Commander Hype Thread


Pathfinder Second Edition General Discussion

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I have read the document.

I just hope the class is better on release.


Arachnofiend wrote:
Ready Aim Fire being level 15 is both unfortunate and unsurprising. No good way to support a caster DPR until then.

level 2, when you roll initiative, recall knowledge,

Level 3 uses warfare lore.

"...their most notable offensive abilities, and whether one of their saving throws is particularly weak".

With feats to boost it to 6x RK.


exequiel759 wrote:

I have read the document.

I just hope the class is better on release.

Better "weak" now with chances to be improved than too strong now and then nerfed.

Sczarni

Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

It's extremely underwhelming...


Mellored wrote:
Arachnofiend wrote:
Ready Aim Fire being level 15 is both unfortunate and unsurprising. No good way to support a caster DPR until then.

level 2, when you roll initiative, recall knowledge,

Level 3 uses warfare lore.

"...their most notable offensive abilities, and whether one of their saving throws is particularly weak".

With feats to boost it to 6x RK.

That's... fine, I guess, but it definitely pales in comparison to just giving your Fighter an extra full MAP strike every round.


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The class has a lot of ways to provide support to your allies. It feels a lot like a martial version of Bard to me.


I'm probably looking at the playtest Commander with rose-tinted goggles and salivating at the combos that can be engineered with certain tactics (for instance, Coordinating Maneuvers with one ally and Strike Hard! with another ally for a MAP-free Strike with flanking), but just looking at what the class does, I'm really impressed with the amount of action economy going on. If the class turns out to be weak, that's great, not simply because it's generally easier to buff than to nerf, but because it means the balanced end result would look and feel even better. I'll have to playtest the class properly to be sure, but being able to let several allies do multiple entire actions as free actions or reactions outside of their turn strikes me as both unique and incredibly powerful in the right circumstances.


One initial thought is that the Banner's 30 ft. range is fine for first level but as the monsters get bigger the Commander might run into the same problems Champions have with their reactions at high levels where Huge and Gargantuan creatures take up so much space that it's really hard to stay in formation against them and party members are often out of range.


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Arachnofiend wrote:
Ready Aim Fire being level 15 is both unfortunate and unsurprising. No good way to support a caster DPR until then.

I agree that the class needs ways to help casters deal damage from the start, not just at level 15.

It would be a shame if Commander had anti-synergy with casters like Skald did in 1e.


Oh, I'm fine with the class being weak now because it means its going to be better on release. Most classes are kinda bad on playtest, but on release they end up getting their issues resolved.

Liberty's Edge

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exequiel759 wrote:

I have read the document.

I just hope the class is better on release.

What part of the class do you find to be disappointing on this front? Commander reads as a really well-balanced class on first read, albeit one that is complicated enough that I imagine it will take some time to really understand the nuances of the builds available.


I made a whole post about it in the feedback thread.


Mellored wrote:

Lazylord is very possible. 2 actions (+your bonus reaction) to grant a Strike at level 1.

As is dumping Int, though you do get legendary DC.

Dumping int is potentially expensive, though. It chokes your number of squadmates.


So my take is that it's too much the lazy lord from 4e in practice it's a lot about giving orders and not a lot about setting examples.

I seems weird to have practiced a bunch of maneuvers that don't include yourself. If I had a tactic to give my ally a charge I would like to be charging besides them in time. Maybe a few more conditional tactics like a one action strike hard with the flourish trait that only be used when flanking with you might help to put you more in the thick of the action.


I mean, I'd argue the class doesn't allow me to play the lazylord honestly. Most of the tactics don't include the commander, but most of the feats do. I really hope on release the class allows for both playstyles to be possible and effective in combat. I personally want a lazylord becuase if I want to play a commander in melee I'd play a fighter with the marshal archetype or the future commander archetype, but I'm not against them allowing a more involved playstyle as long as I can do lazylord too.


Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
exequiel759 wrote:
I mean, I'd argue the class doesn't allow me to play the lazylord honestly. Most of the tactics don't include the commander, but most of the feats do. I really hope on release the class allows for both playstyles to be possible and effective in combat. I personally want a lazylord becuase if I want to play a commander in melee I'd play a fighter with the marshal archetype or the future commander archetype, but I'm not against them allowing a more involved playstyle as long as I can do lazylord too.

Archetypes make that pretty trivial, so the good news is you could easily invest in dandy, marshal, etc, and be a respectable lazylord.


Marshal is far from being a lazylord. The range of your aura pretty much requires you to be in melee and simply you don't have enough options to use all your actions to help others. That's what I expected from the commander and what I assumed most people wanted too since since day 1 people having wanting a full support martial, but it seems people want just a more in-depth fighter with marshal archetype.


Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
exequiel759 wrote:
Marshal is far from being a lazylord. The range of your aura pretty much requires you to be in melee and simply you don't have enough options to use all your actions to help others. That's what I expected from the commander and what I assumed most people wanted too since since day 1 people having wanting a full support martial, but it seems people want just a more in-depth fighter with marshal archetype.

I think the Commander itself has those actions though, two action Strike Hard! that grants a reaction and a 1 action something else like Form Up! or Reload! depending on party comp, is absolutely lazylord territory.

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