Dhampir Mesmerist, so only one feat at Level 1. (Hey, +2 to Dex and casting stat, hard to say no.) Obviously a Mesmerist is never going to be great in melee, but I'm looking for a way to stay useful through the PFS levels (up to 11). Bonus points if I don't have to burn too many feats and gank my casting.
There's archetypes that help. The vexing daredevil uses feints a great deal (& gets many relevant feats as bonus feats), or the vexing trickster gets extra feats and abilities for mesmerist tricks. I think the trickster works better.
Weapon finesse and a 10+ strength allows you to deal damage with a finesse weapon. Painful stare allows a +1d6 damage because you did damage plus the normal bonus. Simple, easy and only 1 feat.
Divine Fighting Technique (Desna's Shooting Star) allows Cha to hit and damage with a starknife. Take the trait Varisian Tattoo and you get proficiency starknives. Add in painful stare and you're not doing bad.
Manifold Stare lets you use painful stare +1 times/rd. That means you can get the buffed up damage by dealing damage yourself AND do base extra damage on someone elses attack.
Intimidating Glance: Demoralize target of hypnotic stare as a swift action. It's a free chance to make your target shaken after 1st rd of hypnotic stare. If you've taken psychic inception bold stare, it can work on mindless creatures too.
Two world magic trait allows you to pick up a damaging ranged touch cantrip. You'll need point blank/precise shot it you're targets are foes in melee. Painful stare makes it 1d3 + 1d6 + 1/2 class damage: not bad for a cantrip.
If you expect undead to be prevalent, Spirit Walker archetype is quite nice. spells to affect undead, pseudo-undead creation, command undead...
If it wasn't PFS, Material Manipulator is nice as it adds Jolt [not allowed in PFS] for a damaging cantrip without spending a trait.
I dipped (metal) Oracle for armour and weapon proficiencies. Decent STR+Intense Pain+big weapon was decent damage. However, they weren't built primarily as a damage-dealer, but as a tank with several attack redirection and accuracy decreasing abilities.
There's archetypes that help. The vexing daredevil uses feints a great deal (& gets many relevant feats as bonus feats), or the vexing trickster gets extra feats and abilities for mesmerist tricks. I think the trickster works better.
The trickster seems built around using combat maneuvers and trick feats. Putting aside that I find the trick feats intensely annoying from a design POV, they're not great options for a 3/4 BAB class unless you've rolled free and have an unusually high Strength score. This is particularly true for a character like a dhampir that has no bonus feat: you're going to be feat-starved, and throwing your precious feats at combat maneuvers isn't usually a great investment because you don't have the other stuff that will make combat maneuvers work.
The daredevil, now, has real promise. You get to swing a martial weapon for real damage, woo. You get Improved Feint, woo. (Honestly, all Mesmerists should have this. But you're only giving up Touch Treatment, which is a pretty weak class ability.) Being able to bark-strip most opponents' Dex bonus is really nice, and it tends to scale with level unless you're fighting a lot of golems and such.
Giving up the Bold Stares is pretty painful and definitely weakens you as a caster and party support. OTOH, if you can consistently score hits, then Blinding Strike, Outmaneuver and Surprise Strike are all pretty good. Note the qualifying phrase, above. If you're going this route you need to have at least Str 14 and probably invest a feat in Weapon Focus. If you fail to hit, you're just standing there next to an angry monster. You have some tricks that can help, but once they're gone, you're in trouble.
That said, yeah, overall the Daredevil looks pretty promising.
As 6-level casters, Mesmerists really feel the loss of levels from dipping. So, no dips.
Doug M.
I see it the opposite. If we are only looking at PFS levels, so max of 11, we would lose the third bold stare, glib lie, and a couple spells per day/known. But most importantly still have access to 4th level spells with just 10 levels of Mesmerist.
Mesmerist lacks accuracy boost. This is what hurts them as a melee class. A one level dip in ID rager is the best option for accuracy boosts on a str build. A nagaji is a good option.
If not the above option I recommend enigma archetype. Invisibility is a good way to hit more often. You lose painful stare, intense pain and Manifold Stare, but you have a better chance to hit and a good defensive option.
Weapon finesse and a 10+ strength allows you to deal damage with a finesse weapon. Painful stare allows a +1d6 damage because you did damage plus the normal bonus. Simple, easy and only 1 feat.
