I'm starting up pathfinder 2e soon so I'm starting a thread I can go to and ask questions of the community every once in awhile, I hope some of my questions I may post aren't already been asked and answered prior.
So to my 1st question going to be starting Age of Ashes as my group 1st foray into 2e and I was thinking of making a sword and board type I was thinking that fighter or champion is probably the way to go unless there's other classes that can do just as well? Any suggestions and classes, which feats to take, and Ancestries they my make the sword and board style better. I've seen the Everstand feat they are interesting I just don't know if My DM will allow stuff form the Character Guide.
I'd definitely check with your GM on what is and isn't allowed.
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Fighter and Champion are both ideal choices for sword and board. There's really no reason for your GM to bar you from taking things from other books; that's what they're there for, and IIRC Everstand isn't uncommon. You could always just say you're an ex-Lastwall knight.
No ancestry in particular will buff your combat abilities in the way you're thinking. Grab a Crafting proficiency so you can fix your shield if it gets smashed.
Definitely find out what sources are allowed as your first step.
As for class, Fighter and Champion are indeed going to be your best bets for sword and board in my opinion. As to which? Well, some of that may depend on the rest of your party (if you will know prior to session 1). Basically, the Champion will likely be the king of defense, not only keeping yourself alive, but helping the rest of the party stay alive too. The fighter on the other hand will have a bit more offensive potential (not that the Champion doesn't get offense, just that its more defensive oriented).
One thing to note about Champs though, if you've played 1e or a paladin in D&D, they are not quite the same anymore. Diving grace has fallen off dramatically for instance, etc. Not to say that they are a bad class (far from it) just that they are . . . different.
I've been reading more of the classes, Barbarian has cought my attention I've been researching there instincts and giant instinct seems cool with the damage they could put out and the reach they can get, I was wondering how often your larger size (if you go that route) or your larger weapon becomes a problem like not having enough room to swing that big weapon around or enough room to go large or huge, In the published adventures that is.
I assume if you went giant Instinct Barbarian and took Giant's Stature and Titan's Stature that when you rage you have to go the increase in size I don't remember reading anywhere that you can choose to not grow big
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I've been reading more of the classes, Barbarian has cought my attention I've been researching there instincts and giant instinct seems cool with the damage they could put out and the reach they can get, I was wondering how often your larger size (if you go that route) or your larger weapon becomes a problem like not having enough room to swing that big weapon around or enough room to go large or huge, In the published adventures that is.
Large weapons never cause problems. Aside from extra damage and Clumsy they are treated mechanically just like medium ones, and Reach weapons no longer have problems in close spaces.
Actually being Large will only work sometimes, but is optional.
I assume if you went giant Instinct Barbarian and took Giant's Stature and Titan's Stature that when you rage you have to go the increase in size I don't remember reading anywhere that you can choose to not grow big
No, as noted you choose to use those abilities.
I've been reading more of the classes, Barbarian has cought my attention I've been researching there instincts and giant instinct seems cool with the damage they could put out and the reach they can get, I was wondering how often your larger size (if you go that route) or your larger weapon becomes a problem like not having enough room to swing that big weapon around or enough room to go large or huge, In the published adventures that is.Large weapons never cause problems. Aside from extra damage and Clumsy they are treated mechanically just like medium ones, and Reach weapons no longer have problems in close spaces.
One quick question on large weapons: I know in PF1, weapons increased their damage dice if they were larger (a large longsword did more on average than a medium one). I've heard people reference the same in PF2, but can't find it in the rules. Am I just blind or does the extra damage for giant barbarians simply come from their increased rage bonus?
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One quick question on large weapons: I know in PF1, weapons increased their damage dice if they were larger (a large longsword did more on average than a medium one). I've heard people reference the same in PF2, but can't find it in the rules. Am I just blind or does the extra damage for giant barbarians simply come from their increased rage bonus?
It's just from Giant Instinct and Rage. For anyone else, wielding oversized weapons just adds Clumsy with no benefits.
Now, some other Class or Archetype might get additional stuff letting oversized weapons be useful, but they remain useless absent such abilities.
