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Okay, so in D&D 3.5 (and previous editions) when an outsider was killed it merely was banished back to it's home plane. Only on it's home plane could an outsider actually be killed. Hence the addendum "extraplanar" on them.
I'm in a mini-debate with someone about this, since Pathfinder itself nowhere says this (that I can find) all I have is references to D&D itself. So, I figured I'd ask you.
Is this still true in Pathfinder, or has it changed?
James answered this upthread:
http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2l7ns&page=1197?Ask-James-Jacobs-ALL-your-Q uestions-Here#59809
Ah, thanks! So they did actually change it in Pathfinder. I was about to apologize to the guy, but he just brought personal insults into it, so I just blocked him instead.
EDIT: Wait... is it changed, or did your question mean that it actually wasn't changed but JJ thinks it should have been? I'm confused.
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So please, ask all the questions you want. If my answer provokes more questions, feel free to ask THOSE. But if you just want to debate or try to convince me that I"m wrong or want to take the discussion to a new level... it needs a new thread.
Ok cool - I'll keep things short and sweet from now on.
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Shizzles...... actually a "Kaijus Revisited" or "Kaiju Companion" book would be awesome, providing rules for Kaiju battles, collateral damage, giant squids vs. ships, fine/diminutive characters going inside a creature's mouth/nose/orifice to do battle against critical organs inside, etc. Basically rules on how a character can fight in Ultraman mode/mech/bio suit and a review of the biggest published baddies out there and what they can do when they're not just rolling against someone's AC... (i.e. you're AC is too high? I'm a kaiju! screw you! I sit on your entire fortress!)
The "Revisited" line is really for us going to a group of monsters that has already been represented in RPGs to a significant extent and, well, revisiting them. Giving all the information about how those monsters are different in Golarion as opposed to, say, Greyhawk or Forgotten Realms or Eberron or real-world mythology or Middle Earth or whatever, is more or less the point of the line of books.
So when we get to something like kaiju, which has actually never had a significant role in the standard D&D type setting, the idea of a "revisited" book doesn't make much sense. It'd make more sense to call it "Kaiju Visited" since it's the first time a fantasy-setting RPG will have done much with the concept, but of course "Kaiju Visited" is a dumb name.
THAT SAID... A book that talks about how the kaiju of Golarion work, perhaps with several stats for new ones, and that would also give information about how to use kaiju in adventures and campaigns and explored methods of utilizing them including methods to make the PCs themselves giant sized like Ultraman would be pretty cool. It'd also be a super-niche product that caters to a tier of game play that I don't think a book could support and make enough money for management to give the green light to. I could be wrong.
But also... it's one of those books that I'd want to write myself, and that means that putting it on the schedule when it doesn't clash against another book I want to write myself is tricky.
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Okay, so in D&D 3.5 (and previous editions) when an outsider was killed it merely was banished back to it's home plane. Only on it's home plane could an outsider actually be killed. Hence the addendum "extraplanar" on them.
I'm in a mini-debate with someone about this, since Pathfinder itself nowhere says this (that I can find) all I have is references to D&D itself. So, I figured I'd ask you.
Is this still true in Pathfinder, or has it changed?
James answered this upthread:
http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2l7ns&page=1197?Ask-James-Jacobs-ALL-your-Q uestions-Here#59809
Ah, thanks! So they did actually change it in Pathfinder. I was about to apologize to the guy, but he just brought personal insults into it, so I just blocked him instead.
EDIT: Wait... is it changed, or did your question mean that it actually wasn't changed but JJ thinks it should have been? I'm confused.
And this is a good reason why I prefer to be the one to answer questions on the thread. I really don't mind answering the same question more than once on the thread, even—it's easier for me to do that than for someone to sift through the giant thread itself.
In any event, in Pathfinder, an outsider that is killed is killed for real, be it on its home plane or somewhere else. The two exceptions would be:
1) Astral projection. An outsider (or ANYthing) using astral projection to visit another plane doesn't die if killed on that plane; as detailed in the spell, that just ends their astral projection and their real body then wakes up.
2) Summoning: Whether or not a summoned creature even exists before or after it appears as a result of a summoning effect is unclear–my preference is that they don't exist, or that if they do, the thing you summon is more akin to an "astral projection" and thus doesn't bring back to it's real body any of the experiences or information it learned when it was summoned. In any event, a summoned creature that is killed does not mean a real version of that creature died. It either goes back to its home plane or, my preference, just goes back to non-existance like it was before the spell was cast and summoned a "copy" of it to your side.
But yes... the bit about how extraplanear creatures can't die forever unless they're on their home plane is NOT a part of Pathfinder. If only because that begs the question of "why doesn't it work that way for my character when I'm visiting another plane?"
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Creative Director
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Would Kaiju Unleashed be a better title for the hypothetical book?
