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Assume the PC's know of a village that contains "some" werewolves. Is there a magical way to discern who are werewolves and who are not? Just curious. Thanks!
Assume the PC's know of a village that contains "some" werewolves. Is there a magical way to discern who are werewolves and who are not? Just curious. Thanks!
Detect evil?
Wait until a full moon, and have lots of silver weapons on hand?
It may be a high Knowledge Nature DC.
Force them to eat Wolvesbane?
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I'd try to avoid letting the PC's waive their "magic wand" and figure it out.
Let it be a detective story. Try to figure out who the Big Bad is through old fashion means. Remember, at least some are going to be involuntarily turned and you are better off trying to cure than to smite them. This is especially true for the more alignment conscious people.
As a matter of Rules though (rather than just opinion) I don't see any spells that would allow you to just cast and detect. At least not in the core rules.
True Seeing looks like it might do it- but only if the individual(s) in question have changed into hybrid or animal forms.. Not terribly useful for the Hybrid form but it could show you that the pack of wolves hanging around wasn't actually a pack of wolves.
-S
In folklore, there are some traditional signs associated with weres.
Such as hairy palms, 1 eyebrow, or having your ring and middle finger be the same length. (If I recall correctly.)
So you could make a case for allowing a k(something) roll if the GM was willing to set the precedent.
One of my players (I'm the DM) briefly mentioned some type of "silver light" spell? I'm not familiar with it. I don't own Ultimate Magic but checked the PRD and didn't see any such spell in it. Maybe it's an old 3.5 spell?
I have ways of allowing perception and knowledge checks to potentially identify who are werewolves and who aren't, but even then it wouldn't be 100% foolproof. I just wasn't sure if I was missing any obvious spells that might work. Thanks!
Not sure what level you're talking here, but I would think true seeing would be rather revealing - but that's probably up to the GM.
Plus, detect evil would work fairly well, since it not only tells you whether evil is present, but also how powerful it is.
Edit: Also, anything that forced people to tell the truth would also be pretty telling, especially if the townsfolk were made aware and cooperated.
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if any body shows up naked covered in blood the morning after a full moon! dead give away
While there is no single foolproof detect lycanthrope spell, the PCS, if they use their ingenuity, should be able to figure out a lot over time. Detect evil could certainly narrow the field, if they have a way of covering everyone. If they can question people, zone of truth would as well. True seeing would be great, of course, but by that level you probably aren't too worried by normal werewolves.
Combine these magicla aids with good old-fashioned detective work, and detecting lycanthropes in a small village population shouldn't be impossible.
Of course it becomes much more difficult if the people don't trust you or don't cooperate with your investigation.
I could picture animals being able to sense the predator in the human body by their enhanced senses - try to use animal companions, buy some hunting dogs, half orcs with scent or shapeshifted druids (and ask your DM if this idea is viable ^^)
Try to tease the beast within with some raw blood - bring a recent slaughtered pig or something like that along
Use strong smelling herbs and smoke - at least mythological werewolves should have some problems with that (since it's originated in rabies and rabies make you dislike any strong smells) - especially for the herbs, ask your DM if you can make a Knowledge (Nature) roll or something like that to remeber what werewolves hate (garlic, thyme, rosemary...)
Use other stuff like wolfsbane, for example eucalytpus, rye or mistletoe
Holding an appropriate bane weapon against their skin would be pretty effective I think. In this case a silver weapon would be equally effective. '
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Hold a fancy dinner party and see who avoids the salad fork.
Were's also tend to have exaggerated personality types associated with the wereform. Werewolves for instance will tend to gather in packs even in thier human form and will play out the same kind of dominance issues.
So look for groups of people air-humping each other to show the other one who's boss. Probably just guys actually. It seems like a very guy thing to do, Then just hose the whole group down with alchemical silver.
Best option I can find is Locate Creature (Bard/Sorc/Wiz 4). *If* you have seen the particular kind of lycanthrope up close before, and there is a lycanthrope within range, it should be able to locate it.
Interesting (and humorous!) ideas. I'll have to see what my players come up with on their own and report back. Thanks!
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You could allow for a combination of knowledge (local) and perception checks to pick out some of the details that others have mentioned. But really, Know(local) would be the important skill to figure out who/what a werewolf was.
Local (legends, personalities, inhabitants, laws,
customs, traditions, humanoids)
You can use this skill to identify monsters and their
special powers or vulnerabilities. In general, the DC of
such a check equals 10 + the monster’s CR. For common
monsters, such as goblins, the DC of this check equals
5 + the monster’s CR. For particularly rare monsters,
such as the tarrasque, the DC of this check equals 15 +
the monster’s CR, or more. A successful check allows
you to remember a bit of useful information about
that monster. For every 5 points by which your check
result exceeds the DC, you recall another piece of useful
information. Many of the Knowledge skills have specific
uses as noted on Table 4–6.