One quick question on large weapons: I know in PF1, weapons increased their damage dice if they were larger (a large longsword did more on average than a medium one). I've heard people reference the same in PF2, but can't find it in the rules. Am I just blind or does the extra damage for giant barbarians simply come from their increased rage bonus?It's just from Giant Instinct and Rage. For anyone else, wielding oversized weapons just adds Clumsy with no benefits.
Now, some other Class or Archetype might get additional stuff letting oversized weapons be useful, but they remain useless absent such abilities.
Thanks, just making sure since the CRB can be a bit muddled at times in terms of finding everything.
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Don't forget this- DO NOT ASSUME ANYTHING based off of PF1.
Sneak attack doubles on crits in PF2, for instance. But I didn't know that for, like, 2 months. I just assumed it didn't.
so you dont have to go large of huge if you don't want to?
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Ok Ty. So I'm thinking of doing a
Mountain Dwarf: Anvil Dwarf Heritage
Barbarian Giant Instinct. Background Local Scion (from age of ashes players guide)
stats would be: -dwarf: 2-CON,2-WIS,2-STR(free).-Background: 2-CON,
2-STR(free). -Class: Barbarian 2-STR. 4 form character creation:
2-STR,2-DEX,2-CON, I was thinking either 2-WIS for saves and Perception checks, INT for more skills, or CHA to offset the -2CHA and take the Intimidation skill.
so it would be STR:18, DEX:12, CON:16, INT:10 or 12, WIS:12 or 14, CHA:8 or 10
Barb Feat: Sudden Charge, Ancestry Feat: I'm thinking either Dwarven Weapon Familiarity(for Dwarven WarAxe), or Avenge in Glory,Rock Runner, or Stonecunning. With the anvil dwarf and local scion i get 3 choices for Specialty Crafting 2 from dwarf and 1 from background.
Skills: Athletics(T),Craft(T),Perception(E),Intimidation(T){I know its not going to be that high either way I go with my CHA},
Breachill Lore(T),Survival(T){I know I can put into stealth instead but I don't see him sneaking around he's more the guy that walk right down the center of the road yelling come an get me.
Rurik Dûnhark is second generation from a small clan of mountain dwarves that settled in the Breachill area after gaining some fame in a previous years Call for Heroes, besides begin as good if not better then some dwarfs (in the minds of the Dûnhark's) in the Martial aspect of being a Dwarf they are very skilled in Stone,Wood, and Metal, Now some of the Oldsters have had kids who are eager to make a name for them selves in a Call of Heroes.
Anything I missed for a 1st level build?, any suggestions on what to choose at higher level I know being a dwarf that the toughness and Mountain's Stoutness is a real good combo. I had also thought of a human or half orc with Ulfen Raider background and the Viking Shieldbearer ancestry feat and making sure his CHA was a little higher and go maybe Dragon Instinct or Fury(and get sudden charge and Raging Intimidation){I know that the Fury Instinct is sub par} and the Intimidation feats.
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Ok Ty. So I'm thinking of doing a
Mountain Dwarf: Anvil Dwarf Heritage
Barbarian Giant Instinct. Background Local Scion (from age of ashes players guide)
stats would be: -dwarf: 2-CON,2-WIS,2-STR(free).-Background: 2-CON,
2-STR(free). -Class: Barbarian 2-STR. 4 form character creation:
2-STR,2-DEX,2-CON, I was thinking either 2-WIS for saves and Perception checks, INT for more skills, or CHA to offset the -2CHA and take the Intimidation skill.
If you want a sword-and-board build, then I'm not sure barbarian is the best choice, even if you get the Shield Block feat.
While Intimidation and Demoralize are great, they do require better CHA than your PC has. I'd play a human instead of a dwarf if you decide to go that route.
And if you want to use Crafting during your Downtime, I recommend boosting INT.
Do you know what book sources are allowed by your GM, or what party composition will be?
