Help me build the most broken character you can think of?


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Liberty's Edge

So I've been playing tabletops for about 10 years now and Pathfider for about 5 of that. I've never really sat down and tried to internationally break a character. I usually DM so I'm not a fan of power building. But for this one occasion I want to make something truley nasty. And don't worry the permitters othe game is to break a character.
I've seen a lot of atrong builds and no the basis of beaking the game. But I'd like some ideas.
Please and Thank you!


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Can you specify a level and stat array?


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do a search for broken in the search. You'll come up with a lot. This question gets asked like every other week.

Basically it comes down to be a 9th level arcane caster and use your spells.

Grand Lodge

What kind of Parameters do we have?

Point Buy?
Banned Feats/Traits/Items?
Mythic? Gestalt? Automatic Progression Rules?

Lastly what Kind of Class where you hoping for?

Grand Lodge

Wizard.


Like broken in a good way or a bad way? Like a hand-crossbow specialist fighter?


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Been done.

http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2rzop?The-Songbird-of-Doom-A-Guide-to-a-most#1

Liberty's Edge

Okay so hear me out. 40 point buy, 3 traits, max of 2 classes, and basically only the core rulebook, advanced players guide, ultimate magic and combat.

Banned are synthasis summoner and firearms.

I know that with this ruleset its nearly impossible to not create an overpowered monstrosity but everyone else playing will be doing the same thing.
I'm well aware of powerful class builds but I wanted brainstorm ideas and lock down a solid idea.

Also, level 11.

Grand Lodge

CommandoDude wrote:

Been done.

Link.

Not even close.

Defeated by Wizard.


Starting at such a high level, anything broken will have to be some version of full caster. The classic god wizard is obvious, but I would probably go with a saurian shaman druid.

Liberty's Edge

Melkiador wrote:

Those are some fairly hefty limitations on sources. You never said a level, so I assume you are starting at level 1.

Just edited my post. We start at level 11.

Grand Lodge

Arcanist, or Druid works too.

Liberty's Edge

Yeah I'm think full caster or a zen-archer are the two on my list. I'm just torn on which will be the most effective. There's suppose to be a lot of combat, traps, and puzzles to deal with.

Or unless someone else has any other ideas.

The songbird link was cool but I'm limited to two classes.


1Fighter1: Power Attack, Cleave, Improved Sunder
2F2: 3.0 version of Improved Sunder: Double Damage on Sunder Attempts against Weapons.

3F3: Combat Expertise
4F4: Great Cleave
5F5: Ancestral Relic: 3.5 Feat from Book of Exalted Deeds. It lets you customize single magic item, paying the GP value of the item as you go.*

The item you will be creating:

A +1 Adamantine Earthbreaker Hammer that combines the Shatterspike and 'of the Titans enchantments. The cost will go something like this

3040gp: Adamantine Earthbreaker
2000: +1
2000: Shatterspike: an extra +3 Attack/Damage when used to Sunder by someone with Improved Sunder
8000: 'of the Titans: Triple Damage vs Inanimate Objects. This will partially stack with 3.0Improved Sunder for Quadruple Damage.

6F6: Greater Sunder
7F7: Combat Brute: 3.5 Feat: once you Sunder your opponent's Weapon or Armor, you may make an additional attack as a Free Action.

8F8: Deadly Concussion: 3.5 Feat: if you destroy your opponent's Armor or Shield on a Sunder Attempt (with a Blunt Weapon), your opponent takes damage equal to the amount that Armor or Shield took.

9F9: Improved Trip: the 3.5 version lets you have a Free Action Attack as your opponent goes down.

10F10: Knockdown: 3.0 Feat. If you inflict 10 or more points of damage on a single hit, you get a Free Trip Attempt.

11F11: Combat Reflexes
12F12: Greater Trip
13F13: Improved Bull Rush
14F14: Pushback: 3.5 Feat: Free Bull Rush with Every hit
15F15: Shock Trooper: 3.5 Feat: if you Bull Rush one guy into another guy, you get a free Trip attempt on both.

