# Heroic Recovery Question

### Rules Discussion

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There seems to be a contradiction in the rules on using hero points to stabilize:

Page 460: "If you have at least 1 Hero Point (page 467), you can spend all of your remaining Hero Points at the start of your turn or when your dying value would increase in order to return to 1 Hit Point, no matter how close to death you are."

Page 467: "Spend all your Hero Points (minimum 1) to avoid death. You can do this when your dying condition would increase. You lose the dying condition entirely and stabilize with 0 Hit Points."

So... the question is, do you return to 1 Hit Point, or 0 Hit Points?

Zero means you are dying, right? No such thing as negatives?

If so, then 1.

One case is when you are in the dying condition, the second is when you would reach dying 4 and because of that die for real.

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Stone Dog wrote:
Zero means you are dying, right? No such thing as negatives?

No, on page 460, you can be at 0 Hit Points and unconscious but not dying. For example, if you succeed at enough recovery checks to lose your dying condition, you are at 0 Hit Points and unconscious.

Kyrone wrote:
One case is when you are in the dying condition, the second is when you would reach dying 4 and because of that die for real.

I'm not seeing that distinction... both statements seem to include both of those scenarios...

Can you be 1 HP and still have the dying condition? If so, that’s the difference.

I'm not seeing that distinction... both statements seem to include both of those scenarios...

In dying 1,2 and 3 at the start of the turn or when increasing the value of the dying condition between them you spend all your hero points to go back to 1HP.

When you would go from dying 3 to dying 4 where you would die for real you spend all your hero points to just stabilize at 0HP.

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Xenocrat wrote:
Can you be 1 HP and still have the dying condition? If so, that’s the difference.

Using Hero Point(s) removes the dying condition, so it can still be 0 or 1 Hit Point.

Kyrone wrote:

In dying 1,2 and 3 at the start of the turn or when increasing the value of the dying condition between them you spend all your hero points to go back to 1HP.

When you would go from dying 3 to dying 4 where you would die for real you spend all your hero points to just stabilize at 0HP.

I can kind of see this interpretation, but "or when your dying value would increase in order to return to 1 Hit Point, no matter how close to death you are" implies from going from Dying 2 or 3 to Dying 4. "You can do this when your dying condition would increase" seems to include going to Dying 2 or 3 as well. I don't know, I also just don't think they would over-complicate things with that distinction after all the revisions the Death & Dying rules went through during the playtest. Not saying you may not be right... I'm just feeling it was a missed edit more than anything.

Edit: I just checked the GM Screen, and it states 0 Hit Points...

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I think the error is on Pg. 460, it seems like a holdover from the Playtest and something they missed in the final edit. However, I actually hope it is the other way around and does grant 1 hit point. Using a Hero Point should be a Heroic 'recovery' not a Heroic stabilization.

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Scott Yauger wrote:
I think the error is on Pg. 460, it seems like a holdover from the Playtest and something they missed in the final edit. However, I actually hope it is the other way around and does grant 1 hit point. Using a Hero Point should be a Heroic 'recovery' not a Heroic stabilization.

I actually like it better if it only stabilizes you, since RAW you get a lot of Hero Points anyway (at least one per session). It is quite strong even if it only stabilizes.

Do Hero Points carry over to the next session if you don't use them?

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mrspaghetti wrote:
Do Hero Points carry over to the next session if you don't use them?

What does your heart tell you?

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mrspaghetti wrote:
Do Hero Points carry over to the next session if you don't use them?

No. They are a per session resource.

Of course, I suppose that even that would be up to GM discretion if you do something weird such as end a session in mid-combat.

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David knott 242 wrote:
mrspaghetti wrote:
Do Hero Points carry over to the next session if you don't use them?

No. They are a per session resource.

Of course, I suppose that even that would be up to GM discretion if you do something weird such as end a session in mid-combat.

They carry over in Oblivion Oath.

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AnCap Dawg wrote:
David knott 242 wrote:
mrspaghetti wrote:
Do Hero Points carry over to the next session if you don't use them?

No. They are a per session resource.

Of course, I suppose that even that would be up to GM discretion if you do something weird such as end a session in mid-combat.

They carry over in Oblivion Oath.

Yes, but this is per GM fiat. Keep in mind that the Hero (and Villain) Points in Oblivion Oath are granted by viewers. It would be a shame to buy a Hero Point for someone and then have it disappear unused at the end of a session because no fitting situation came up.

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I was reading this one straight from the book, but since everything about hero points is up to the GM, a GM could certainly treat two sessions as one if he wants to.

But remember that a separate episode is not necessarily the same thing as a separate session. Did they actually stop playing for a day or more and come back with the same number of hero points (and not a reset)?

Actual query here, are people thinking hero points are worth the hassle?

Again, actually asking this it is not rhetorical.

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The Gleeful Grognard wrote:

Actual query here, are people thinking hero points are worth the hassle?

Again, actually asking this it is not rhetorical.

They are worth the hassle as another tool in the player's arsenal. Whether used for a re-roll or avoiding death they empower the player and allow for the story line to continue. Anything that allows the player to determine the character's destiny is good for the game.

The Gleeful Grognard wrote:

Actual query here, are people thinking hero points are worth the hassle?

Again, actually asking this it is not rhetorical.

The occasional re-roll is nice to have. I usually forget about them at the time I need them though. I'm hoping I can at least think of them if my character's dying.

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AnCap Dawg wrote:
The Gleeful Grognard wrote:

Actual query here, are people thinking hero points are worth the hassle?

Again, actually asking this it is not rhetorical.

The occasional re-roll is nice to have. I usually forget about them at the time I need them though. I'm hoping I can at least think of them if my character's dying.

I would think either someone in your party or the GM would think to remind you

I don't like the per session or as 'perks' for out of game actions, but I do like the idea of some player based control of fate. So I'm keeping them in but changing how they are earned.