The "Unleashed" line of books is a VERY specific format—it presents encounters in a very short and abbreviated context and doesn't leave a lot of room for giant stat blocks or the like. I know in Hell Unleased we've started to relax that restriction, so I suppose it's possible... but I'd rather do a Kaiju book on its own so it doesn't have to follow ANY pre-established format.
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James,
Over at the PFS section there is some confusion on how the UMD Skill works in regards to emulating a class. The question was targeted at Ring of Revelation. The argument is can a non-oracle utilize the ring to gain temporary access to a revelation with a sufficient roll of UMD?Some argue that no, you have to be an Oracle, and if you're not UMD won't help you.
Others say that UMD circumvents those standard preventions.
Use Magic Device will let you trick an item into thinking you're a different class... but it does not grant the POWERS of that class. The way the ring of revelation is worded pretty much means you HAVE to be an Oracle (aka you have to meet minimum level requirements in class abilities granted by the oracle class, since the powers granted directly affect that ability rather than grant you NEW abilities). Furthermore, the ring specifically says that it has no effect if worn by a non-oracle.
SO. Best case scenario, you could Use Magic Device to trick the ring into activating, but if you don't actually have class levels in oracle, the ring will do nothing more than take up a ring slot for you.
Are you sure that is not umbalanced that an Oracle of Lore could have, for example power of Oracle of Air? Or other extrange combination don't umbalance the game?
Could you give an official answer?
This is not the place to get "official answers." At least, not in the way that the internet would accept. You need to post rules questions like that to the actual rules forum or to the forum for the appropriate book, so that the question can be FAQed and the design team can get involved... and if you're looking for an official answer for PFS, then you also need to get the PFS team involved.
My "official" answer would be "What your GM says." I'm not interested in subverting your GM's authority. If YOU are the GM, then I'll certainly give you my opinion and advice...
But to me? What's official depends more on your group than anything in a book.
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If there was another kingdom in Golarion that resembles traditional Medieval high-fantasy that would support a hefty magic school, but this nation wasn't in the region usually detailed in the Inner Sea or Dragon Empire books, where would you place it? We're approaching a "timeskip" in my campaign and the player of our wizard requested he could go "off map" to study now that he has teleport, and I'm inclined to grant the request.
I wouldn't place it. The "Classic medieval high-fantasy" stuff you're asking about (which I also assume means "european themed") is all set in the Inner Sea Region. Putting something like that on another continent would make it a fish out of water outlying culture which takes it away from "classic" by the very fact that it's not in a region that you consider classic.
Up to you. If that wizard asked me in a Golarion game to go off somewhere to study, I'd give him options that already exist in the Inner Sea region, and if the wizard didn't have an option already chosen as a result of his knowledge of the world (be it in character our out of character) I'd have the wizard make a Knowledge (arcana) or (local) check, ask what sort of topic he'd want to study, and then give him an established already location that would be appropriate for that sort of study. No new nation needed. There's more than enough options in the Inner Sea for pretty much any topic in "classic" fantasy to be represented multiple times in multiple regions.
Hey James,
I was wondering what your thoughts are on disease and its interactions with magic. I see Remove Disease requires a Caster Level check against the DC of the disease, and was wondering if this represents some sort of magical resistance disease has accumulated over the years similar to a sort of Spell Resistance (sort of the way disease becomes resistant to antibiotics over time)?
If so is there any sort of reluctance to use Remove Disease aggressively for fear of more resistant strains?
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Creative Director
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Hey James,
I was wondering what your thoughts are on disease and its interactions with magic. I see Remove Disease requires a Caster Level check against the DC of the disease, and was wondering if this represents some sort of magical resistance disease has accumulated over the years similar to a sort of Spell Resistance (sort of the way disease becomes resistant to antibiotics over time)?
If so is there any sort of reluctance to use Remove Disease aggressively for fear of more resistant strains?
In the 2nd Curse of the Crimson Throne adventure we covered this topic extensively—the idea of a plague in a setting like Golarion is just as scary and dangerous there as it is here. And that was for the 3.5 rules, where remove disease worked automatically.
What you're seeing in how we adjusted how spells like remove disease and remove curse work is to keep those afflictions relevant at higher levels. It was always frustrating to have an effect like a disease or a curse hit your character when you had no way to fix it (aka, afflicting someone with this at 4th level or lower), but just as frustrating from the GM's side to see what should be frightening dooms (diseases, curses, etc.) get turned into minor inconveniences that don't last beyond a combat in length.
By setting things up so that there's a chance that the disease or curse isn't removed by a simple spell casting, you keep the affliction as something to fear, rather than something just to be annoyed by.