So, by level 8, this guy is getting multiple Free Action Attacks, some of them inflicting octople damage, all of them inflicting at least triple damage. The number of attacks is multiplied by the number allowed with each Great Cleave. Double check the math, but I think it is at level 8 where the DPR tops 1000.

Since you are allowed to follow your opponents with Bull Rushing, a Single Great Cleave might not run out of opponents to hit for quite some time, meanwhile, each hit is triggering free bull rushes and free trips which all trigger extra attacks both as Free Actions and Attacks of Opportunity.

I WIN AT D&D!


Oops, just saw your list of allowed resources. More later.

But that was quite the monstrosity, though, right?


UnboltedAKTION wrote:
Yeah I'm think full caster or a zen-archer are the two on my list.

Note that by 11th level there are a lot of casting options to shut down an archer.

Grand Lodge

Well, no.

Your first mistake, was that you did choose a full casting class.

Second mistake, is you chose Fighter.


UnboltedAKTION wrote:

Okay so hear me out. 40 point buy, 3 traits, max of 2 classes, and basically only the core rulebook, advanced players guide, ultimate magic and combat.

Banned are synthasis summoner and firearms.

I know that with this ruleset its nearly impossible to not create an overpowered monstrosity but everyone else playing will be doing the same thing.
I'm well aware of powerful class builds but I wanted brainstorm ideas and lock down a solid idea.

Also, level 11.

Only 2 classes? That rules out some pretty basic stuff, like Arcane Archer and Mystic Theurge!

Grand Lodge

Prestige Classes?

I thought this was "broken" in the positive light.

Not Core Rogue "broken".


Depend on what you want!

For ranged combat ->
Here is a paladin with oath of vengeance:

Stats after racial modifiers (human):
STR: 18
DEX: 18
CON: 10
INT: 7
WIS: 10
CHA: 18

Traits: Reactionary, Birthmark

Skills: Everything in perception and with that extra point for being human I would put it in use magic devices or any other social skill you might be using the most as a player (intimidate fit with oath of vengeance concept).

Feat progression:
Level 1 - Point blank shot and precise shot
level 3 - Rapid shot
level 5 - Deadly aim
level 7 - Manyshot
level 9 - Weapon focus: Long bow
level 11 -Improved precise shot

Equipment:
Gun for an adaptive Composite longbow.
Bracers of archery.
Boots of haste.
scarab of golem bane (one of the only non evil thing you will have a hard time to kill because of DR)

strategy: smite stuff and kill them with your bow, you are really good at it.

With that kind of stat array it's hard to NOT do anything overpowered.

Will think of something more outside the box tonight... have fun pondering!

Grand Lodge

Nobody has posted a full caster build?

Where are the build that shape reality?


If alignment isn't a restriction, then selling your soul for power is in play (literally). Contract devils give three wishes for absurdly cheap (basically the cost of casting sending to get in contact) (and your soul), so if you were not planning on bringing your character back from the dead a million times you don't really lose too much. This is the choice for if the GM is wants to see high power levels, but not complete cheese. For complete cheese sell everyone's soul (including your own). And then you have the soul trade to break the WBL system a little bit, (livestock sell for less than their souls are worth in crafting, for example). You are still limited by how fast you can convert these resources, so investments in immortality not tied to bringing you back from the dead (as they would fail) are prudent (so that you have time to convert them slowly). Recommendations include graveknight and lich. Graveknight is somewhat sub-optimal however as you are forced to fight for eternity, and you sacrifice your happiness along with your soul. Like seriously, you become an emo undead general that can never feel pleasure. But you did say broken... I digress, from immortality and infinite money you then use scrolls of gate to let insane HD outsiders do your bidding. Do not forget the scrolls of things like heightened (for the higher cl mostly) magic circle, dimensional anchor, and the like. Because binding is your easy out of doing work in this campaign, you are going to want an intimidate build for bargaining with outsiders because it can be used in place of diplomacy to influence people (don't forget to also max diplomacy for the bargaining, as it is still needed). Use intimidate first because its much much easier to get massive bonuses on, especially as a half-orc. You should easily be looking at +30-40 at this level on intimidate. From there, read scroll of gate, threaten the balor, then when its your friend, ask it to do whatever it is your party is going to do in the next half hour (intimidate as diplomacy wears off then). Then you kinda just win, although by this point if your GM isn't slapping you with a herring then he is probably doing something wrong.

