GM Rogue Problem


Advice

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My group recently started a a new campaign together and so far everything is going fine, the group is awesome and the GM has not killed us all...yet.
The main problem is our skill monkey rogue.

So it has finally been revealed to me that the rogue is stealing my items, wondrous items, and gold regularly and has sold it for for gp.

My first reaction was to confront the rogue in game and stop him. He supposedly does and then later keeps stealing my gear.
Normally i went to the GM to get it sorted out after the session and he doesn't care and tells me to deal with it myself.
I later asked if i could just force the rogue player to reroll by either kicking his rogue out of the group or killing him,
both of which i could do extremely well. The GM, after running the idea by him, says that i can't. I asked if i could pin and tie him up and just carry him everywhere, still the GM says no.

So after looking around on wondrous items and forums i can't think of anything to stop the rogue reliably or make everyone else want to kill him.

So here i am asking this question, how do you defeat a skill monkey rogue without killing him?

Notes about situation to help-

-the rogue in question gets a +26 to all sleight of hand roles and normally takes 10 when stealing from me.
-i am a grabble based brawler and he has no ranks in escape artist
-i have 14300gp and we are in a metropolis so i can buy anything i want including wondrous items


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Kill him he made this PVP. Or report him to to the local authorities.


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Only one real question: Are you aware of this in-character? And if so is the rest of the group?


He's a lovable scamp, let him do his thing.


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Step one. Buy Elixir of sex shifting

Step 2: Lable it "Potion of Invisibility". Label and inventory all your other potions noting how a few seem to go missing.

Step 3. Keep strait face.


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It's very simple, stop playing with this group.

Pathfinder is a game for a group of friends to have fun playing with eachother, if you are not having fun, then you should confront your GM, which you did, and by his response, it seems he doesn't care if your having fun or not. That is a very bad GM to have, it is the GMs utmost crucial responsibility to make the game enjoyable for all of the players. If even one player isn't having fun, he is failing at being a GM, it's as simple as that.

Stop wasting your valuable time playing a game that isn't fun. You tried to be reasonable and ask them to change how they played, you even told the GM you didn't appreciate the PvP and he basically said, "F you, this is my game. You play it my way or not at all."

Also this seems like there may be a bit of favoritism at play. The GM is supposed to be completely neutral and unbiased and treat the players equally and fairly.

As I said, I would just find another group.


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Tell him to play an archaeolo—sorry, thought this was a different sort of "rogue problem".

There are two solutions to this: The sensible one, and the "like with like" one.

Sensible One: Talk to your GM again, assuming he's your friend. Point out he's giving you a problem you can't solve, so tell him to either make the rogue stop PvPing you (because robbing you is PvP) or let you fight back. Is the rogue a friend of the GM's? Could be some bias here.

Consider talking to the rogue's player, too. Explain to him your predicament. If he's a friend, he'll see that he's being petty and obnoxious (since you're incapable of fighting back, it's an unfair and unfun situation). Make him promise he'll stop—don't let him worm and half-truth, make him swear that he will rob you no more.

Like With Like: Fight back. You can't kill or trap him, so take the passive approach. Maybe see if you can get other PCs on board with this. How's his Perception? Search him him while he sleeps, since sleeping gives a -10 penalty to Perception. Maybe even just pin him and rob him that way—tell your GM you're doing the exact same thing he's doing, just with different abilities. Never injure him. Just take his gear. The GM has no right to call you out on it.

Also, try to pick up cursed items that need to be used to activate. Get a bag of devouring and let him try and rob it. Oops, did he want that hand?

If you aren't even allowed this much, the game's gone sour, and it's time to think about exit strategies. If the other players aren't friends, you shouldn't even really bother trying, since the GM and rogue player are both clearly asshats. I only give the lenient advice I give because you say you've played with them previously without a problem.


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Talk to him out of character. Explain that his in-character actions are harming your out-of-character enjoyment of the game. Do not try to solve this in character, you won't be able to.


fictionfan wrote:
Kill him he made this PVP. Or report him to to the local authorities.

Reporting to the local authorities is a great idea actually.

