I ask because I'm still a relatively new GM and have two players in a custom home-brewed campaign I'm doing right now, however I haven't had the time to write out any of the encounters and barely any of the story (not great on figuring out proper encounter difficulty since new), so i'm considering going to an AP (skull and shackles, rise of rune lords, etc..) so that they could just play a previously built world while I try to find time to work on my own campaign.
I don't really have any other players willing (or wanted) right now. So, is an AP doable with just two players? Or will one have to go through a lot to tweak encounters and even story?
Well, they're designed with the assumption that you'll have a part of 4, so you'd need to tweak a bit, or just have each play 2 characters.
They could run two characters each. RotRL is for four people, so from a difficulty standpoint it should be fine.
Roleplaying and in-character interactions, not so much, but that's how things go when you've only got two players.
Have you considered using gestalt rules? 2 well-built gestalt characters should be able to handle most anything written for a 15 point buy party of 4. Give them a more generous point buy or let them roll for stats and ensure that their builds are at least somewhat optimized. The only place they should notice a marked difference is with their action economy compared to a larger, less optimized group and you can always lower the number of baddies they have to fight in each individual encounter if you find they are really struggling for it.
The gestalt idea is an interesting possibility. I had to look it up since I've never played it before. That being said I think they might enjoy something like that.
I'll ask them how they'd feel about playing two separate characters each, but they may feel bogged down trying to answer for both.
Have you considered using gestalt rules? 2 well-built gestalt characters should be able to handle most anything written for a 15 point buy party of 4. Give them a more generous point buy or let them roll for stats and ensure that their builds are at least somewhat optimized. The only place they should notice a marked difference is with their action economy compared to a larger, less optimized group and you can always lower the number of baddies they have to fight in each individual encounter if you find they are really struggling for it.
This is good advice, though I should highlight that two gestalts are definitely weaker than four characters. It is a sort of compromise between having more people and having multiple characters to a person, though.
Don't use a 15 point buy. Use 20, minimum. My group uses 25 and there's no problem (we too are running RotRL, and we're a new group, too) and, in fact, the problem is closer to "too weak" than "too strong" because of poor battle planning. If you use gestalts, I would lower the minions for most of the encounters.
http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2rcbb?Pathfinder-class-tiers
Sure they are. All you need is a single T1 character...according to this thread. So having two should make any AP a joke. Becuase those T1 characters are worth like 3 Fighters...or something like that.
I highly suggest the "system mastery" Wizard archtype.
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Now to be serious - give it a shot. They might acutally suprise you.
I think I may go the gestalt way. If I see them having extreme trouble, I'll back down on the enemies if possible.
They're both quite experienced, one especially so who is quite good at both RP and team work. So, they may just be able to handle it.
You could add a DMPC with a supporting role - help them with buffs and healing, but let them take the main stage.
I do that when DMing for my 2 kids.
You might be able to get by if you have summoning focused characters. That should help solve the action economy problems.
Still, I would probably want to gestalt on top of that because:
1.) Having poor saves would be brutal. Losing 1 player means a lot of your fighting force is gone. So Good saves minimizes this chance without ruining balance too much
2.) A lot of the summoning classes have 2+Int skill points per level. While some of those classes are Int based casters...I would still feel more comfortable throwing in a bit of ranger for 6+int skill points so you guys can cover as much as possible.
3.) Having good armor and hp is important since things just fall apart if you are torn apart in the surprise round. Getting some armor friendly casters (clerics, oracles, summoners, etc) would help to solve that problem.
Throwing them an cleric NPC might also help them out a lot, since there would someone who could both heal and deal with problems like conditions if they come up. Just make the guy reluctant help who doesn't exactly follow their commands (so he picks his own spells and feats) and it shouldn't be too much of a problem.
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Running with more players is easier to modify than running for less in my experience.
Some things that may help is having the 2 players higher level than the AP suggests.
2 second level players could handle a first level encounter relatively well. It would be a fine balance to reach though.
Provide more healing than normal.
Some class choices could handle this better than others. Everyone talks about god like casters, but I'd seriously consider a casting martial (paladin, ranger etc), and a full caster like cleric, oracle, summoner. Those casters can do well in combat as well as utility spells.
Be prepared to throw specialist magic items above wealth per level that lets them deal with invis, flying, teleport etc if they're not capable of dealing etc.
Leadership feat is a good option as well.
Those ideas should let you run the APs with less modification on your end.
Cheers
My wife is going to run me through Jade Regent solo.
I'm playing a Gestalt Summoner/Druid. That shouldn't be a problem. :D
I ask because I'm still a relatively new GM and have two players in a custom home-brewed campaign I'm doing right now, however I haven't had the time to write out any of the encounters and barely any of the story (not great on figuring out proper encounter difficulty since new), so i'm considering going to an AP (skull and shackles, rise of rune lords, etc..) so that they could just play a previously built world while I try to find time to work on my own campaign.
I don't really have any other players willing (or wanted) right now. So, is an AP doable with just two players? Or will one have to go through a lot to tweak encounters and even story?
Just let the Players play 2 PCs each. This resolves your issues.
You can also just give each PC 2 levels to bring them up to where they are supposed to be CR wise.Alternatively you could allow PCs to roll initiative twice a round and double their HP and any consumable/uses per day abilities they have. Doubling the times per day the Cleric can channel energy, spells per day, and such. This equalizes action economy to where it should be, and is essentially the same as having multiples of the same character in a party.
2 min/maxed 25-30 point buy can easily destroy any AP. Period.
two members party adventures can be epic.
Also keep in mind that every good hero needs a lancer to balance him out.
You could probably get away, quite nicely I might add, with one PC playing a pragmatically skilled and physically imposing Crusader Cleric and the other a knowledge based high save oriented Wizard. Two of the most powerful classes in the game built to support one another is going to end with them being able to deal with pretty much everything.
Crafting will play a bigger role since it will mean that the Cleric and Wizard gain access to each other's abilities in potion form.
Honestly so long as you have your bases at least somewhat covered, the majority of the game falls into place on its own. If the Cleric is a battle cleric who is built to be an unmovable wall and the Wizard is built to dominate people or summon armies, then they will do just fine. The major point is that they have to realize how dependent on one another they are.
Matching CR's works on paper but as was already noted one failed save (or lucky hit by the bad guys) and half the party's offensive power is gone.Just let the Players play 2 PCs each. This resolves your issues.
You can also just give each PC 2 levels to bring them up to where they are supposed to be CR wise...
It could be offered that instead the failed save only effects 1 of the character's 2 initiative orders, thereby allowing him to continue moving and acting so long as he does not fail two disabling saves.
Give them mythic tier if you can, it's solving a lots of classes's weakeneses. ´