It doesn't represent the disease building up any sort of resistance to the magic at all; it represents the "skill" of the spellcaster at using magic to cure the condition. For healing spells, this is modeled by allowing the caster to add her level to the amount of healing done. For disease and curses, there's not gradiation of hit point levels there, so the best way to model you getting better at your job is to base it on a caster level check.
There is no reluctance to use remove disease aggressively for fear of creating more resistant strains at all. It doesn't work that way at all when magic is involved. That's one way that magic and technology differ, and having differences like that is important, since the end result of magic or advanced technology is often identical.
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Thanks for your answer, James. I suspected that would be your response but I won't know if I don't ask! Fortunately my players don't read the forum.
The "European" flavored component was my idea, to go along with an Arthurian style kingdom, and the usual suspects on the Inner Sea don't qualify either due to issues such as, for example, thematic (Cheliax devil focus, Acadamae (same)), PC involvement (not welcome in Brevoy, alientated power groups in Absalom, too much attention in Magnimar....), campaign events (e.g. civil war in Taldor, a necromantic plague in Ustalav has largely forced the country to close up). I put significant effort to have events happen throughout the world without my players intervention, to help them feel part of the world.
I am taking advantage of the timeskip to plant some seeds for future adventures. We had planned to doing a few "sidebar" RP/mini adventures for each of my players and this one's motif would be along the lines of the visiting noble from a distant land comes to study, and inadvertently gets involved in the local political scene which would eventually have the longer term effect of thwarting the fate of the NPC "King Arthur" type: he cannot fulfill his destiny to save his kingdom, [thanks Age of Lost Omens] eventually requiring the full party of heroes to arrive and save the day.
With respect to the character himself, he's found the need to lay low for a while, but as a Taldan, he is still trying salvage some prestige from his "noble" birth hence his character is trying to swing an academic time out far from the inner sea.
So, since this a question thread, does any other place spring to mind as good place to hold this? Maybe with some tinkering, somewhere in the Padishah Empire? I wouldn't think too hard on it (that is my job) but I appreciate your thoughts not only as an experienced GM.
Well... we don't really have an obvious "Arthurian style kingdom" in the Inner Sea region on purpose—because that's a trope we felt had been done to death and we wanted to explore nation themes that interested us more.
There's not a place that springs to mind for this, in other words. My advice would be that you pick a region you're not fond of in the Inner Sea Region and transform it into a nation more to your liking... but since the campaign you're doing is already well underway, it's WAY too late to do that. Now, all that said, all of your notations above are Avistan based. My suggestion would be that the character seek research and advice down south in Garund, specifically among the scholars of the Magaambya traditions in the Mwangi Expanse. That is, after all, where magic more or less was "reborn" in the Inner Sea region after Earthfall hit and reset the region back to a fresh start.
It's obviously not "european" in flavor, but in my opinion, that's a great strength of the setting.
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Hey James,
1. On Golarion did humanity evolve there, was put there, be created there, or travel there, for its origins? If you don't want to answer that then does evolution exist on Golarion?
2. Does Asmodeus always tell the truth but manipulate it to his advantage or does he lie sometimes?
3. If you were going to make your own pathfinder T.V show would you use the iconics as main characters or would you make up your own?
4. Could a god survive something like a supernova if not a hypernova (its like a supernova but around 100 times stronger) going off point blank?
5. When Aroden was going to come back around 100 years ago, did that violate any sort of god codes? For example, gods can't directly interfere with the mortal worlds. Or did I just imagine that?
6. The witch Manticce Kaleekii has a spider familiar named Gozzlemer which is fairly close to the monster gossamer which was the red monster owned by a witch from looney tunes. Is that on purpose or just a happy accident?
7. When Rock and Roll is finally created (if it hasn't already) which of the outsider of the outersphere will attempt to lay the most claim over it?
Thanks for answering my questions. :)
In any event, in Pathfinder, an outsider that is killed is killed for real, be it on its home plane or somewhere else. The two exceptions would be:
1) Astral projection. An outsider (or ANYthing) using astral projection to visit another plane doesn't die if killed on that plane; as detailed in the spell, that just ends their astral projection and their real body then wakes up.
2) Summoning: Whether or not a summoned creature even exists before or after it appears as a result of a summoning effect is unclear–my preference is that they don't exist, or that if they do, the thing you summon is more akin to an "astral projection" and thus doesn't bring back to it's real body any of the experiences or information it learned when it was summoned. In any event, a summoned creature that is killed does not mean a real version of that creature died. It either goes back to its home plane or, my preference, just goes back to non-existance like it was before the spell was cast and summoned a "copy" of it to your side.
But yes... the bit about how extraplanear creatures can't die forever unless they're on their home plane is NOT a part of Pathfinder. If only because that begs the question of "why doesn't it work that way for my character when I'm visiting another plane?"
Is it true for Gods as well? (ie Or did Aroden have to die on his 'home plane'?)
