Hot DM's Song of Silver (Inactive)

Game Master Hotaru of the Society

Actually it's a fun prestige class, since it's supposed to simulate the classic bard from 1st Ed. Bard/druid would simulate it pretty well. Another idea that comes to mind is bard/gunslinger...

Probably shouldn't argue 3.5 balance stuff here, so, eh.

@Stormcrow27:
1. Nope. Opening up the 3.5 classes can-of-worms and winding up with a planet-destroyer is not in the cards. :) I don't have the personal knowledge to prevent such escapades, don't have access to the information, and really don't want to try to wrap my head around multiple 'new' classes. Sorry!

2. I don't have any significant problems with characters based on real world or fictional things (it would be extremely unfair, as I recognize that my own creations are heavily influenced by those things I've spent my life enjoying!). That being said, your character should not be a real person (except maybe yourself?), nor a strict parody of a person. It's just... usually boring, and plays out way too soon. I'm in this more for story than gimmicks or builds.

3. I'm not allowing dreamscarred press classes, but I'll allow some of their feats on a case by case basis. Psionics are cool, overall. You can possibly play a psionic class, but you'll have an uphill battle. If you want to work hard on a good story and still maybe not get in, go for it!

@Thunderbeard: But they get more healing abilities than the Chirurgeon. And that's part of the flavor text, which is at best a suggested intent. I just don't believe that an archetype that is 90% based on 'becoming better at buffing and healing' is an 'inherently evil archetype'.

@Stormcrow pt. 2: I can't comment on things like 'classes', other than suggesting possible themes. But, Bolt Ace is the only available gunslinger archetype. At least that I'm aware of. I don't have direct access to anything newer than Bolt Ace that I would allow.

Re: 3.5 Balance: I agree that it should be left out. :) It doesn't add much to the thread, and the short answer is 'no', the long answer being 'almost assuredly no'. :)

I've got a question about the bard/skald half of the gestalt, can it be used for a prestige class later or does it have to be bard/skald the whole way? (And no I'm not thinking of witch :))

So, if I do apply, I think my daring champion would be order of the star with Arshea for my faith (possibly taking celestial obedience eventually). And, I might dip 2 levels of paladin if it feels organic enough. Not sure about archetypes on the bard side, but I like the feel of the court bard.

Of course... It seems like the vast majority of pitches so far are leaning towards physical... I have another potentially interesting idea for a magician bard/arcanist I could work on (or maybe a flame dancer/blackened fire oracle?)

@Trawets: Bard/Skald can go into an appropriate archetype, such as Shadowdancer. There may need to be adjustments, and you'll have to run it by me first. The other side cannot use your bard side to qualify for archetypes. :)

For example, a Bard/Rogue could not go Arcane Trickster, unless the Rogue side could qualify for it on its own merit (No early access to archetypes through sneakiness!). This extends to several other classes that are typically used to 'marry' two normally quite divergent concepts (Eldritch Knight, Arcane Archer, Mystic Theurge, and so on.)

Rule of Thumb: if you think of laughing maniacally, you should ask.

Hi DM,

Here's my submission: Timm Tones, wrestler/celebrity of Jarvis End :)

He was a blast to create! I'll be completing his profile with more information on the next days.

@Nate Lange: All sound pretty solid.

@Archlich: Taking a look now, expect a PM shortly to go into more depth!

@Everyone: I care a great deal more about your ability to tell a story, and to build a character that feels 'right' for that story, than your ability to build the most obscenely powerful character imaginable. That isn't an accusation, at all. I fully appreciate folks setting up to wreck encounters so the story can keep going. It's just that your Crunch is basically useless without your fluff. I don't mind seeing what concept you have though. Concepts are cool. :)

I was more thinking bard/Dragon Disciple on one side and fighter on the other. I've a Sorc/DD idea that I've been trying to pursue that hasn't happened yet. Every time I get the idea into a game it collapses or there are so may DDs that I don't get picked. I'm think bard/dd might be a dumbed down version and I may not be happy with it.