The core rule book, lost omens character & world guide and age of ashes player guide. And ty for telling me about the crafting I'm coming from playing D&D 5e were u just had to be proficient in the crafting tool and didn't have to do checks, I was mainly thinking that the 3 craft specialties from anvil dwarf and local scion which would be blacksmithing, stonemasonary, and woodworking would really help according to the age of ashes player guide your going to be getting a the fort which will have to be rebuilt I'll probably put the 4th stat boost from lvl 1 into INT then to make it a 12 at 1st.
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Given your goals of being a front-line warrior that can Repair Citadel Altearin, I recommend a different class, background, and spread of Ability Scores.
Ability Score Modifiers: STR 4, CON 2, DEX 0, WIS 2, INT 2, CHA -1
The high STR gives good melee accuracy and damage, while the god CON and WIS means your character has great Will, Fortitude and Perception. You don't need DEX if you wear heavy armor (see below) and a your PC doesn't *need* CHA. Let your party members specialize in that. When the time comes to boost your Ability Scores, choose STR, CON, WIS, and INT.
Class: Champion or Fighter
These classes are trained in heavy armor which means you can leave DEX at 0 without lowering your AC or tanking your Reflex save. Get Plate Armor ASAP.
Background: Artisan or Tinker
These backgrounds will give you Specialty Crafting, same as Local Scion, but also let you have the ability score array above. IMHO a starting with a 16 on a non-Key Ability Score is too high and leads to weirdness at Level 20. If you don't agree, or really like the Local Scion background, then go ahead and keep it.
So, to sum up:
Excellent summary.
So, to sum up:
I suggest you to choose between a Champion or a Fighter.
Or combine the two:
Fighter1 reactive shield
1 If human: natural ambition - Exacting strike
2 Champion ded
4 Anything
5 Gnome Flickmace (work very nice for a Paladin indeed).
6 Champion reactiion
8 Quick shield block
9 Divine ally blade
10 combat reflexes
12 Paragon guard
Advantage: Better attack (but worse AC), also affects retributive strike.
More fighter options (exacting strike is nice, maybe double slice)
Attack of opportunity
Same quick block as paladin at 8.
Extra reaction for AoA at 10
Auto shield raise at 12 (paladin at 20)
Paragons guard is very nice at 12, action economy, where Champion gets that only at 20. Of course, Champion also has nice stuff at 10+. Depends on what you want.
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Thanks for your help I went with the dwarf barb I dropped doing intimidate with him, h works out quite well hits like a truck, and get hit back like that in return, Were level 2 now and that nice bump in Hp
is going to help alot got knocked down twice and one of those i was close to being Dead, So I've been locking and other classes and builds just in case was wondering wat all of you think about a Fighter dual wielding Shield and some offhand probably and agile one, I know the shield with have to a a spike or shield boss on it maybe something like a hatchet with its agile, sweep, and throwing. Thats all i could come with it popped into m head as I was falling asleep so any fillers would be nice Ancestries,Class,Background,skills and feats besides shield which off hand. Oh I jst thouhgt of somthing can shield even be use a a weapon like this and still be set for doing the shield bock, If u cant do it effectivly maybe a good sword and board build then
TY and sorry for the weird post an such 4:am here and half a sleep but ned to ask these question to get rid of the ear worm so i can sleep. :_)
I was wondering defense wise how durable are dual wielding rangers I'm playing a giant instinct Barbarian and have a few close calls so far and em getting a just in case replacement in the works.
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And actually a giant instinct barbarian suffers a -2 AC penalty (1 for Rage, 1 for Clumsy).
As for what to play that would give more defense, a lot is also going to depend on your group make up. As HumbleGamer says, most classes can get to the same AC, but their durability will ultimately depend on whether or not there's somebody in the group able to take hits. Champion is probably the best defensive class (though monks are pretty much right there too), and a dwarven Champ is going to be pretty close to the barbarian in terms of HP too. They will give up a bit of offense though to achieve that. Some of that (like with the fighter) can be made up in reactions though.
Ultimately, if you do end up going with a new character, I would suggest just trying to find something that looks fun to play with the group you have. After all, the ultimate goal is to have fun! If you do, then you did it right.