Yeah, if you're not going daredevil finesse is a must-have.
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Divine Fighting Technique (Desna's Shooting Star) allows Cha to hit and damage with a starknife. Take the trait Varisian Tattoo and you get proficiency starknives. Add in painful stare and you're not doing bad.
I personally dislike the starknife a lot -- it's such an obviously silly weapon concept -- but mechanically, yeah, that works.
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Manifold Stare lets you use painful stare +1 times/rd. That means you can get the buffed up damage by dealing damage yourself AND do base extra damage on someone elses attack.
Okay, question. Am I reading this wrong, or can you use Manifold Stare twice on yourself? I mean, just reading the thing, it really looks like that's what it allows. And it's not even OP, really -- it's an extra d6 of damage per feat that you burn. Is this correct? It would explain why the feat specifically limits how and when it can be taken.
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Intimidating Glance: Demoralize target of hypnotic stare as a swift action. It's a free chance to make your target shaken after 1st rd of hypnotic stare. If you've taken psychic inception bold stare, it can work on mindless creatures too.
I wouldn't call this a melee combat option exactly, but yeah it's pretty powerful if you build into it. Take this with the Nightmare stare, throw full ranks into Intimidate, and you've got a pretty good chance of shutting down a lot of single enemies with one round of action: throw a spell that causes the shaken condition (Doom does nicely) then intimidate as a swift. If you succeed, boom, shaken + shaken = frightened and that combat is over.
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Two world magic trait allows you to pick up a damaging ranged touch cantrip. You'll need point blank/precise shot it you're targets are foes in melee. Painful stare makes it 1d3 + 1d6 + 1/2 class damage: not bad for a cantrip.
That's clever! Not sure it's worth a feat and a trait, but still clever.
Character concept: the mesmerist has to step up because the party lacks a better melee fighter. It's like, her and three wizards, or some such.
After racial modifiers, a 15 point build gives Str 12, Con 10, Dex 14, Int 10, Wis 12, Cha 17. (We could boost Str to 14, but we're going to want that 18 Cha at fourth level.) Vexing Daredevil archetype, and let's not screw around here: the chosen weapon is "greatsword" and the first feat is Weapon Focus: Greatsword. Attacking at +3 for 2d6+3 damage makes our girl a very respectable damage dealer at first level! Unfortunately, she's going to start with AC 15 (16 once she can afford that chain shirt) and just 8 hp. Worse yet, bought that greatsword with her first level trick, so no defensive tricks giving her a mirror image or autoheal. So, every combat starts with a quick "throw a spell or go to melee?" judgment call. This character will really benefit from having defensive buffers and healers on side..
Spells, there's a reason Dancing Lights, Daze, Charm Person and Sleep are classics. The Stare makes these a lot stronger! Of course, she's not that great against undead, oozes, vermin and such, and as for swarms, just run away. But that's first level for you.
Level 2, +1 BAB and hey her Will save just jumped from +3 to a very nice +6, or +8 against mind-affecting effects (dhampir). And she gets a trick! Obviously we will choose a defensive trick. The default is Mesmeric Mirror, but if there are no healers in the party then Psychosomatic Surge or Shadow Splinter look good too. For a new spell, we take Burst of Adrenaline; it's not perfectly optimized but it's thematic, and it's pretty cool to have Str 20 even if it's just for one round.
Level 3, okay now we're cooking. Improved Feint as a bonus feat. We take Skill Focus (Bluff) as the 3rd level feat. Yeah, I know, but we always want to win those feints. Bluff is now 3 class + 3 ranks + 3 Cha + 3 feat + 2 racial +1 Consummate Liar = +15. Meanwhile: Blinding Strike or Outmaneuver? I think our gal would love to hit and run a lot, but unless she has some way to boost her Acrobatics score, Outmaneuver is just a crapshoot -- there are a lot of CR 3-4 opponents with CMDs around 20, meaning even with the +4 bonus she'll eat an AoO about a third of the time. Until she gets some way to boost Acrobatics, Blinding Strike is better even if the save DC is low. (Just DC 14, and it's targeting Fort which is almost everything has as a good save. Well, it'll jump to DC 16 next level.)