Also considering bard summoner or bard/wizard (conj) and summon his own band/back ups.

I don't mind Bard/DD as long as it makes sense for the character, without feeling forced.

So many submissions... I bow out. Good luck everyone.

No worries. I was inquiring after the bard prestige classes for story, not power. As for balance, this is Pathfinder with gestalt. It's already unbalanced in comparison to 3.5, and regular Pathfinder. It is balanced with itself. As for the gunslinger archetypes, all of them are either in Ultimate Combat, the Advanced Class Guide, or the Advanced Race Guide, all of which are easily accessible on the prd or pfsrd20 sites. Now if you don't want firearms, no worries either. I'm thinking either bard/druid, skald/bard, bard/psychic from Occult Mysteries, or bard/cavalier going into battle herald.

@Archlich: Taking a look now, expect a PM shortly to go into more depth!

Thanks my friend. I still have to add some more fluff there, but the overall theme is taking shape nicely.

I'm going to take a small break from replying and reading over things, so I can do some me-related things! :)

But in the meantime, there's a link up at the top of the page to 'Recruitment Spreadsheet'. I'm trying to keep up with who has dotted (and withdrawn), what has been submitted, and giving them a rough 'outline' of what they are good at.

My goal is to build a well-balanced team, but character-wise, I will choose a character who excites me that I have ideas for over making absolutely certain the team is balanced.

If I miss your dot or character sheet, you are responsible for bringing it to my attention.

I'm going to make mistakes and gloss over things, as I'm prioritizing getting fluff feedback (and asking about crunch choices) over keeping the spreadsheet strictly up to date.

I am currently thinking of limiting dots to 25. That's going to be at least twenty people who submit something, and don't wind up getting in, which will make me ridiculously sad. That does not mean you'll have your two-day warning when that happens, though.

Edit: Won't get a two-day warning as in, the two-day warning will come later, to give adequate time to give me solid characters. :)

Remove me from the list please, I was just joking around with the Brian Blessed character

Dotting, got an interesting concept for a nature-themed Animal Speaker/Sylvan Sorcerer.

Are we allowed to dot for someone else? I have a friend that did a joint application with me for the game I'm waiting to hear about, if we don't get picked I think he might be interested in this one...

Sure. Like I said, I fully support friend applications. Would you like to be treated as a dual-app or still treated as separate players/characters?

Dotting. Thinking about a Metal Elementalist Wizard bent on bringing some fresh sounds from Tian Xia to the opera houses of Cheliax.

@Thunderbeard: But they get more healing abilities than the Chirurgeon. And that's part of the flavor text, which is at best a suggested intent. I just don't believe that an archetype that is 90% based on 'becoming better at buffing and healing' is an 'inherently evil archetype'.

A Vivisectionist's class abilities are "Sneak Attack," "Torturer's Eye," "Cruel Anatomist," "Torturous Transformation," "Bleeding Attack," and "Crippling Strike." While a few of them can be used for healing, that's never struck me as the game designer's intent.

But really I think I just played a game once with a bad vivisectionist and am still bitter about it ^_^;;

For example, a Bard/Rogue could not go Arcane Trickster, unless the Rogue side could qualify for it on its own merit (No early access to archetypes through sneakiness!).

Sandman Bard can also do this on the bard side. Sandman Bard is actually pretty neat, for anyone who wants to play a sneaky bard.

Now if you don't want firearms, no worries either.

Pretty sure that was the intent. There are few people I know more familiar with PF archetypes and where to find them than Hotaru.

Hah, that's not irony. I mention that I might miss something, and it's the post two up that I missed!

I've no problem with gunslinger, I have a problem with gunslinger. If that makes more sense to you.

I'm sort of waiving the obvious implications of being a catfolk in a city that maybe sees 5 catfolks in a given month, while you still expect to keep your secret identity. Perhaps it's the hairbow?