Werewolf
Human natural werewolf fighter 2
CE Medium humanoid (human, shapechanger)
hold a annual cart washing contest and have all the water mixed with silver !
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if any body shows up naked covered in blood the morning after a full moon! dead give away
"Hey, it's just that time of the month, don't judge me."
Sadly, it looks like Locate Creature would work if the PC's have ever been within 30 feet of a Werewolf and realized it as such.
If i was DM though I'd not let PC's make random knowledge checks be the sole source of figuring out if someone was a werewolf. If that was all it took then werewolves would have been wiped out long, long ago.
Detect Evil just tells you someone is evil. It doesn't tell you why or have a big glowing wolf head above them to show you who and what they are. It could just be an evil person living quietly in a village. It could be nearly anything.
Bummed about locate creature though.. that just.. sucks.
-S
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Get all the townspeople in a circle. Some people are werewolves, but no one in the village knows who they are. Some people are werewolf hunters, but they want to keep their identities hidden so the werewolves don't know to kill them off right away.
Take turns, with everyone keeping their heads down except the werewolves, who identify which townsperson they are going to kill...
...no, wait, that's a party game. Sorry, I got totally sidetracked...
In this particular case, Locate Creature is not an option. The group does not have an arcane caster other than a bard and the bard is not high enough level to get/take Locate Creature. Detect Evil will be effective at highlighting the most powerful evil members of the village, but it doesn't tell you who is a werewolf and who is just...evil.
The PC's have a desire to remove the werewolves from the village but leave the village otherwise intact. It seems a difficult challenge they have put upon themselves. One of the players mentioned this "silverlight" spell but I have no clue what it is or where he might have seen it.
FWIW, there are *very* few ways to detect a Lycanthrope in human form at all:
Detect Evil - Lycanthrope may not be evil in Human Form (if afflicted). Even if Evil, many Lycanthropes are not powerful enough to register as Evil.
Silver - No Lycanthrope is unusually damaged by silver, they simply don't have DR against it...and in human form, they don't have DR against anything, so silver is exactly as effective against a lycanthrope as anything else. (though maybe Sense Motive may be useful to see who flinches unusally near silver, or unconsciously avoids it).
A DC17 Knowledge (Local) check seems to be the only other option
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Does the party have access to a duck?
Can the party see if the villagers float?
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And actually, detect evil probably won't be of much help anyway. A lot of people make the mistake of thinking that anyone who is evil aligned will register on the spell, but that's not the case. If you check out the table on pg 266 CRB, you'll see that unless the creature (humanoid, werewolf, dragon in disguise, whatever) has more than 5 HD, are undead, an outsider, or a cleric they won't show any trace of evil.
I found this out when the paladin in our group tried to detect evil on the slaver. He was only 3 HD, so he didn't show up as evil. :) And since your base werewolf is a 2HD fighter, they won't show up either...
here is what you do in all seriousness have the party come into the village, and have one of the pcs as a prisoner say he is a werewolf you caught and hang him in a cage overnight to make an example till you figure out what to do with him. that night the real werewolves will show up to rescue the captured lycanthrope! spring the attack and one step closer to your goal.
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One of my players (I'm the DM) briefly mentioned some type of "silver light" spell? I'm not familiar with it. I don't own Ultimate Magic but checked the PRD and didn't see any such spell in it. Maybe it's an old 3.5 spell?
Silverlight was printed in the Guide to the River Kingdoms.
--Moon Vrock
Easy, you get all the villagers together, and you choose which villager to lynch! If they're a lycanthrope, they'll change to their bestial form upon their deaths!
...I might be thinking of another game though...
Silverlight was printed in the Guide to the River Kingdoms.
--Moon Vrock
Holy cow I feel so stupid. I use that book all the time but almost exclusively for the information about the kingdoms. Doh!
This is exactly what he was referencing, though. Thanks, Vrock Star!
Hold a fancy dinner party and see who avoids the salad fork.
When is Paizo going to implement a "Like" button!?
OOOooo dog whistle.
Whistle, Signal: With a DC 5 Perform (wind instruments) check you can use a whistle to signal the same sorts of situations as signal horns. A whistle's piercing report can be clearly heard (Perception DC 0) up to a quarter-mile away. For each quarter-mile beyond, Perception checks to hear a whistle suffer a –2 penalty.
Silent whistles that only animals and other creatures with keen hearing can hear also exist.
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Hold a fancy dinner party and see who avoids the salad fork.When is Paizo going to implement a "Like" button!?
They did - it's that "+" under the Reply button.