TarkXT wrote:
Only one real question: Are you aware of this in-character? And if so is the rest of the group?

The entire group knows but he is only stealing from me.

BigNorseWolf wrote:

Step one. Buy Elixir of sex shifting

Step 2: Lable it "Potion of Invisibility". Label and inventory all your other potions noting how a few seem to go missing.

Step 3. Keep strait face.

THIS IS THE BEST. YES. problem solved case closed.


Kill him, hopefully causing the DM some inconvenience, and leave the game. Because there's not really anything you can do if Player A is a t+~~, and so is the GM for allowing it to continue, especially while telling you you're not allowed to stop it in any way, basically,

Tell him to cut out the middle man and just give the Rogue 100% of everybody's s&~! since nobody's allowed to stop him from stealing. Apparently that's what the GM and this player want, so let them have it and move on.

137ben wrote:
Talk to him out of character. Explain that his in-character actions are harming your out-of-character enjoyment of the game. Do not try to solve this in character, you won't be able to.

According to the OP:

Already done, Rogue player told him "Yeah I'll stop" with his fingers crossed.

He went to the GM, and the GM told him politely to f&+# off.

No reason in sticking around. Cut and run before the Rogue sells the whole party into slavery and the GM runs 5 sessions of you guys doing nothing but rolling Profession: Miner checks while the Rogue sits around in some high class brothel or something stupid like that.


Like I said, the only reason I'm not with the others on "ditch the jerks" is that the OP implied he'd played with this group before without any problems. I'm assuming they're friends, too.


BigNorseWolf wrote:

Step one. Buy Elixir of sex shifting

Step 2: Lable it "Potion of Invisibility". Label and inventory all your other potions noting how a few seem to go missing.

Step 3. Keep strait face.

Thats a thing? I thought you could only do that through the cursed item. You may want to apologize to my GM because we made him have to kill all off the potion makers in an entire city just so me and the wizard could't blow our ENTIRE WBL to order a love potion to use on some other party mates.


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Stop letting him be the one to search the bodies after you win a fight.
Also invest heavily in perception, which someone in the group should be doing anyway.

Also while you may not see him steal your things if you keep them in a stored area he still can just open things without being noticed, and not seeing him still does not mean you do not notice they are gone. Tell everyone you want to search them upon the item going missing.

Is he only stealing from you?

If not then do what people would do in real life and vote him out of the party. Actually with a group of specialized killers he might be dead, but since the GM does not want you to kill him, sending him away might work.

Tell the town guard he stole from you.

Last but not least--->Find a new group. I put this last because when I put it first people tend to find a reason to not want to leave the group.


Rynjin wrote:
Already done, Rogue player told him "Yeah I'll stop" with his fingers crossed.

Actually, in fairness, that part was ingame. He hasn't talked to the player yet, and there's a remote chance the player's only crime is ignorance. There's an even thinner chance that the GM is just crappy and going with gut instinct "Uhhh, yeah, you can rob him, sounds fun. Uhhh, no, PvP is bad, don't do that. Wait, sorry, that troll's claw attack should've hit the paladin last session. Uhhh...let's rewind."


Yeah. I'd start reporting the guy to the authorities, and follow up with the potions.

You could sell him to a wizard as a skillmonkey familiar. Just attach a tail.

What you might also do is work with the other members of the group, and deny him healing so long as he does this. It's amazing how effective that is.

If you're not allowed to kill him, you can still knock him out, repeatedly, and leave him behind on adventures. Did he spend points in tracking?

I'd also point out that things like diplomacy and so on working on other PCs is a house rule. I forget the source, but it's in there somewhere.

If the group is otherwise good, and they just aren't dealing with this guy...I don't know, man.


1. Buy a magic item that lets you go without food and water.
2. Grapple him till he dies from starvation.
3. Convince the GM you are hugging him because you are friends and it is not PVP

Alternatively acquire a magic storage space that only you can access. That may need some house ruling. If it is still not working, beat him up and sacrifice him too an elder god for power.

Best one yet: Declare you knew he would do this and surrounded yourself with fake magic items. Now everyone who brought a weapon from him wants to kill him for selling them a fake.


