I became a noble and I have no idea what I'm doing.


Advice


Long story short, Grand Prince Stavian III granted my family nobility and ~1,370 acres of forest just outside Taldor. My family is me, my wife, and our unborn son. The only other people with me are the 20 men of arms I have been granted. I have no idea how to make money, raise my status, and build a home in my 6 months of downtime. Any advice? (I'm a leaf/storm druid btw) [lvl 9]


I am mostly just writing on speculation about general domain building, and have no idea about actual mechanics that might already be in place for this kind of thing.

Well, anyway, the first step is determine what season you are in. If your 6 months are early in the year, then you might be able to get farming started. Otherwise, you should only settle for making a small fort area as a base of operation while you prepare for next spring. You don't want too many workers when you don't have a reliable way to feed those extra mouths.

Next, survey the area you have been granted. A standard druid skillset would likely help here- determine the fertility of the soil, availability of clean water, whether you have access to decent quality wood, etc. You might want to find experts in surveying for other potential resources, such as minerals.

When preparing for setting up a farming community, you seek out people that DO know what they are doing. Assuming that you have permission from local nobles, go to a large town and try to find refugees who have been displaced due to disaster, war, bandit raids, etc. You likely want people that lost their homes due to things that are 'not their fault'- you likely don't want a settler that is trying to start again because their previous farm failed. Face skills help at this step, since i am pretty sure this is a gather information check.


If you have access to it, find the old Kingmaker AP books as they had some kingdom building stuff in them that might help you, or wait for the new printing for 2nd ed

One thing to take account of in the grand plans is that 1370 acres is not a huge amount of land. Think a square 2.2km/1.4mi on a side. If most of that is forest, then you might not have much in the way of farming that can be done, but might be able to develop a solid woodcutting/saw mill/treating industry to make the land productive.

Waterways offer some fishing or transport options, major roads likewise.

Being a druid and being able to keep land arable, controlled, and growing will probably help you with this, if you have the relevant skills


It also depends on the actual title. A Baron often didn't even have land as a noble apart from his mansion/personal space, and his duties were more in the actual capital.

Honorary titles like Knight and Baron, were usually given as rewards exactly due to tat, it didn't make them important enough to shift the power of balance, meanwhile it gave them the benefits that came with higher status in the area.

The amount of land you'd be given is not enough to say that you are really a landowner-noble, since those usually had enough land to have at least a village or two under their command, in which case their duties were more about focusing said commoners towards a task, protecting them, and levying them taxes (basically their land was *your* land, so whatever they did there was by default yours, and that usually came as a heavy levy on their actual production towards your coffers, which you could either use to further develop the land, or just pocket, or invest elsewhere)


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Asethe wrote:
One thing to take account of in the grand plans is that 1370 acres is not a huge amount of land.

I wonder if the GM realizes that? 'Cause it sounds like a fair amount offhand.

CRB p131, Leaf Druid wrote:
You revere plants and the bounty of nature, acting as both a gardener and warden for the wilderness, teaching sustainable techniques to communities, and helping areas regrow after disasters or negligent humanoid expansion. [...] Committing wanton cruelty to plants or killing plants unnecessarily is anathema to your order. (This doesn’t prevent you from defending yourself against plants or harvesting them when necessary for survival.)

Is it necessary to have logging operations there? Not just good for your status, but necessary? If not you can't really do it. If there was already a community there doing logging, teaching them sustainable techniques would cut down on the cutting down, but starting up logging where there is none really seems right out for a leaf druid....


Fuzzy-Wuzzy wrote:
Asethe wrote:
One thing to take account of in the grand plans is that 1370 acres is not a huge amount of land.

I wonder if the GM realizes that? 'Cause it sounds like a fair amount offhand.

CRB p131, Leaf Druid wrote:
You revere plants and the bounty of nature, acting as both a gardener and warden for the wilderness, teaching sustainable techniques to communities, and helping areas regrow after disasters or negligent humanoid expansion. [...] Committing wanton cruelty to plants or killing plants unnecessarily is anathema to your order. (This doesn’t prevent you from defending yourself against plants or harvesting them when necessary for survival.)
Is it necessary to have logging operations there? Not just good for your status, but necessary? If not you can't really do it. If there was already a community there doing logging, teaching them sustainable techniques would cut down on the cutting down, but starting up logging where there is none really seems right out for a leaf druid....

Totally agree.

Also, to think about a druid setting up its little kingdom is something to me really off.

A Leaf/Storm ( or just a druid to begin with ) druid might want to just take the place the way it is, leaving it open to anybody.


As previously noted, according to google 1370 acres is about 2.2 square miles, which is a square about 1.5 miles on each side. That's pretty small in the grand scheme of things.

You're a druid. Don't bother developing this area. Make a home suitable for your family and the men at arms you've been granted. You can hunt on the land. Verify if there are any useful natural resources. Assign your men to maybe have a small farm just to feed the 20ish of you and maybe acquire natural resources for your needs (like wood for building structures but not to sell). Other than that, it's basically you now have an extended family. You could let the men at arms go if you decide you don't really want them.