She probably has a masterwork weapon, so she now hits at +6 for 3d6+2 damage against most opponents, plus almost always ignoring Dex bonus, plus a modest chance of blinding every round. It's not AM BARBARIAN, but it's very respectable for a non-melee character. AC and hp continue to be the big issues, along with "things that are immune to stares". Against an undead or a golem she's just hitting at 2d6+2 with no chance for blinding. That said, the character concept is not a solo fighter; presumably those three wizards can do something useful. New spell is Vanish, because 5' step + Vanish for when things go completely pear-shaped. "Burst of Adrenaline, I hit at +10 for 3d6+6, it's still standing? Okay, well I'm fatigued this round anyway..."
-- Okay, does this look like a reasonable start? Play it out a bit further?
Level 4: Second level spells! Suggestion and Eagle's Splendor. Stat bump! Cha up to 18. And a trick. Psychosomatic Surge and Mesmeric Mirror, take whichever one you didn't take at 2nd level.
Level 5: For your feat take Manifold Stare, allowing you to pile on another d6 of damage. Against foes who are affected by your stares, you now do 4d6+2 damage. You get Manifold Tricks (so, both your tricks are implanted at once, and also the Mirror now generates two duplicates). You get Mental Potency, which keeps Sleep and Color Spray useful for one more level. At this level you should be able to invest in a Cha-boosting item and probably a +1 weapon as well.
Level 6: You get another d6 of Painful Stare damage, so with your +1 sword you'll do 5d6+3 (!) every time you hit. You get Greater Feint, which lets everyone else get the benefit of your feint. You get another trick, and now you might as well take something that benefits the party: Gift of Will if there's someone with a bad Will save (yours is pretty amazing, it's probably around +11 /+13 against mind-affecting), Mesmeric Pantomime, or Shadow Splinter.
Level 7: Third level spells! And there are so many good ones -- Charm Monster, Deep Slumber (works up to 11 HD), Glibness if you want to boost your Bluff over the moon (doesn't work for feinting, alas), Loathsome Veil (also boosted by Mental Potency), Phantasmal Reminder for a fast 7d6 damage, Triggered Suggestion if it's that sort of campaign... Otherwise, you get a second Dazzling Feint. If you've managed to boost your Acrobatics with an item or some such, Outmaneuver could be good. Otherwise, I'd say go with Surprise Strike. Yes, Piercing Strike is tempting -- you'd do 2d6+23d8+3 with every blow, and that's before bonuses! And you don't get your Painful Stare dice on the second blow, because Painful Stare only works once/round. But unless you're attacking something with crazy high AC, the math favors Surprise Strike, so go with that.
Math:
Say your opponent is AC 20 after you feint. You have your +1 greatsword and no other bonuses. You hit at +6 BAB +3 Str +1 Weapon Focus +1 sword -> +12, meaning you need an 8 to hit. You do 5d6+3 damage, average 20.5. Piercing Strike gives you +3 extra damage on average. Surprise Strike gives you a second blow at -5, which hits on a 13 or higher (40% chance) and does only 2d6+3, average 10. So it gives you (10 x 40%) 4 extra damage on average. Piercing Strike isn't better unless you're swinging at something that's AC 22 or higher, and that's after your feint and before flanking, buffs, or anything else that helps you hit. Stick with Surprise Strike.
Level 8: Stat bump on Cha. Your stare penalty jumps to -3, woo! BAB+6, so you get a second attack -- remember that you don't get Painful Stare dice after the first one. You get another trick; see Level 6. Next level you'll be able to stack three at a time.
Okay, pausing now. Comments very welcome. This is a "glass cannon" build, all strengths and weaknesses. +8 Will save, great! +0 Fort save, whoops. High damage output, great! Crappy AC and hp, less good. Sky-high bluff means great feinting! Except against non-humanoids and animals. Undead, run away. And so forth. A bit like a magus, come to think. The dhampir reverse-heal thing is a big problem at lower levels. Later on, when wands of Inflict Light Wounds are a thing, it stops being an issue. If nobody can heal you, then take Psychosomatic Surge as the first trick and have someone throw a few ranks at the Heal skill. (Being a dhampir: hard, but still worth it for the various racial benefits.)
Melee chops notwithstanding, this is still a pretty SADdy build: Charisma, Charisma, Charisma. Spell DCs, Bluff for feinting, Intimidate, Will save, blindness save... Get Eagle's Splendor, use it regularly, and invest in a Cha-boosting item ASAP.
