I am thinking of using Ranger: Wild Hunter and Shapeshifter Archetypes, and perhaps a dip into Monk of The Four Winds, or vice versa.
With the Feral Combat Feat, any feat with Improved Unarmed as a prereq can be applied to Natural weapons, and therefore I can use Elemental Fist.
With the ranger combat style feats, I can grab WEapon Focus: Natural and either Aspect of The Beast (if no inherent Claws) or Improved Natural to bump to d6's.
The various animal aspects will offer circumstantial buffs to abilities.
Ideas:
Race: Human (w Aspect of the Beast for Claws), Skinwalker, Catfolk or Tiefling
Feats: Aspect of Beast, Weap Focus: Natural, Feral Combat, Imp Nat Weapon
Am I missing anything? I am picturing a Sabretooth or Wolfsbane esque melee skirmisher. Any thoughts?
I do not know a lot about Rangers, but I know that both solo Primal Companion Hunters and Alchemists do a VERY good job at being natural attackers.
I also suggest that you drop the idea of being human and go for being a Skinwalker because there is nothing you would rather be than a Skinwalker.
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/races/other-races/more-races/standard-races-1-10-rp /skinwalkers-10-rp
Rageborn if you can get it, since that allows you to grab the extra transformation for two hooves with your gore so with claws from Aspect of the Beast you can get 5 natural attacks.
Also since they have an SLA you can take Arcane Strike since a SLA counts as being able to cast spells with your character level used as your caster level. Arcane Strike is absurd with natural attacks.
He will be 5th or 6th level to start btw
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Rageborn Beastmorph Vivesectionist Alchemist 5th Level
1: Feat: Extra Feature
2: Discovery: Feral Mutagen
3: Arcane Strike
4: Discovery: Spontaneous Healing
5: Power Attack/Multiattack
Right you have 3d6 Sneak attack die, and attack with 2 Hooves at 1d4 (Secondary attacks), 1 Gore at 1d6, 2 claws at 1d6, and 1 bite for 1d8.
Additionally all these attacks have a +2 damage thanks to Arcane strike
So you deal a minimum of 18 damage if everything hits and rolls a 1 without sneak attack die. That is your minimum damage once you have hulked out.
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Whilst a force of nature natural attack beast is incredibly fun to play, do bear in mind the level of game mastery of the rest of your party. If you're going to be dealing as much damage as the rest of them combined perhaps spend some time trying to help them optimise as well so that their characters as the best they can be and can contribute meaningfully, otherwise, through no real fault of your own you might end up with bad feelings when you're soloing encounters and the others are left simply feeling like cheerleaders for your character.
At higher levels, consider Feral Combat Training and the first two Dragon Style feats. Also, with that many attacks a 1 level dip in Archeologist Bard and the Lingering performance feat (probably best at 7th level) + starting with the Fates favoured trait will give you a huge hit/damage increase essentially all day for a relatively reasonable investment (plus Saving Finale which is an amazing spell as well as a ton of good skills) if you want to be even more op and you think your party won't give up and go home when they hear how much damage you do ;)
Damn Shrouded...that's nuts!
Thus far the party is: 5 Inquisitor (Ranged Based), 5 Starsoul Sorceror, 4/1 Fighter/Barb (Brutal Pugilist), and 4/1 Cleric/Ranger (Corpse Hunter)
Pretty decent at damage already, and lacking a little in skills, so that's why I was thinking Ranger.
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With even a 14 Int, Alchemists get as many skill points as a Ranger so if skills is something you want then they're set and are pretty equal given what skills are class ones (also the Bard dip I suggest above would lock this down even more at 7th, every knowledge skill and a bunch more skill points).
Half orc with toothy racial trait, barbarian with beast tootem. That will net you 3 primary natural attacks when raging. And will serve you with no problems until at least level 10 and then you get pounce:)
To be fair, most GMs will make you roll for which Skinwalker type you end up, and that is taking things to their absolute extreme.
Even without being Ragebred and Mix-maxed to insanity, like say a default Tiefling, you still have access to Arcane strike and 3 natural attacks plus an extra feat to spend.
