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One that can sunder weapons/Armour/shields as a tactic,
Then when you get really mad, make a whole spell of any level disappear?
HULK DOSNT LIKE WIZARD SMASH SMASH WALL OF FORCE! BAM!
SMASHY SPELLS!
I've been wanting to make either a grapple, trip, or critical, truely number of attacks, based barbarian.
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I would definitely put constitution before dexterity, and sometimes even before strength.
Feats to get: Power Attack, and that's the only hard requirement.
Rage Powers of note: Superstition is probably the biggest, but it's also hated by many, as it makes you harder to heal. A high constitution helps alleviate this a bit, as does fortification armour.
So here's the rough build. Again, I'm shooting to try to be mechanically relevant in some way outside of combat. Thoughts?
Barb, level 1
Half-orc
Favored Class Bonus = +1 skill pointSuperstitious
Str=18
Con=14
Dex=14
Int=10
Wis=8
Cha=12Wpn=Great Sword
Armor=Studded LeatherTraits
Armor Expert
Suspicious
Better to put some more points in the Wisdom Ability, if not your barbarian will be very fragile to mind effects even with rage and superstition. Intelligence could be the 8 pts ability but if you can avoid negative bonifiers better to move it to a minimun of 10.
First, congratulations on your decision to play the best class.
Moving on.
Half orc barbarians are an odd bird. You get the floating +2, but they just don't have as good of saves as a human with the superstition favored class bonus. I'd recommend taking iron will or a higher wisdom. Or both. Also, I highly recommend spell sunder. Nasty wall of force blocking your path? With a simple sunder check, it's gone. Dispel magic that isn't actually dispel magic at all on a stick outside of battle, and once each rage in battle is to die for.
I also recommend raging vitality to avoid dying, and strength surge to win any cmb or cmd roll instantly 1/rage
Like spell sunder, for instance.
Raging Vitality is great, and after that and power attack, feats are pretty wide open.
Going to want the beast totem pounce at higher level, so why not grab the toothy h-orc trait to max your natural attacks in early game, in late game you'll probably ignore the claws but still will have that bite as a free secondary pip to your full attacks. You can use your falchion or grtsword or preferably bardiche on the charge before you get pounce, then drop it to full attack once in range.
Iron will and improved, combat maneuvers, extra rage powers, plenty of room as you level to pick what seems fun, since raw str plus power attack will probably give you enough damage to feel badass without optimizing further. At highest levels, the come and get me, dazing assault combo is pretty groovy, the surprise attack is another nice one to get an easy aoo here and there. If you go with the bardiche, then combat reflexes is nifty.
Invulnerable / drunken brute is a great archetype combo, get your enlarge person potions swigged as a move action when you don't want to charge or full attack, the extra dr is cool but dependant on how much you miss the lost abilities.
First, congratulations on your decision to play the best class.
Moving on.
Half orc barbarians are an odd bird. You get the floating +2, but they just don't have as good of saves as a human with the superstition favored class bonus. I'd recommend taking iron will or a higher wisdom. Or both. Also, I highly recommend spell sunder. Nasty wall of force blocking your path? With a simple sunder check, it's gone. Dispel magic that isn't actually dispel magic at all on a stick outside of battle, and once each rage in battle is to die for.
I also recommend raging vitality to avoid dying, and strength surge to win any cmb or cmd roll instantly 1/rage
Like spell sunder, for instance.
Also if your GM likes to use long duration spells that are harmful like bestow curse you can spell sunder those to get the evil magic out of the allies.
You could take step up but be aware this uses an immediate action and will make you stay in people's faces when they take a 5 foot step.
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I've been playing around with Rage Powers and have come to the conclusion that there are three rage powers that I REALLY want for my barbarian build: Reckless Abandon, Spell Sunder and Greater Beast Totem. Since two of those have two pre-reqs EACH, it is tough to fit them all into the build. Bottom line? You have to take the Extra Rage Power feat a couple of time to get all of the Rage Powers that I wanted to have by level 10.