Whoops, almost forgot: at creation you probably wanted to swap your rather mediocre Detect Undead SLA for either Dayborn (no daylight penalties) or Heir to Undying Nobility (Command / Charm Person once each/day).
I guess it depends on your GM. If they are likely to be careful with you guys and intentionally avoid killing players you should be safe enough. At my table you would likely die at level 1 no matter which of us were GMing.
Level 1 with 8 HP and 15 AC combined with being the only character not trying to avoid front lines at all cost would be extremely lethal. The first time you get crit, or even hit with a high roll on a longsword or something you'd be down/dead. Few level 1 wizards with magic missile or what not probably couldn't save you at that point. Not to mention you'd have a hard time getting them to heal you in the first place
Personally I'd definitely go level 1 into either inspired blade or barbarian/bloodrager depending on preferred attribute.
Level 1 human inspired blade
str 10, dex 14, con 13, int 10, wis 10, cha 17.
Feats weapon focus rapier, weapon finesse, fencing grace, toughness
AC 17, HP 14, rapier +4 1d6+2
Level 1 human barb
str 14, dex, 10, con 13, int 10, wis 10, cha 17
Feats power attack, toughness
AC 13, HP 16(18 rage), raging power attacking greatsword +4 2d6+8
Just made both human for simplicity. But plenty of other races like dhampir, halfling, nagaji, etc would potentially work even better.
I'd suggest a single handed weapon and a shield. Darkwood Shield [257 gp] bonus the AC up 2 and gives a dramatic boost in AC with no negatives. Quite honestly, I'd drop str and wis to 10 to bump con or dex and take weapon finesse to allow melee attacks. For this character, I think rich parents would be a HUGE boon as it might let you survive till second. Buy the Darkwood Shield + Lamellar (leather) for AC 18. Maybe even use Fighting Defensively for a 20.
The only melee with AC 15 and 8 hp isn't looking good for a need to figure out 2nd level abilities.
Why a greatsword and not a polearm (like a Lucerne Hammer or a Bardiche)? I really like Polearms on casters, particularly psychic ones who do not want to make concentration checks, so you don't have to cast defensively if you're in your preferred melee range?
Level 1 with 8 HP and 15 AC combined with being the only character not trying to avoid front lines at all cost would be extremely lethal. The first time you get crit, or even hit with a high roll on a longsword or something you'd be down/dead.
I don't think the DM would have to go all that easy. You'd expect to be dropped to 0 more than once, but that's normal at 1st level. Also, note that you're not entering melee as often as a fighter or a barb; you're going to avoid a number of encounters with charm, sleep, command, or color spray. (And then you'll run away from some, too.)
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Personally I'd definitely go level 1 into either inspired blade or barbarian/bloodrager depending on preferred attribute.
Wait, melee classes are better at melee? You astonish me.
Look, OF COURSE the Mesmerist won't be as good at melee as a full BAB fighter type, no matter how many combat feats we give him. "Fragile at lower levelss" is a thing. If we toughen him up -- move build points to Dex and Con, give him toughness and dodge, whatever -- he does less damage (and isn't as good a caster). Dip a level of fighter or whatever? All his Mesmerist progressions get ganked. Which is going to gank his damage output too, because in the long run he's getting most of his dpr from feints and stares.
Anyway: the challenge is, take a pure Mesmerist, no dips, and make him okay in melee. Can you do it?
Color Spray is going to be way better than Sleep if you're at the front lines. Let the wizards hiding behind you cast Sleep. Also note Spite as a 3rd level spell, which you might be able to load with Stricken Heart to avoid full attacks, or with Vampiric Touch to get a temp HP buffer. Or Horrific Doubles as a major upgrade to your 2 mirror images via tricks.
On the vexing trickster, combat expertise can be used for combat maneuvers - or for other things. Moonlight Stalker for example, or any of several styles, or even improved feint.
I'd suggest a single handed weapon and a shield. Darkwood Shield [257 gp] bonus the AC up 2 and gives a dramatic boost in AC with no negatives.
Huh: so there's no disadvantage to a Darkwood Shield at all? Even if you don't have shield proficiency?
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Quite honestly, I'd drop str and wis to 10 to bump con or dex and take weapon finesse to allow melee attacks.
Why that as opposed to the Vexing Daredevil build? Remember, we want a build that will do decent damage down the line.
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For this character, I think rich parents would be a HUGE boon as it might let you survive till second. Buy the Darkwood Shield + Lamellar (leather) for AC 18. Maybe even use Fighting Defensively for a 20.