To summarize:
Be evil.
Harvest the souls of water fowl.
Use the money to become immortal.
Use more money to hire people (specifically CR20 demons and devils) to do the adventuring thing for you. (or if you want just by the cosmic supply of scrolls of wish.)
Sit back in the comfiest chair money can buy while you drink eggnog and discuss the failings of representative democracy with your manservent, the reanimated corpse of Aristotle.
Why? Because power at all costs, especially the souls of water fowl.


40 point buy?

No question, full cleric, druid or shaman. You have a maxxed out casting stat and full blown secondary stats to allow you to trounce things in physical combat if you want to on top of full casting. Pick up some crafting feats for more silliness. Really you could invest the rest of your feats into skill focus: basket weaving and it wouldn't matter.


I agree with Melkiador that Saurian Shaman druid would be the most effective option.

Full casting, excellent summoning, spectacular combat skills in wild shape, and an animal companion on top.


blackbloodtroll wrote:
CommandoDude wrote:

Been done.

Link.

Not even close.

Defeated by Wizard.

You can't beat that which saves against everything you can throw at it.


hence why you use magic to do things that don't require a save.


Speaking of which, 11th level is when Geas starts being a thing. Anyone have a build for that? An Echoing metamagic rod would be a good start.

Lantern Lodge

With the amount of power in the campaign, I don't think being better than the rest of the party is necessary- -why not focus on making everyone else better?

Something like a Witch or a Bard or something?

Dual-Cursed Oracle 1/Witch 10. Obliterate the opponent's ability to fight back via Misfortune (Oracle Revelation), Misfortune (Witch Hex), Evil Eye, etc.

I've seen it wreck pretty much everything's ability to fight back with a 20-point PFS buy. Giving it 40 and teammates with 40s seem irresponsible.


Skald wouldn't be a bad idea if you end up with a melee-heavy party.


With 40-point-buy an Arcane Enlightenment-abusing Shaman is a very real possibility. If you want a spell - Divine or Arcane - it is pretty much yours for the taking. If for some reason you wanted to cast Time Stop and then spam Heal on every party member it is doable (odd, but doable). The high point buy really mitigates the MADness of this type of Shaman.

All while wearing medium armor, having D8 HD, 3/4 BAB (for Enervation and other touch spells, naturally), whatever your primary Spirit gives you and Hexes for when you feel cheesy. This is not a one-trick-pony build. It gets all the tricks.


blackbloodtroll wrote:
Wizard.

Lol.

Perfect answer.


I've got a broken character for you:

A venerable gnome dagger fighter with STR, DEX, and CON as dump stats. Oh, and he's blind and missing a leg and both hands. Totally broken.


Chess Pwn wrote:
hence why you use magic to do things that don't require a save.

There are not many spells that don't give saves, and they're usually not specifically awesome when used alone. Filling your slots up with such spells also hurts the wizard's main specialty, which is diversification and adaptability (it's also super gamey to assume wizards do that without prior knowledge they're gunna be dealing with X or Y).


1-Charm monster. Charm person on a humanoid works too.
2-Enlarge.
3-Magic weapon or greater magic weapon on their weapon.
4-Bulls strength.
Use that feat that lets you increase the duration of spells.
Suggest the dwarven door breaker game and take offense from every door. :)

I almost forgot haste. How could I forget haste.