Here's the breakdown:
1) Feat: Toughness (+ Weapon Focus, if Human)
2) RP: Reckless Abandon
3) Feat: Raging Vitality
4) RP: Superstition
5) Feat: Power Attack
6) RP: Witch Hunter
7) Feat: Extra Rage Power: Spell Sunder
8) RP: Lesser Beast Totem
9) Feat: Extra Rage Power: Beast Totem (Prereq: level 6)
10) RP: Greater Beast Totem (Prereq: level 10)
11) Feat: Improved Critical
I'd highly recommend going Invulnerable Rager for the DR, especially since your AC isn't going to be great (not a lot of room for DEX if you are focusing on high STR -- and Reckless Abandon kinda tanks your AC at mid levels and beyond).
So here's the rough build. Again, I'm shooting to try to be mechanically relevant in some way outside of combat. Thoughts?
Barb, level 1
Half-orc
Favored Class Bonus = +1 skill pointSuperstitious
Str=18
Con=14
Dex=14
Int=10
Wis=8
Cha=12Wpn=Great Sword
Armor=Studded LeatherTraits
Armor Expert
Suspicious
I'd switch Chr for Int and drop the Dex by 1 to 13 increasing INT to 13 so you can get Combat Expertise and then Stalwart. Then take the the Invulnerable Rager and at level 12 you'd have DR 17/- and a -4 to hit. You get 6 as a class feature, 3 for raging, and 8 for Improved Stalwart.
Going to want the beast totem pounce at higher level, so why not grab the toothy h-orc trait to max your natural attacks in early game, in late game you'll probably ignore the claws but still will have that bite as a free secondary pip to your full attacks. You can use your falchion or grtsword or preferably bardiche on the charge before you get pounce, then drop it to full attack once in range.
I keep seeing folks taking the beast totem tree but then ignoring the claws. Is say a level 10 Claw-Claw-Bite barbarian that much of a poor choice over a greatsword-bite build?
CCB attacks +10 claw (d8+str), +10 claw (d8+str), +10 bite (d4+str)
Greatsword attacks +10 sword (2d6+1.5 str), +5 sword (2d6+1.5str), +5 bite (d4+.5str)
The greatsword does more damage per strike but how likely are the greatsword barbarians last two attacks to hit?
I am clearly missing something. Could someone point me to the clue dispenser?
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Going to want the beast totem pounce at higher level, so why not grab the toothy h-orc trait to max your natural attacks in early game, in late game you'll probably ignore the claws but still will have that bite as a free secondary pip to your full attacks. You can use your falchion or grtsword or preferably bardiche on the charge before you get pounce, then drop it to full attack once in range.
I keep seeing folks taking the beast totem tree but then ignoring the claws. Is say a level 10 Claw-Claw-Bite barbarian that much of a poor choice over a greatsword-bite build?
CCB attacks +10 claw (d8+str), +10 claw (d8+str), +10 bite (d4+str)
Greatsword attacks +10 sword (2d6+1.5 str), +5 sword (2d6+1.5str), +5 bite (d4+.5str)
The greatsword does more damage per strike but how likely are the greatsword barbarians last two attacks to hit?
I am clearly missing something. Could someone point me to the clue dispenser?
There are a couple reasons to not focus just on claws. One, improving them requires an amulet of mighty fists, and a greatsword is a lot cheaper to improve. Two, you only have claws while raging, and there may be situations where you cannot.
Looking at the build, I'd really suggest moving Power Attack right to number 1, and also fitting in Iron Will. Will saves suck, and the sooner you can look at any will save and say "HAH", the better.
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Let me take the discussion in another direction...
Be a character - not a set of stats and feats.
You want to be relevant out of combat? What skills are you taking and what traits? With the Highlander trait you get access to Stealth as a class skill. Coupled with Survival? You are now a scout.
Will a ranger or a rogue likely be better? Likely but it doesn't hurt when you are closing on some badguys.
LOL..."Be a character" means don't focus on stats and feats, but focus instead on skills? I'm not sure that I understand what you are getting at, there.