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I keep reading "report him to the authorities" as an OOC course of action.

It must be getting late.


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Kobold Cleaver wrote:
Rynjin wrote:
Already done, Rogue player told him "Yeah I'll stop" with his fingers crossed.
Actually, in fairness, that part was ingame. He hasn't talked to the player yet, and there's a remote chance the player's only crime is ignorance. There's an even thinner chance that the GM is just crappy and going with gut instinct "Uhhh, yeah, you can rob him, sounds fun. Uhhh, no, PvP is bad, don't do that. Wait, sorry, that troll's claw attack should've hit the paladin last session. Uhhh...let's rewind."

Ah, then he should talk to the player.

Then when it inevitably happens again, either force the issue by saying "I pound the little weasel into a pile of mush" and hope the GM lets it stand (lel), or start singin' [url=https://soundcloud.com/the-theme-song/f~%~-this-s&~+-im-out]this song]/url] and find a better game.

Because playing his game will not end well. The GM isn't on your side. Thassit, game over, anything you try IC is automatically going to fail, because the GM doesn't want it to happen.

People with the personality of someone who plays the party thieving Rogue aren't usually the sort of people you can amicably sort things out with. IME they're doing it because they're dicks IRL too, but either can't get away with stealing IRL, or already lost all their previous friends by doing so, so they content themselves by stealing in-game instead.

Liberty's Edge

Depending on the length your willing to go it always comes down to what your willing to put up with. I recommend getting out if talks do not settle this immediately.

If your not willing to do that then:

BigNorseWolf wrote:

Step one. Buy Elixir of sex shifting

Step 2: Label it "Potion of Invisibility". Label and inventory all your other potions noting how a few seem to go missing.

Step 3. Keep strait face.

This is awesome, I highly recommend this. If your willing to put up with this some more, I might skip talks and start actively investing here to really screw with the Rogue.

From there it goes:
Pumping perception and religiously checking loot and raising suspicion of the other party and every in game NPC.

Or:

I would make it apparent it your GM that you (strongly) feel this is PVP and that it is unfair that the Rogue gets to do their shtick to you if you cannot respond in kind.


1st thing 1st, safty of your items.since he can't steal items you wear(unless gm rule otherwise,pants joke aside). get all your gear in one sack\backpack and get a glove of storing. you might even be able to store bag of holding,depand on your gm rulling ,since the glvoe basicly shrink the item not place it in a difrent dimantion.(hance the spell used to craft it and the phrase "While stored, the item has negligible weight")

as for teaching him a lession.gm says :
don't pin him and carry him. and don't kill him or force him out of party. ok you still have very ncie other options. dm dind't say you can't attack him.
knock him uncouncius or tie him down(not to carry around just fo rmaking him helpless) then do the old arebian nights fix cut off his hands .also loot him and leave him naked. he's still alive and in group. but i betch'ya he wont steal from you again.

if the GM object point out that if the rogue can do his shtick(stealing stuff) you can do yours(cutting and hurting people you don't like)


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While the Rogue player is being an ass, the real massive a$~~#%# here is the DM. "Settle in character issues in character," is a valid, if potentially problematic approach depending on the circumstance and your out of game take on what is happening. But playing favorites by arbitrarily restricting your actions while not the Rogue's because it would be un-fun for the person actively making it un-fun for you? Yeah... no, that's not fine.

Perhaps that's not the case and the DM is just vetoing the nuclear option (i.e. murder). Need more information there. If that's the case I'd consider an out of character talk with the Rogue and then in character non-lethally roughing him up and telling him that was the payment for his crimes against you and not to do it again. If the DM is just a massive ass, that probably wouldn't be allowed nor would the previously mentioned idea of just getting the Rogue thrown in jail.


To the large people who say to leave, no i am not leaving since these are the only pathfinder friends i got but anyways i would like as a follow up question

I thought about the potion idea and actually need to change the lable to something else. (yes the gm will allow this idea)

after looking at the potions i couldn't find a single one that a rogue with steal, let alone drink. The reason being he still has only stolen items that are either worth something (upwards of a 1000g) so i need it to be something he would drink rather than sell for flat money.