You need to write a background about how you became a free vampire, and hop no one in the party makes positive energy cleric/paladin types...

Old Gnome Vampire Oracle of Lore:

sry 'bout format

change spells to see fit::

BROKEN ORA
CR 12
XP 19.200
Male vampire old gnome (vampire) oracle 11
LE Small undead
Init +9; Senses darkvision 60 ft., low-light vision, Perception +34
DEFENSE
AC 33, touch 25, flat-footed 21 (+2 deflection, +11 Dex, +1 dodge, +8 natur al, +1 size)
hp 186 (11d8+132)fast healing 5
Fort +19, Ref +19, Will +16, +2 vs. illusion spells or effects
Defensive Abilities channel resistance +4; DR 10/magic and silver; Immune ability drain, death effects, death from massive damage, disease, energy drain, exhaustion, fatigue, mind-affecting effects, nonlethal damage, paralysis, poison, sleep, stunning; Resist  cold   10 , electricity   10
Weaknesses Vampire Weaknesses,
OFFENSE
Speed 40 ft., Spider Climb
Melee slam +13  (1d3+4)
Special Attacks blood drain, children of the night, create spawn, dominate, energy drain
Innate Spell-Like Abilities: dancing lights ( 1/day) ghost sound ( DC 21, 1/day) prestidigitation ( DC 21, 1/day) speak with animals ( DC , 1/day)
Known Oracle Spells (CL 11th, concentration +22): 5th (6/day)—curse, major (DC 26), true seeing, contact other plane, inflict light wounds (mass) (DC 26)
4th (8/day)—fleshworm infestation (DC 25), freedom of movement, poison (DC 25), legend lore, inflict critical wounds (DC 25)
3rd (9/day)—magic circle against good, protection from energy, sands of time, vision of hell (DC 25), inflict serious wounds (DC 24), locate object
2nd (9/day)—arrow of law (DC 23), darkness, death knell (DC 23), desecrate, dread bolt (DC 23), tongues, inflict moderate wounds (DC 23)
1st (9/day)—ant haul, command (DC 22), deadeye's lore, deathwatch, detect chaos, identify, inflict light wounds (DC 22)
0 (at will)—bleed (DC 21), create water, detect magic, light, mending, purify food and drink (DC 21), read magic, spark (DC 21), stabilize
STATISTICS
Str 18, Dex 16, Con —, Int 16, Wis 22, Cha 33
Base Atk +8; CMB +11; CMD 27
Feats Alertness, Clustered Shots, Combat Reflexes, Dodge, Fleet (2x), Great Fortitude, Improved Initiative, Lightning Reflexes, Point-Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Toughness,
Skills Bluff +19 , Diplomacy +25 , Fly +16 , Knowledge (Planes) +17 , Knowledge (Religion) +17 , Linguistics(Abyssal, Celestial, Cyclops, Daemon, Dwarven, Giant, Gnoll, Goblin, Infernal, Orc, Undercommon) +14 , Perception +34 , Sense Motive +32 , Spellcraft +17 , Stealth +15
Traits calistrian prostitute (calistria) (sense motive), reactionary
Languages Abyssal, Celestial, Common, Cyclops, Daemon, Draconic, Dwarven, Elven, Giant, Gnoll, Gnome, Goblin, Ignan, Infernal, Orc, Sylvan, Undercommon, Tongues (Ignan),
SQ brain drain, change shape (dire bat or wolf, beast shape II), channel resistance, darkvision 5, defensive training, fast healing, gaseous form, gnome magic, hatred, illusion resistance, immunity to ability drain, immunity to death effects, immunity to death from massive damage, immunity to disease 10, immunity to energy drain 10, immunity to exhaustion, immunity to fatigue, immunity to mind-affecting effects, immunity to nonlethal damage, immunity to paralysis
Gear slam, amulet of natural armor +2, headband of alluring charisma +6, bracers of falcon's aim, ring of protection +2, ring of sustenance, belt of physical might (str/dex) +2, cloak of resistance +3, boots of striding and springing, outfit (traveler's/small)