Claxon wrote:
You could let the men at arms go if you decide you don't really want them.

Be really sure before you do that. You're probably legally responsible for enforcing the laws in your small territory, like making sure nobody uses it as a base for banditry or rebellion. Men-at-arms are great for dealing with that if you don't want to or are out adventuring.


Fuzzy-Wuzzy wrote:
Claxon wrote:
You could let the men at arms go if you decide you don't really want them.
Be really sure before you do that. You're probably legally responsible for enforcing the laws in your small territory, like making sure nobody uses it as a base for banditry or rebellion. Men-at-arms are great for dealing with that if you don't want to or are out adventuring.

I mean, I don't personally see a reason to let them go, but at the same time with the character being a druid I can see why the character wouldn't want to be responsible for these other people.


A pretty standard Knight's Fee; maybe a little on the small side. You've got way too many men at arms though. A fee that size might support the knight, 1 or 2 squires for said knight, and a couple of men at arms.

As far as making money and raising status (without violating your druidic anathema): find a environmentally suitable plant that will grow in the forest and an alchemist partner, go into the "painkiller" business... Encourage the plant throughout your holdings, harvest (sustainably), process and distribute. We'll just call you Mr. Escobar from now on.


Might be worth looking up Crystalhurst for some ideas.


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You know, a few square miles of forest is about the right size for a bandit camp and training grounds if you need money...


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Claxon wrote:
Fuzzy-Wuzzy wrote:
Claxon wrote:
You could let the men at arms go if you decide you don't really want them.
Be really sure before you do that. You're probably legally responsible for enforcing the laws in your small territory, like making sure nobody uses it as a base for banditry or rebellion. Men-at-arms are great for dealing with that if you don't want to or are out adventuring.
I mean, I don't personally see a reason to let them go, but at the same time with the character being a druid I can see why the character wouldn't want to be responsible for these other people.

Has it been defined who these men-at-arms are?

Perhaps they might be otherwise set of misfits from a recent event of people who were drafted, but might not otherwise be a good fit for the more conventional units.

A unit of 20, ratfolk, leshy, pixie, goblin, hobgoblin, changeling, or elemental-touched souls that got pulled into action and are looking for a better fit of a life might sign up to transfer to report to a notable druid who was just granted a title, to finish their commitment to serve, however said service came about existing. The units they come from might even welcome getting rid of them.

Back to the original questions...

If you have been granted a title and land, you can ask your GM but I'd assume that in doing so you can perhaps be allowed to 'work' at managing your fiefdom as a downtime Job equal to your level. Although as a GM I would make you give me the fluff of what line of work you are doing to earn said money.

Paying the men-at-arms, personally, that may be pretty expensive. Lacking the rules that will eventually be coming out in the Kingmaker Conversion. I don't have them on me right now, but I think Ages of Ashes vol 2 has some information about repairing an old castle, I don't recall if it gave some basic income for the castle, but I honestly don't recall. But if you view those men-at-arms as part of the fiefdom, and not personal staff. I can easily imagine the organization being a meta-character that could earn income based on some rolls made by you as the administrator. Either simple administration/income rolls, or a Victory Point system of some sort that could be used to pay its staff, and build up resources that could only be spent on upgrading the manor fiefdom. Which would be in line with what they do in the Extinction Curse, with the Circus development.

With that sort of situation, you would explain what your men-at-arms are doing to help make the area better. (patrolling the trails, checking up on residents to insure all is well, etc) Make the GM feel like you have them doing enough to justify their existence you have a good chance of breaking even. If you have them idle, you're probably going to need to subsidize them, if you are good at explaining their usefulness, you may earn an income for getting upgrades, such as better roads, richer crops, rarer artisans, etc.

Honestly, I'd imagine if you've been given the land, and troops, I imagine with it would come the stipends to pay for the troops for at least few months to get things set up. But after that, yes I'd imagine you'd be expected to make your land pay for itself, and be prepared to provide troops and resources if needed to your lord in the future.


Area is small enough to just set up a personal holding have a couple men-at-arms and try to be self sustaining.

Maybe treat the holding like an organisation until the kingdom management rules come out. The men at arms are recruits you make some of them lieutenants. They are there to protect the land your family and run errands in the surrounding area. Work out some milestones with your GM be they time and/or money. Doubt you can get much done in 6 months to start so spend that time set up a caretaker or make your wife that while you, I imagine, go keep adventuring.


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Bold of you to assume that anyone knows what they're doing.


EnderFist wrote:
Any advice?

When in doubt, pinky out?


Jokey the Unfunny Comedian wrote:
Bold of you to assume that anyone knows what they're doing.

Yeah, that is kind of the flaw of a feudal based social system. The value placed on military achievements and power might have little to do with sound governing abilities in the economic and agricultural spheres.


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lemeres wrote:
Jokey the Unfunny Comedian wrote:
Bold of you to assume that anyone knows what they're doing.
Yeah, that is kind of the flaw of a feudal based social system. The value placed on military achievements and power might have little to do with sound governing abilities in the economic and agricultural spheres.

In my experience, there are two kinds of people:

1.) AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

2.) AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA but can hide it

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