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Defensively, in terms of martial classes, Rogues are in last place with mediocre AC and bad HP. Above them are Rangers and Barbarians, with which is ahead depending on various specific factors (ie: Giant Instinct is below basically all Rangers, Animal Instinct is probably above all Rangers). Above them are Fighters, then Monks, and then Champions at the very top.
So...yes, Ranger is probably more defensive than a Giant Instinct Barbarian, but that's not saying much. The only Martial Class less defensive is Rogue (and, really, with Giant Instinct even that is arguable).
Sure, the ranger and barbarian get medium armor proficiency, but medium armor isn't better than light armor. Both max out at +5 total from armor and Dex. What medium armor does is let you cover for non-maxed Dex with Strength instead, or possibly take a penalty to certain skills.
One should add that even if individual armor types may be equal in AC they are not at all equal regarding the runes they are going to accept.
Fortification rune (12+): Medium or heavy armor only.
Invisibility (8+): Light armor only.
Shadow (5+): Light or nonmetallic medium armor only.
This means that even if light and medium armor provide the same AC bonus early on, medium armor eventually will become the better defensive tool in the late game.
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Hit points yes, but rogue armor proficiency is the same as the barbarian's, and the ranger is only ahead at levels 11 and 12 (rangers get armor expertise at level 11, rogues and barbarians at 13).
I'm aware of all this, and of light armor being as good as medium in terms of AC. I described their armor as 'mediocre' which is also how I'd describe Rangers and Barbarians.
I also strongly disagree that Barbarians won't hit their Dex Cap for armor. Their Dex cap is, for the most part, +1. Barbarians having Dex less than 12 throughout their careers are such a small minority as to not be worth talking about.
I think 4 HP per level and some damage resistance is probably better than +1 AC, and that's why I put Barbarians above Rogues (since those are their respective defensive advantages). Animal Instinct specifically can also equal Ranger AC (or, between 6th and 10th levels, actually exceed it...they fall behind at 11th and 12th, then equal out from 13th onward), on top of using a shield at no penalty, while maintaining their greater HP and damage resistance, which is why I said with those two Classes it depends on build.
It's arguable that Giant Instinct specifically is worse than Rogue, defensively, but I think that's the only real argument to make with my initial ratings.
I was wondering in regards the transferring rune from one weapon or armor to another can that be done with the Specific Magic weapons and armor? I.E. lets say a dwarven thrower(which is warhammer) being transferred to a dwarven waraxe?
I was wondering in regards the transferring rune from one weapon or armor to another can that be done with the Specific Magic weapons and armor? I.E. lets say a dwarven thrower(which is warhammer) being transferred to a dwarven waraxe?
The specific abilities are tied to the item but the fundamental runes work the same
So it would just the the +2 and striking not the If you’re a dwarf, a dwarven thrower functions for you as a +2 greater striking returning warhammer with the thrown 30 feet trait, and your attacks with the hammer deal 1d8 additional damage against giants, part of the Dwarven thrower?
So Were just finishing up book one of Age of Ashes we had a group wipe In the Goblinblood Caves at I'm sure most know by what (I'm not gonna do to big of a spoiler) we head back into the cave with fresh new guys there hook is we were going the breachill but are travels slowed us down and were late we come across the guard house outside the gob cave and the bodies are other group tossed into the shack and decided to go check the cave out and we end up fight the same dude again when it looks like the out come is going to be the same again are GM decides the change the encounter to a normal one of the guy with 2 hob gob followers the difficulty of the encounter is the same. It was still hard but know one died. The got me to thinking the 2nd adventure path book Isn't going to be in the same area as the 1st book and was wondering which Ancestries and backgrounds would be suggested for a replacement character for book 2 if my character die's again? I was thinking maybe a Champions of Abadar(A Judge Dredd like guy) or Sarenrae both would be Paladin don't know race for either, or maybe a sorcerer maybe gnome fey bloodline, or dragon or Elemental and do him mostly a blaster? My guy that died was a Dwarf Giant Instinct Barbarian I had started him out the gate as wanting to swing a big 2 handed wepn for massive damage but the soon made me take shield block at 3rd level and was waiting to take dwarf weapon feat so i could go waraxe and shield just didn't survive long enough to do it, the guy I'm doing now is a half orc flurry Ranger i rolled random for main hand weapon which is flail and picked Main-gauche for off hand sense i have the twin parry with my dwarf all was fight with a -2 to ac I wanted to get a higher ac. I just don't know if i want to do another front line warrior sense I did 2 already, any suggestions of a ranged build either with spell or none anyone can give me for a back up just incase character.