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Creative Director
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Hey James,
1. On Golarion did humanity evolve there, was put there, be created there, or travel there, for its origins? If you don't want to answer that then does evolution exist on Golarion?
2. Does Asmodeus always tell the truth but manipulate it to his advantage or does he lie sometimes?
3. If you were going to make your own pathfinder T.V show would you use the iconics as main characters or would you make up your own?
4. Could a god survive something like a supernova if not a hypernova (its like a supernova but around 100 times stronger) going off point blank?
5. When Aroden was going to come back around 100 years ago, did that violate any sort of god codes? For example, gods can't directly interfere with the mortal worlds. Or did I just imagine that?
6. The witch Manticce Kaleekii has a spider familiar named Gozzlemer which is fairly close to the monster gossamer which was the red monster owned by a witch from looney tunes. Is that on purpose or just a happy accident?
7. When Rock and Roll is finally created (if it hasn't already) which of the outsider of the outersphere will attempt to lay the most claim over it?
Thanks for answering my questions. :)
1) That is currently unrevealed. Evolution absolutely exists on Golarion though.
2) He sometimes lies, but much prefers to stretch truths or omit information as is convenient.
3) I would absolutely use the iconics. They're the only PCs we have access to for telling stories like that, after all.
4) Gods have no stats, therefore whether or not an exploding star can hurt or kill a deity is 100% up to you, depending on the type of story you want to tell.
5) True deities do not generally directly interact with mortals. Demigods do. Whether Aroden's prophecised return was actually going to be him physically appearing or any one of countless other possible manifestations is unrevealed, as is whether or not that would have violated any of the "god codes" which exist but which mortals do not understand or know the exact particulars about.
6) Accident. I created that character and her familiar and did not have any Loony Tunes in mind at the time.
7) Proteans.
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In reference to The Provinces of Holomog, is there any one particular African region/culture that stands out as an accurate analog?
Specifically, is there one/are there a few that could serve as inspiration for clothing and/or architectural styles?
Holomog isn't intended to stand in for a real world region or culture at all. It's more like Varisia or Cheliax in that regard, and a lot less like Osiron or the Lands of the Linnorm Kings.
Beyond what we've said about Holomog in print, I am not quite ready to say more. The nation IS from my homebrew setting, but I wasn't really able to do much with it in Distant Shores due to time constraints. My input to Crystal was pretty much "Holomog is a good-aligned matriarchy and they have a tradition of dinosaur riding."
In fact, now that I think of it... you could do a lot worse than to look to Dinotopia for inspiration on architecture and clothing, I guess...
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Creative Director
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Is it true for Gods as well? (ie Or did Aroden have to die on his 'home plane'?)In any event, in Pathfinder, an outsider that is killed is killed for real, be it on its home plane or somewhere else. The two exceptions would be:
1) Astral projection. An outsider (or ANYthing) using astral projection to visit another plane doesn't die if killed on that plane; as detailed in the spell, that just ends their astral projection and their real body then wakes up.
2) Summoning: Whether or not a summoned creature even exists before or after it appears as a result of a summoning effect is unclear–my preference is that they don't exist, or that if they do, the thing you summon is more akin to an "astral projection" and thus doesn't bring back to it's real body any of the experiences or information it learned when it was summoned. In any event, a summoned creature that is killed does not mean a real version of that creature died. It either goes back to its home plane or, my preference, just goes back to non-existance like it was before the spell was cast and summoned a "copy" of it to your side.
But yes... the bit about how extraplanear creatures can't die forever unless they're on their home plane is NOT a part of Pathfinder. If only because that begs the question of "why doesn't it work that way for my character when I'm visiting another plane?"
Gods break rules. Whether or not its true or not for any one of them is something the storyteller gets to decide when he/she tells the story.
That said, if a god has a stat block (as in the case of a demigod), they're treated no differently than any other creature in this regard, although SOME of them do have special rules regarding death (such as the Great Old Ones); these special rules are spelled out as needed in their stats.
Is further development of Arcadia kinda/sorta content-contingent like Vudra's relationship with Occult Adventures, or are the mechanical nuts and bolts more or less in place and it's more a question of needing flavor to intersect with priority?
Gods break rules. Whether or not its true or not for any one of them is something the storyteller gets to decide when he/she tells the story.
That said, if a god has a stat block (as in the case of a demigod), they're treated no differently than any other creature in this regard, although SOME of them do have special rules regarding death (such as the Great Old Ones); these special rules are spelled out as needed in their stats.
Thanks.
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Is further development of Arcadia kinda/sorta content-contingent like Vudra's relationship with Occult Adventures, or are the mechanical nuts and bolts more or less in place and it's more a question of needing flavor to intersect with priority?