Fighting Defensively makes it hardly worth going into melee in the first place! After all, if you hit first, hit hard, and drop them with one shot, your AC is a lot less of an issue. That said, I definitely think you're on to something with rich parents...
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The only melee with AC 15 and 8 hp isn't looking good for a need to figure out 2nd level abilities.
Wait, melee classes are better at melee? You astonish me.
Look, OF COURSE the Mesmerist won't be as good at melee as a full BAB fighter type, no matter how many combat feats we give him. "Fragile at lower levelss" is a thing. If we toughen him up -- move build points to Dex and Con, give him toughness and dodge, whatever -- he does less damage (and isn't as good a caster). Dip a level of fighter or whatever? All his Mesmerist progressions get ganked. Which is going to gank his damage output too, because in the long run he's getting most of his dpr from feints and stares.
Anyway: the challenge is, take a pure Mesmerist, no dips, and make him okay in melee. Can you do it?
Doug M.
Well, the attitude is certainly not required. Firebug rather quickly and effectively explains why dipping doesn't remotely cripple your character. If you don't want to hear suggestions or counter arguments go take one of the melee focused mesmerist and call it a day. Good luck
Why a greatsword and not a polearm (like a Lucerne Hammer or a Bardiche)? I really like Polearms on casters, particularly psychic ones who do not want to make concentration checks, so you don't have to cast defensively if you're in your preferred melee range?
I was thinking about polearm + the Meek Facade trick. "The mesmerist can trigger this trick when the subject misses a creature with an attack... The enemy must attack no one other than the subject, and the subject gains a +2 dodge bonus to AC against the triggering enemy’s attacks. Both of these effects last for 1 round... This is a mind-affecting compulsion effect." Put that trick on yourself and as soon as the enemy misses an attack (against anyone) you can trigger it. Then he MUST either attack you or attack nobody -- no save. Polearm with reach = either he sits out a round or you get a free AoO!
Drawbacks: no undead (plants, oozes, whatever). Don't try this against something that can throw things. You get a free AoO, but then if you don't drop him your squishy self is next to the monster. Still, worth considering.
Kickin' it old school. I mean, what do you dump? Int?
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Color Spray is going to be way better than Sleep if you're at the front lines. Let the wizards hiding behind you cast Sleep.
True, true.
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Also note Spite as a 3rd level spell, which you might be able to load with Stricken Heart to avoid full attacks, or with Vampiric Touch to get a temp HP buffer. Or Horrific Doubles as a major upgrade to your 2 mirror images via tricks.
Holy smokes, how did I miss Spite? Something hits me, and it eats a touch spell? What a cool spell. Thank you. And Stricken Heart deals negative energy damage, so it doubles as a cure spell for a dhampir!
You'd expect to be dropped to 0 more than once, but that's normal at 1st level.
25% of d20's rolled hit you before adding anything and you only have 18 hp between full and dead. Monsters winning initiative [you only have a +2] hurts and you're by yourself.
Douglas Muir 406 wrote:
he does less damage (and isn't as good a caster)
Well laying down in the ground means even LESS damage and I don't see how dropping wis, int and str drops Cha spellcasting in any way. Even without multiclassing, you can at least take the 'hit me' sign off your back.
Secondly, if you're counting on spells knocking out monsters, coup de grâce works better with high crit weapons, meaning Boarding pike, Kumade, Lantern staff, Longspear, Spear and Weighted spear are viable two handed options [simple weapons] with x3 crit. The lantern staff also does a point of fire damage as a bonus.
Darkwood Shield: non-proficiency make you take a penalty equal to the armor check penalty to attacks. The Darkwood Shield has an ACP of 0, meaning you take 0 off you to hits.
Vexing Daredevil build: Personally, I want to make sure I'd live to see higher levels. The nifty things you can do later only matter if you can make it to then. Also, what stops the archetype? The bonus feats say "She doesn’t need to meet the prerequisites for these feats".
Fighting Defensively: If you're the only melee, the benefit of defense is allowing the 'casters' to do their thing. If they hit with a cantrip, you still add painful stare. You're missing out on the 'normal' flanking and other things multiple melee brings. This is a good reason to think reach weapon. Attacks of Opportunity as monsters try to get to the casters might get you more attacks.
greatsword: From vexing daredevil? Personally if two handed is your thing, Naginata looks good. Reach and x4 crit for coup de grâce. Hooked lance is the same but with trip.