But it's really difficult to waive 'explosion that can be heard from miles away' not drawing some unwanted attention to where you are in an urban setting. :) That's not to say 'real world urban setting', but rather, pathfinder urban setting.

Sure. Like I said, I fully support friend applications. Would you like to be treated as a dual-app or still treated as separate players/characters?

I don't know yet- I think he already went to bed. One of us will post about it tomorrow.

Alrighty :)

I probably won't be around until tomorrow (after a little bit), so we have that in common!

Bed? I know not of this mythic location.

Maybe you just don't have mythic levels yet? ;)

I knew I was doing something wrong!

Oh, I do have a more serious question: Will retraining be available?
I specifically ask for those archetypes not replacing Versatile Performance.
It would feel more organic to put skill points into the respective skills, THEN get the upgrade from Versatile Performance(rather than not care about the skills until said upgrade activates).

But then, one has those ranks in a skill one never uses because Perform trumps it...so it would be interesting to know if we can spend down-time to "learn something new" in its place.(I doubt we'll run short of skill points in this group, but figure it's worth asking)

On the campaign info page she (she?) said under Sources, 'will generally allow you to retrain at no cost'.

This is the Wyrm's submission - an angel-blooded (angelkin) aasimar, barbarian (invulnerable rager) / bard (savage skald, songhealer) 1. I didn't like how the skald class was set up, so I just went with barbarian and bard straight out. Kind of makes for a brash sort; hoping I get to play him.

I have now finished my character application here they both are.

Ticaria Imoroa
Shelyn's Avenger

On the campaign info page she (she?) said under Sources, 'will generally allow you to retrain at no cost'.

I reserve the right to use or ignore Errata and will generally allow you to retrain at no cost.

I took that to mean that if Errata affects a build, you get to retrain, freely. I may be too careful, but I did not interpret this to mean that retraining will generally be available, or free.

Dotting till the fat lady sings! Now I just have to figure out the bard side of my character. Let us see what we can create here...

Re: Versatile Performance: I'll actually let you immediately retrain all of the associated skill-points for free. I feel neither way is particularly ideal, but the latter at least doesn't punish choices that enforce who a character is. Other similar abilities will almost assuredly be handled the same way.

Similarly, Bonus Feats and Bonus Spells that you already have when your class would give them to you may be retrained in the same way, following the same restrictions.

Re: Retraining overall: For Free, Immediate retraining: That was just for errata/DM Fiat situations (as well as the three things I just mentioned). I'll never force you to stick with an ability that I (or Paizo) determines doesn't or shouldn't work the way you believed it did when you took it.

Normally, however, retraining will take all of the normal prerequisites and investments, but is available. :)

@Wyrm/@Natalie: I'll do my best to get to the sheets soon. :)

@Kakure: Added to the sheet.

Still dotting, but ignore my previous note about the character concept, going to try and come up with something more fitting.

Hah, that's not irony. I mention that I might miss something, and it's the post two up that I missed!

I've no problem with gunslinger, I have a problem with gunslinger. If that makes more sense to you.

I'm sort of waiving the obvious implications of being a catfolk in a city that maybe sees 5 catfolks in a given month, while you still expect to keep your secret identity. Perhaps it's the hairbow?

But it's really difficult to waive 'explosion that can be heard from miles away' not drawing some unwanted attention to where you are in an urban setting. :) That's not to say 'real world urban setting', but rather, pathfinder urban setting.

It's Cheliax. Explosions are a fact of life in a realm filled with devils. As for the catfolk, it's not the hairbow, it's the furry cult that has links into the government. Like the X-files. There is a cigarette smoking dwarf in a cat suit making sure that all mention of them is plausibly deniable.

But it's not Cheliax. It's a portion of Cheliax that is ridiculously different from the main portions of Cheliax proper. Even in mainstream Cheliax, 'Devils in the streets' isn't really a thing unless they're very sneaky devils (Looking at you, Imps).

Cheliax is not about 'every street corner has a magic circle to hell'. It's really, really not. Diabolism is definitely a thing, and then there's a step away from that - worshiping the structure and 'perfection of law'. Kintargo is about four steps away from that, which is really upsetting for Barzillai.

