I would vote for the spell creates a new body. Edited to say its like death from old age so the spell would fail.
I'd say it doesn't work. The original android has died of old age.
It should probably be ruled as old age, to prevent issues, but a reset doesn't have to be from old age.
This reset is voluntary; androids once rebelled against their masters to classify a manual renewal as murder.
So, a young android could also reset, if they so choose. It would probably be analogous to suicide. Also there was a way to force a renewal on an android, and we are given no indication that this method wouldn't still work.
My ruling would be if the body has been inhabited by a new soul, that the old soul has passed through Pharasma's judgement, and on to the outer planes. Thus, the spell fails...
Being that renewal only takes a couple weeks, androids must have some sort of express lane through the afterlife. True Resurrection works on people who have been dead for over a century, implying that the usual time buffer is huge.
Old age. Doesn't work.
My ruling would be if the body has been inhabited by a new soul, that the old soul has passed through Pharasma's judgement, and on to the outer planes. Thus, the spell fails...
This is the most correct answer. The material we have available tells us that Pharasma often hold souls back from judgement because she knows if/when they will be brought back. If they've already been judged and moved on, they have lost most of their memories of life and most likely would not want to come back anyway, thus the spell fails.
But if renewal is the android equivalent of death by old age then True Res would fail regardless of the amount of time passed.
Going on the information on Archives of Nethys the only time a new soul enters the body of an android id during renewal:
an android’s cybernetic mind eventually shuts down and self-restarts after about a century, leaving its body vacant for several weeks as the old soul departs for its final reward in the Great Beyond and a fresh, new soul finds its way into the shell.
If you think the spell fails because of old age, androids’ souls shutting down does not have to be because of old age.
What are these other causes of shutting down to which you refer?
I have read it and I'm not seeing anything to suggest that an android shutting down in any other way bar renewal would result in a new soul entering the body.
In that specific instance I'd go with my first post and say it creates a new body.
Is renewal voluntary?
It is explicitly voluntary, and could be forced by others in ancient times.
Then it just seems like the spell would fail, since a soul has to be willing to return, right? If you've voluntarily moved on, hard to say you want to live.Is renewal voluntary?It is explicitly voluntary, and could be forced by others in ancient times.
Depends.... you could do it for logical reasons. Like you are about to drown and don’t want to suffer. And maybe you know your friends can fish you out soon and revive you.
It looks like there's voluntary renewal (which could be forced by others in ancient times) and renewal which occurs after the android's cybernetic mind shuts down after about a century. The former seems like suicide (or murder) and in this instance I would say True Res creates a new body; though if this is analogous to suicide or murder then it doesn't fit the OP's question unless suicide and murder are regarded as "natural". The latter renewal looks to be equivalent to death by old age and as such True Res would fail.
Here's a question: if during the two week period between shutdown and renewal a finger is removed from the android and then, after a new soul inhabitants the android husk a Resurrection spell is cast using the finger, what happens?
Edited for:
Character idea: an android spiritualist who’s phantasm was the former inhabitant prior to renewal.
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Planar Adventures added a bit to the part on why resurrections still work a long time after death. Basically, the Boneyard includes a lot of apartments where those temporarily dead hang out while waiting to get res'd. So, it you're destined to get True Resurrected a couple centuries from now, you wind up there for a while. If you're not, proceed to judgement.
Unfortunately, androids and psychic magic don’t mix very well without using feat taxes.
It's only the 1 feat they'd need to take, or they could take the Onmiyoji archetype.
Old age. Doesn't work.Read the thread please. This has already been disproven.
[original answer deleted]
Be more specific. Since you proposed the situation: why did the android in question die? If the android died because "an android’s cybernetic mind eventually shuts down and self-restarts after about a century", that would trigger the old age clause. If it died untimely and the body is now a different creature, true resurrection would simply create a new body, the same as if one tried to true resurrect a creature whose body was completely annihilated. Evil twin plot ensues.
I think the summation of arguments here is:
1) Renewal can be the equivalent to death from old age, which would make it invalid for True Res
2) Renewal could also be done at a young age, and possibly even forced on someone. In this case, the Renewal is unlike death from old age, and True Res should work.
So Renewal isn't death by old age all of the time...
Can it be both? Depending on circumstances? Maybe.
At the very least if I were having to GM this situation I would treat a willing renewal before the breakdown of mind as death not by old age, and would allow for True Res to work. Of course, any adventurer worth their salt would never die from old age, provided they wanted to go on living, as they can reincarnate into a new body. If you're especially powerful, you can probably wish to just be young again.
And if the Android is the victim of a Forced Reincarnation hex, will we end up with two living Androids when we're done?
In terms of any sort of reincarnate, almost certainly no.
The chances of coming back as what you were, is typically going to be low.
Also, why would there be two?
Forced reincarnation kills your body and reincarnates you in a new one.
The only scenario in which you have two androids is casting True Res on a an Android that went through Renewal that isn't equated to death from old age.
I've looked through android "reproduction" myself and almost none of the options ever pan out. It's really hard to turn 1 android into 2 permanent androids.
Also, why would there be two?Forced reincarnation kills your body and reincarnates you in a new one.
The only scenario in which you have two androids is casting True Res on a an Android that went through Renewal that isn't equated to death from old age.
Ah. That's what I was missing -- you get a new Android soul specifically at the renewal, not when you die with your body intact (as when some effect targets your life force).
You have to cast Resurrection on a body that's not occupied. For True Resurrection, any piece of an android such as a finger or toe would work. If they moved on, with no intention of coming back(that's why I'm going to have my corpse cremated), then the spell fails.
I'm going by the source material,"Ghost in the Shell". She can come back in any empty android body. Waste of a spell if you ask me.