Rich parents: There are also other traits to look at.
Chosen Child: increases by 900 gp. [instead of rich parents replace]
Signature Moves: single masterwork item under 900 gp and +1 Bluff/Intimidate when in hand.
Ancestral Weapon: gain cold iron/silver weapon up to 500gp and GAIN +1 hit with weapons made out of that material.
Coin Hoarder: like Chosen Child but only +500gp.
So if you take Signature Moves and Ancestral Weapon, you get a free Darkwood Shield [heck, throw on a spike too if you wish], a +1 bluff/intimidate, and a free masterwork weapon with a +1 to hit.
My melee mesmerist in PFS is only 6, but he's pretty fun to play so far. The biggest issue with doing a melee mesmerist, vs. doing a melee bard, is the lack of positive buffs to throw on yourself to offset losses in damage and hit. So I've tried to flip that a bit and emphasize using my spells to debuff my opponents to make them easier to hit and to make it harder for them to hit us. He's definitely not primary melee, but I think it works. My build won't completely work for your character given you're a Dhampir, but it might help you come up with ideas. If I'd done this a little later, I might have skipped Eyebiter and done Vexing Trickster instead, but I can't rebuild without a significant cost now.
Half-Orc, Mesmerist 6 (Eyebiter)
Orc Weaponry to pick up a Great Axe
Darkvision 60ft.
Intimidating
Sacred Tattoo (+1 All Saves)
Feats:
1) Intimidating Prowess
3) Blind-fighting
5) Reflexive Trick
Future Feats:
7) Power Attack or Intense Pain
9) Vital Strike
11) Excorciating Stare
Since I can only apply my painful stare once a round, I'm going for a single bit hit build. My tactics are usually to stare + cast a debuff (like Shadow Trap or Grease) on my target and move to position. Being able to intimidate with a trick is also great action economy. If I go into battle with Fearsome Guise on, I can potentially end round 1 with with an opponent stared, shaken, and entangled. If someone damages my target I trigger painful stare, otherwise the next round I attack. Eyebiter gives up Touch Treatment for some awesome melee (and eventually ranged) touch debuffs to blind your opponents which is usually what I'm using offensively instead of spells lately in combat. They are also supernatural abilities, instead of SLAs. This gives me a good pool to open with a touch attack (easier to land) to soften the opponent up for my lower BAB actual attacks. And that also leaves my spell slots for defensive buffs, utility. My spells known currently are:
1) Vanish (tactical re-positioning), Burst of Adrenaline ("reverse power attack" - +4 to hit, -1 to damage/AC until next round), Shadow Trap (will save debuff to entangle, not mind-affecting), Grease (reflex save to trip or disarm).
2) False Life (helps buffer HP, great duration), Placebo Effect (useful since I lost Touch Treatment and temporarily removes most conditions), Silence (anti-caster), Psychic Leech (debuff target, get stronger in the process, save doesn't completely negate).
You can see I'm actually doing the opposite of what most mesmerists do. by specifically avoiding mind-affecting spells. Level 3s will probably be Dispel Magic, Vampiric Touch, Jester's Jaunt or See Invisibilty.
Reflexive Trick is incredible. I usually put mesmeric mirror (currently at two images) on myself and another melee. You know they will get used, so the action economy of triggering them is amazing even if its only 1-2 images. Once it's gone, you can reflexively call up another trick mid combat (another mesmeric mirror or mask misery or whatever). The trick is just balancing the swift action -- moving the stare, burst of adrenaline, reflexive trick can easily stomp on one another if not careful.
Without a big two-hander, you probably won't get the same mileage maximizing a single hit, but you could definitely work out something different. As noted earlier, if you went Vexing Trickster, you could easily drop into Moonlight Stalker feat lines to boost your damage and attack. Spectral Smoke and reflexive trick would let you pull it out whenever you needed. Faerie fire is on your list, so you could also open with that and then when your opponent attacks you use Spectral Smoke. You and your team have concealment from it, but everyone can see the target. You also have blur on your list to give yourself concealment. The free trick feats are also nice since they'd potentially free you to grab some things like Toughness and something to boost your fort save. Your FCB probably should go into HP.