Let me take the discussion in another direction...
Be a character - not a set of stats and feats.
You want to be relevant out of combat? What skills are you taking and what traits? With the Highlander trait you get access to Stealth as a class skill. Coupled with Survival? You are now a scout.
Will a ranger or a rogue likely be better? Likely but it doesn't hurt when you are closing on some badguys.
You're a madman.
Stealth isn't bad - it allows your barbarian to get where he wants - CLOSE without worrying about damage on the way in.
While I agree with you there, I would like to point out that a hasted-flying-mount-charge-pounce does much the same thing, only without the die roll and from the edge of where the enemy can possibly see you.
Why not let the rogue stealth in, drop the barbarian bomb and then let the rogue sneak around into flanking while everyone's going 'OH SHIZ ITS A BARBARIAN ON A FREAKING DIRE BAT OUT OF NOWHERE!!!'
(Which is generally the reaction.)
Stealth isn't bad - it allows your barbarian to get where he wants - CLOSE without worrying about damage on the way in.While I agree with you there, I would like to point out that a hasted-flying-mount-charge-pounce does much the same thing, only without the die roll and from the edge of where the enemy can possibly see you.
Why not let the rogue stealth in, drop the barbarian bomb and then let the rogue sneak around into flanking while everyone's going 'OH SHIZ ITS A BARBARIAN ON A FREAKING DIRE BAT OUT OF NOWHERE!!!'
(Which is generally the reaction.)
When I imagine AM BARBARIAN's Batty Bat charge, I see Batty Bat doing a barrel roll straight down on the squishy that makes the lance into a drill from the heavens. I worked out the damage, though I added Raging Brutality (cause squishy need die harder), and came out with something akin to 1140 damage with a x5 crit. Also, could Batty Bat just be a vampire cohort? xD
ON TOPIC:
If you want to go full crazy BARBARIAN SMASH *foams at mouth* I would suggest the Wild Rager + Superstitious Archetypes, Extra attack on a pounce (though -8 to AC, but who cares?) and a ton of little bonuses like Darkvision, Lowlight Vision, Scent, Blindsense and Blindsight. Pick human for that free ignore exhaustion/fatigue trait Heart of the Fields, Favored Class bonus and bonus feat for fun times.
Lvl 1 Feat: Raging Vitality
Human Feat: Power Attack
Lvl 2 Rage Power: Reckless Abandon
Lvl 3 Feat: Improved Sunder
Lvl 4 Rage Power: Superstitious
Lvl 5 Feat: Rage Power: Witch Hunter
Lvl 6 Rage Power: Beat Totem, Lesser
Lvl 7 Feat: Rage Power: Spell Sunder
Lvl 8 Rage Power: Beast Totem
Lvl 9 Feat: Extra Rage Power: Strength Surge
Lvl 10 Rage Power: Beast Totem, Greater
Look into Feats like Raging Brutality and Greater Sunder as you level up, and bump your will save if you can. Drop your Cha as far as it will go to further hinder the save DC on Confusion. 10+lvl+Cha modifier.
Weapon you want to get would either be a Greatsword or grab Exotic Weapon Proficiency Bastard Sword and get an enlarged one. -2 for wrong size, but larger hit dice.
Don't worry about armor, but an Adamantine breastplate gives DR (which my build lacks) as well as access to things like Fortification.
As far as magic items, pick up a Ring of Sustenance ASAP, because it lets you recharge your Rage Powers after a tiny two hour nap.
Going to be honest, Barbarians are probly the class I enjoy playing most. Good luck and happy smashing!
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Drop your Cha as far as it will go to further hinder the save DC on Confusion. 10+lvl+Cha modifier.
Whatsat?? The DC of the confusion save is based on the CASTER'S CHA, not the target's CHA.
Weapon you want to get would either be a Greatsword or grab Exotic Weapon Proficiency Bastard Sword and get an enlarged one. -2 for wrong size, but larger hit dice.