Thank you for reading and Replying if you do :-)
I also strongly disagree that Barbarians won't hit their Dex Cap for armor. Their Dex cap is, for the most part, +1. Barbarians having Dex less than 12 throughout their careers are such a small minority as to not be worth talking about.
Heck, with an Armored Skirt, they can comfortably have a Dex Cap of +0. They've got the Strength to ignore the extra check penalty, even with the increase, as well as the extra Bulk. The works drawback is the Noisy trait, so they might as well stick with Chainmail to save a couple of gold.
I also strongly disagree that Barbarians won't hit their Dex Cap for armor. Their Dex cap is, for the most part, +1. Barbarians having Dex less than 12 throughout their careers are such a small minority as to not be worth talking about.Heck, with an Armored Skirt, they can comfortably have a Dex Cap of +0. They've got the Strength to ignore the extra check penalty, even with the increase, as well as the extra Bulk. The works drawback is the Noisy trait, so they might as well stick with Chainmail to save a couple of gold.
So, I've seen a couple of people use Armored Skirt, and I cannot for the life of me fathom why. All it does is make your Armor Noisy.
A Chain Shirt + Armored Skirt is exactly the same as Hide or Scale Mail, except more expensive, Noisy, and has no Armor Group.
A Barbarian doesn't have Heavy Armor Proficiency, so they can't use it with any other type of Armor, but the same thing happens with Breast Plate, Chain Mail and Scale Mail.
Breast Plate and Chain Mail both become +5 Heavy Armor with a DEX Cap of +0, making them worse than all other Heavy Armors. Scale Mail becomes Heavy Chain Mail, except with a higher Check Penalty.
Why would anyone ever spend money to make their Armor objectively worse?
Defensively, in terms of martial classes, Rogues are in last place with mediocre AC and bad HP. Above them are Rangers and Barbarians, with which is ahead depending on various specific factors (ie: Giant Instinct is below basically all Rangers, Animal Instinct is probably above all Rangers). Above them are Fighters, then Monks, and then Champions at the very top.
So...yes, Ranger is probably more defensive than a Giant Instinct Barbarian, but that's not saying much. The only Martial Class less defensive is Rogue (and, really, with Giant Instinct even that is arguable).
Mostly agree, but I think Monk is the most overall defensive class since it excels at all areas of defense; great hp, great AC, great saves, exceptional mobility. Champion has slightly better AC, but can't beat that overall package.
Where champion does beat Monk is in tanking, where the class is the undisputed kings and queens. Monks can hold their own here via Stand Still, but aren't nearly as effective at this as Champions.
I missed that armored skirt + medium armor means you need to use the heavy armor proficiency. My bad.
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Mostly agree, but I think Monk is the most overall defensive class since it excels at all areas of defense; great hp, great AC, great saves, exceptional mobility. Champion has slightly better AC, but can't beat that overall package.
Where champion does beat Monk is in tanking, where the class is the undisputed kings and queens. Monks can hold their own here via Stand Still, but aren't nearly as effective at this as Champions.
I was mostly just talking about defending against actual attacks, not spells, and not thinking about Saves. If taking Saves into account, it's arguable that Fighter and Champion should get a downgrade since they have worse Saves than the other martials on the list (this'd put Fighters on par with Rangers, and Monks definitively above Champions). I'm not sure whether I'd do that, but it's certainly defensible.
And Saves aside, it's still a fair point. I'm not sure I entirely agree, since it ignores shields, which Champions have some inherent bonuses with over Monks, but I'm not inclined to argue with any analysis as long as it puts Monk and Champion as the two top defensive Classes.