Not at all. It's a topic we could start today, or could have started to explore years ago. The reason we haven't done much with it yet is that building new campaign settings (which is what developing one of those other continents is) is a VERY hard and time-consuming effort. Furthermore, we want to do Arcadia RIGHT and that means solving the complex issue of how to incorporate Native American elements in a respectful manner that's also compelling for adventures and to read. And furthermore, Adam is particularly eager to do stuff with Arcadia, but he's had his hands MORE than full over the past several years working on the backmatter of every single AP (or now, the adventure side of an AP).
We've got all the rules tools we need to do Arcadia, and have had them more or less from the start. We just don't have the time or resources on staff to start it yet. In a perfect world, we'd have an Adventure Path to support it as well, which only further complicates the timing. Jade Regent was originally going to be the 3rd Adventure Path, but instead of launching with volume #13 of the AP line it launched with volume #49.
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Well... we don't really have an obvious "Arthurian style kingdom" in the Inner Sea region on purpose—because that's a trope we felt had been done to death and we wanted to explore nation themes that interested us more.
You DO have Lastwall. It's just that Lastwall's boring due to having so many paladins hangin' around. ;)
You think it's interesting in the Dragon Age games that the "paladin-like" groups like the Templars and the Grey Wardens (even if just via their trappings of plate armor and helmets with wings on them), are anything BUT paladins given their willingness (or even eagerness) to do morally questionable things in service to a higher goal, contributing to the overall dark feel of Thedas?
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You think it's interesting in the Dragon Age games that the "paladin-like" groups like the Templars and the Grey Wardens (even if just via their trappings of plate armor and helmets with wings on them), are anything BUT paladins given their willingness (or even eagerness) to do morally questionable things in service to a higher goal, contributing to the overall dark feel of Thedas?
I've never thought of them as "paladin-like" at all.
They, like paladins, are "knight-like" but that does not mean they are like paladins.
if you could change anything about any paizo adventure path what would it be?
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I'm being really excited at finally getting chance to run RotR ^_^ Thanks for awesomeness that is that AP
I got few things I'm curious though about it so might as well ask before first session:
What kind of voice you imagine goblins speak with? Like, are they high pitched or more scratchy or growly?
Do Goblins sing the Goblin Song in common or in goblin? Or is it the case where singers sing the song in common while goblin warriors who don't understand the common just listen the tune?
Does Erylium intend fight to death with PCs when she practices her "Hit, run and heal" tactics? Like, will she chase players if they leave her alive?
What does Ironbriar's job/title as Justice exactly mean? Is he something like a judge?
What exactly is Old Murdermaw?
Did any of Runelords(the final ones or earlier ones) possibly leave any descendants?
So any tips on whether Valdemar or Deverin family stuff could be integrated into AP as sidequests or something like that?(since the merchant family trait means PC can be member of them)
Does that small isle in region actually have a dragon?
How did Brodert Quink come to conclusion about Old Light?
Is Niska Mvashti someone who might help during
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Looking at high level outsiders named in Bestiary 1 I noticed that zero Archons made it into Chronicles of the Righteous, and only one Azata (Cerunnos) did. By contrast only one demon lord (Demogorgon) didn't make it into Book of the Damned, and maybe 1/3 of the "known devils" appeared in some way in their volume of the BotD.
Any consistent explanation for this? I know why some of the devils (Glasya-Labolas) and Demogorgon didn't continue, but the Archons and Azatas all being redone puzzles me. Maybe I just don't recognize those from 3.5.
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if you could change anything about any paizo adventure path what would it be?
Second Darkness: I'd add a new adventure to ease the transition between Adventure 2 and 3, and would rewrite all of the first half of Adventure 5 so the elves feel like allies and friends you want to help rather than enemies you're forced to help.
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James,
I need a bit of help. I'm running a game I named "Reign of the Serpent King" and I'm starting to feel like I wrote myself into a corner.
** spoiler omitted **
I need some kind of way to guide them rather than an NPC showing up who just says, "OK, seriously, the Book: The First Council, that you got back in session 2 tells you exactly what these artifacts are and where they are. I know you thought it was fluff, but I gave you a two-page handout that you needed to know Draconic to read. I don't care what order you take them on in just pick one."
What do you do when you realize that they are just not getting the clues?
If you're not comfortable having some powerful NPC or even a minion of a deity or the like step in to push the PCs back on course...
Consider shorter handouts. Two pages is a lot to absorb in the middle of a game. Instead, give them the information they need to track down the next artifact only, and in it tell them more about the boons and powers they'll earn by getting that one. If that helps them focus and they get the next artifact, hand out the info about the one after that once that first one is recovered, and so on.
That said, if you're still early in the adventure, and you're comfortable with impromptu stuff and just making things up as you go, consider allowing the PC choices to drive the plot. LET them decide where to go next. If that means they want to go to an orc village to attack them, perhaps they rescue a prisoner who was on the quest for the artifact and he might encourage the PCs to get back on track.