The bastard sword suggestion is very bad advice for a barbarian. Pretty much for most any class, actually, given the alternative exotic weapons that are out there -- and the similarity between a longsword and a bastard sword.
Drop your Cha as far as it will go to further hinder the save DC on Confusion. 10+lvl+Cha modifier.Whatsat?? The DC of the confusion save is based on the CASTER'S CHA, not the target's CHA.
Weapon you want to get would either be a Greatsword or grab Exotic Weapon Proficiency Bastard Sword and get an enlarged one. -2 for wrong size, but larger hit dice.The bastard sword suggestion is very bad advice for a barbarian. Pretty much for most any class, actually, given the alternative exotic weapons that are out there -- and the similarity between a longsword and a bastard sword.
You're thinking of the spell, I'm referring the Wild Rager archetype. Y'know, like I said in my post?
The bastard sword is in no way the optimized weapon, but when you're rolling 2d8 for damage dice, 3d8 when enlarged, it has an amazing feel to it. Being a barbarian is all about smacking things around with a massive 1H weapon, not about a DPR pissing contest.
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The BS isn't 2d8. And Conan almost always fought with a 2H weapon...
The bastard sword is in no way the optimized weapon, but when you're rolling 2d8 for damage dice, 3d8 when enlarged, it has an amazing feel to it. Being a barbarian is all about smacking things around with a massive 1H weapon, not about a DPR pissing contest.
an enlarged BS is though is 2d8, take more care when reading
grab Exotic Weapon Proficiency Bastard Sword and get an enlarged one. -2 for wrong size, but larger hit dice.
And to be honest i'm starting to think that using a one handed weapon isn't all that bad. you can always run around two handing it, but when the time comes there is always the option to use a shield, or keep that potion of enlarge person handy
The BS isn't 2d8. And Conan almost always fought with a 2H weapon...
The bastard sword is in no way the optimized weapon, but when you're rolling 2d8 for damage dice, 3d8 when enlarged, it has an amazing feel to it. Being a barbarian is all about smacking things around with a massive 1H weapon, not about a DPR pissing contest.
That was a typo on my part, meant to say 2H.
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The BS isn't 2d8. And Conan almost always fought with a 2H weapon...
The bastard sword is in no way the optimized weapon, but when you're rolling 2d8 for damage dice, 3d8 when enlarged, it has an amazing feel to it. Being a barbarian is all about smacking things around with a massive 1H weapon, not about a DPR pissing contest.an enlarged BS is though is 2d8, take more care when reading
grab Exotic Weapon Proficiency Bastard Sword and get an enlarged one. -2 for wrong size, but larger hit dice.And to be honest i'm starting to think that using a one handed weapon isn't all that bad. you can always run around two handing it, but when the time comes there is always the option to use a shield, or keep that potion of enlarge person handy
He said it was 3d8 it enlarged, 2d8 normal.
but when you're rolling 2d8 for damage dice, 3d8 when enlargedSo, maybe you should take more care when reading?
He said it was 3d8 it enlarged, 2d8 normal.
but when you're rolling 2d8 for damage dice, 3d8 when enlarged
So, maybe you should take more care when reading?
He meant a Large one, not an enlarged one. That's why he brought up the -2 for wrong size. So a Large one would become Huge when enlarged and go to 3d8.
This thread is now about BS. 's.
You can wield a Bastard Sword one or two handed. You can wield a one handed weapon a size category larger with two hands, albeit at a -2 penalty. So the trick is to get a large sized bastard sword. Then get someone to use Enlarge Person on you. You then become a large sized barbarian wielding a huge sized bastard sword.
Normal size 1d10
Large size 2d8
Huge size 3d8
Now lets get back to talking about how to make an awesome barbarian.
Also want to put in how AM BARBARIAN works, he uses a this feat chain and a lance to get a weapon that x3's his damage with a x5 crit. Pounce, murder, keep moving to get back into charge distance. There might be more feats needed though, not quite sure.