As a subquestion, what is a potion that a brawler would carry, and rogues would drink for the benefit?


if the GM is letting a player do this to you with no way to stop it then just KO the rouge take all his stuff and sell it and give the money away. After all he is using his skills to get your stuff, so use yours to get his.

If he is stealing from you with no kind of checks being made by you then the GM is helping him take your stuff ask them both why.


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HoneyBadger92 wrote:

To the large people who say to leave, no i am not leaving since these are the only pathfinder friends i got

Consider this an opportunity to find new ones. Trust me, it's often hard to tell exactly how bad your PF experience is until you have a better one to compare it with. My first GM was terrible at it, but I thought it was good until he shut down his game after throwing a tantrum and I had to find a better one.


tindin wrote:

if the GM is letting a player do this to you with no way to stop it then just KO the rouge take all his stuff and sell it and give the money away. After all he is using his skills to get your stuff, so use yours to get his.

If he is stealing from you with no kind of checks being made by you then the GM is helping him take your stuff ask them both why.

A potion of dex (if there is any) you got it for a armor boost, his rouge so it's almost everything bost.

potion of haste


why did it quote my post...sorry

Scarab Sages

Look at the most expensive potions (upleveled Barkskin comes to mind). +5 Natural Armor is good for anyone. You can also do stuff like Stoneskin potions as well, thanks to the Summoner class. Check them for cool potion ideas.


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HoneyBadger92 wrote:

To the large people who say to leave, no i am not leaving since these are the only pathfinder friends i got....

Are you saying these are the only friends you have or the only group you can find to play with?

If you mean the only group, then you can use roll20.net for online play, and it's free. I don't mean you get a trial subscription, and have to pay later. I mean it is 100% free unless you choose to pay for certain things.


maybe he doesn't want to insult his real lif frindes over one of them being a kinda dusch. heck my own borther used to try this on me every once in a while. i sitll game with him .he just learned better.

as for a potion that he'll drink as it doesn't cost much. go for invisability. the mere thought of geting free sneak attacks should apeal for him to keep that one. also if your gm allow. try other curse poitions as well(as cure is a 3rd level spell).


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Others have already said the sensible things to do before walking out: ask the player to stop OOC, ask again the DM to handle the situation.
I'll echo that, if neither of those work, leave: trying to resolve the whole thing IC will only bring to more drama. We play RPGs to have fun, not to put have with other's dick-ish behavior: in the end, it all can be summed up with the mantra often cited on these boards

'No gaming' is better than 'Bad gaming'


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Kill the Rogue. Take the flack. Use the moment to teach a lesson about PvP. If the Rogue wants to try and pull some frankly ludicrous actions such as this, he has to be willing to pay the piper.

If that doesn't go well, find a new group. Try Meetup.com.

That said, every group I have ever played with has had a strict no-pvp policy that includes theft. Unless you have a very specific type of group, it is, IMO, the best way to ensure that everyone stays happy.


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My suggestion, grapple him senseless and tie him up anyway. Tell the GM instead that you are not going to keep him tied up for long. just long enough to loot all his items and sell them. Use the proceeds to buy back everything which was stolen then donate the rest to charity.

If the rogue tries it again and the GM doesn't allow this to happen at all even if once or twice it means he is favoring the rogue so leave. its not worth it.

If you don't want to leave then its your own fault for suffering. Especially since the rest of the party members are completely apathetic.

Alternatively get your brawler killed in an awesome way at the next opportunity, reroll a paladin. The most lawful anal paladin to make this rogue and the rest of the party suffer.

Grand Lodge

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OP if your in Illinois anytime you can come play with us! Also let us know how this works out.


Let me see if i have understood it correctly:
The rogue character is stealing from your character.
DM told you to solve it in game.
You tried solving it in game by talking and didn't work.
You say to the DM that you are going to solve, in game, by beating/kicking/killing his character and the DM said no.

Am i correct on the above?


leo1925 wrote:

Let me see if i have understood it correctly:

The rogue character is stealing from your character.
DM told you to solve it in game.
You tried solving it in game by talking and didn't work.
You say to the DM that you are going to solve, in game, by beating/kicking/killing his character and the DM said no.