Looking at your build specifically, and I cannot emphasize this enough, if you want to cast at all on opponents, do not be a Vexing Dodger because you will lose out on the Psychic Inception bold stares. That is the single thing that makes being a mesmerist work unless you know you won't be regularly going against mind-affecting immune creatures. It's the equivalent of multiple metamagic feats. For stats, Towering Ego will more than cover your 10 Wis instead of 12. I really think you should consider dropping Charisma a bit. 16 has been more than sufficient for me with a headband getting to 18. The stare penalty more than makes you competitive. And I say this doubly because you've got three wizards behind you. Let them to the debuffing/control spells. Use your illusions to defend yourself and disable your immediate target. It may not be ultimate melee, but it's a fun play style so far.
This is a SUPER interesting build, and definitely fulfills my original request of "build a decent melee mesmerist without dips". Thanks, cavernshark!
cavernshark wrote:
Half-Orc, Mesmerist 6 (Eyebiter)
Orc Weaponry to pick up a Great Axe
Darkvision 60ft.
Intimidating
Sacred Tattoo (+1 All Saves)
Favored Class Bonus: +1/2 Level to Painful Stare
I've avoided the eyebiter because Ocular Occlusion is a bunch of touch attacks. But if you're a melee character anyway, hey touch attacks aren't so bad. Sacred Tattoo vs. Ferocity is a tough call for a melee character, but those weak saves are a real concern. And the favored class bonus... woo! If you apply that consistently, you're getting a PF damage die every two levels. At 10th level you'd have five instead of two. Nice!
Hm, are you actually using these all that much? Armor Expert is basically "I want to do Stealth and Acrobatics in a chain shirt"; do you?
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Starting Stats
16, 13, 14, 10, 10, 15
+1 to Cha at 4
+1 to Dex at 8
Get a Headband of Cha, Belt of Str
The big issue I see here is that, as noted above, mesmerists use Cha so many different ways: spell DCs, feinting, Will save... oh, wait, I guess you're not feinting much. Well, I see the force of getting better physical stats but I'm still wincing a little.
Okay, I totally see the first two. But why Mask Misery? Do you get hit with bad conditions that often? Yes, you gave up Touch Treatment, and yes, psychic casters worry about emotion effects. But isn't that what you have that +12 Will save for?
The stares, yeah, there are four stares that are clearly superior and these are two of them. You could argue for swapping them (you need that debuff more at lower levels when you're squish) but we're into "depends on the DM and campaign" territory here. If you're playing Kingmaker, maybe swap; if Carrion Crown, do not.
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Feats:
1) Intimidating Prowess
3) Blind-fighting
5) Reflexive Trick
Future Feats:
7) Power Attack or Intense Pain
9) Vital Strike
11) Excorciating Stare
I see Intimidating Prowess because of the synergy with Fearsome Guise. But Blind-fighting? You have darkvision. How often do the lights get turned out? I would think Manifold Stare would be better here. You're already piling on the damage dice with your favored class ability; why not double down? At 10th level that would be 10! d! 6! of extra damage on your first blow each round.
(More perhaps in a bit -- you've provided a lot to think about.)
half orc FCB us +1/2 point of painful stare damage per lvl you take the FCB, not +1/2 to your effective level for painful stare
Ohhh right you are. Okay, so you're only getting +1 damage / 2 levels. That's... okay. Worth giving up 1 hp or sp / level? Maybe? But anyway, alas for my dreams of massive overkill damage.
That said, I think my original point still holds: if you're going to invest in the half-orc FCB, you might as well pick up Manifold Stare, because it doubles the FCB bonus. At 9th level you'd get two stares per round for up to 3d6+4 each. That seems pretty attractive.
The build I posted isn't entirely optimized; I've been feeling it out as I go. I started off with the goal of inflicting lots of different conditions and debated between doing an intimidate or moonlight stalker build. I found that in practice I don't get to do all of it though, so it's meandered a bit. A few notes based on your questions/comments:
On Manifold Tricks: yes, I suppose being able to trigger it twice a round would work well, but in practice I usually only get 1, maybe 2, hits on an opponent before it's down since I usually spend my first round debuffing it and in PFS I can usually rely on other melee doing damage too. It would double the effectiveness of my FCB, but I'm really designed more to debuff an opponent, hit him, then move to the next. Vital Strike supports that mobility. I also don't like relying too heavily on Painful Stare since it's precision damage and there's plenty out there immune to it. You won't necessarily have that luxury in your party.