SPECIAL ABILITIES
Blood Drain (Su) A vampire can suck blood from a grappled opponent; if the vampire establishes or maintains a pin, it drains blood, dealing 1d4 points of Constitution damage. The vampire heals 5 hit points or gains 5 temporary hit points for 1 hour (up to a maximum number of temporary hit points equal to its full normal hit points) each round it drains blood.
Brain Drain (Su) You can take a standard action to violently probe the mind of a single intelligent enemy within 100 feet. The target receives a Will save (DC 0) to negate the effect and immediately knows the source of this harmful mental prying. Those who fail this save are wracked with pain, taking 11d4 points of damage. After successfully attacking with this ability, you may use a full-round action to sort through the jumble of stolen thoughts and memories to make a single Knowledge check using the victimUs skill bonus. The randomly stolen thoughts remain in your mind for a 11 rounds. Treat the knowledge gained as if you used detect thoughts. This is a mind-affecting effect. You can use this ability 3 time(s) per day.
Calistrian Prostitute (Calistria) (Sense Motive) You worked in one of Calistria's temples as a sacred prostitute, and you know how to flatter, please, and (most of all) listen. You gain a +1 trait bonus on Sense Motive checks and Diplomacy checks to gather information, and one of these skills (your choice) is always a class skill for you.
Change Shape (Su) A vampire can use change shape to assume the form of a dire bat or wolf, as beast shape II.
Channel Resistance (Ex) You are less easily affected by clerics or paladins. You add +4 to saves made to resist the effects of channel energy, including effects that rely on the use of channel energy.
Children of the Night (Su) Once per day, a vampire can call forth 1d6+1 rat swarms, 1d4+1 bat swarms, or 2d6 wolves as a standard action. (If the base creature is not terrestrial, this power might summon other creatures of similar power.) These creatures arrive in 2d6 rounds and serve the vampire for up to 1 hour.
Create Spawn (Su) A vampire can create spawn out of those it slays with blood drain or energy drain, provided that the slain creature is of the same creature type as the vampire's base creature type. The victim rises from death as a vampire in 1d4 days. This vampire is under the command of the vampire that created it, and remains enslaved until its master's destruction. A vampire may have enslaved spawn totaling no more than twice its own Hit Dice; any spawn it creates that would exceed this limit become free-willed undead. A vampire may free an enslaved spawn in order to enslave a new spawn, but once freed, a vampire or vampire spawn cannot be enslaved again.
Darkvision (Ex) Range 60 ft.; Darkvision is the extraordinary ability to see with no light source at all, out to a range specified for the creature. Darkvision is black and white only (colors cannot be discerned). It does not allow characters to see anything that they could not see otherwise-invisible objects are still invisible, and illusions are still visible as what they seem to be. Likewise, darkvision subjects a creature to gaze attacks normally. The presence of light does not spoil darkvision.
Defensive Training (Ex) Gnomes get a +4 dodge bonus to AC against monsters of the giant type.
Dominate (Su) A vampire can crush a humanoid opponent's will as a standard action. Anyone the vampire targets must succeed on a Will save DC 26 or fall instantly under the vampire's influence, as though by a dominate person spell (caster level 12th). The ability has a range of 30 feet. At the GM's discretion, some vampires might be able to affect different creature types with this power.
Energy Drain (Su) A creature hit by a vampire's slam (or other natural weapon) gains two negative levels. This ability only triggers once per round, regardless of the number of attacks a vampire makes.
Fast Healing (Ex) You regain hit points at 5 hit points per round. You regain hit points at 5 per round. Fast healing does not restore hit points lost from starvation, thirst, or suffocation, nor does it allow a creature to regrow lost body parts. Unless otherwise stated, it does not allow lost body parts to be reattached. Fast healing continues to function (even at negative hit points) until a creature dies, at which point the effects of fast healing end immediately.
Gaseous Form (Su) As a standard action, a vampire can assume gaseous form at will (caster level 5th), but it can remain gaseous indefinitely and has a fly speed of 20 feet with perfect maneuverability.
Gnome Magic (Sp) Gnomes add +1 to the DC of any saving throws against illusion spells that they cast. Gnomes with a Charisma of 11 or higher also gain spell-like abilities.
Hatred (Ex) Gnomes receive a +1 bonus on attack rolls against humanoid creatures of the reptilian and goblinoid subtypes due to special training against these hated foes.
