I have yet to hear of any disruptive goblin players.Makes me want to cosplay a goblin while playing whatever I'm playing, to show there's non disrupting goblin players.
Wouldn't you need to dress up a small child to do that?
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Well, the only openly cannibalistic character I've seen so far in PFS2 was a goblin.
Other than that, though, PFS2 has brought in an influx of completely new players, and they haven't seemed to show much interest in playing a goblin. So far, I've seen just the one I mentioned, plus one pregen. At least locally, people weren't as excited to play goblins as at first seemed.
That being said, I haven't seen any paladins/champions armed with a "Holier Than Thou" attitude either.
Venture-Captain, Missouri—Columbia
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Haven't seen any goblins driving away any players. In fact, I don't see that many goblins in online or meatspace games. I do see a lot of new players enjoying PFS2 though.
What else? Oh yes, I haven't seen Paizo go bankrupt because of Pathfinder 2. I also haven't seen Pathfinder 2 become a total failure with scads of players abandoning the game for something else.
My PFS2 lodges have doubled in size as the direct result of PFS2. The Online Region seems to be growing as more players, both veteran and brand new take a look at the actual rules instead of the hate posts by people who haven't read the PF2 rules.
So much for the doom and gloom predictions of the folks who hate change.
Premier Event Coordinator
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That charisma penalty makes it a bit less likely for me to want to build a dwarf champion.
Of course it will depend on exactly how you intend to build your character, but I find that a lower Charisma has very little impact on a champion unless you intend to cast a lot of spells and even then it really only affects offensive magic. YMMV
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Premier Event Coordinator
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I’ve seen quite a few goblins in 2E play. I don’t recall a single table without one and roughly half my tables have had 2-3 of them. None of them have been disruptive. They might have some unusual habits, but nothing that has interfered with play. I’m still disappointed with the change in their theme because the original Pathfinder goblin is one of the features that I enjoyed most about the campaign, but not so much to make me want to quit now that they have lost their “character.”
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I indeed have not seen a single Lawful Good Dwarf Paladin of Torag.
Win-win?
So let me tell you the story of mine! I've spent 3 years writing it down. So, his name is Thrugin Willowshield, he comes from a proud clan that lives in the mountains, he got his hammer from his father, also a Paladin of Torag and then he set out to destroy evil! He speaks with a Scottish accent, drinks a lot of beer and thinks elves are womanly wussies! Also, when he attacks, his battle cry is "FOR JUSTICE!". I actually want to send his story to Paizo because he's a fascinating character and he could make his way into some rulebook one day! Whaddya think?
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So let me tell you the story of mine! I've spent 3 years writing it down. So, his name is Thrugin Willowshield, he comes from a proud clan that lives in the mountains, he got his hammer from his father, also a Paladin of Torag and then he set out to destroy evil! He speaks with a Scottish accent, drinks a lot of beer and thinks elves are womanly wussies! Also, when he attacks, his battle cry is "FOR JUSTICE!". I actually want to send his story to Paizo because he's a fascinating character and he could make his way into some rulebook one day! Whaddya think?I indeed have not seen a single Lawful Good Dwarf Paladin of Torag.
Win-win?
Plot twist, he’s a Leshy.
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Plot twist, he’s a Leshy.So let me tell you the story of mine! I've spent 3 years writing it down. So, his name is Thrugin Willowshield, he comes from a proud clan that lives in the mountains, he got his hammer from his father, also a Paladin of Torag and then he set out to destroy evil! He speaks with a Scottish accent, drinks a lot of beer and thinks elves are womanly wussies! Also, when he attacks, his battle cry is "FOR JUSTICE!". I actually want to send his story to Paizo because he's a fascinating character and he could make his way into some rulebook one day! Whaddya think?I indeed have not seen a single Lawful Good Dwarf Paladin of Torag.
Win-win?
*takes notes*
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Anybody else seen an uptick in disruptive play from players who are playing goblin characters? Maybe it's just that my play style differs greatly from the style in my new location, but I don't find it particularly enjoyable to spend my time cleaning up after a character that, in pf1, would've been arrested in the first act.
I haven't had the negative experience yet but I know it's come up locally. I always point people to the Community Behavior Policy, specifically this line
"We ask all participants to respect their fellow players and to work together to create positive memorable experiences."
If afterward anyone is still of the opinion of "but my character" that is when I'll go up the chain.
Venture-Captain, Wisconsin—Franklin
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The Goblin RP I've seen at my PFS tables has largely been more like Kender from Dragonlance and less like cannibal pyromaniacs. It's been about as disruptive as PF1 clerics of evil gods, occasionally annoying or problematic but mostly silly and good for the narrative.
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Venture-Captain, Online—VTT
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The Goblin RP I've seen at my PFS tables has largely been more like Kender from Dragonlance and less like cannibal pyromaniacs.With all due respect but isn't that worst? O.o
Would 100% take cannibal pyromaniacs over kender.
(But yes, most goblins I've seen, and I hope my own, have been more funny and interesting roleplay than disruptive.)