I've run a few campaigns like this, where I knew that there were 3 or so big events that the PCs would need to be able to handle, but didn't really plan out what adventures they'd go on getting up to those. I had a HUGE supply of published adventures on hand of all sorts, so if in session 1, the PCs decided to go explore the swamp, I'd improvise the start of that and then by the time the next session started I was ready to go with an adventure set in a swamp drawn from my library. And I kept adding in tidbits that foreshadowed the next big event, or changed NPCs and monsters to be more on theme for that upcoming event, and in the end, it played out as a really fun trilogy of sorts.
Part 1 of that trilogy sort of ended up being adapted to Serpent's Skull, while part 2 of it sort of ended up being adapted to Curse of the Crimson Throne. Part 3 has not yet been adapted, but that's mostly because it's pretty high level and does some things with the multiverse that worked for my homebrew but don't work so much for a published setting.
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I'm being really excited at finally getting chance to run RotR ^_^ Thanks for awesomeness that is that AP
I got few things I'm curious though about it so might as well ask before first session:
What kind of voice you imagine goblins speak with? Like, are they high pitched or more scratchy or growly?
Do Goblins sing the Goblin Song in common or in goblin? Or is it the case where singers sing the song in common while goblin warriors who don't understand the common just listen the tune?
Does Erylium intend fight to death with PCs when she practices her "Hit, run and heal" tactics? Like, will she chase players if they leave her alive?
Spoiler:Is there a way for players to learn of connection between minor Runewell of Wrath and The Late Unpleasantness?
Spoiler:Does anyone call Skinsaw Man by that name in AP? I think I might have missed something, but I'm not sure. If its name made by villagers, just like Chopper, how do they recognize him to be related to Skinsaw Cult?
What does Ironbriar's job/title as Justice exactly mean? Is he something like a judge?
What exactly is Old Murdermaw?
Did any of Runelords(the final ones or earlier ones) possibly leave any descendants?
So any tips on whether Valdemar or Deverin family stuff could be integrated into AP as sidequests or something like that?(since the merchant family trait means PC can be member of them)
Does that small isle in region actually have a dragon?
How did Brodert Quink come to conclusion about Old Light?
Is Niska Mvashti someone who might help during
Spoiler:She is one of highest leveled npcs in town I thinkthe siege?
Goblins speak in a high-pitched raspy voice. Stitch, from Lilo & Stitch, is a great model for goblin voices.
The goblins sing the Goblin Song in Common. It's supposed to scare and be a threat, after all, to humans, not goblins. Goblins who don't know Common would still know the words, and you don't have to understand the words to receive bonuses from bardic performances. I don't speak Latin, but the sound of Gregorian Chants sung in Latin is still incredible to me, for example. Or operas, for that matter!
Erylium won't fight to the death. She doesn't want to be killed. She might eventually seek the PCs out for revenge (not the players, unless you're really into LARPing!) in time if they leave her alive, but not until she recovers and rebuilds resources.
Yup; he's a judge. There are 13 of them in Magnimar.
Old Murdermaw can be whatever you want him to be... but if you want to know what he REALLY is and what I'll eventually stat him up as... he is...
Possibly, yes... but whether or not those descendants also survived Earthfall and the following 10,000 years to keep their bloodline alive today? Very very very doubtful. To the extent that if this DID happen, that character would be a good one to be the entire focus of a whole AP or to be a PC.
I would use those links with the Valdemars and Deverins to give the PCs anchors in town, but if you want to use them to send the PCs on side quests, that works too. "Feast of Ravenmoor" is a great potential sidequest.
Yes.
Years and years of research in old books in his collection or kept in Magnimar or Riddleport.
She can if you want. As long as the bulk of the work is done by the PCs, whoever helps is relatively incidental. THAT SAID... Niska is also incredibly old. She's only a few years away from dying of old age, in fact, and does just that at the very start of Jade Regent; she may be high level, but her age penalties to Str, Dex, and particularly Con might make her too fragile to be much help in the combat itself.
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Looking at high level outsiders named in Bestiary 1 I noticed that zero Archons made it into Chronicles of the Righteous, and only one Azata (Cerunnos) did. By contrast only one demon lord (Demogorgon) didn't make it into Book of the Damned, and maybe 1/3 of the "known devils" appeared in some way in their volume of the BotD.
Any consistent explanation for this? I know why some of the devils (Glasya-Labolas) and Demogorgon didn't continue, but the Archons and Azatas all being redone puzzles me. Maybe I just don't recognize those from 3.5.
I love writing up high-level stat blocks, particularly for Demon Lords. LOVE IT. And as such I've been a champion of including demon lord stat blocks in books as often as it makes sense, and when it does, I've written all of them when the time came to actually design them.