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Barbarians who dump their wisdom end up killing allies while enemy-controlled.Protection f/ alignment stops most of that
"Oh well, gee; I'm glad you won't splatter my brains most of the time. Tell you what: you pay for all the Raise Deads you are responsible for, plus additional for 'pain and suffering' and all that; and I'll think about letting you join my team."
<skeptical PC leader, to Wild Rager job-applicant>
Barbarians who dump their wisdom end up killing allies while enemy-controlled.Protection f/ alignment stops most of that"Oh well, gee; I'm glad you won't splatter my brains most of the time. Tell you what: you pay for all the Raise Deads you are responsible for, plus additional for 'pain and suffering' and all that; and I'll think about letting you join my team."
<skeptical PC leader, to Wild Rager job-applicant>
While I completely agree with your point, wisdom is never a dump stat for a melee class, Wild Ragers rarely go nuts and murder their party. Well, as long as an enemy keeps attacking them so they don't have to roll the %'s. Should have heard my party's moans when I converted my CE Dwarf barbarian into the Wild Rager Archetype "Don't worry guys! The chances of Logen murdering you all hasn't really changed!"
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Wild Ragers rarely go nuts and murder their party. Well, as long as an enemy keeps attacking them so they don't have to roll the %'s.Intelligent enemies will notice the berserk/confusion. If all enemies are dead, the party may be screwed even worse. Low-level parties are particularly hosed.
Should have heard my party's moans when I converted my CE Dwarf barbarian into the Wild Rager Archetype "Don't worry guys! The chances of Logen murdering you all hasn't really changed!"
Chaotic-evil, eh? LOL
Well, they probably haven't, then (because they're already 100%).
Wild Ragers rarely go nuts and murder their party. Well, as long as an enemy keeps attacking them so they don't have to roll the %'s.Intelligent enemies will notice the berserk/confusion. If all enemies are dead, the party may be screwed even worse. Low-level parties are particularly hosed.Should have heard my party's moans when I converted my CE Dwarf barbarian into the Wild Rager Archetype "Don't worry guys! The chances of Logen murdering you all hasn't really changed!"Chaotic-evil, eh? LOL
Well, they probably haven't, then (because they're already 100%).
In Logen's case I made sure to bump his will save and always toss him towards the boss and farthest away from the party as I can. So far, it's worked out wonderfully. Confusion only gives a 25% chance of attempted murder anyway, and because you can't use rage powers you can't pounce your team mates. They'll be fine!
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In Logen's case I made sure to bump his will save and always toss him towards the boss and farthest away from the party as I can. So far, it's worked out wonderfully. Confusion only gives a 25% chance of attempted murder anyway, and because you can't use rage powers you can't pounce your team mates. They'll be fine!
One of these days your DM is going to get cute, the enemies will have Scrying and know what they're facing ahead of time -- and when the party tries the patented "dwarven fireball" trick, the bad guys will simply run-action to other side of the PCs after Logan has blown his save.
(Wild Ragers are exceptionally dangerous once they're Hasted at BAB11+, because then there are multiple remaining attacks provided the first one in a sequence drops a target.)
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would recommend to make your own thread instead of resurrecting a 2 years old thread.
Anyway this guide is a good place to start: Barbarian guide
Sorry only made this account in the past week so i have no idea how to do that sorrywould recommend to make your own thread instead of resurrecting a 2 years old thread.
Anyway this guide is a good place to start: Barbarian guide
Go to the main forum section you want to post in.
Now, look at the search option on the upper right side of the page. Next to that will be the "Add New Thread" button. You can also do a ctrl+F to look for those words (in the system I use; whatever lets you look for individual words on a page)
Anyway, for advice- I won't say that barbarian is great for TWF, but you at least have a decent option from your rare: the dwarven Urgrosh is a fairly decent double weapon for you.
Double weapons are nice for TWF builds because they can be used either as a 1 handed/light combo, or as a 2 handed weapon. This means that you can use it for TWF when you full attack, and use it 2 handed when you do standard action attacks or attacks of opportunity (which means you would get 1.5x power attack/strength bonus)