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Another option is the Oracle of Heavens Revelaion:
"Mantle of Moonlight (Su): Your innate understanding of the moon renders you immune to lycanthropy. Additionally, you may disrupt a lycanthrope’s connection to the moon with a successful touch attack. This action automatically forces the lycanthrope into its humanoid form, which it must remain in for a number of rounds equal to your oracle level."
And the wording isn't clear whether the limited usage is strictly for forcing someone into a rage or if it also includes forcing a lycanthrope into its humanoid form.
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I would feel very cheated if lycanthopes were identified 'easily.'
Anything as simple as eyebrows and fingers should be spotted by villagers and taken care of before you ever got there... Vampires and Werewolves are always fun/scary becasue they blend into society so well.
Their disguises are so good you REALLY have to work at it figure them out.
having the wizard/cleric walk in, wave a hand and point would be VERY frustrating to me as a DM OR as a player.
I'm more a fan of threats that ordinary people CAN'T solve... that's why they need HEROES!!
I get frustrated when the clues are so blatant or the PCs do things so easy, it's impossible to have respect for the Npcs...
Playing a game right now, where the local guards are trying to solve murders for a few months... we rode into town and had the cult killed and/or captured in 36 hours...
ZERO respect for the captain in charge ;)
Assume the PC's know of a village that contains "some" werewolves. Is there a magical way to discern who are werewolves and who are not? Just curious. Thanks!
I know this doesn't qualify, but some view lycanthropy as a disease. They could cast Diagnose Disease on people to see if they're "infected." =)
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Silverlight was printed in the Guide to the River Kingdoms.
--Moon Vrock
Holy cow I feel so stupid. I use that book all the time but almost exclusively for the information about the kingdoms. Doh!
This is exactly what he was referencing, though. Thanks, Vrock Star!
Yeah, unfortunately like the other silver solutions, this won't work to identify werewolves in their human form. It only affects creatures with DR X/Silver and in human form werewolves don't have DR. They'd have to be in their hybrid form for it to hurt them, and then its pretty obvious... ;)
Yeah, unfortunately like the other silver solutions, this won't work to identify werewolves in their human form. It only affects creatures with DR X/Silver and in human form werewolves don't have DR. They'd have to be in their hybrid form for it to hurt them, and then its pretty obvious... ;)Silverlight was printed in the Guide to the River Kingdoms.
--Moon Vrock
Holy cow I feel so stupid. I use that book all the time but almost exclusively for the information about the kingdoms. Doh!
This is exactly what he was referencing, though. Thanks, Vrock Star!
Interesting! I had not considered that. Very good point there. Thanks!
Yeah, unfortunately like the other silver solutions, this won't work to identify werewolves in their human form. It only affects creatures with DR X/Silver and in human form werewolves don't have DR. They'd have to be in their hybrid form for it to hurt them, and then its pretty obvious... ;)Silverlight was printed in the Guide to the River Kingdoms.
--Moon Vrock
Holy cow I feel so stupid. I use that book all the time but almost exclusively for the information about the kingdoms. Doh!
This is exactly what he was referencing, though. Thanks, Vrock Star!
It'd be good for picking the werewolf out of a pack of wolves, though.
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An Augury might work, especially for a divine caster serving a non-lycanthrope-supporting deity.
"Is it a good idea to persecute this person for being a werewolf?"
If that person is not one, or otherwise doesn't deserve it, the answer would invariably be "Woe" unless asked of an evil deity.
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An Augury might work, especially for a divine caster serving a non-lycanthrope-supporting deity.
"Is it a good idea to persecute this person for being a werewolf?"
If that person is not one, or otherwise doesn't deserve it, the answer would invariably be "Woe" unless asked of an evil deity.
Or you worship a god of nature and you're questioning a lumberjack.
The last time we had a lycanthrope issue, we simply walked up to the town's most prominent barbarian and had a brief conversation which ended by our somewhat tactless/cleverly haphazard bard asking... "So what do you know about the werewolf attacks?" According to the DM, the barbarian failed his bluff so tremendously (bard randomness FTW!) that he decided shifting on the spot was appropriate and began to maul said bard, lol.
Does the party have access to a duck?
A nakid halfling walks into the inn with a duck under one arm and 3 silver dog treats in the other and the tavern owner says "So i gues you know that we have a were problem then...
OOOooo dog whistle.
Whistle, Signal: With a DC 5 Perform (wind instruments) check you can use a whistle to signal the same sorts of situations as signal horns. A whistle's piercing report can be clearly heard (Perception DC 0) up to a quarter-mile away. For each quarter-mile beyond, Perception checks to hear a whistle suffer a –2 penalty.
Silent whistles that only animals and other creatures with keen hearing can hear also exist.
how would you deal with pissing off all the dogs and dog owners in the places your trying to find werewolves in and i think elf and half-orcs can hear it too. so that can get you into more truble and can the werewolves just bluff out of way they seemed effected my your dog whistle.