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Premier Event Coordinator
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Like most things I think it boils down to roleplay vs cinematic. If cannibalism, or slavery, or prostitution, or whatever is happening off screen merely for the amusement of the player, who really cares. If it’s being described in detail and forced upon the entire table, then it could quickly become at best tiresome and at worst offensive.
I think most of us agree that disruptive play is not caused by game rules, but by disruptive players and they’ll do it regardless of the character being played. Yes, goblins are a tool easily perverted into disruptive play, but they are not the cause. If a player is pressing into disruptive play, simply ask them to stop. In that moment, you will usually understand their motivations and willingness to be a community supporter.
As always, if it becomes a problem, escalate the issue to the event organizer or your local venture-officer team. The health of the community is paramount and more important than the right of an individual to “that’s just what my character would do.”
Explore! Report! Cooperate!
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I have never been a big fan of the idea of goblins and gameplay, but during the play test I had somebody I was at a table with play one in a fun and interesting way I really liked. At the end of the night they apologized because they were of the mindset they got it completely wrong by playing a goblin that way. Since then I just avoid tables with goblins.
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During that gap before this thread was revived, I played my first PFS2 character, a goblin redeemer champion of Sarenrae, up to 2nd level. Most of my inspiration for him comes from 1. those couple of late PFS1 adventures that feature non-murder-hobo goblins that I mentioned last year, and 2. seeing Valais Durant (possibly my favorite recurring NPC in all of PFS1) as a faction leader, because of her "redeemed monster" backstory. Thibdab's whole schtick is that he is trying to be a living example of a properly heroic warrior to his own kind as well as other Pathfinders. He's a lot of fun, but I haven't been able to play him in a while because there is just not a lot of demand for PFS2 yet in our immediate area, except at cons.
My daughter, OTOH, has a charismatic goblin rogue who is much more on the bloodthirsty side and does occasionally need a strong hand to keep him out of trouble. But she's had some years to see how unwelcome disruptive players of any kind are, so has ample examples of what to avoid herself. She's always careful to make sure her more sketchy characters still play well with others.
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Venture-Captain, California—Sacramento
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My daughter plays a goblin cleric of Sarenrae who has extended Sarenrae's teaching of "Everyone deserves a second chance" to apply to all the junk humans throw away on a regular basis. (She is a junkcrafter and a radical recycler.)
I play a spirit rage barbarian chef who is trying to overturn the stereotype that goblins eat gross trash by learning to prepare the rarest and most subtle flavor of all, incorporeal meat.
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Venture-Captain, California—Sacramento
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has there been a book about it outside of PFS ?Does the history presented in the Core Rulebook not suffice?
It is also covered in some depth in the lost omens character guide, with specific references to the *several* tribes that have integrated into human society over the years.
Also covered in lost omens world guide, though it is less centralized there. For example.
The Isgeri are not, however, the only ones to carry scars from the Goblinblood Wars. The goblins themselves paid a terrible price for their short-lived triumph. Not only were they massacred by the thousands in the final battles, but the victorious armies—and later, vengeful Isgeri survivors—burned great swaths of the Chitterwood to destroy the goblins’ homes. From these hardships, a new strain of goblin leadership has emerged. Several goblin chieftains, brighter and longer-sighted than their predecessors, have formed an alliance between their tribes and made diplomatic overtures to nearby Isgeri settlements. Given that the war’s wounds remain raw, the tribes’ progress is slow, but they have established some mutual defense agreements with nearby towns, and they have begun to change how goblins are perceived in the region. Isger’s rural towns and villages, accustomed to making their own decisions without any help from a disinterested central government, have found some of these goblins to be more reliable allies than their own nominal lords.
This shift in relations is driven by need. Undead have long bedeviled this land, particularly in remote places such as Finder’s Gulch and the plague-ravaged ruins of Gillamoor, where rotting and ravening zombies stalk through the crumbling houses of the dead. Urgathoan cults proliferate among blood-soaked battlefields and the blackened remains of torched villages, feeding on the fear and pain that still linger in those haunted sites. These malign forces have grown stronger and more numerous since the Goblinblood Wars and, some say, since Tar-Baphon’s rise. Whether or not that rumor is true, it is certain that neither goblins nor humans can afford to ignore the rising tide of undead in Isger’s hinterlands much longer.
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Venture-Captain, Online—VTT
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My own problem with that ultimately is the narrative having been insufficiently brought on in the year 10 PFS1 campaign. One scenario seriously dealt with it but as goblins are an important part of the story, could have been more (a series of scenarios from 1-5 to 7-11 tiers, wouldn't have said no). Outside of that scenario, there's the last We be Goblins, has there been a book about it outside of PFS ?
I strongly recommend reading Michaels post here.
Goblins have been positioned as being able to sometimes be better and not the Rise of the Runelords version for a long time, going back many many seasons of PFS.
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Kobold seemed much more setup for it in society though, storywise.
And just general societal norms (lawful) as well. Kobolds for tight knit communities - yes, xenophobic - but they at least have a basis for supporting the community being a strong force. goblins (chaotic) will eat their own tribesmen if they get antsy.