Worth noting, slavery is not nearly as common in Kintargo as anywhere else, Tieflings aren't treated as trash (though they're still second-hand citizens.), except by people who are inherently jerks. It's not a social thing in Kintargo to beat tieflings, it's a personal thing. Likewise, there are free halflings all over the place. Total madhouse, that. :P

Explosions aren't a fact of life. In an inner-city environment, you get used to gunshots because they're an everyday thing. In pathfinder, wizards throwing fireballs are not. Guns are not, outside of Alkenstar (barring supertech). When you do something that will draw a large amount of attention, you'll draw a large amount of attention (possibly using this to your advantage as a distraction. :))

If your Modus Operandi draws a lot of attention (Guns, Fireballs), then your activities draw a lot of attention. It's not so much that I'm 100% against guns, it's that I don't want players to sink significant investments into something I will punish them for.

Soooooo not Cheliax. Kintargo is Chaotic Good. 'nuff said.

But, what COULD work would be a silence-spell on the gun you intend to fire...like, a magical silencer ;)
*quickly exits stage, right*

Where are you from?
How and why did you become your classes?
Why do they wield the weapons that they do? What lead them to that particular weapon?
Is your character Religious?
Do they worship a particular god? Why?
What does your alignment mean to your character?
Do you have a code?
Does your character retain these beliefs when they're alone?
What does your character look like?
What do they look like when alone?

You do not need to change your sheet to this format, it's just... easier.

The above should help folks who are trying to make a template to answer my questions. You should just be able to click reply and then copy what you need. In a rare bout of self-awareness, I realized pretty much everyone was having to do it, because one person (me) hadn't thought of it! Rectified?

Also, I'm finding that those that have answered the mini questionairre above have had much better fluff.

Likewise, those who have submitted ten-minute backgrounds have done a great job of drawing me into their characters. I'll post a template for the Ten-Minute Background in the next post (in case folks want to fill it out). Doing these is strictly better for your characters, because it helps you figure out who they are before you play them. Trying to do one of these for a character saved me from creating someone I would hate playing.

Hello again, here's a link to the nitty-gritty mechanical part of my character submission: Adonara Strixis. (I'm still torn between Dazzling Display and Combat Reflexes for her first feat, but I think everything else is there.)

In terms of character role and direction, I would be tempted to multiclass quite intensely on the warpriest side of the gestalt to give her some more flexibility in combat early on, and with the skills from the bard side, I'm imagining a skilled support role for Adonara: getting into places people don't want others getting into, and some social muscle - she's not the best at running a con or sting, but should be able to handle negotiations once it's clear what's at stake, whether diplomatically or not.

I hope to give her a proper background for "Hell's Rebels" specifically this afternoon or evening; what's under "Character description" is left over from when I first got the idea of Adonara during the ACG playtest.

Step 1: Write 5 background and concept elements that you feel are important to your image of the character. These can be a concept overview, a list of important life events, a physical description, a personality profile...whatever you need to get an image in your mind.

Step 2: List at least two goals for the character. At least one of these goals should be one that the character has, while another should be one that you, as a player, want to see developed over the course of the game.

Step 3: List at least two secrets about your character. One is a secret the character knows, one is a secret that involves him but that he is not actually aware of yet. This will help me in creating plots that center around your character.

Step 4: Describe at least three people that are tied to the character. ‘Blood, Romance, Honor’ is a good default. Alternately, two people important to your character in a friendly way, and one that is an enemy.

Step 5: Describe three memories, mannerisms, or quirks that your character has.

This ‘Ten Minute’ Background tends to take me more than an hour to finish in a satisfactory way, but it’s simply a significant boon in determining personalities before you’ve even played a character.