Lowers your damage to more reasonable levels while still allowing you to be pretty scary. Claw+Claw+Bite is plenty powerful, especially with sneak attack die.
Alternatively to that, someone once recommended to me a Swordmaster/Scout Tiger trance Tengu rogue.
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/races/other-races/featured-races/arg-tengu/swordmas ter-rogue-tengu
With Scout and Charge from level 4 onward if you beat their CMD you can charge and make a full attack with sneak attack die.
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To be fair, most GMs will make you roll for which Skinwalker type you end up, and that is taking things to their absolute extreme.
Even without being Ragebred and Mix-maxed to insanity, like say a default Tiefling, you still have access to Arcane strike and 3 natural attacks plus an extra feat to spend.
Lowers your damage to more reasonable levels while still allowing you to be pretty scary. Claw+Claw+Bite is plenty powerful, especially with sneak attack die.
Alternatively to that, someone once recommended to me a Swordmaster/Scout Tiger trance Tengu rogue.
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/races/other-races/featured-races/arg-tengu/swordmas ter-rogue-tengu
With Scout and Charge from level 4 onward if you beat their CMD you can charge and make a full attack with sneak attack die.
Tieflings only get claw/claw or bite. So to get 3 natural attacks as a tiefling you need to take claw/claw plus the social adopted trait for the racial orc trait Tusked. So your other trait can neither be social nor racial. It's definitely a good option, but it's not as straight forward as what you wrote implies.
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The problem with feral combat training is that you need to take it for EACH natural weapon type you have. If you are an Aasimar Ranger/Wolfscarred oracle/Whitehaired Witch with wing attacks and a helm of the mammoth lords for Claw/Claw/Bite/Hair/Wing/Wing/Gore you would need to take Feral Combat training 5 times.
Tieflings only get claw/claw or bite. So to get 3 natural attacks as a tiefling you need to take claw/claw plus the social adopted trait for the racial orc trait Tusked. So your other trait can neither be social nor racial. It's definitely a good option, but it's not as straight forward as what you wrote implies.To be fair, most GMs will make you roll for which Skinwalker type you end up, and that is taking things to their absolute extreme.
Even without being Ragebred and Mix-maxed to insanity, like say a default Tiefling, you still have access to Arcane strike and 3 natural attacks plus an extra feat to spend.
Lowers your damage to more reasonable levels while still allowing you to be pretty scary. Claw+Claw+Bite is plenty powerful, especially with sneak attack die.
Alternatively to that, someone once recommended to me a Swordmaster/Scout Tiger trance Tengu rogue.
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/races/other-races/featured-races/arg-tengu/swordmas ter-rogue-tengu
With Scout and Charge from level 4 onward if you beat their CMD you can charge and make a full attack with sneak attack die.
Tieflings get both when they are alchemists with Feral Mutagen, which is what I was commenting about. ^_^
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The problem with feral combat training is that you need to take it for EACH natural weapon type you have. If you are an Aasimar Ranger/Wolfscarred oracle/Whitehaired Witch with wing attacks and a helm of the mammoth lords for Claw/Claw/Bite/Hair/Wing/Wing/Gore you would need to take Feral Combat training 5 times.
Yeah that's always a problem with FCT and natural attack builds. Also, sadly there's nothing that implies you can take Feral Combat training more than once, that can solved however if you're willing to spend some feats and a serious dip via Human or Racial Heritage Human, 4 levels of Fighter and Martial Versatility, quite an effort all told.
Alternatively a Rage-Born Beast Totem Barbarian gets a similar set-up.
Pick up Animal Fury and Lesser Beast Totem. That way you can get Gore/Bite/Hoof/Hoof/Claw/Claw. You're losing out on sneak attack damage but your high strength means you'll be dealing more static damage on each of those natural attacks. Plus at level 10 you'll be able to get pounce through the Beast Totem line.
Rageborn Beastmorph Vivesectionist Alchemist 5th Level
1: Feat: Extra Feature
2: Discovery: Feral Mutagen
3: Arcane Strike
4: Discovery: Spontaneous Healing
5: Power Attack/MultiattackRight you have 3d6 Sneak attack die, and attack with 2 Hooves at 1d4 (Secondary attacks), 1 Gore at 1d6, 2 claws at 1d6, and 1 bite for 1d8.