Illusion Resistance (Ex) Gnomes get a +2 racial saving throw bonus against illusion spells or effects.
Immunity to Ability Drain (Ex) You are immune to ability drain attacks.
Immunity to Death Effects (Ex) You are never subject to death effects.
Immunity to Death from Massive Damage (Ex) You are not at risk of death from massive damage.
Immunity to Disease (Ex) You are never subject to disease effects.
Immunity to Energy Drain (Ex) You are immune to energy drain attacks.
Immunity to Exhaustion (Ex) You can never be exhausted.
Immunity to Fatigue (Ex) You can never be fatigued.
Immunity to Mind-Affecting Effects (Ex) You are never affected by mind-affecting effects (charms, compulsions, phantasms, patterns, and morale effects).
Immunity to Nonlethal Damage (Ex) You are never subject to nonlethal damage.
Immunity to Paralysis (Ex) You can never be paralyzed.
Immunity to Poison (Ex) You never take poison damage.
Immunity to Sleep (Ex) You are never subject to sleep effects.
Immunity to Stunning (Ex) You are never subject to stunning.
Keen Senses (Ex) Gnomes receive a +2 bonus on Perception skill checks.
Lore Keeper (Ex) Instead of encyclopedic knowledge, you learn most of your information through tales, songs, and poems. You may use your Charisma modifier instead of your Intelligence modifier on all Knowledge checks.
Lore Mysteries You draw upon the divine mystery of Lore to grant your spells and powers.
Low-Light Vision (Ex) You can see x2 as far as humans in low illumination. Characters with low-light vision have eyes that are so sensitive to light that they can see twice as far as normal in dim light. Low-Light Vision is color vision. A spellcaster with low-light vision can read a scroll as long as even the tiniest candle flame is next to her as a source of light. Characters with low-light vision can see outdoors on a moonlit night as well as they can during the day.
Obsessive (Ex) Gnomes receive a +2 racial bonus on a Craft or Profession skill of their choice.
Orisons You can prepare a number of orisons, or 0-level spells. These spells are cast like any other spells, but they are not expended when used and may be used again.
Reactionary You were bullied often as a child, but never quite developed an offensive response. Instead, you became adept at anticipating sudden attacks and reacting to danger quickly. You gain a +2 trait bonus on Initiative checks.
Resistance to Cold (Ex) You may ignore 10 points of Cold damage each time you take cold damage.
Resistance to Electricity (Ex) You may ignore 10 points of Electricity damage each time you take electricity damage.
Shadowless (Ex) A vampire casts no shadows and shows no ref lection in a mirror.
Sidestep Secret (Su) Your innate understanding of the universe has granted you preternatural reflexes and the uncanny ability to step out of danger at the very last second. Add your Charisma modifier (instead of your Dexterity modifier) to your Armor Class and all Reflex saving throws. Your armor's maximum Dexterity bonus applies to your Charisma instead of your Dexterity.
Spider Climb (Ex) A vampire can climb sheer surfaces as though under the effects of a spider climb spell.
Think On It (Ex) Once per day, the oracle of lore can reattempt any previously failed Knowledge check. On this attempt, add a +10 competence bonus on the check.
Tongues (Ignan) In times of stress or unease, you speak in tongues.
Vampire Weaknesses Vampires cannot tolerate the strong odor of garlic and will not enter an area laced with it. Similarly, they recoil from mirrors or strongly presented holy symbols. These things don't harm the vampire--they merely keep it at bay. A recoiling vampire must stay at least 5 feet away from the mirror or holy symbol and cannot touch or make melee attacks against that creature. Holding a vampire at bay takes a standard action. After 1 round, a vampire can overcome its revulsion of the object and function normally each round it makes a DC 25 Will save. Vampires cannot enter a private home or dwelling unless invited in by someone with the authority to do so. Reducing a vampire's hit points to 0 or lower incapacitates it but doesn't always destroy it (see fast healing). However, certain attacks can slay vampires. Exposing any vampire to direct sunlight staggers it on the first round of exposure and destroys it utterly on the second consecutive round of exposure if it does not escape. Each round of immersion in running water inflicts damage on a vampire equal to onethird of its maximum hit points--a vampire reduced to 0 hit points in this manner is destroyed. Driving a wooden stake through a helpless vampire's heart instantly slays it (this is a full-round action). However, it returns to life if the stake is removed, unless the head is also severed and anointed with holy water.
Weapon Familiarity (Ex) Gnomes treat any weapon with the word "gnome" in its name as a martial weapon.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Take mythic ranks. If you can't break a game with them, sell your dice in shame.


