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Somewhere in the SRD, it says that the rogue's sneak attack with a ranged weapon is limited to 30'. How can a rogue get a sneak attack when not adjacent to the target?
Never mind. I found the answer. Either the rogue flanks the target or the target is denied DEX bonus to AC.
"The rogue's attack deals extra damage anytime her target would be denied a Dexterity bonus to AC (whether the target actually has a Dexterity bonus or not), or when the rogue flanks her target. This extra damage is 1d6 at 1st level, and increases by 1d6 every two rogue levels thereafter. Should the rogue score a critical hit with a sneak attack, this extra damage is not multiplied. Ranged attacks can count as sneak attacks only if the target is within 30 feet."
Somewhere in the SRD, it says that the rogue's sneak attack with a ranged weapon is limited to 30'. How can a rogue get a sneak attack when not adjacent to the target?
Anytime the target is denied his dex, for instance being flat-footed, they are subject to sneak attacks. I'm not sure why they chose 30' as the arbitrary distance but thats the SRD, I'm a little more open minded since I've seen a sniper in action but when someone is unaware of an attack they are very vulnerable.
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It's worth noting that you can't flank from range, though, as you're not actually threatening any squares. So, you can do a ranged Sneak Attack either when the rogue is successfully Stealthed or invisible so the target is unaware of her, or in the first round of battle when the target's initiative turn hasn't come up yet.
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So what about having Snap Shot and Improved Snap Shot? That gives you a threat range. Then you can flank because you threaten, which gives you sneak attack correct?
So what about having Snap Shot and Improved Snap Shot? That gives you a threat range. Then you can flank because you threaten, which gives you sneak attack correct?
While a giant necro, Flanking only applies to melee attacks.
"When making a melee attack, you get a +2 flanking bonus if your opponent is threatened by another enemy character or creature on its opposite border or opposite corner."
You can, with Snapshot, provide flank for another person who is melee, but you are not receiving any benefit from being in such a position. At least, that is how I understand the rules on it.
this faq also confirms that flanking is a melee only thing.
Disregarding the huge thread necro...
As noted by the others flanking applies to melee attacks only.
Snap Shot allows you to provide flanking to others, but does not allow you to benefit from it.
Ranged sneak attack requires your enemy be denied their dex against your attack. In general, this is not particularly viable and ranged sneak attacks are pretty hard to pull off.
If you're enlarged and with a reach weapon and threaten from 30 feet you are flanking .. and can throw with your other hand and get sneak attack... Right? :)
nope, cause the moment you're attacking with the ranged weapon you're no longer getting flank.
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Disregarding the huge thread necro...I support the decision to necro the thread. The Seans611 the Necromancer had a legit question that was relevant to the thread. He's not creating Zombies. He's just casting Speak with Dead!
fortunately it was short enough that it wasn't bad to read the context. But it's still overall more polite to ask in a new thread. something like,
"I've been searching and it seems you can't flank with a bow, but what about once you have snap shot?" if this thread had dozen or more posts I wouldn't have read them to understand what the context was.
I believe the feat ranged feint allows you to feint as a move action and then attack. As I recall, you spend an arrow on the feint as well as the attack. Not as good for full attack shenanigans, but maybe you could use some of the other feinting feats.
Disregarding the huge thread necro...
As noted by the others flanking applies to melee attacks only.
Snap Shot allows you to provide flanking to others, but does not allow you to benefit from it.
Ranged sneak attack requires your enemy be denied their dex against your attack. In general, this is not particularly viable and ranged sneak attacks are pretty hard to pull off.
It seems to me that being a Rogue with a Ranged Weapon is the reason to take Improved Initiative.
Ranged sneak attack requires your enemy be denied their dex against your attack. In general, this is not particularly viable and ranged sneak attacks are pretty hard to pull off.I think one could design a character to reliably make Ranged Sneak Attacks.
That depends on how you are defining "reliably". Is it once per round, once every other fight, etc?
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And that's when you have your party wizard cast greater invisibility on you. I mean, if you're not planning on having your party wizard cast greater invis on you, you wouldn't be building a ranged sneak attacking rogue, would you?