Am i correct on the above?

i think you mised the part the GM went to the rogue and asked him what he thinks of the op sugjestions : "The GM, after running the idea by him, says that i can't"

Grand Lodge

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Pathfinder Companion Subscriber

Are the DM and the Rogue player lovers?


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My suggestion:

Step 1) Grapple rogue.
Step 2) Pound rogue's head into the concrete. Don't kill him.
Step 3) Strip him of his gear and sell it to the local authorities for money.
Step 4) Shove that sex-changing elixir down his throat.
Step 5) Give him to the party cleric and act as if nothing ever happened.

Grand Lodge

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Pathfinder Companion Subscriber

So, wait, the DM is only allowing one kind of PvP, and only allowing it to be one-way?


Well...

Quote:

My first reaction was to confront the rogue in game and stop him. He supposedly does and then later keeps stealing my gear.

Normally i went to the GM to get it sorted out after the session and he doesn't care and tells me to deal with it myself.
I later asked if i could just force the rogue player to reroll by either kicking his rogue out of the group or killing him,
both of which i could do extremely well. The GM, after running the idea by him, says that i can't. I asked if i could pin and tie him up and just carry him everywhere, still the GM says no.

The PvP suggested here involved killing, booting, or hogtying the character perpetually. I'd HOPE a temporary thing, such as stripping him of his loot and selling it all, would work just fine. After all, it's exactly the same sort of PvP the rogue has been using against him.

If your DM doesn't allow that... I'd call shenanigans.

Grand Lodge

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Pathfinder Companion Subscriber

Go to the DM one last time.

Tell him if you cannot retaliate, or the Rogue player won't stop, then you can't play.

It is bullying. This is now an attack, at your expense.

You are there to have fun as well, and everyone's fun should matter.

Stress that point.

That should always, always, be the most important thing.


May i suggest approaching a wizard to craft a rather nasty cursed item, possibly a permanent negative level, of the rogues preferred type. If it is made properly it could appear as a normal magical item (that is better than whatever the rogue has) until wielded at which point the curse activates. Simply drop this item into the next treasure hoard, wait for the rogue to find and try it, wait for hilarity to ensue...
This is as an alternative to the potion

Grand Lodge

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Pathfinder Companion Subscriber

I find no in-game solution here.

This is an obvious out of game issue.


blackbloodtroll wrote:

I find no in-game solution here.

This is an obvious out of game issue.

I should maybe have added. Then quit the group leaving them to deal with the negative levels and curses


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On a side note, in character, your party members know he's stealing your belongings, and they do nothing? Not even stop him in a preemptive attempt at protecting their own s##@? And your character trusts these people with their life? They're asshat bandits, why would you put up with these people if you weren't held together by being player characters?

If your "friends" won't settle this with you like adults, and they won't let you settle it like a kid, then you can't win. Either leave the game or accept your flogging.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Companion Subscriber

They cannot do anything.

The DM has disallowed it.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

Oh, then why is this even a discussion? The Op probably needs to take their leave. This isn't a game of Pathfinder anymore, it's a Mexican soap opera with character sheets.


zza ni wrote:
leo1925 wrote:

Let me see if i have understood it correctly:

The rogue character is stealing from your character.
DM told you to solve it in game.
You tried solving it in game by talking and didn't work.
You say to the DM that you are going to solve, in game, by beating/kicking/killing his character and the DM said no.

Am i correct on the above?

i think you mised the part the GM went to the rogue and asked him what he thinks of the op sugjestions : "The GM, after running the idea by him, says that i can't"

Who can't do what?


Since the GM is allowing him to steal from you he obviously allows a certain amount of PvP. So turn the tables on him. Every morning when you wake up simply forcibly search him for your gear. Hold him down and take back your stuff and let him go. Don’t kill him simply take back your gear. Don’t harm him more than is necessary just be very firm with him.

Anytime something is missing search him. Purposely misplace something and blame it on him and search him. Think of it as a roleplaying opportunity instead of a problem.


The GM isn't allowing the OP's character to retaliate, apparently.

However he is allowed to cry, if he's so inclined.

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