Re: Silenced Gun: Sure. I've no problem with that, but it's a pretty high level solution. By the time you have it, you might also have access to guns. :)

Re: Chaotic Good: Pretty much. It's not that cut-and-dry, but compared to Cheliax, very, very chaotic and good. The players will not be having to drag the citizens kicking and screaming into their new regime. :P

Well, my friend and I did get accepted in the other game, so you can remove my/our dot. Thanks and good luck! Sounds like it'll be a fun game.

Good luck!

@Adonara: I'm currently much more concerned with fluff than crunch, once I've found favorites I'll deal more with crunch. In the mean time, I'm asking folks questions about their applications to learn more about the characters in question. Definitely let me know when you're done with the fluff!

If I'm missing anyone, don't be afraid to poke me. I'm easily distracted. :)

I shall dot here. I was thinking of reviving my mute bard and this fits perfectly. Especially if the Kineticist is available. I can finally make the bard I envision who's power ballad is enough to bring down any foe. SHouldn't take too long to tweek the alias to fit.

But it's not Cheliax. It's a portion of Cheliax that is ridiculously different from the main portions of Cheliax proper. Even in mainstream Cheliax, 'Devils in the streets' isn't really a thing unless they're very sneaky devils (Looking at you, Imps).

Cheliax is not about 'every street corner has a magic circle to hell'. It's really, really not. Diabolism is definitely a thing, and then there's a step away from that - worshiping the structure and 'perfection of law'. Kintargo is about four steps away from that, which is really upsetting for Barzillai.

Worth noting, slavery is not nearly as common in Kintargo as anywhere else, Tieflings aren't treated as trash (though they're still second-hand citizens.), except by people who are inherently jerks. It's not a social thing in Kintargo to beat tieflings, it's a personal thing. Likewise, there are free halflings all over the place. Total madhouse, that. :P

Explosions aren't a fact of life. In an inner-city environment, you get used to gunshots because they're an everyday thing. In pathfinder, wizards throwing fireballs are not. Guns are not, outside of Alkenstar (barring supertech). When you do something that will draw a large amount of attention, you'll draw a large amount of attention (possibly using this to your advantage as a distraction. :))

If your Modus Operandi draws a lot of attention (Guns, Fireballs), then your activities draw a lot of attention. It's not so much that I'm 100% against guns, it's that I don't want players to sink significant investments into something I will punish them for.

That was meant as a joke.

If you're thinking of a mute bard (would still need sound to cast spells, though), miming is a perfectly acceptable use of Perform (acting).

Depending on GM interpretation, though, you could potentially use Spellsong to cast *all* your spells as miming.

So you're looking at a combination of La Boeheme/Rent and Les Miserables set in Cheliax. Hopefully with better success on the rebellion side then in Les Miserables and less Russell Crowe singing. Now I have the theme down.

I forgot about that. The last DM was nice enough to let his instrument qualify for the verbal component. Will you be nice like that too Hot DM?

Oh yeah, my character is definitely Enjolras.
Hopefully with less getting shot.
Definitely with more epic solos.

I was the fence about applying for this... But I just realized Hotaru is the GM... So now I really want to apply...

How strict are you on the bard requirement? Because I'm thinking that my character can start of as bard (or skald I guess) then go into Sentinel/Evangelist of Shelyn. Would that be ok? With Paladin on the other side.

Too bad about the no path of war, there area number of PoW classes that work great with bards...

Another idea I have is a Archivist combined with Oracle (Lore). Would that be against the spirit of the idea?

I assume you want me to refrain from making my background too dark? I actually have a character with a lighter background now (Zariya)!

I like to match up flavor with crunch, sorry that I probably won't really be able to provide one without the other.

Alright here is Melissa 'Medina' Al-Shams. Born in Katheer but has a close personal connection to Kintargo.

At the start I was kinda worried that a Dervish Dancer/Fighter Gestalt would be a bit cheesy and if I had gone with a Scimitar OR if Slashing Grace worked the way I *thought* it did then it might have been. But as I wrote out the fluff she turned into a far weaker TWF Kukri character. Still I really really like the flavour of what she is now. Please let me know if there are any questions.