Gnome Bard with Psychosis. If that isn't the most broken character, I don't know what is.
Well, if there were Kenders in Pathfinder, maybe...

Grand Lodge

Quote:
Well, if there were Kenders in Pathfinder

I would play no other race.

Kender Slayer/Horizon Walker with a sling staff is my dream....

But Paizo hates Halflings and Slingstaffs.


2 people marked this as a favorite.
CommandoDude wrote:
blackbloodtroll wrote:
CommandoDude wrote:

Been done.

Link.

Not even close.

Defeated by Wizard.

You can't beat that which saves against everything you can throw at it.

Saves? You have seriously misunderstood how Wizards fight.


Anzyr wrote:
CommandoDude wrote:
blackbloodtroll wrote:
CommandoDude wrote:

Been done.

Link.

Not even close.

Defeated by Wizard.

You can't beat that which saves against everything you can throw at it.
Saves? You have seriously misunderstood how Wizards fight.

I know how to kill them really good.

Sneak up on one and instagib him before he even casts a spell.


2 people marked this as a favorite.
CommandoDude wrote:
Anzyr wrote:
CommandoDude wrote:
blackbloodtroll wrote:
CommandoDude wrote:

Been done.

Link.

Not even close.

Defeated by Wizard.

You can't beat that which saves against everything you can throw at it.
Saves? You have seriously misunderstood how Wizards fight.

I know how to kill them really good.

Sneak up on one and instagib him before he even casts a spell.

The odds of that happening to a properly played Wizard are so low they can be discarded as being not statistically significant. And god help you if it's a Diviner.


blackbloodtroll wrote:

Nobody has posted a full caster build?

Where are the build that shape reality?

They only exist in theory crafter's heads. I find it VERY telling that Gunslingers are banned but Wizards aren't.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Anzyr wrote:
CommandoDude wrote:
Anzyr wrote:
CommandoDude wrote:
blackbloodtroll wrote:
CommandoDude wrote:

Been done.

Link.

Not even close.

Defeated by Wizard.

You can't beat that which saves against everything you can throw at it.
Saves? You have seriously misunderstood how Wizards fight.

I know how to kill them really good.

Sneak up on one and instagib him before he even casts a spell.

The odds of that happening to a properly played Wizard are so low they can be discarded as being not statistically significant. And god help you if it's a Diviner.

"Properly played" as in, several rounds to apply buffing spells that would not ordinarily be allowed unless the wizard could know ahead of time he was being attacked. (And, in any case, would be trivially easy to disengage and wait out for them to expire).