Additionally all these attacks have a +2 damage thanks to Arcane strike
So you deal a minimum of 18 damage if everything hits and rolls a 1 without sneak attack die. That is your minimum damage once you have hulked out.
Sorry to nitpick, my understanding was alchemists do not qualify for Arcane Strike as they don't cast arcane spells--when has this changed?
A less optimized but IMO fun and versatile combination is bard/dragon disciple; see Oterisk's guide here on the forums for details.
Ruyan.
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Rageborn Beastmorph Vivesectionist Alchemist 5th Level
1: Feat: Extra Feature
2: Discovery: Feral Mutagen
3: Arcane Strike
4: Discovery: Spontaneous Healing
5: Power Attack/MultiattackRight you have 3d6 Sneak attack die, and attack with 2 Hooves at 1d4 (Secondary attacks), 1 Gore at 1d6, 2 claws at 1d6, and 1 bite for 1d8.
Additionally all these attacks have a +2 damage thanks to Arcane strike
So you deal a minimum of 18 damage if everything hits and rolls a 1 without sneak attack die. That is your minimum damage once you have hulked out.
Sorry to nitpick, my understanding was alchemists do not qualify for Arcane Strike as they don't cast arcane spells--when has this changed?
A less optimized but IMO fun and versatile combination is bard/dragon disciple; see Oterisk's guide here on the forums for details.
Ruyan.
Skinwalkers get a SLA, I don't remember what rageborn get though.
Another alternative: Tengu Ninja. Swap the sword proficiency for claws, giving you a Claw/Claw/Bite routine. Take Weapon Finesse, Unarmed Combat Training, and Two Weapon Fighting, which gives you 5 attacks when full attacking by level 3, albeit with -2/-2/-5/-5/-5 on the attacks prior to BAB and other mods.
Nothing to turn on, nothing with durations. It's just there and it can all Sneak Attack.
THanks guys! Great info!
Amieko sizes you up and pours a beer from the leaky keg, then slides it in front of you. She inhales deeply and the patrons perk up, knowing she was once again going to tell a tale. Beast with claws, hu? Let me tell you the story of the cunning ratfolk of chelliax. Well most folks steer clear of that area, least those with sense enough to disregard devils. But at the heart of the city a group emerged, calling themselves the children of westcrown and proceeded to make life there much more bearable. Anyways, in this group was ratfolk that was dabbling with alchemy. He would prepare all sorts of ingredients that smelled foul, then quaff them without a blink. His fur got shaggier, his claws grew longer, and his fangs grew out. I suppose the stress of fighting devils and the amount of concoctions he drank eventually got to him. He started acting different in the bestial form and became more agressive and cruel to those that opposed him. He became more withdrawn and I believe he still lurks in the sewers. He became powerful at quite a cost, and he surely is best avoided.
Fighter - Mutation Warrior is an alternative.
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does the rageborn SLA speak with animals count? Cause arcane strike says you need to be able to cast arcane spells and speak with animals pops up on ranger and druid list who are divine casters.
From the FAQ, it counts as the druid version, so divine.
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You'd only get a claw/claw/bite or weapon/weapon/bite routine even with two weapon fighting since your hands would be preoccupied using the claws/weapons. You would not have 5 attacks at level 3, you would have 3 (0/0/-5 or -2/-2/-5)Another alternative: Tengu Ninja. Swap the sword proficiency for claws, giving you a Claw/Claw/Bite routine. Take Weapon Finesse, Unarmed Combat Training, and Two Weapon Fighting, which gives you 5 attacks when full attacking by level 3, albeit with -2/-2/-5/-5/-5 on the attacks prior to BAB and other mods.
Nothing to turn on, nothing with durations. It's just there and it can all Sneak Attack.
He's taking unarmed so his weapon/weapon is kick/kick. So he can use claw/claw in this case.