Not everyone at Paizo shares this delight in designing high-level stat blocks. And so, when it comes to things with high level stats that I'm not passionate about (not demon lords, not kaiju, not great old ones)... they tend to not happen unless they end up being ABSOLUTELY necessary for a book.
My question wasn't intended to be about stat blocks. The Bestiary 1 intro sections for some outsider races include sidebars with names of paragons of their kind. It's weird that zero of the Archons and only one of the Azatas named in that book survived to be discussed in Chronicles of the Righteous. It makes it look like someone who cared about demons (you) wrote that section so they stayed around for their entries in the Abyss volume of Book of the Damned, and like the Archon/Azata names were written with a random name generator and then dumped to recreate entirely new Empyreal Lords wholesale.
I guess my question is whether you think the Chronicles of the Righteous authors were even unaware that Paizo had already published over a dozen Empyreal Lord names in Bestiary 1 before they threw it all away to start from scratch.
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Awesome :D Thank you for answers!~
Now I got follow up question(s) though. I thank again in advance :)
So if Erylium survive long enough to reunite with Scribbler I guess they team up and stuff, but it won't change Scribbler's actions much, right?
If that would happen, I guess I should buff Erylium for rematch since a long time has passed by then and PCs are now at way higher level... I guess I could just increase her class level, but I'm not sure if that would be enough. What would you recommend? Is increasing class level enough or would Scribbler or Lamashtu provide her some sort of boon that makes rematch with PCs more different?
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Creative Director
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My question wasn't intended to be about stat blocks. The Bestiary 1 intro sections for some outsider races include sidebars with names of paragons of their kind. It's weird that zero of the Archons and only one of the Azatas named in that book survived to be discussed in Chronicles of the Righteous. It makes it look like someone who cared about demons (you) wrote that section so they stayed around for their entries in the Abyss volume of Book of the Damned, and like the Archon/Azata names were written with a random name generator and then dumped to recreate entirely new Empyreal Lords wholesale.
I guess my question is whether you think the Chronicles of the Righteous authors were even unaware that Paizo had already published over a dozen Empyreal Lord names in Bestiary 1 before they threw it all away to start from scratch.
Oh! I see.
That's mostly because the game's history has always had a huge number of in-canon demon lords and arch devils, most of whom are drawn from mythology, so we could use those established and familiar names for demon lords in our game without worrying about intellectual property rights for things that WotC created on their own (which is why you don't see Zuggtmoy or Pale Night or Obox-ob or Graz'zt on the list of demon lords).
Empyreal Lords, though, are a brand new creation and addition to the game. D&D hasn't really done as much with the concept of this, and they're certainly not as well-known to gamers—demon lords showed up in the first Monster Manual in 1st edition AD&D but they never really statted up any good guy demigods like this in a monster book. Deities & Demigods is an exception, but most of THOSE are not all that appropriate for Golarion.
And as a result, we came up with a mostly brand-new list of names for them in the Bestiary, partially drawn from mythology and partially made up brand new by us.
In fact, what sort of did happen is that I, being the one who generated the demon lord list for the Bestiary and also being the one who wrote the demon books and content for the campaign setting DID keep all that in mind. When it came to generating Empyreal Lords, though, that simply wasn't done in the same way, partially because so many of the Empyreal Lords we'd invented for Golarion are world specific and we chose to deliberately keep them out of the world-neutral Bestiary.
The author of Chronicle of the Righteous was very much aware of the Bestiary 1 list. Wes was the one who outlined Chronicle, and he's also the one who actauly started the ball rolling for Empyreal Lords in the first place, so he'd be the one to ask for the exact reason... But I'm pretty sure the answer is: "The ones in the Bestiary are world-neutral, and the ones in Chronicle of the Righteous are Golarion specific."
The fact that that's a different decision made than what we chose to do with demons is mostly down to the fact that, as I mention above, demon lords have about 30 years more tradition and built-in presence in the game than does the relatively new category of Empyreal Lord.
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Creative Director
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Would "Weird Al" Yankovic's classic tune "Dare To Be Stupid" make a good theme song for goblins?
Not at all.
That's actually a mistake lots of folks make.
Goblins are crazy, and goblins are impulsive, and goblins are mean, but they're not stupid.
Check their ability score mods in the Bestiary for proof:
–2 Strength, +4 Dexterity, –2 Charisma
Goblins are no more or no less stupid on average than, say, dwarves or gnomes or halflings or any other race that doesn't get a bonus or penalty to their Intelligence score.
Also, goblins already have a theme song! :-P
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Creative Director
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Awesome :D Thank you for answers!~
Now I got follow up question(s) though. I thank again in advance :)
So if Erylium survive long enough to reunite with Scribbler I guess they team up and stuff, but it won't change Scribbler's actions much, right?