I was wondering if the Trick Magic item Feat would allow someone to use a holy avenger and not be a champion or is evil, Or a non dwarf to use a Dwarven Thrower to its full +2 greater striking returning warhammer with the thrown 30 feet trait, and your attacks with the hammer deal 1d8 additional damage against giants? or is it just for getting a person to use wands,scrolls, staves and such with out being a spell caster or for a spell caster to trick the item that he is that casting tradition?
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Sort of.
Trick Magic Item specifically interacts with spending actions to Activate items. It doesn't work for other purposes. So, if you're Evil and have a Holy Avenger you're still enfeebled 2 and don't do anything special to enemies on a crit, but you can use Trick Magic Item to use the 'Paladin only' activated ability of the item.
It doesn't help with the Dwarven Thrower at all, since that has no activated abilities.
Question with my google search for animal companions(assuming horse or so other capable animal for mounts) and the steed ally is taking the ride general feat which says.
-When you Command an Animal you’re mounted on to take a move action (such as Stride), you automatically succeed instead of needing to attempt a check. Any animal you’re mounted on acts on your turn, like a minion. If you Mount an animal in the middle of an encounter, it skips its next turn and then acts on your next turn. Do you need this feat? or sense the steed ally and animal companion act as minions is it not needed? ( at least I think steed ally does, it late and in a little sleepy).
So on my latest game session of the Age of Ashes I had my current character a half orc Flurry dual wield ranger die, and now I'm thinking of doing a Dwarven Warpriest of Trudd I'd fight with a warhammer and shield was thinking of doing healing and buff spells. I was also thinking of going the champion dedication. Any suggestion would be greatly appreciated the build is for 7th level.
With warpriest going champion dedication is the only way to get higher then trained in armor the 14th level dedication feat diverse armor expert and is there anyway to get to master? Or would going Bastion with medium armor or going Sentinel give you the better defensive capabilities?
I've also been looking at an Imperial blood sorcerer but Signature Spells is throwing me a little do I as a 7th level sorcerer get 4 Signature Spells one of 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and 4th? and could i say go magic missile, dispel magic, fireball, and with the 4th spell level one take Invisibility?
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So, I've seen a couple of people use Armored Skirt, and I cannot for the life of me fathom why. All it does is make your Armor Noisy.
A Chain Shirt + Armored Skirt is exactly the same as Hide or Scale Mail, except more expensive, Noisy, and has no Armor Group.
A Barbarian doesn't have Heavy Armor Proficiency, so they can't use it with any other type of Armor, but the same thing happens with Breast Plate, Chain Mail and Scale Mail.
Breast Plate and Chain Mail both become +5 Heavy Armor with a DEX Cap of +0, making them worse than all other Heavy Armors. Scale Mail becomes Heavy Chain Mail, except with a higher Check Penalty.
Why would anyone ever spend money to make their Armor objectively worse?
Medium armor + armored skirt gets you heavy armor that is -1 AC compared to default heavy armor but retains the only -5ft speed reduction of medium armor. It might be worth it if you want the heavy effects of Armor Specialization but stay more mobile (or have some other abilities that favor heavy armor).
With warpriest going champion dedication is the only way to get higher then trained in armor the 14th level dedication feat diverse armor expert and is there anyway to get to master? Or would going Bastion with medium armor or going Sentinel give you the better defensive capabilities?
There's no way to reach Master defense on a Warpriest.
Both Champion Dedication and Sentinel can get you Expert in heavy armour. Sentinel does so a little more efficiently, but Champion offers Lay on Hands, Shield Ally and Champions Reaction, all of which are very powerful options.
I've also been looking at an Imperial blood sorcerer but Signature Spells is throwing me a little do I as a 7th level sorcerer get 4 Signature Spells one of 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and 4th? and could i say go magic missile, dispel magic, fireball, and with the 4th spell level one take Invisibility?
You are correct. I don't recommend magic missile as a signature spell, since you'll basically never want to cast it at its base level- something like fear is a better choice.