Armor Expert allows me to wear Mithral Breastplate (Medium Armor) with no ACP. With +1, it's 7 AC. I don't have the benefit of the Dex boost like you do, so that helps me a lot. I actually use Focused Mind a lot less than I thought, mostly because I'm using Occular Occlusion so much and it doesn't provoke.
I have Mask Misery because, in practice, I'm almost always going into fights with Mesmeric Mirror or Fearsome Guise implanted. They are almost always triggered at the start of a fight. The action economy is huge since it lets me go offensive immediately by either throwing up a line of defense or weakening an opponent out the gate with shaken. Once those tricks are used, I use Reflexive Trick to call up another one as needed mid-battle. Having a deep bench of situationally strong tricks known is useful in that case, so I can respond to situations as needed. It can give me the round or two I need to take a potion or cast Placebo Effect on myself. I'm looking at Slip Bonds and Compel Alacrity next. Reflexive Trick is almost like Mesmerist Spell Combat since it allows you to get tricks out seemlessly.
Blind-fighting was a remnant of when I thought I might go Moonlight Stalker or to combine with my own Spectral Smoke trick. I opted not to go that route, so I could probably rework things, but it's not necessarily critical.
As I mentioned, I play PFS, so Psychic Inception is super huge. It's literally what sets you apart from your wizard friends who might specialize in Enchantment. Being able to affect oozes, undead, constructs, etc with mind-affecting abilities is amazing, even with the bonuses they get to the save. I cannot emphasize enough how useful it is.
On stats, you need to remember that your stare is the equivalent of 4 charisma, eventually 6 charisma. Yes, you get a lot of boosts from Charisma, like will saves (which you should already have a good one), more tricks, etc... but the difference between 16 and 18 is only 1 on everything. That 2 ability points frees you up a lot in a 15 pt buy. Here's a very rough possible Dhampir build:
Spoiler:
Dhampir, Mesmerist (Vexing Trickster)
Favored Class Bonus: All health
Traits:
Armor Expert: -1 ACP
Pick a trait you like
Starting Stats
14, 15, 11, 10, 10, 16
+1 to Con at 4
+1 to Dex at 8
or
13, 16, 11, 10, 10, 16
+1 to Con at 4
+1 to Str at 8
Feats:
1) Toughness (we shore up your health until we can add a point to con)
2B) Combat Expertise (bonus from archetype, sacrifice your Towering Ego)
3) Blind Fight (you'll be fighting in your own smoke)
3B) Reflexive Trick (bonus from archetype)
5) Moonlight Stalker (Flat +2 to opponents that you have concealment from)
7) Intense Pain
9) Manifold Stare (you now have a way to maybe hit something twice a round) or Improved Feint
10B) Split Trick (bonus trick feat, guarantee your tricks see use)
11) Stare Feat or Moonlight Stalker Feint (bluff as a swift action.. may conflict with swapping your stare)
This build has better stats as a nagaji with False Flanker, Mesmeric Mirror, concealment/invisibility have better offense and defense.
Armor Expert Mithril breast plate is great for this build. It avoids the need for manifold stare so you can grab things like bouncing trick for extra support.
Auto hypnotist, Fey Trickster
Auto hypnotist helps cover the lower Cha, Fey Trickster gives you spells that help with melee combat much more than the standard spell list. The loss of towering ego means you will want to avoid dumping wisdom. But, this build with Manifold stare at each time it is available will be decent in melee. The tricks in the above build with still be top choice for a melee mesmerism.
Half Orc FCB is worth it if you have build in decent defenses and can spare the point of damage. The combo of manifold stare, painful stare, and FCB give level to damage + 1d6/2 level (Gained at odd times). That's a lot of damage for class features.
The single issue that holds mesmerists back in melee is accuracy. This needs to be the focus of any melee build. Weapon focus and false flanker help you need the stats to back them up.
Inspired blade 1/Vexing Daredevil X isn't bad. Decent damage(intense pain and manifold stare), can do some fun things with feinting to debuffing opponents, still has tricks, casting is still decently powerful thanks to the stare nerfing opposing saves and the defences are really strong between decent AC, party riposte and mirror image.
I haven't really put much thought into it but a casty based Mesmerist with Vox and intense pain might be a fun way of damaging anyone who gets close.