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You'd only get a claw/claw/bite or weapon/weapon/bite routine even with two weapon fighting since your hands would be preoccupied using the claws/weapons. You would not have 5 attacks at level 3, you would have 3 (0/0/-5 or -2/-2/-5)Another alternative: Tengu Ninja. Swap the sword proficiency for claws, giving you a Claw/Claw/Bite routine. Take Weapon Finesse, Unarmed Combat Training, and Two Weapon Fighting, which gives you 5 attacks when full attacking by level 3, albeit with -2/-2/-5/-5/-5 on the attacks prior to BAB and other mods.
Nothing to turn on, nothing with durations. It's just there and it can all Sneak Attack.
You could use unarmed strikes+TWF for UAS/UAS/Claw/Claw/Bite, at -2/-2/-5/-5/-5
But since the claw is using up the attacks granted to the hand, you can't make those unarmed attacks even if it doesn't use your "hand" per se. I used your logic to say that I could unarmed strike during spell combat when I had +6/+1 while still using a weapon in the main hand. I was given the reason I just described above as the reason why it can't be done. Apparently, once a limb has has been used for an attack (even if other limbs could be used to make that attack) you can't use that attack.You'd only get a claw/claw/bite or weapon/weapon/bite routine even with two weapon fighting since your hands would be preoccupied using the claws/weapons. You would not have 5 attacks at level 3, you would have 3 (0/0/-5 or -2/-2/-5)Another alternative: Tengu Ninja. Swap the sword proficiency for claws, giving you a Claw/Claw/Bite routine. Take Weapon Finesse, Unarmed Combat Training, and Two Weapon Fighting, which gives you 5 attacks when full attacking by level 3, albeit with -2/-2/-5/-5/-5 on the attacks prior to BAB and other mods.
Nothing to turn on, nothing with durations. It's just there and it can all Sneak Attack.
You could use unarmed strikes+TWF for UAS/UAS/Claw/Claw/Bite, at -2/-2/-5/-5/-5
Thing is claws are tied to "hands at the end of your arm" and IUS aren't, and since natural attacks can be added onto ANY full attack (that doesn't expressly forbid it) making your IUS with kicks leaves claws open all legal. Only in regards of TWF do you have "hands" that are effective effort hands limiting what you can do with TWF. These don't interact with natural attacks at all.
Regarding this post:
"Alternatively a Rage-Born Beast Totem Barbarian gets a similar set-up.
Pick up Animal Fury and Lesser Beast Totem. That way you can get Gore/Bite/Hoof/Hoof/Claw/Claw. You're losing out on sneak attack damage but your high strength means you'll be dealing more static damage on each of those natural attacks. Plus at level 10 you'll be able to get pounce through the Beast Totem line."
How are you picking up the Gore and the Hoof/Hoof?
There is a feat that allows you to select additional "beastmorph" features.
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That does, however, bring up an interesting question: Would it be possible to use Two-Weapon fighting to attack with a two-handed weapon (say, a greatsword) held in both hands and an unarmed strike using a kick or head butt? The two-weapon fighting rules don't restrict what type of primary weapon you can use, and the barbazu beard and armor spike weapon descriptions seem to imply that it might work.
No
Armor Spikes: Can I use two-weapon fighting to make an "off-hand" attack with my armor spikes in the same round I use a two-handed weapon?
No.
Likewise, you couldn't use an armored gauntlet to do so, as you are using both of your hands to wield your two-handed weapon, therefore your off-hand is unavailable to make any attacks.
Unarmed strikes are considered manufactured weapons, and you can't use more than "two hands worth" of manufactured weapons in a full attack. That is why you can't kick/kick/punch/punch/headbutt all unarmed strikes in one full attack.
We have a Druid 4/Barb 3 monstrosity in our current campaign, and he does a great job of killing stuff. By taking shaping focus he'll get up to the level 8 version of wild shape, and since rage and wild shape strength bonuses stack, he gets to around 30 strength with both active. Next level he unlocks allosaurus and rake, which will be an upgrade over his current pouncing dire tiger. The four levels of Druid also let him pick up some nice spells from a driud domain (he took growth so he could cast enlarge person in the early levels, and barkskin now). The biggest drawback is that it's feat intensive. He had to spend 2 feats on shaping focus and wild speech, and natural spell would be useful to have too.