If that would happen, I guess I should buff Erylium for rematch since a long time has passed by then and PCs are now at way higher level... I guess I could just increase her class level, but I'm not sure if that would be enough. What would you recommend? Is increasing class level enough or would Scribbler or Lamashtu provide her some sort of boon that makes rematch with PCs more different?
Nope, and in fact i wouldn't wait till adventure 5 to bring back Erylium. I'd have her pester the PCs the whole time. IF she survives to adventure 5, I'd honestly consider having HER be the main villain of that first bit, not the Scribbler. Of coruse... leveled up appropriately.
So we have the Sahkil, the fallen Psychopomps who want to rule over humanity through fear rather than keep their 'just a job' mentality.
What about the opposite? Are there any Psychopomps who care about humanity too much? Who have stepped beyond the borders of duty and honestly care about humanity, ala Discworld Death?
Who would give the Harvest the care of the Reaperman.
If so, would they be banished as well by Pharasma and what sort of abilities would they have?
Would Lorthact from the Inner Sea Bestiary be a good point of reference for writing up a high-end malebranche?
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Creative Director
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So we have the Sahkil, the fallen Psychopomps who want to rule over humanity through fear rather than keep their 'just a job' mentality.
What about the opposite? Are there any Psychopomps who care about humanity too much? Who have stepped beyond the borders of duty and honestly care about humanity, ala Discworld Death?
Who would give the Harvest the care of the Reaperman.
If so, would they be banished as well by Pharasma and what sort of abilities would they have?
At this point, we've said zero about an "opposition" to the sahkils, and have no plans to explore that any time soon. Personally, I like the idea that there isn't an "opposite" to them, and that it's more of a binary system between them and the psychopomps. After all, one of the design philosophies of the Great Beyond is that there's NOT balance between things like this; the powerful entities of the Great Beyond are not simply all mirrors of an opposite.
So, at this point, no, no such thing. And I'm very strongly inclined to keep it that way.
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Creative Director
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Would Lorthact from the Inner Sea Bestiary be a good point of reference for writing up a high-end malebranche?
Nope. Lorthact is a weird case. He's actually an infernal duke, but he's exiled and has had some of his power stripped from him as a result.
We haven't statted up any of the maelbranche yet, but given the fact that they all have ties to Material Plane worlds, that'd be something I'd like to see them share as a trait.
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Would "Weird Al" Yankovic's classic tune "Dare To Be Stupid" make a good theme song for goblins?Not at all.
That's actually a mistake lots of folks make.
Goblins are crazy, and goblins are impulsive, and goblins are mean, but they're not stupid.
Check their ability score mods in the Bestiary for proof:
–2 Strength, +4 Dexterity, –2 Charisma
Goblins are no more or no less stupid on average than, say, dwarves or gnomes or halflings or any other race that doesn't get a bonus or penalty to their Intelligence score.
Also, goblins already have a theme song! :-P
Oh, I see! That makes sense, given "impulsive" tends to be conflated with "stupid" when that's not actually the case. Thanks for the clarification! :)
How would the definition of "wrath" differ between the Abyss and Hell? What does wrath "look like" in each case?
You’ve stated over the years how much you love Monsters.
Ulunat’s molted shell in Sothis is similar to the picture in the Giant Beetle entry in the 1E Monster Manual.
Is this a coincidence or an Easter Egg?
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Creative Director
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You’ve stated over the years how much you love Monsters.
Ulunat’s molted shell in Sothis is similar to the picture in the Giant Beetle entry in the 1E Monster Manual.
Is this a coincidence or an Easter Egg?
Since both beetles are likely based somewhat on the shapes of real-world beetles, it's a coincidence.
How would the definition of "wrath" differ between the Abyss and Hell? What does wrath "look like" in each case?Wrath wouldn't differ. Wrath is wrath, wherever it is.
Really? I'd always kind of pictured the Abyss as sudden and brutal annihilation as retribution for any perceived wrongs. Whereas Hell would plot out and execute the most insidious destruction of everything you know and love, while subtley letting you know that you are the cause of everything, before letting you die in the most miserable way that can be arranged.
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Creative Director
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Really? I'd always kind of pictured the Abyss as sudden and brutal annihilation as retribution for any perceived wrongs. Whereas Hell would plot out and execute the most insidious destruction of everything you know and love, while subtley letting you know that you are the cause of everything, before letting you die in the most miserable way that can be arranged.How would the definition of "wrath" differ between the Abyss and Hell? What does wrath "look like" in each case?Wrath wouldn't differ. Wrath is wrath, wherever it is.
What you're describing is a potential difference between the Abyss and Hell... not wrath. Wrath is just a word. It's got a definition. It's not a place or a physical thing that changes.
That said, Hell and the Abyss are huge and varied. There are plenty of subtle evils on the Abyss and plenty of over-the-top brutal evils in Hell.