Fogcutting Lenses + Saltspray Ring
Note that a Goz Mask costs exactly the same as Fogcutting Lenses and confers additional benefits without sacking your Perception.
(But it'll pretty much boil down to whether or not you need your head slot or your face slot open for something else.)
Invisibility has the problem that at around level 10 many monsters are capable of seeing invisible creatures or negating invisibility through various spells. While it sounds like a good method, I've personally seen a ninja who ended up starting every combat (of an AP) by going invisible only to learn that the monsters could see her, and then proceeding to run away from them for the rest of combat.
Relying on some method to block line of sight (like fog/mist) and finding a way to see through it is the most common method I've seen. But it's honestly a problematic thing IMO. It forces the entire party to change their combat tactics, and makes it very difficult for the GM to be able to have monsters do anything effectively against the party.
It also relies completely on the availability of magical items, rather than on the classes own power or feats. I consider that to be a rather large malus as well.
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And that's when you have your party wizard cast greater invisibility on you. I mean, if you're not planning on having your party wizard cast greater invis on you, you wouldn't be building a ranged sneak attacking rogue, would you?Halflings do.
.... I stand corrected.
I've been looking into making a new dex based non-caster for a while, might have to check out that build.
Hey everyone! Thank you! Its been awhile since I've been on any website to post so I didn't take into consideration posting ettiquitte. This is actually my first post on the Paizo Threads so thank you for being so helpful! Again, thanks for the hint on posting and on my question.
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Or an oracle dip, or a shaman dip, or a witch dip. Or be a smog sight half orc and eat the 20% miss chance. Untill you can afford a seeking hornbow.
Or multiclass 6 levels of slayer, take the ranger combat style talents at 2 and 6 to pick up improved precise shot early. Use the feat you save from the 2nd level to take accomplished sneak attacker at 3rd. Use your 4th level talent to grab deadly range if you like. (Lets you SA from 40ft).
BAB boost, no lost SA, martial proficiency (for hornbow, because your a half-orc). Yeah, not bad...
You missed a Bard (Flame Dancer) dip (3 levels). And their fire sight applies to the party, so they won't hate you when you make fire, fog, or smoke. Your folks get cover, and the enemies don't.
/cevah
Well, in Pathfinder Society, those Magic Items are indeed readily available at market prices and and for Prestige Points. The combination of Scent and Blindfighting is usually enough (for functioning while Blinded or vs. Invisible, not for achieving SAD yourself). Blind Fighting is a Feat. Greater Blindfighting would do the trick. And there are lots of ways to gain Scent. It is available as a Feat for Half Orcs. Dwarves can get Temorsense at the cost of 2-3 Feats. There are 2 level 2 Spells: Bloodhound (Ranger) and Alter Self.
While I agree with you that there are ways to counter such tactics, having a PFS player who you don't normally play with drop in one weekend and use the various blinding tactics can create a real surprise for the DM. Not only that but the ways in which such tactics are countered are typically not something the DM simply has on hand and waiting to use at a moments notice, any more so than a player comming up with ways to summon a cube / sphere of water to simply drown his enemies.
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Or an oracle dip, or a shaman dip, or a witch dip. Or be a smog sight half orc and eat the 20% miss chance. Untill you can afford a seeking hornbow.
Or multiclass 6 levels of slayer, take the ranger combat style talents at 2 and 6 to pick up improved precise shot early. Use the feat you save from the 2nd level to take accomplished sneak attacker at 3rd. Use your 4th level talent to grab deadly range if you like. (Lets you SA from 40ft).
BAB boost, no lost SA, martial proficiency (for hornbow, because your a half-orc). Yeah, not bad...
You missed a Bard (Flame Dancer) dip (3 levels). And their fire sight applies to the party, so they won't hate you when you make fire, fog, or smoke. Your folks get cover, and the enemies don't.
/cevah
I was wondering if anyone would think of Flame Dancers...
Yeah, this work great - just need to define some of the mechanics of it with your DM (if I move more than 30' from the 'Dancer, an I still her performance? If she performs, then moves 35' away from me, am I still covered by the performance? etc.)