The best a wizard could expect to have up at any given time are hour per level spells. Maybe 10 minute per level if they're somewhere they perceive as threatening but not immediately in danger.

A diviner wizard is regarded as one of the weakest subclasses of wizard (again due to limiting their spell selection to a poor school). The Foresight gimmick, while powerful, is not gunna win most fights (at best, it's an assured escape for the unprepared). But given the lack of power in the Divination school, few wizards are diviners.

Frankly, I think this board has a bit of an obsession with making wizards out to be the be all end all. Yeah, they're really strong, but they're not THAT strong, and only then if they're given time to make preparations.


My level 2.1 twice grandfathered summoner ;)


Few Wizards are Diviners huh? You know Arkalion is a Diviner right? And that some of the best spells are hours per level like say Aroden's Spellbane. So a Wizard will have at least one on at all times out of yesterday's spell slots. (12 hours ago thanks to the Fast Time Demiplane)


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Anzyr wrote:
Few Wizards are Diviners huh? You know Arkalion is a Diviner right? And that some of the best spells are hours per level like say Aroden's Spellbane. So a Wizard will have at least one on at all times out of yesterday's spell slots. (12 hours ago thanks to the Fast Time Demiplane)

Considering few parties ever even reach the level necessary to cast 9th level spells, I don't consider them. Hell I wouldn't consider them even if you did get to level 17 considering that's going to be 5% of your character's career - discarding late level from the get go games. The link I provided gave an example of a build broken by level 12 (far earlier if you consider the shenanigans you can accomplish very early into the build before wizards are even capable of casting teleport), that's 5+ levels earlier.

I'd also note that Aroden's Spellbane is very expensive to cast day to day, and frankly is not going to stop a wizard from getting instagibbed.


CommandoDude wrote:
Anzyr wrote:
Few Wizards are Diviners huh? You know Arkalion is a Diviner right? And that some of the best spells are hours per level like say Aroden's Spellbane. So a Wizard will have at least one on at all times out of yesterday's spell slots. (12 hours ago thanks to the Fast Time Demiplane)

Considering few parties ever even reach the level necessary to cast 9th level spells, I don't consider them. Hell I wouldn't consider them even if you did get to level 17 considering that's going to be 5% of your character's career - discarding late level from the get go games. The link I provided gave an example of a build broken by level 12 (far earlier if you consider the shenanigans you can accomplish very early into the build before wizards are even capable of casting teleport), that's 5+ levels earlier.

I'd also note that Aroden's Spellbane is very expensive to cast day to day, and frankly is not going to stop a wizard from getting instagibbed.

Aroden's spellbane has no cost, so it's not really very costly to cast especially since it protects you from something actually dangerous like say spells.


Anzyr wrote:
CommandoDude wrote:
Anzyr wrote:
Few Wizards are Diviners huh? You know Arkalion is a Diviner right? And that some of the best spells are hours per level like say Aroden's Spellbane. So a Wizard will have at least one on at all times out of yesterday's spell slots. (12 hours ago thanks to the Fast Time Demiplane)

Considering few parties ever even reach the level necessary to cast 9th level spells, I don't consider them. Hell I wouldn't consider them even if you did get to level 17 considering that's going to be 5% of your character's career - discarding late level from the get go games. The link I provided gave an example of a build broken by level 12 (far earlier if you consider the shenanigans you can accomplish very early into the build before wizards are even capable of casting teleport), that's 5+ levels earlier.

I'd also note that Aroden's Spellbane is very expensive to cast day to day, and frankly is not going to stop a wizard from getting instagibbed.

Aroden's spellbane has no cost, so it's not really very costly to cast especially since it protects you from something actually dangerous like say spells.

I misinterpreted the component. I thought it was a material instead of a focus. So, much better spell, but still, it'll only protect against a very few amount of spells. And most martials aren't using spells anyways. And again, it's a very, very late level spell.

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