a movie not when it's written in such away that it dooms everyone else imo.

That's under the assumption that he would have succeeded and destroyed the blaster ram (or whatever it was) rather than just disintegrating. He'd been ordered to retreat and was disobeying. He should also be tried for disobeying orders, were this actually any kind of real military organization.

Shadow Lodge

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pauljathome wrote:


I think that you have lots and lots of valid concerns about this movie. Too much plot armour seems to me like pretty small potatoes compared to your other points :-)

They're interrelated.

If the deeper levels of the story/subtext/message is that someone is wrong and needs to learn/change grow because what they're doing is getting someone killed (Don't kill what you hate save what you love!) .... for me that absolutely has to have a measure of plausibility in the upper levels of the plot.

Doing the thing you're supposed to be doing can't be the thing you're supposed to do just because its the thing you're supposed to be doing. It's circular and arbitrary. Its the metanarrative taking over the entire story. It makes the entire story a heavy handed authors message with tell don't show.

I am a philistine. I am somewhere between I don't care about that layer and actively annoyed because that layer tends to put on airs with pretenses at high art. Critics gobble that layer up like a space cat on Thela siren milk.

Stormtroopers are nameless faceless mooks. Them being terrible at their job is both consistent with the story and the Genre in general. They may be unrealistically bad shots and easy to kill or knock out but they're CONSISTANTLY bad shots that are easy to kill. The way spaceships move is more like a dog fight/ariel combat but its consistent in that regard. So fine, they all shot at han solo and missed.

But Just sitting in front a bunch of at at walkers sipping tea and eating crumpets... No. At least show the guy in the atat go "godamn it FN-2187..." and pull the laser a bit to the left to shower him in rocks or something. As it is is there anything in star wars nearly as egregious as not being shot or squashed there? Luke had to DIE to pull that off.

Shadow Lodge

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thejeff wrote:
That's under the assumption that he would have succeeded and destroyed the blaster ram (or whatever it was) rather than just disintegrating. He'd been ordered to retreat and was disobeying. He should also be tried for disobeying orders, were this actually any kind of real military organization.

1) everything in the star wars universe explodes when you crash a ship into it

2) rule 1 goes double for anything bright and glowy.

3) Poes bringing someone up on disobeying an order trial will be delayed until we can find jurors who don't fall out of their seats laughing...:)


BigNorseWolf wrote:
thejeff wrote:
That's under the assumption that he would have succeeded and destroyed the blaster ram (or whatever it was) rather than just disintegrating. He'd been ordered to retreat and was disobeying. He should also be tried for disobeying orders, were this actually any kind of real military organization.

1) everything in the star wars universe explodes when you crash a ship into it

2) rule 1 goes double for anything bright and glowy.

3) Poes bringing someone up on disobeying an order trial will be delayed until we can find jurors who don't fall out of their seats laughing...:)

How exactly Poe is prosecuting a trial in the first place as traitor (I don't think a single military looks highly on mutiny no matter how much of a jerk your CO is) is a question left for another day. That or the Resistance really is that short handed they need Poe to do some double duty before he was sentenced to being discharged (either dishonorably or out the airlock of the Falcon).

Silver Crusade

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BigNorseWolf wrote:

like a space cat on Thela siren milk.

Hmm. Space cats.

You're right, THAT is what Star Wars is missing. You can keep the silver foxes and porgs, I want Space Cats :-) :-) :-)

On a more serious note - as I say, I mostly agree with you. I thought that scene very badly handled. I just think other parts of the movie were considerably worse :-).


pauljathome wrote:
BigNorseWolf wrote:

like a space cat on Thela siren milk.

Hmm. Space cats.

You're right, THAT is what Star Wars is missing. You can keep the silver foxes and porgs, I want Space Cats :-) :-) :-)

On a more serious note - as I say, I mostly agree with you. I thought that scene very badly handled. I just think other parts of the movie were considerably worse :-).

Kilrathi would definitely screw up the first Orders day.

Shadow Lodge

Why fan theorizing ruined star wars .. and makes it better.


So what are we complaining about now? The First Order didn’t fire on two ships that were totally useless and then crashed into each other?


Ah the internet that place where everyone hates everything at all times.


Hmm..Porgs are actually CGI'd puffins. This was done because it was too much of a hassle to CGI them out, but Puffins are in fact a common food source so...just eat the puffins and problem solved!

Liberty's Edge

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How it should have ended. Great stuff


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Sad thing is, every one of those changes would make a better movie.


Agreed Bjorn.


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Frankly I'm surprised they didn't go for the obvious and just have all problems (the Dreadnought, Snoke's fleet, etc) instantly solved by suicide hyperspace jumps.

"Admiral, Admiral! We've evacuated our medical frigate and its almost out of fuel, what do we do!"

"Eh just turn it around and hyperspace ram everything. We'll be sure to give the pilot a posthumous medal"

"Brilliant!"

Then you can feature a MAD scenario as the galaxy burns under superluminal suicide tactics.

Shadow Lodge

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... are the HISE people reading this thread or were the changes THAT obvious...


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My vote goes for "that obvious"

That said, activating the lightsaber during Rey/Kylo's battle of wills was quite inspired.

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